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What's the big deal about the largest crowdfunded failure in history guys? Who cares that something this big is likely to make a few depressed over "invested" idiots it attracts, kill themselves? Who really cares that the "founders" of it all will just walk away when the RSI website goes offline and the chances of them actually being brought to account for running a deception for years is low?
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Dec 10, 2016 01:52
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AP posted:What's the big deal about the largest crowdfunded failure in history guys? Who cares that something this big is likely to make a few depressed over "invested" idiots it attracts, kill themselves? Do you think when CIG/RSI implodes financially that they'll do the thing where they gather everyone together and tell them it's over, or just bail from the LA studio really quietly while everyone else at the other studios keeps turning up to work?
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Dec 10, 2016 01:58
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TheLastRoboKy posted:Do you think when CIG/RSI implodes financially that they'll do the thing where they gather everyone together and tell them it's over, or just bail from the LA studio really quietly while everyone else at the other studios keeps turning up to work? I think they'll cut staff numbers, Austin most likely first, then in the end it'll be like this. http://www.bostonmagazine.com/2012/07/38-studios-end-game/
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Dec 10, 2016 02:01
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The paychecks start coming late. They start bouncing. Excuses are made about the payroll company and the bank making errors. People go a month or more without being paid. One day, they show up to work and the building is locked.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:06
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:Yeah, I felt bad for the guy and his team. They worked hard on this. Miyazaki eviscerated them; I don't think I've ever witness such a thorough critical beatdown.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:12
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:The paychecks start coming late. They start bouncing. Excuses are made about the payroll company and the bank making errors. People go a month or more without being paid. One day, they show up to work and the building is locked. This, but hopefully not stupid enough to keep working once the checks bounce. That's already happened too many times in the industry. Key signs to look for is supervisors/producer level people with access to financials* who decide to leave before the ship sinks. *- most studios I've worked for share financials of some sort to its employees, so it shouldn't be a shock if things aren't going well. Of course this is CIG we're talking about, not a publically traded company. Has CIG/F42 actually released any recent financials in the UK or are they still late and paying fines? MC68000 fucked around with this message at 02:16 on Dec 10, 2016 |
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Dec 10, 2016 02:13
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Dec 10, 2016 02:14
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MC68000 posted:This, but hopefully not stupid enough to keep working once the checks bounce. That's already happened too many times in the industry. It'll keep happening. 
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Dec 10, 2016 02:16
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if they're really hiring a lot of kids right out of college, those are the ones who are going to get turbofucked.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:23
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:The paychecks start coming late. They start bouncing. Excuses are made about the payroll company and the bank making errors. People go a month or more without being paid. One day, they show up to work and the building is locked. Um, speaking of which...
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Dec 10, 2016 02:30
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I saw that, I would expect far more noise hitting the industry rumor mill if it was one missed pay period, let alone 6 months...something doesn't smell right here.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:38
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It's odd there wouldn't be rumors about Crytek sooner, but... People remaining in exploitative situations wherein their employers are not honoring payroll obligations is unfortunately not very rare. A lot of factors play into this behavior, including sunken cost fallacy and the fear of being black-balled in the industry or region. Lots of folks in this position never receive the wages they're owed, let alone any punitive interest payments owed per local/state/national law. Most of the time, wage violations go unreported and thus unpunished. People are afraid of retaliation or cling to the idea that their employer will eventually make good. But when someone breaches contract with you and does so persistently, they're not interested in making good, and you don't owe them any further goodwill. It's time to loving report on them using the structures put in place to help you. Worse, at least in US bankruptcy law, employees with unpaid wages come after most other creditors, and their claims are limited to unpaid wages within the previous 180 days (starting with cessation of business operations or the bankruptcy filing, whichever's earlier) and those are limited to something like $13k or less (can't remember when the last time this poo poo was adjusted for inflation). I imagine creditor priority is similar, if not largely identical, elsewhere. German insolvency rules seem very similar (excepting domestic support order stuff, which changed here in '05). e. If this is true, it's not the first time Crytek has hosed with payroll.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:42
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Dec 10, 2016 02:44
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:Yeah, I felt bad for the guy and his team. They worked hard on this. Miyazaki eviscerated them; I don't think I've ever witness such a thorough critical beatdown. Not getting called out leads to garbage like Star Citizen though, I'll take feeling like poo poo for a day over putting out poo poo for years and thinking I'm a genius for it.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:49
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I see they solved the "ships shake themselves apart" problem.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:53
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I'm dickin' around on Glassdoor to see if any leaks have sprung up, and, well... eta: this is for crytek, not cig quote:Pros Bolding mine. This isn't the only recent review that mentions delayed paychecks. Seems like it's been going on since Q2 at least. Good Dumplings posted:Not getting called out leads to garbage like Star Citizen though, I'll take feeling like poo poo for a day over putting out poo poo for years and thinking I'm a genius for it. Sure, but it's a pretty big leap from nascent AI project to psychotic crowd funding scam. POOL IS CLOSED fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Dec 10, 2016 |
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Dec 10, 2016 02:53
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Propagandist posted:Yeah but what's the value in recording a higher number of resolved issues than the number of created issues? Seems like that's the whole point. Otherwise why even plot it? Note the title of the chart. I bet that "must-fix created" is a subset of all bugs, but "resolved" covers any bug that's fixed.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:55
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:Sure, but it's a pretty big leap from nascent AI project to psychotic crowd funding scam. I'm not sure it is, this started as a nascent MMORPG extension to a pitch for a space sim. And even if they aren't the same size or have the same intention, criticism is still important to prevent things from turning into awful slogs like this.
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Dec 10, 2016 02:57
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Good Dumplings posted:I'm not sure it is, this started as a nascent MMORPG extension to a pitch for a space sim. And even if they aren't the same size or have the same intention, criticism is still important to prevent things from turning into awful slogs like this. I'm definitely not going to say that critique is bad or should be delivered in the form of a poo poo sandwich. That would be pretty hypocritical of me, since I really rely on it for my work. I just found Miyazaki's delivery to be unusually brutal. (But also, an MMO's scope is still pretty different from what these guys seem to be doing.)
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Dec 10, 2016 03:04
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:I'm definitely not going to say that critique is bad or should be delivered in the form of a poo poo sandwich. That would be pretty hypocritical of me, since I really rely on it for my work. I just found Miyazaki's delivery to be unusually brutal. It totally was, though to me it's understandable because he's probably looking at it from a way longer perspective than the devs were - like if this is what they think's worthwhile now, what will they end up crapping out ten years from now? It's kind of like if you were shown a really, really well-drawn Syrian refugee pony OC and the artist asks you "how they could improve it".
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Dec 10, 2016 03:16
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Good Dumplings posted:It totally was, though to me it's understandable because he's probably looking at it from a way longer perspective than the devs were - like if this is what they think's worthwhile now, what will they end up crapping out ten years from now? It's kind of like if you were shown a really, really well-drawn Syrian refugee pony OC and the artist asks you "how they could improve it". Accept pledges to draw it in various spasschips of course! I'm still not entirely sure how "AIs with no notion of limb differentiation" translates into the team's stated goal of "AIs that make art like humans," but I don't know nothin' about no videogame development. That last part seemed to be what offended Miyazaki the most -- he's a humanist to the core, and any effort that aims to replace human ingenuity with artificial machine calculation probably seems obscene from his perspective. His response after the cut was pretty bleak.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:20
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As someone with a movement impairing disability I found this fantastic. <3 I love that man.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:22
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TheAgent posted:everyone in this thread will be murdered  TheAgent posted:by the low low ship prices on sale now at RSI 
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Dec 10, 2016 03:22
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:
Yeah, pretty much. At least employee wages fall behind secured creditors (banks and other financial institutions dumb enough to loan them money) and unsecured creditors (probably the biggest one is Restoration Hardware and other accounts payable with net terms such as the catering service) on the totem pole of getting hosed in the rear end. The funny thing about all of this shitstorm I find right at the moment are the financials. It is not a panacea to exposing this smoking gun. Sure it will basically show how much they blow through in salaries, how much is in cash and assets on the balance sheet but you won't find the gritty details of officer compensations and such. Only thing we hang on to is is the UK filings which are outdated and probably doctored beyond belief.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:23
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C-Bangin' it 
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Hopper posted:Q: What do you do when all your staff are crunching and your artists are too busy to complete an insignificant virtual model of a virtual spaceship? You just wrecked the magic. And also next months subscriber flair when it's another gold textured 97% scale model of the actual model for space flying.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:26
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Colostomy Bag posted:Yeah, pretty much. At least employee wages fall behind secured creditors (banks and other financial institutions dumb enough to loan them money) and unsecured creditors (probably the biggest one is Restoration Hardware and other accounts payable with net terms such as the catering service) on the totem pole of getting hosed in the rear end. I don't know anything about UK financial statements standards -- they don't include a disclosure of the compensation to the top managers (CEO, CFO, etc.)? That's one of my favorite things about reading public companies' filings for the US.  Why couldn't CIG make this clusterfuck even more fantastic by going public here?
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Dec 10, 2016 03:26
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:Accept pledges to draw it in various spasschips of course! Also because the team doesn't seem to know why they're working on the project; given that it's no surprise what they're making has no use and no sense of humanity. They didn't mean to, but they basically told an old man that his descendants don't know where they're going and don't care.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:30
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Holy poo poo this is hard core.  Here's our work, master. An AI to create new movements that can be creepy! Revolutionary movement system! I am horrified by your work. I hope it is destroyed. What do you want to do with your lives? B... bu... build a machine that can.. draw like humans...
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Dec 10, 2016 03:31
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:The University of Phoenix-Trump Hyperwarp Spasschip College That sounds an awful lot like where Chris and or Sandi got their degrees from.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:33
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:I'm definitely not going to say that critique is bad or should be delivered in the form of a poo poo sandwich. That would be pretty hypocritical of me, since I really rely on it for my work. I just found Miyazaki's delivery to be unusually brutal. I went through architecture school, and this delivery is pretty brutal, but pretty common in a design environment. I used to go to presentations and watch this happen like once a month. I've been on the receiving end of it a few times, too, and it sucks exactly as much as you think it does.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:35
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The Titanic posted:Happy Friday, friend. FTFY.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:37
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 I'm Ben's body telling him he is one krispy kreme away from a devastating sepsis binge and impending heart failure
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Dec 10, 2016 03:41
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:I'm dickin' around on Glassdoor to see if any leaks have sprung up, and, well... Whoa. Is this a cig review? Once the checks get late, it's time to start figuring out an exit strategy. I can't believe CIG burned through all of their money with nothing to show, but on the other hand I've been expecting it.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:42
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nawledgelambo posted:
good news for Ben. The ear cheese is in fact edible.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:44
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The Titanic posted:That sounds an awful lot like where Chris and or Sandi got their degrees from. There is no US Department of Education in the glorious future of the Fourth Stimpire Natron posted:I went through architecture school, and this delivery is pretty brutal, but pretty common in a design environment. I used to go to presentations and watch this happen like once a month. I've been on the receiving end of it a few times, too, and it sucks exactly as much as you think it does. Do you feel that this style of, uh, mutual polishing has made you a better designer? I'd expect it would lead people to be more conservative about their projects/proposals, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I'm saying mutual polishing because I'm assuming some sort of peer review here rather than top down or client contractor unidirectional feedback. I haven't experienced it that often, but I don't do design, and the occasional screaming fits in my last career were mostly internal clients who didn't understand wage garnishments or employment taxes. It's hard to take that kind of feedback personally!  Good Dumplings posted:Also because the team doesn't seem to know why they're working on the project; given that it's no surprise what they're making has no use and no sense of humanity. They didn't mean to, but they basically told an old man that his descendants don't know where they're going and don't care. Miyazaki just realized his heir and spare in Crusader Kings II have 0s for their diplomacy and stewardship scores. Now he has to initiate a plot or change the succession laws in order to find creatives whose values align with his own. I got more the sense that they were just really intimidated by that point, not that they didn't have any reasoning to support their goals, but I also have a real keen sense of fremdschämen.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:45
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The Titanic posted:Whoa. Is this a cig review? Once the checks get late, it's time to start figuring out an exit strategy. I can't believe CIG burned through all of their money with nothing to show, but on the other hand I've been expecting it. No, this is for Crytek -- in relation to that reddit link a ways up talking about unpaid or untimely paychecks for the last 6+ months. Looks like this started in May.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:46
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:The paychecks start coming late. They start bouncing. Excuses are made about the payroll company and the bank making errors. People go a month or more without being paid. One day, they show up to work and the building is locked. Stop doxxing a prior job I had!
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Dec 10, 2016 03:47
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Samizdata posted:Stop doxxing a prior job I had! Did you successfully collect on the unpaid wages plus any statutory interest owed?
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Dec 10, 2016 03:48
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POOL IS CLOSED posted:I just found Miyazaki's delivery to be unusually brutal. He's well known to be a complete grump. "Anime is trash" - H. Miyazaki I think it's a Japan thing where when you're old and respectable you're suddenly allowed to be super insulting to people and they have to just take it. POOL IS CLOSED posted:No, this is for Crytek -- in relation to that reddit link a ways up talking about unpaid or untimely paychecks for the last 6+ months. Looks like this started in May. Crytek has been having money trouble since like 2014. That's why Crobbler was able to pick up some decent devs for a while, before they peaced out to work for non-insane places. Star Citizen is probably the only thing that's kept Crytek afloat the last couple years.
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Dec 10, 2016 03:53
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Klyith posted:He's well known to be a complete grump. "Anime is trash" - H. Miyazaki are the magic crytek people gone?
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Dec 10, 2016 03:55
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