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I haven't really seen any debate anywhere for a while now. It's pretty clear to everyone across the board that Fultz is #1, then its unclear on the order that follows with Jackson, Smith, Ball, etc.
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Jan 17, 2017 20:35
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Someone irl was aggressively arguing with me that Ball was better than Fultz because Fultz's TS% was 56.5% which is "below average for an NBA of prospect" (which is not true).
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Jan 17, 2017 20:38
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Slow work day so I'm reading about some of the late-draft international talent and came across this guy: http://www.nbadraft.net/players/michael-fusek 7'5" and 220lbs. 
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Jan 18, 2017 17:51
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Paul Zuvella posted:Slow work day so I'm reading about some of the late-draft international talent and came across this guy:
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Jan 18, 2017 18:07
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At least he's heavier than that Romanian kid with the worm neck
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Jan 18, 2017 20:31
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People that pay attention to CBB. What is wrong with Tacko Fall? I would think a 7 foot 6' tall man would at least be in the 2nd round of mock drafts. http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18473661/ucf-knights-tacko-fall-road-relevancy Spacebump fucked around with this message at 21:56 on Jan 18, 2017 |
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Jan 18, 2017 21:36
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Spacebump posted:People that pay attention to CFB. What is wrong with Tacko Fall? I would think a 7 foot 6' tall man would at least be in the 2nd round of mock drafts. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAsvdxLvk0g
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Jan 18, 2017 21:39
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lmao that still
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Jan 18, 2017 21:47
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straight up brolic posted:Someone irl was aggressively arguing with me that Ball was better than Fultz because Fultz's TS% was 56.5% which is "below average for an NBA of prospect" (which is not true). I think the only college stats hill I'm prepared to die on is pg/non scoring wing steals/rebounds/wingspan coefficient Anyway, I've been watching MSU because the Pistons make me sick. Miles Bridges seems to be moving up mocks, as yet another undersized MSU player who's really good. He kind ofmakes me think of a much more explosive Jae Crowder, they have very similar body tpyes, but without the super intense defensive instincts. He knocks down threes like nothing, he finishes with ease. He could have trouble with NBA length at sf, but he's such a good shooter that he should have space. There are a lot of holes in his game and he isn't really a tenacious defender, assuming so is just MSU magical thinking. He has Potential baby and he grew up in FFFFFflint Town so I assume he's mentally tough, even if he went to basketball prep school in West Virginia for 2 years Dejan Bimble fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jan 18, 2017 |
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Jan 18, 2017 21:50
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Paul Zuvella posted:Slow work day so I'm reading about some of the late-draft international talent and came across this guy: That dude needs to put on, like 50 pounds, but Kristaps was 7'3" 230 when he came out
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Jan 18, 2017 22:03
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Spacebump posted:People that pay attention to CBB. What is wrong with Tacko Fall? I would think a 7 foot 6' tall man would at least be in the 2nd round of mock drafts. Most insanely tall dudes are as slow as they are large and don't really have any basketball skills beyond "stand in the paint and stick your arms up on defense." There's a reason Sim Bhullar and Mamadou N'Diaye are D-Leaguers who went undrafted.
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Jan 18, 2017 22:33
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Henchman of Santa posted:Most insanely tall dudes are as slow as they are large and don't really have any basketball skills beyond "stand in the paint and stick your arms up on defense." There's a reason Sim Bhullar and Mamadou N'Diaye are D-Leaguers who went undrafted. I get that but sometimes it doesn't stop teams from drafting those guys. (Like Satnam Singh) Him being slow and not having many skills makes sense. That espn article overhyped him. After I made the post I checked his stats. It made this quote hilarious. "He's the most dominant player in college basketball, point blank, period," UCF assistant coach Jamill Jones said. "Whoever the best center is, if you put him in front of Tacko, he won't be the best center. If they had to play against one another, they can't physically stop Tacko from doing what he wants to do right now." I should have just looked at what he did vs Tulane.
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Jan 18, 2017 22:45
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I watched Villanova play them earlier this year. UCF had to play zone with him planted directly under the basket. The Villanova guards would just penetrate and shoot a little jumper or floater at the top of the paint over him repeatedly because he couldn't get out to contest the shot.
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Jan 18, 2017 22:52
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Spacebump posted:I get that but sometimes it doesn't stop teams from drafting those guys. (Like Satnam Singh) Him being slow and not having many skills makes sense. That espn article overhyped him. After I made the post I checked his stats. 13, 10 and 2.4 on 80% shooting (what) isn't too bad
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Jan 18, 2017 22:59
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Fultz is absurd
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Jan 19, 2017 07:05
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Dwyane Wade  Markelle Fultz  
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Jan 19, 2017 07:51
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How can he shoot 42% on 4 and half threes a game, but only shoot 67% from the line? That's either really weird or really troubling inasmuch as it makes me wonder if that long range shooting is repeatable.
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Jan 19, 2017 08:08
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Josh Hart plays really big for 6'5". He has decent form on his shot. He looked good in the break and when he attacked the basket, and had a couple crisp passes but he seemed to absolutely refuse to orchestrate the offense or be involved in any two man basketball which is a problem if he ends up somewhere that wants to play him at point. Strong on the ball defense was interesting to see in a college guard. Tyler Lyndon has an amazing shot with a high release. He's not just a jump shooter either, he has a lot of nifty moves and a very nice touch around the hoop. drat he has awful footwork with the ball in his hand, though. He dribbles like pre-steroids Ryan Kelly. Doesn't seem to understand the concept of rebounding. The announcers said he plays three positions but he really only looked comfortable defensively guarding the three (which probably would be his position in the NBA if he wasn't such a bad dribbler); there is some potential maybe as a rim protector but he is missing fundamentals such as "raising your hands above your head." The announcers harping on him needing another year in college had a point due to so many awful fundamentals, but that shot might be pretty tempting to NBA teams. There was an hour of Kansas on my DVR after the Syracuse/UNC game so I got a preview of Josh Jackson and man that guy is so athletic and makes some pretty passes off of drives. He got pulled twice in that hour for mistakes, and while I don't like that style of coaching for young guys they were pretty boneheaded plays.
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Jan 19, 2017 12:54
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DeimosRising posted:How can he shoot 42% on 4 and half threes a game, but only shoot 67% from the line? That's either really weird or really troubling inasmuch as it makes me wonder if that long range shooting is repeatable. Rick posted:Josh Hart plays really big for 6'5". He has decent form on his shot. He looked good in the break and when he attacked the basket, and had a couple crisp passes but he seemed to absolutely refuse to orchestrate the offense or be involved in any two man basketball which is a problem if he ends up somewhere that wants to play him at point. Strong on the ball defense was interesting to see in a college guard. straight up brolic fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Jan 19, 2017 |
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Jan 19, 2017 14:37
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DeimosRising posted:How can he shoot 42% on 4 and half threes a game, but only shoot 67% from the line? That's either really weird or really troubling inasmuch as it makes me wonder if that long range shooting is repeatable. Free throw shooting form tends to be totally separate from a jump shot form, so besides jitters, if he's still working out kinks on one, it might not show up on the other.
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Jan 20, 2017 03:26
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Declan MacManus posted:Free throw shooting form tends to be totally separate from a jump shot form, so besides jitters, if he's still working out kinks on one, it might not show up on the other. They tend to correlate really well outside of very rare cases like Bruce Bowen. Low FT% but high 3 pt% is a pretty good sign that someone's 3 pt% might be a sample size fluke that won't carry over (good recent example is Justise Winslow). I think college FT% actually has a higher corellation with NBA 3 pt% just because the sample is larger E: the best formula people have found for projecting NBA shooting is some combination of college FT% and 3 point attempts as far I know, but maybe there's been a recent breakthrough there I missed MourningView fucked around with this message at 19:23 on Jan 20, 2017 |
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Jan 20, 2017 15:52
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MourningView posted:They tend to correlate really well outside of very rare cases like Bruce Bowen. Low FT% but high 3 pt% is a pretty good sign that someone's 3 pt% might be a sample size fluke that won't carry over (good recent example is Justise Winslow). I think college FT% actually has a higher corellation with NBA 3 pt% just because the sample is higher. I hope you appreciate how much more of a nerd you sound like these days.
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Jan 20, 2017 16:48
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Lockback posted:I hope you appreciate how much more of a nerd you sound like these days. I willing served as a unpaid internet janitor for an increasingly obscure website for like almost a decade I was never very cool
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Jan 20, 2017 19:15
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OG Anuoby will have knee surgery and is out for the season.
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Jan 20, 2017 19:22
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Someone tell me about Lauri Markkanen
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Jan 20, 2017 21:32
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He's incredibly skilled and does a little bit of everything, but he's kind of stiff and looks vaguely like a smaller Brook lopez.
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Jan 20, 2017 21:39
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Someone tell me about Lauri Markkanen He's a really tall shooter who has been impressive internationally for a while despite being only 19, he's agile and plays defense well even against smaller guards. He looks competent when he attacks the basket, has a way of scoring on drives that look like they're going to be goofy, but I'm not sure that will work in the NBA. Close-in-size or more muscular centers really toss him around, although that's less of a negative in the modern NBA where everyone's going small or stretch. I'm pretty sure he'd be a top ten prospect most years anyway, but the fact that this is such a PG/wing draft may mean he'll go generally higher than he might most years.
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Jan 20, 2017 21:55
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I'm watching this Arizona/UCLA game right now and honestly I just don't see how Ball gets a shot off in the NBA. The release is so awkward, slow and low that he's going to get non-stop blocked by NBA athletes closing out, let alone guys that are actually guarding him. That shot seems like such an incredible risk for a guy you're taking 3-4.
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Jan 21, 2017 22:21
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The thing is he's really really good at everything else, so even if he has to rework his shot you can still get value out of him. He's super athletic and by far the best passer in the draft.
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Jan 22, 2017 00:02
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MourningView posted:The thing is he's really really good at everything else, so even if he has to rework his shot you can still get value out of him. He's super athletic and by far the best passer in the draft. 
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Jan 22, 2017 00:26
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MourningView posted:The thing is he's really really good at everything else, so even if he has to rework his shot you can still get value out of him. He's super athletic and by far the best passer in the draft.
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Jan 22, 2017 00:32
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MourningView posted:The thing is he's really really good at everything else, so even if he has to rework his shot you can still get value out of him. He's super athletic and by far the best passer in the draft. I'm not saying you can't get value out of him, I'm saying he seems to be projected too high to me for someone who looks like they may have serious problems shooting at the NBA level, especially given the premium placed on shooting and spacing in the current NBA. I guess I may be underrating his other tools but that shot is so loving ugly.
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Jan 22, 2017 01:03
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I really like Hartenstein more than Markannen if we're talking nordic euros in the draft. He really does have a dirk esque fadeway jumper and scoop/flip that I don't think NBA players will be able to bother, he's really big, much bigger than MArkannen, and he can handle the ball a bit. He's not as good a shooter as Markannen at this level, but I think he'll have a much easier time getting clean looks in the NBA. How's TJ Leaf matching up with Markannen? If they are matching up at all. I'm changing my mind a bit about Miles Bridges. He might be a 6'6 power forward unless he improves his handle and finds a way to move faster with the ball in his hands. His 3p shooting numbers are good but when I watch college teams defend the three point line, the contests are often just pathetic. His .625 ft% makes me worry since he mainly gets to the rim by bashing guys out of the way with his shoulders, and he doesn't get up high once he's there, he's got about Jae Crowder strength and athleticism but without the nimble feet. He really needs to polish his game if he wants to be more than a role player in the NBA.
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Jan 22, 2017 01:41
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Dejan Bimble posted:I really like Hartenstein more than Markannen if we're talking nordic euros in the draft. He really does have a dirk esque fadeway jumper and scoop/flip that I don't think NBA players will be able to bother, he's really big, much bigger than MArkannen, and he can handle the ball a bit. He's not as good a shooter as Markannen at this level, but I think he'll have a much easier time getting clean looks in the NBA. Markannen at times beat Leaf the way that good offense almost always beats good defense, but I thought Leaf was defensively competitive in the matchup. Another possible issue of concern for Markannen is that when the game was fast-paced he might as well not have been out there, although he was super valuable in the halfcourt, of course. Defending Markannen ate up a lot of Leaf's attention, but I was impressed with his rim protection when Markannen was off the floor. Of course I've learned that this is something that doesn't always transfer to the NBA but he was really good at altering shots, and his positioning was mostly good and he recovered well often when it wasn't. They didn't really go to him a ton on offense this game, but Arizona is really big. What little they showed looked positive to me. Ball's speed and skill is great, and man, weaving passes through traffic 40 feet away is fun. Obviously the form of the shot is a problem but it's effective enough that I almost wonder if you have to see him against NBA competition first to see if he can get it off against NBA talent (which is a fair point Mikeraskol raises). Rick fucked around with this message at 03:42 on Jan 22, 2017 |
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Jan 22, 2017 03:40
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MourningView posted:The thing is he's really really good at everything else, so even if he has to rework his shot you can still get value out of him. He's super athletic and by far the best passer in the draft. He can still hit shots if he is not guarded. That's the reason why people like Rubio and MCW are bad. Ball will hit shots you leave him open for.
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Jan 22, 2017 04:53
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honest lonzo can flat out ball imo
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Jan 22, 2017 06:06
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Markkanen was like perfect in that game
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Jan 22, 2017 07:18
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Paul Zuvella posted:He can still hit shots if he is not guarded. That's the reason why people like Rubio and MCW are bad. Ball will hit shots you leave him open for. Rubio hits open shots too. Rubio is bad at finishing at the rim if there is a hint of defense. If Ball can finish then he's already ahead of guys like MCW and Rubio at that.
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Jan 22, 2017 16:22
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Ball can absolutely finish. It's just the shooting motion, all the other aspects of his offensive game are pretty great.
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Jan 22, 2017 21:49
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I was a bit confused as to why Johnathan Motley was ranked so low, and I think one thing I have finally accepted is the red flag of age. He had a monster all around game and knocked Texas's bigs off the floor, including Jarret Allen. Is that because he's a 21 year old who has had three years to work on his body? Like he's bigger than most college guys, but he's not NBA big. All things I guess draft watchers have to consider while watching a guy who just was absolutely dominant. Jarrett Allen…I just didn't see 'it' but I guess in a game where someone is in constant foul trouble is useless so I'll try and find another.
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Jan 23, 2017 12:58
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