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 Godlike, Chapter V, Part VIII As a reminder, ALL loving NAZIS MUST loving HANG.  So anyway, the last update concluded with the famous July 20 bomb plot, which almost killed Hitler. In real life, Hitler was saved when another officer pushed the briefcase behind a heavy table leg; in Godlike, it was Hitler’s spontaneous decision to walk around the table that saved him. In both cases he escaped with no worse than a ruptured eardrum; the main difference is that in Godlike the assassin was instantly killed, rather than caught and executed later. The failed plot led to mass arrests and executions as the Nazi high command took advantage of the situation to eliminate political enemies with no connection to the plot. 7/21/1944, U.S. Takes Guam: The 1st Provisional Marine Brigade and 3rd Division landed at Guam. The Japanese allowed them to come ashore, where they found themselves surrounded by dug-in positions. The fight became a war of attrition for every inch of ground, even devolving into hand to hand combat. “Banzai” suicide charges were common, but usually resulted in disastrous Japanese losses as they were mowed down by machinegun fire. By August 10, the Marines had lost 1,044 men, but the Japanese garrison was almost totally wiped out. 7/23/1944, U.S. Takes Pisa: The U.S. 34th Division entered Pisa after securing the port of Livorno. The Reichskommisariat Norditalien was now reduced to a cluster of troops in the mountains. Axis presence in Italy was over. 7/25/1944, Operation Cobra: General Collins’ U.S. VIII Corps launched Cobra, a southward push to flank the Germans from the west. Air support, artillery, and TOG teams crushed the German front line, followed by tanks. After four days of fighting, the Allies flanked the Germans near Marginy.  8/1/1944, the Warsaw Uprising: The Polish Home Army--loyal to the Polish government-in-exile in London, with British-American support--seized key points in Warsaw with 38,000 troops, inflicting heavy losses on the German garrison in brutal street fighting. Pevnost kept the Polish troops well-supplied, while Cien destroyed 11 tanks by himself. Over a dozen other Polish Talents killed about 8,000 Germans in 2 weeks. The Polish troops hoped to deliver Warsaw for the Polish government, giving them a bargaining chip with Stalin. On August 2, the 1st Bellorussian Front crossed the Vistula into Poland, bringing 50,000 troops and 2,000 tanks into the country. It seemed they would take Warsaw, but Stalin had the advance suddenly stop for “lack of supplies.” It was obvious that Stalin was letting the Germans and Polish fight it out, intending the seize what was left. Cien and Pevnost were recalled under protest. On the 15th, Stalin made a brief announcement that the Soviet Union only recognized Poland’s communist Committee of National Liberation, considering the Polish government-in-exile “irrelevant.” Despite public outcry from Cien and other Talents, the Allies did nothing. By the 29th, the Polish Home Army was devastated by heavy German support, fighting back from hidden boltholes in the sewers. Only 6 of the 12 Polish Talents were still alive, and special Überkommandos called Hunds were brought in to hunt them down. Without aid from Russia, they were unlikely to survive until the city’s liberation. 8/1/1944, Death on Tinian: Forty thousand Marines assaulted a 6,000 strong Japanese garrison; fewer than 25 Japanese soldiers survived to surrender. Only hours later, the Seabees began building an aistrip large enough to land a B-29 Superfortress. Soon the Allies were bombing the Japanese islands from over 1,500 miles away 8/15/1944, Operation Dragoon: Part of a coordinated effort to have more military operations with kickass names, Operation Dragoon was another landing in France designed to force the Germans to fight on three fronts. After a night of raids by British and French commandos, 94,000 men and 11,000 vehicles landed near Montpellier, quickly pushing for Lyons. The Germans were surprised and forced to retreat. Within weeks, Dragoon had liberated Toulon and Marseilles and was miles from linking with Operation Overlord forces. In less than a month, the two forces would comprise a single gigantic front from the English Channel to the Mediterranean. Surrounded by Allied forces at Falaise, the German 5th Panzer and 7th Army fled east across the Seine. But Canadian/American closed the Falaise “pocket,” leaving 60,000 Germans surrounded on all sides. After losing 10,000 to air attacks and artillery, the Heer defied Hitler’s orders and surrendered. 8/21/1944, Der Flieger Dies!: After the humiliation at Falaise, Hitler sent Der Flieger and 14 flying Übermenschen on a propaganda mission to drop leaflets on London. After buzzing the capitol for a half-hour, they dropped propaganda on Buckingham Palace and the House of Commons. Since the “Flying Krauts” were doing no real damage, the 1st Non-Mechanized Long Range Flight Group was grounded. As the Germans prepared to leave, they were attacked with AA fire using the new, OSRD-invented proximity fuze. In the end, Der Flieger met his match not in a greater Talent but in a simple yet brilliant advance in weapons technology. All but 2 of the Übermenschen were blasted out of the sky. Konrad Rahn, “Der Flieger,” the world’s first known Talent, was dead at 28. A lavish state funeral was held in Berlin. The paranoid Hitler refused to attend.  8/23/1944, Romania Rebels: Nazi-Allied Romania was now trapped between Germany and Russia; their reward for joining the Axis would be to have their country used as Hitler’s battleground, then seized as Stalin’s prize. King Michael’s agents negotiated an armistice with the Western Allies, then were forced to sign one with the Soviet Union. Prior negotiations by the Big Three, and the reality of a half-million Soviet soldiers on their border, meant that Romania’s future was a Soviet one. Nonetheless, King Michael announced the arrest of Hitler’s insane puppet, Prime Minister Ion Antonescu, and Romania’s defection to the Allies. 8/25/1944, the Liberation of Paris: Ignoring orders to bypass the city, the 2nd Free French Armored Division entered the city to assist the Maquis uprising, forcing American forces to follow. German General von Choltitz, by now disgusted with Hitler’s insanity, refused his orders to level the city rather than surrender it, and handed Paris over to French forces. However, 14 Übermenschen had not surrendered. Their orders were to reduce Paris to “a heap of rubble and ashes,” and they had the power to do it. Over the following week, they came out of hiding periodically to launch terror attacks. An attack on the Hotel Meurice killed 14, and 4 American officers were murdered the next day. Der Schreck held an entire train station hostage with his powers. Worst of all, the Talent Die Resonanz had begun creating a destructive resonance that was already shattering windows and causing nosebleeds across the city, and could eventually collapse every stone building in the city. The attacks were only stopped when General Eisenhower peeled off 230 American Talents to capture the Übermenschen. TOG 33 killed 2 Übermenschen moments to stop them from destroying the Eiffel Tower with a huge bomb, and 9 more were captured and shot as spies when they tried to sneak through a checkpoint in stolen American uniforms. The last 3 Übermenschen were cornered and killed in the Paris sewers at the cost of 2 TOG commandos. This is where you should set your campaign, by the way. 8/26/1944, Bulgaria Withdraws: Cut off from Axis reinforcements by the Romanian defection, King Simon II of Bulgaria decreed that Bulgaria was withdrawing from the war. They hoped that this would prevent a Soviet invasion. They were as wrong about this as they were about Axis victory. On September 5th, the Bulgarian government resigned hours before Communist partisans seized vital positions and the Red Army crossed the border. Nine days later, a pro-Soviet government was installed with support from the 50th Soviet Shock Army, made up of almost 1,000 Soviet Talents. 8/30/1944, Ploesti Falls: The 2nd and 3rd Ukrainian Fronts, under Generals Malinovsky and Tolbukhin, reached Ploesti and easily destroyed the German garrison. With Romanian assistance, they freed almost 1,000 Allied airmen held prisoner there. About 120 Übermenschen were stationed at Ploesti; 25 chose to die fighting while the rest fled. 9/2/1944, the Allies Enter Belgium: Overlord and Dragoon forces linked up and nearly liberated all of France that summer. But when they entered Belgium, their advance slowed to a crawl. General Eisenhower took command of the ground forces, planning to pass through Belgium on the way to capturing the Ruhr Valley, the industrial heart of Germany. British-American forces had early success in Belgium, but after liberating Brussels and Antwerp, German forces reorganized and small pockets of resistance slowed the Allied advance. With help from Vevel’s Communist partisans, the 3rd Canadian Division seized the port of Zeebrugge. Vevel, who had spent the war terrorizing Nazi forces in Belgium, destroyed dozens of German positions. The 50,000 German troops still in Belgium were now scattered in isolated areas. Vevel rules. 9/4/1944, Armistice in Finland: Bogged down by Marshal Mannerheim’s defense of the country, the Soviets were ready to end the war in Finland. Von Mannerheim outmaneuvered Stalin politically as well as militarily, giving the Soviets only the Karelian Isthmus they had won in 1940. 9/8/1944, V-2 Attacks: The first V-2 missiles were launched on London. Far more dangerous than the V-1, these huge rockets with one-ton warheads flew in 60 mile arcs to hit their targets, impossible to intercept. Thousands were made with slave labor in secret underground bunkers, and could be launched from mobile platforms. These weapons would kill thousands in just a few months.  /1944, the Good Time Boys Scout Bitburg: General Patton’s Talent team entered Germany and reconnoitered positions near the border of Luxembourg after a few brief engagements with the German 7th Army. “Well, that sure was a hell of a lot of Germans,” said 1st Lieutenant “Muscles” Meyer. “It looked like two Nurembergs and a Barbarossa put together.”9/15/1944, Tito Links with Soviets: General Tolbukhin’s Soviet-Bulgarian force entered Yugoslavia, destroying what little resistance remained after Communist leader Josip “Tito” Broz had liberated much of the country. (Don’t ask me about Communist guerrillas and their assumed names, it’s complicated.) Amazingly, Stalin welcomed Tito as a comrade and agreed that Soviet presence in Yugoslavia was a temporary measure. Tito admired Stalin, but intended to take control of Yugoslavia after the war. His forces linked with the Red Army at Kragujevac, and the combined force turned their attention to German forces in the northwest. 9/15/1944, the Soviet 1st Polish Army: After the scant remains of the Polish Home Army surrendered, the Soviet 1st Polish Army crossed the Vistula and invaded Warsaw. Stalin had deliberately allowed the Polish patriots to be destroyed so that he alone could determine Poland’s future. 9/17/1944, Operation Market Garden: Field Marshal Montgomery’s plan called for airborne forces to seize key bridges in Holland behind enemy lines. This would allow Allied tanks to move through the country and threaten Germany’s Ruhr Valley. It was at that point the largest airborne force in history. The U.S. 82nd and 101st Airborne dropped on the evening of the 17th. American forces faced little resistance, but the British 1st Airborne encountered strong resistance at Arnhem--the key to the operation, since the tanks had to travel through there to reach the Rhine. Only Col. John Frost’s unit made it to the bridge, where they were cut off, but refused to abandon their position. The British XXX Corps encountered heavy resistance in Holland, and American forces found resistance increasing. It was obvious that the entire operation was in danger of collapsing. They should have given it a cool name like Pitbull or Lancer. 9/20/1944, Talents Converge on Holland: The fierce fighting in Holland drew a large number of Axis and Allied Talents. Forty Allied Talents (including Cien, the Invincible Man, and Misfire) parachuted into Holland, and were soon joined by independent partisans like Vogel and Daegal. One-hundred-and-six Übermenschen arrived to reinforce the Axis. Only 18 Allied Talents would survive the operation. On the 20th, Cien and 350 men of the Polish 1st Independent Parachute Brigade pushed toward Arnhem to reinforce Col. Frost’s unit. After a 4-hour battle, they broke through the 12th SS Panzers but never reached the bridge. The Panzer division’s 14 Übermenschen cut off Cien’s forces as they crossed the IJssel river. Cien killed Siegfried and Der Ziegel (“The Brick”) with his powers before dying of wounds inflicted by Krieg. His force was quickly eliminated. The same day, Daegal and 15 more Dutch Talents fought their way toward Eerde to support the Allies, encountering Überkommandogruppe 99. Der Tragheit (“The Inertia”) killed Daegal by pretending to be in awe of his power and surrendering. He then touched Daegal, which robbed his body of its inertia and flung it into the upper atmosphere where he burnt to ashes. The ensuing battle was brief and deadly. Only one Dutch Talent escaped by teleporting to Allied territory. 9/26/1944, Market Garden Fails: The XXX Corps arrived at Arnhem but couldn’t take the bridge. Instead, the tanks held off German attacks as Allied forces evacuated south to the lower Rhine. The Allies had suffered 3,000 deaths and 7,000 troops captured in a failed operation famously dubbed “a bridge too far.” Next time on Godlike: Nuts! Halloween Jack fucked around with this message at 18:28 on Feb 7, 2017 |
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Feb 7, 2017 16:24
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The Sin of Onan posted:Hunter: Tooth and Nail – Part One: When the Calling Comes I think at this point we have to seriously consider whether McFarland is gaslighting readers.
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Feb 7, 2017 17:52
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Hm, this is where the strict adherence to the WW2 timeline starts to grate a little. I was wondering if superpowers might seriously change the progress of Market Garden; instead it seems to be used by the setting as a handy way to cut down the number of superpowered characters. I agree on that amazing Paris campaign concept though. Start there, and move into the end of the war with crazed Nazi fanatics, some superscience, and then a Talent-based ASHCAN.
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Feb 7, 2017 17:56
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Seeing how we're keeping the thread for this year, I might as well return into the ring. Before tackling something bigger, I'll look back at stuff I already did and cover supplements. What do you want first: Another take on cyberpunk, or has Beast enraged you so much that you wanna see something with Fatalities? ZeroCount posted:I know you think the Heroes are dumb but to be honest I've sort of loved every single example Hero we've gotten since the little old lady with the AK-47. Heroes are rad. I want an Evil PewDiePie who puts character models of Beast in his modded out version of Slender. Simian_Prime posted:Ha ha the whole point of putting a monster in a Hunter book is so you can outline a group of hunters that hunt said monster, and they *still* manage to gently caress it up. Beast poisons everything it touches. Which is why my theoretical splat will include the line "And then the first team of magical girls nuked Dark Mother with love and happiness". (Magical girls will have only started to appear a few years ago because I don't want to deal with ancient secret society stuff.)
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Feb 7, 2017 18:05
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SirPhoebos posted:I think at this point we have to seriously consider whether McFarland is gaslighting readers. The antagonists in the Beast chapter are some of the thinnest strawmen I've ever seen, so I'm cackling like a loon right now. Doresh posted:Which is why my theoretical splat will include the line "And then the first team of magical girls nuked Dark Mother with love and happiness". Oh come on, don't you want to detail the sordid history of the Black Sakura Plenipotentiary?
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Feb 7, 2017 18:14
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Kurieg posted:Oh come on, don't you want to detail the sordid history of the Black Sakura Plenipotentiary? It is a price I am willing to pay if I can make all the other splats go "WTF is going on?!" even more so than usual.
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Feb 7, 2017 18:22
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Rifts World Book 8: Japan Part 9: ‘We somehow forgot all the other directions’ So now we're going to go through several different priestly OCCs. I have complained in the past about Rifts completely failing to address religion even in circumstances that desperately required it. Now I wish it would shut the gently caress up because Siembieda is so clueless and incapable. This section took me months to write because it is racist and ill-informed, but also unimaginably tedious and repetitive. Now we have the Bishamon Fighting Monk. The what now? I haven’t spent a lot of time reading about the sectarian conflicts within Japan but as far as some cursory searching can tell me, this group is basically something invented whole cloth in Rifts. There was probably some obscure sect they based this on, but now in Rifts Japan they’re “one of the most popular” religious groups active. “Bishamon” is the name of one of the four directional guardians, the guardian of the north. In Rifts Japan the other three have been forgotten, apparently going for unidirectional madness like Zax who carry literature.  The fighting monks wander the countryside, heal the sick and battle demons...with aikido. They’re described as generally very jovial, humble, and willing to pitch in at any level to help out. They pretty much only wear Millennium Tree armor along with a brown robe, and use a two-handed sword or long spear to fight.  the mark of enlightenment is never opening your drat eyes Again we get a list of special training and powers the Bishamon monks have. A lot of these feature lists are cribbed or inspired by Ninjas & Superspies which had some pretty buff character options for an SDC world. For Rifts, they’re just alright. The Bishamon monks have “Chi-Gung” as a way to toughen themselves. They automatically get +90 to SDC...and for 1 PPE every two minutes they can convert all their SDC to MDC. They get the ‘Chi M.D. Death Blow’ (somehow I think this must be a kung-fu medical procedural) and they can select some special martial arts powers at various higher levels. Bishamon monks get a pretty broad selection of psionic powers, mostly those that heal, and decent ISP. PPE is PE x2 which is decent since only one of their powers uses one point every two minutes. They get the special skills of Begging (10%), Fasting (33% to avoid weakening or getting sick after two weeks), Bishamon Meditation (20%) that lets them recover resources at a rapid rate, and “Oriental Philosophies” which is really a choice of Japanese mythology, magic lore, haiku poetry, go, or Zen gardening. To be a Bishamon you must be human, human only, no bumpy-head d-bees even. They receive a selection of monkly skills including the option for Mystic Herbology from England, several changes of clothes, a backpack and some other survival gear and food. They have a Millennium Tree staff and an ancient weapon of choice. They also specifically always have a pouch of medical supplies and 1D6x5 non-magical herbs so have fun going through that stupid list in England and “the character is always interested in healing and magic potions, teas, herbs and ointments.” At 6th level, if they’ve shown sufficient sacrifice, they might get one of the better Millennium Tree staves. At no point does this equipment list mention getting the big sword or spear mentioned in the initial description aside from the one weapon of choice, which is an SDC implement and so useful for applying butter to bread. But not supernatural butter. Money is not a large concern for the Bishamon monks. They might use some loot to better their gear since they are an adventuring class, but otherwise they give it away to the order or sometimes the needy. Also, there are no lady monks, it is just dudes all using Aikido on the monsters. As well, Aikido’s full bonuses are in the back of the book, in a section devoted to various martial art forms. That’s cool and all, it’s just more of Palladium’s schizophrenic organization. Now we’re done with the Bishamon, we get to the sohei warrior monk. Now these were real dudes but they were specifically Buddhist which surely did not escape the writers here-- Rifts Japan posted:
  a rifty rendition of a warrior dervish of some kind  modern re-enactors The historical sohei were more or less the military arm of the Buddhist sects who were not under the jurisdiction of the emperor or the shogun and picked quite a few fights until 1603 when the Tokugawa stability more or less ended the need (and the tolerance) for their existence. They traveled in military groups with portable shrines that tended to keep ordinary non-monk soldiers away from them because committing violence in front of the shrine was a damning offense--unless it was monk-on-monk violence, then it was crushing the non-believers and that was cool. Rifts sohei are described more or less exactly like Bishamon monks, being lone wanderers who travel around helping people out, babysitting the kids or fighting demons or whatever. We get some more of those lovely bafflingly specific stats--a typical temple will have 2D4 jodo masters at 1D4+9th level (yeesh), 4D6 experienced monks (1D4+5th level), 6D6 young monks (1D4+1 level), 1D4x10 1st level scrub monks and 1D6x10 novices with 1D4 years of training to go. Two large monasteries as well as a Bishamon monastery are located within a half mile of the Kyoto Millennium Tree with a big ole shinto complex dominating the tree proper. The sohei and Bishamon have been “friendly rivals” for generations. Man, if there was one thing the sohei did not do, it was friendly rivalry. They are listed as wearing a knotted towel (that’s a weird way to spell ‘cowl’) over their shaved heads, often cut from Millennium leaf, and a white robe with a darker tan or brown outer robe, and carrying a naginata or staff, their ‘signature weapons’. As is coming to be typical of Japan’s layout, Sohei receive a list of martial-arts powers. Theirs is jodo, “The way of the staff.” Rifts asserts that this was developed because the staff isn’t considered a weapon and so anyone can use and have one. This is false--it’s true the Tokugawa banned all non-samurai from carrying weapons of war, but part of that ban was because of the sohei, who pretty much carried the same kinds of weapons the samurai did. Jodo Training
They also get the Chi M.D. Death Blow (this will never not be funny to me), and a choice of one body hardening power at level 1. They also get the begging and fasting skills plus feng shui which permits evaluation of PPE flows in an area, including good/evilness, natural or not, and when people are using it. At least, if you can make the 15%+5% skill roll. They have sohei meditation and “oriental philosophies” as well, pretty much identically to the Bishamon monks. The sohei have fairly low attribute requirements, a pretty scattered alignment range, and permit non-humans to join--women have their own orders (and separate OCC). Since they don’t have any default way of mystically MDCing themselves up, it’s not a bad idea to choose a naturally MDC race like Wormwood Human. Sohei get a fairly obvious selection of monkly skills, plus jiujitsu (explained later) which can be changed to ‘teng-jutsu’ at the cost of three ‘other’ skill choices. For equipment, they get a suit of MDC armor, typically Millennium-based, at 6th level they get a set of 120M DC bark armor. This is worn under the robes. They have some minimal clothing and supplies, a naginata, the Millennium staff, and that’s about it. At 6th level they might get a cooler Millennium staff. Honestly, making up a few other variant magic staves would have been nice for this book and also for in general. They have almost no money (3D4x10 credits) and tend to be given free food and shelter anywhere they go (at least in the New Empire) and have their material needs met by communities grateful to have them around. The sohei warrior nun comes right after this with a big flop. They’re basically identical to the male version but they learn a few different skills, including cooking and sewing. The sohei females tend to be focused on homestead arts, teaching, crafting and whatever but wandering adventure nuns do exist. Honestly this didn’t need to be a separate class and the sohei on the whole are just markedly inferior to the Bishamon monks--the Bishamon get natural MDC, psionics, healing herbs, the ability to have money of their own, and the magic staff guaranteed, and aikido is grossly overpowered even (and perhaps especially) compared to 'teng-jutsu'.  not a monastery The last priestly OCC is the Yamabushi Mountain Priest. These guys are followers of the Shugendō religion, which is a syncretic mystery religion that focuses heavily on ascetic discipline in order to seek enlightenment. Another term for followers of this religion is familiar: shugenja. The yamabushi tend to focus on oneness with nature through various tests or trials of discipline. The book gets this much more or less right, then immediately compares them to western druids.  This is one of those weird classes that is described as being mostly non-combat. The yamabushi maintain no temples or monasteries and wander alone through the countryside, assisting the people they meet along the way as followers of peace. They will sometimes join small groups of adventurers just to see where the wind carries them, and some of the more towny members of the New Empire think they’re uncouth unwashed mountain weirdoes, which is accurate, and they’re also suspicious of the yamabushi accepting basically anything into their order, and consorting with tengu, goblins, fairies--basically whatever walks the earth and doesn’t try to kill them.In this respect they can be useful to rural communities by trying to find nonviolent solutions to disputes. For this reason apparently they are widely feared by various demons and oni.  These guys (they’re not all guys I guess but in general) tend to go for the hobo-chic, with fairly ragged clothing, poor hygiene, long hair worn loose and plenty of trail dirt and clinging grass. They don’t have any particular uniform to identify them.They get supernatural powers of course, that’s the whole point. These powers use PPE though they are expressed as not being “magic” in the classical sense. W’ev.
Phew, that seems to be it for this stupid class’s powers. These are so random and weird and often useless and they take up multiple pages of rambly nonsense. Further statistical data: they get normal mediocre PPE, some bonuses to save vs Horror Factor, possession, and elemental magic and they can’t be psionic. Oh wait, there’s a couple more:
 Equal split between men and women, generally scrupulous or unprincipled, no minimum attributes. Any race may become yamabushi if they really want to eat rocks and sit on rocks and look closely at rocks for days at a time. They get some various selections from Siembieda’s idea of medieval Japanese skills, a few other sorts of skills, a small pouch filled with 20-30 small stones (BUT NO MORE), clothes, no starting armor, several empty sacks (MORE STONES), a backpack (not for stones), water skin and rations. For weapons they get a skinning knife, butcher knife, a small combat knife, a frying pan, grappling hook and cord (for climbing), mallet and wood or iron stakes (for climbing), small hand axe (for chopping wood and climbing), wood or iron staff, and weapon of choice (reflective of WP) (for climbing) They get no money and no cybernetics because they are rolling monks who acquire no moss. This class is nuts, packed with useless and weird powers based on an esoteric minor sect in Japan. I mean doing some background research for the write-up, the faith they’re sort of inspired by sounds interesting in its way but not nearly this insane and I can’t help but wonder what old orientalist book on Japanese religions Siembieda dug out of early 90s Wisconsin to come up with this writeup. Probably from the same place he got his dictionary. There’s also no non-wandering priest class, all religion is itinerant I guess. Next time: Another OCC and their mysteeeeelious arts.
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Feb 7, 2017 18:27
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Doresh posted:Which is why my theoretical splat will include the line "And then the first team of magical girls nuked Dark Mother with love and happiness". 
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Feb 7, 2017 18:45
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it really baffles me that heroes are supposed to be antagonists and beasts are supposed to be protagonists i certainly wouldn't assume that if i hadn't been explicitly told and even knowing that it feels weird, like do the writers know?
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Feb 7, 2017 18:48
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Evil Mastermind posted:That doesn't sound very mature or adult to me. How can you even do serious roleplaying with that kind of idea? 
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Feb 7, 2017 18:50
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Meguca Menuca will be specifically not used as an inspiration. Aside from probably using "Meguca" as a term for evil magical girls.Evil Mastermind posted:That doesn't sound very mature or adult to me. How can you even do serious roleplaying with that kind of idea? Beast had so much edge it tore a rip into a different, more lighthearted reality.
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Feb 7, 2017 18:53
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The storm has a name... - Let's Read TORG Part 16g: Off the beaten path At this point, there's only three chapters left in the book plus the templates, so let's just get through them because these three chapters are literally only 13 pages all told. And of course, these 13 pages are about what you're actually supposed to do in the Living Land. The Designing Adventures in the Living Land chapter itself is only five pages long (one of which is a full-page illustration), setting the tone for the rest of the game line. To make things worse, a solid page of this chapter is reiterating the whole "Earth is invaded by other realities, each reality has its own tone, here's how you remove stelae and restore hope" thing that's already detailed in the main book. Seriously, we get it! I've got the core set, I already know all this! Ugh. They do that in a lot of the books, actually. I just never really point it out but it's really hard to ignore here, where they're wasting space with stuff that's from the core instead of giving me stuff I can use. Part of me wishes it was practical to c&p the whole "chapter" into this post so you can see how useless it is, but instead I'll have to pick and choose. quote:The Living Land is based in part on the fictional lands of the Lost World, created by Arthur Conan Doyle, and Pellucidar, created by Edgar Rice Burroughs (who also wrote the Tarzan and John Carter of Mars books). Although the Living Land has some important differences from these two places,which will be discussed shortly, there is a wealth of similarities that can act as a guide for the gamemaster. If you've got the time, go out and get some books by the above authors. You'll find them very inspirational for creating adventures set in the Living Land. If you don't have time, here are the main points of adventures set in places like the Living Land and the Lost World. I assume they wanted us to go get those books because they sure didn't spend a lot of time thinking of ideas for themselves. The point they hammer home the hardest is that the Living Land is every trip into the realm should be a trip into the unknown. While it's incredibly easy to get into the Living Land, the challenge lays in getting out in one piece. The Deep Mist obscures everything, making every shadow a potential threat. A large number of creatures in the realm look like normal plants...up until the point where they attack you. Everything familiar (buildings, wrecked vehicles, landmarks) are made alien due to damage and the overgrowth of the jungle.  Like this, but foggier. Unfortunately, the only advice we get on how to make this come to life is "go read those books". Even for creating actual adventures, they only give three basic hooks for "lost world" adventures:
 For example, you can help your friends move! Oh, but don't worry; once you cycle through those three concepts you can start adding complications to keep things fresh! Like...uh, copying the plot of Doyle's The Lost World. Or Tarzan at the Earth's Core. Basically, go read something else and do that. quote:New plots can directly effect the player characters or can be something outside of their own concerns that they can become involved in. An example of the former is if their vehicle crashes far into the interior of the Living Land and they have to escape on foot. An example of the latter is if the group comes across a resistance community being harassed by survivalists and the heroes help defend the community. I'm starting to see why they didn't use the place much. Anyway, the next chapter is three Locations in the Living Land that people can run around and do things in. Really these are sample adventures so I don't know why they're not called such. The first one is "The Valley of the Uscranta", which is notable because it contains a tree that's an eternity shard. The first trick is finding the valley in the first place. quote:On a piece of paper, draw two lines across the page. Label each of the three sections created as Area One, Area Two, and Area Three. Ask the players if they want their characters to explore Area One, Two, or Three. The second location is "The Altar on Lake Michigan", which is one of the major sacrificial sites used by the gotaks in the Eastern Land. The altar is set up in an observatory on the Northeastern University campus, and rituals are performed there most nights. Both gotaks and Jakatts operate out of the structure; the Jakatts aren't too happy about it, but see the structure as only a little blasphemous due to being open to the sky. There's not much to do here; it's just a place to go blow up and free prisoners from. The third location is "The Sword of Cochulain and the Uptown Express", and is basically an excuse to use the three New York gangs described in the previous chapters. quote:Buried in a subway tunnel in Manhattan is the Sword of Cuchulain, forged by Cregory Augusta in ancient Ireland for his king. The sword was found in a burial mound in 1902 and was kept at the College of Dublin until just before Earth was invaded, when it was brought to New York's Metropolitan Museum of Art with an exhibit about Ireland.  Ugh, another boring documentary. The final chapter is Adventure Ideas, and it's just a few rough outlines for "standard" Living Land adventures. The first idea is what ended up becoming the Default Living Land Adventure: escorting a convoy through the Living Land to survivor colonies. The twist on this one is that there's a resistance colony in the area, and people are competing to report it for a government reward. The next outline is based around the idea that the PCs catch word of an infantry unit in Philly that's going to try and take out a Jakatt tribe. The problem is that the tribe in question is actually working against Kaah (apparently one of the PCs just "knows" this), and the further problem is that high command knows the tribe is friendly. The idea is that the platoon is going to the tribe under the pretense of joining up for an attack on Kaah's forces, then mowing the tribe down and filming it to show as a rah-rah "we're beating the lizards!" propaganda film. The third and fourth ideas are pretty straightforward; a race against Kaah's forces for an eternity shard, and rescuing an expedition. Nothing to really comment on. The fifth adventure seed actually brings in the other High Lords: a small contingent of Cyberpapal agents are posing as "normal" Christians and are hiring Storm Knights to escort them into New York City. Their ultimate goal is to steal the altar crucifix from St. Patrick's Cathedral, but sadly we're not told what their cover story is. This one is basically an escort mission with a betrayal at the end. And...that's the end of the book, really. All that's left are the character templates. The Living Land is a little unusual in this regard because a lot of the templates from the realm book are actually Core Earthers (okay, Americans) who are tied to the Living Land in some way, shape, or form. Since I'll be covering Core Earth in a brief "here's the basics" post before we move on to the last three realms, I'll deal with a bunch of those templates there to pad my word count. For now, I'll just deal with the Living Land focused characters. The core set only had two real "Living Land" templates:  The Realm Runner was always good with cars. She's the quintessential grease monkey, always tinkering with any vehicle she can get her hands on. When the invasion happened, she learned that she was one of the people who could keep tech working in areas where it shouldn't. That's an ability that's in high demand nowadays. And really, the only thing better than fixing cars is driving them. She starts with a beat-up ride of her choice, tools and spare parts. Her tag skill is either land vehicles, air vehicles, or water vehicles.  The Renegade Edeinos used to be loyal to Baruk Kaah, and followed the will of Lanala as handed down by the Saar. But Kaah's ways always sat wrong with him. First it was the gotaks, then when the edeinos came to this new world Kaah chose to starve out the enemy tribes rather than fighting. But when told to use the dead things called "rifles" taken from the humans, he brought his concerns to his optant...and was almost killed for his troubles. Now he's escaped his tribe and is exploring the new sensations available to him in this new world of "Earth". He starts with a hrockt spear, a loincloth for some reason, a musical greeting card, and a TMNT t-shirt. His tag skill is melee weapons. The realm book added a few more options, which is to say it added some options. There are a few Core Earth templates I'm not listing, simply because they don't have anything specific to do with the Living Land. I'll cover them when I cover Core Earth itself.  The Big Game Hunter is actually pretty okay with the whole invasion thing. Used to be, to hunt dangerous game he had to head to Africa or something; now he barely has to leave his front yard. What's more, the creatures crawling around the Living Land are much more impressive (and much more dangerous) than the stuff he's been hunting his whole life. He starts with a bunch of survivalist gear, a rifle, and his tag skill is tracking.  The Earther Gone Native used to be, well, normal. He played sports in high school, loved the rush of action and the thrill of victory. Then, well, time happened. He got an office job, settled down, started to let himself go. Then the invasion happened. But unlike most of the people affected by it, he realized the changes were breathing new life into him, letting him appreciate life more. He's an ardent follower of Keta Kalles, but as a recent convert he can see Kaah for what he truly is. He starts with a hrockt shoot club and a hrockt shoot spear, and his tag skill is direction sense.  The Gang Member grew up on the streets of New York, in one of the neighborhoods where you pretty much had to join up with a gang to survive. He did a lot of things he's not proud of, but when the lizards invaded he had to start doing a hell of a lot worse. New York is almost literally "kill or be killed" nowadays, and his time is split between keeping his own turf safe and protecting people who come into the city to salvage stuff to fight the dinos with. He gets a leather jacket, switchblade, and "gang colors", and his tag skill is lock picking.  The Edeinos Gone Native is a reminder that transformation works both ways; this is actually a Core Earth template and operates under those axioms. He left his tribe to learn more about the humans, but somehow lost his connection to Lanala (and the Living Land in general), but the trade-off is an increased understanding of "dead things". These devices no longer seem evil, and in fact are capable of providing excitement and sensations beyond anything he ever dreamed of. He's a "noble savage in a strange land" , and starts with a long bow, some grenades and a loving minigun. His tag skill is fire weapons. Yes, I know you've seen this before. The Inquisitive Stalenger has been travelling as part of Baruk Kaah's tribe as it's brought the word of Lanala to new worlds. But as exciting as it is to be a Jakatt, it's even more exciting to examine these humans and their amazing new experiences. Things like music, and clothing, and televisions. But by communicating with the humans, it's learned what Kaah's crusade is really about. It doesn't start with any items apart from some Core Earth souvenirs, but it does have one of my favorite character quotes: quote:"Let's listen to that Rolling Stones circle again."  The Edeinos Tech Prodigy is another transformed edeinos, although this one's circumstances are different. He was captured by human soldiers early in the invasion, and transformed when brought to a military outpost in Core Earth. He became fascinated with machines after watching a soldier fix a jeep, and actually started befriending the soldiers when Kaah's counterattack happened. Now he fights to protect his new home from his former master. He starts with a bunch of tools, a .44 Magnum, and various Core Earth trinkets. His tag skill is scholar (mechanical engineering).  The National Guardsman found out that he was P-rated the hard way: he was the only guy in his unit whose gun didn't jam when fighting the lizards. That wasn't enough to stop his home from being overrun by the edeinos, so now he's getting his revenge one dead lizard at a time. This guy starts pretty well kitted out, with Kevlar armor, an M-16, and a bunch of survival gear. His tag skill is fire combat.  The New York Cop is one of the few survivors of being at the first invasion point, and it's only because he was the only person around who could get his car to work. In the new post-invasion New York, he's focused on protecting what little territory isn't already controlled by the gangs or the lizards. He took a vow to serve and protect, and by God that's what he's going to do. The standard cop loadout's a little beefier since the invasion: bullet-proof vest, .38 revolver, nightstick, walkie talkie, and (for some reason) his ticket book. His tag skill is evidence analysis.  The Profiteer isn't an rear end in a top hat, he's just practical. There are people stuck in the Living Land who need food and supplies brought to them on a regular basis, resistance colonies that need guns and ammo, but what none of them realize is that all that poo poo costs money. And you gotta spend money to make money, right? Plus you got expenses, you gotta hire bodyguards and guides...that stuff affects the prices, you know? This guy starts with a big rig, a few guns, and $500 cash. His tag skill is persuasion.  The Royal Mountie is having an easier time than most law enforcement types in the States. The invasion left Canada relatively untouched, but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have anything to do. Kaah's efforts to expand his territory need opposing, but fortunately as a Mountie he's trained to survive in the wilderness. Plus his horse is more reliable than a car nowadays. His tag skill is tracking.  The Spartan signed up with the military to serve his country, and got his chance when the invasion happened. The Delphi Council recruited him to go on deep operations into the realm. Only now he's hearing these rumors about some of the stuff the Council's been up to, like killing human survivors and blaming it on the edeinos. He hasn't been asked to cross any lines, though...yet. He starts with Kevlar armor, some guns as well as some primitive weapons (a bow, a spear), a compass that's useless, and polarized sunglasses. His tag skill is persuasion. Yes, they use the same picture for both stalenger templates. What do you want? It's a flying starfish. The Stalenger Optant is a follower of Lanala who revels in every sensation it experiences. It's also realized that Kaah is perverting the worship of Lanala for his own ends, and has heard Her calls for revenge. So it has joined with these new beings that oppose the High Lord, and as a result has begun opposing the Saar. It starts with no gear, but has one of my other favorite character quotes: quote:"If you want a real experience, I recommend running head first into that tree."  The Tech Wiz has been tinkering with technology since she was a kid. But when the Living Land happened, technology stopped working...for everyone else, anyway. But things still work when she's around, and in the current post-invasion world that is a very valuable commodity. She starts with various tools, spare parts, and an AK-47, and her tag skill is scholar (electrical or mechanical engineering).  The Vengeful Human is a survivor. But not by choice. Her home was overrun by the lizards, but for some reason she was the only survivor. She's lost her family, and now all she has is a desire for revenge and a death wish. All that matters is killing the lizards, and no matter what happens she'll never kill enough. She starts the game with a bunch of weapons, and her tag skill is unarmed combat. And with that we finish up with the Living Land. That was a quick one, wasn't it? But as always, before we go we're going to take a look into the future of Baruk Kaah and see how the metaplot treats him. As stated many times before, Kaah becomes the whipping boy of the whole game line because nobody liked adventuring in the Living Land. I'm sure part of that was pre-planned due to metaplot, but even so Kaah starts suffering setbacks pretty much from day one. In the first 18 months of the invasion, Kaah actually manages to lose two of his three bridges: the one at Sacramento is lost when 3327 destroys the stelae zone closest to San Francisco, and the the entire Northern Realm in Canada is taken down by Storm Knights. On top of that, his Darkness Device, Rec Pakken, has actually betrayed him twice without him realizing it. That's not to say that Kaah doesn't have some wins; he starts expanding both of the Lands in the States inwards towards the Midwest, dropping another bridge on the Wyoming/Colorado border and actually getting his own borders to the outside borders of the Dakotas. Despite that, Kaah still skirmishes with the other High Lords. He hates 3327 for taking part of his territory, Mobius keeps sending teams into New York to hunt for eternity shards, and in the near future Malraux sets up shop around Boston. When the Northern Land falls, the edeinos start turning against Kaah as they see this as a sign of weakness. Within a year, a Death-worshiping edeinos attempts to usurp Kaah and seize Rec Pakken for himself. The coup fails, but it's a further drain on Kaah's resources. He soon loses Denver, and that becomes a major rallying point for Core Earth forces. What's worse, he ends up losing drat near all his maelstrom bridges, cutting him off from his home cosm and any reinforcements he could get. Kaah starts taking bigger and bigger risks as his power base starts to erode, and begins losing territory as a result. But his biggest setback will come in just under two years, when a major metaplot-related geological event destroys all of the Eastern Land and a sizable chunk of North America.  Holy poo poo. Eventually, Kaah realizes that Rec Pakken is basically out to get him, and this is the final straw that changes Kaah from "failed conqueror" to "omnicidal maniac". He convinces the Darkness Device to transform itself into a portable shape so he can take it to a "new master". Instead, Kaah brings Rec Pakken deep under the Earth to a strange multifacited crystal called "The Nexus of All Realities" and attempts to throw the Darkness Device into it. His theory is that throwing the thing into the thing will destroy the entire Core Earth cosm and all the other High Lords because he's sick of all their bullshit. Instead, Rec Pakken vanishes to parts unknown when it hits the crystal, and Kaah is pulled into the crystal because Reasons. The last he is seen, he's being ripped apart across all known realities.  Believe it or not, this is the most impact he's had on the metaplot in years. And that is the end Baruk Kaah. OR IS IT? It's not. By the way; that last plot point? That was only described in the newsletter. If you didn't subscribe to the monthly newsletter, then the only other way you'd learn Kaah was gone was to get the second or third metaplot update books, and even then they didn't give you the details. The inherent assumption by the writers that everyone was reading everything they put out really comes into focus here. With Kaah "dead", the Living Land begins to collapse rapidly. All the bridges to Takta Ker are destroyed, and while it's not eliminated completely when the game line ends, it's only a matter of time before it's wiped out. By the end of the game line the Living Land realm is barely a footnote in the game line it helped kick off. The only real dangling plotline is what happened to Rec Pakken: it popped up again in the Western Realm, but by the time the game line ended it hadn't picked a new High Lord. ---- And there we go. The most wasted potential in the entire game line, a realm that came out of the gate strong and actually started petering out before they even hit the end of the book. I mean, I don't even have much to say about the realm as a wrap-up because there's so little there. I mean, yes, there are great idea in there; the non-human races, the whole religion of Keta Kalles, Kaah's constant expansion, but it seems like the ink had barely dried before they just lost interest in the realm. It didn't help that even the creators couldn't think of interesting things to do there beyond "go find stuff, I guess?". But before we actually finish up with the Living Land, we gotta address the elephant in the room. We gotta talk about Skippy.  Oy. Skippy first appeared in the Character Collection, which was a book of pregenerated characters/NPCs. Skippy is an edeinos who's "gone native" and flipped to Core Earth reality, and through means never really explained becomes a sort of mascot for "good" edeinos for humanity. Skippy also owns what's believed to be the crown of King Pellinore, whoever that is. I think it has something to do with Aysle but honestly the whole concept of Skippy the Edeinos is so goddamn stupid I can't care enough to check. Skippy becomes famous somehow, to the point where they're making action figures of him. He ends up getting killed in an appropriately stupid way. quote:In the end, Skippy was slain, not in combat with the minions of High Lords, but in the middle of a private war. Ensign Egypt, the Keefee Haroo sidekick of Nile Mystery Man Colonel Cairo, had shifted inclination to Evil and begun plotting his mentor's death. One of his attempts involved planting a time bomb in a building and then luring the Colonel there. Egypt's work was interrupted by Skippy, who helpfully pointed out that the Keefee's clock was set to the wrong time. Skippy corrected the "error" and perished in the ensuing explosion. --- Hey. Do you all realize where we are now? That's right: we've finally, finally finished the last of the realms from the core set. All six invading realities have been covered in more depth than I like to think about. So that means we're done, right? Hahahahahanooooooooo. See, once all the realms were covered, West End still needed to keep the supplement train a-rollin'. And since you can only put out so many adventure modules and gear books before those wells run dry, three more realms showed up to start loving with the status quo. Hey, remember in the first book how the Gaunt Man needed seven invading realities to overcome Earth's natural resistance? And how since one of them didn't make it, we hit this state of equilibrium? And as such, adding three more would logically tip the balance the other way? No? That's okay, the writers didn't either! So yeah, we have three more books to cover before we get to War's End, the metaplot-capping adventure. Before that, though, we're going to take a quick stop in Core Earth to cover the basic there and hit a few more metaplot points before we start chugging through the back half of the game line. Y'all ain't seen nothin' yet. NEXT TIME: Oh yeah, technically Core Earth is a realm.
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Feb 7, 2017 19:12
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Wait, the Realm Runner can "keep tech working in places it shouldn't"? How? The only method you've described that'd keep modern technology from just rusting away in the Living Land is making a reality bubble, and that costs 1 XP per 15 minues.
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Feb 7, 2017 19:31
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Zereth posted:Wait, the Realm Runner can "keep tech working in places it shouldn't"? How? The only method you've described that'd keep modern technology from just rusting away in the Living Land is making a reality bubble, and that costs 1 XP per 15 minues. Regardless, yes, if the Realm Runner was in a pure zone then it's 1 Possibility = 15 minutes of item use. If it's a mixed realm then they just risk disconnecting on a roll of 1. They're just describing it all from the point of view of characters who didn't get how P-rated people could keep items outside their expected tech axioms working.
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Feb 7, 2017 19:34
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The Darkness Devices have separate motivations from the High Lords? Are they all slaved to the Gaunt Man or something?
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Feb 7, 2017 19:40
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Glazius posted:The Darkness Devices have separate motivations from the High Lords? There are a few exceptions; for instance while Drakacanus, the Darkness Device of Aysle, could have reconnected with Uthorion once he got a new body. But since Uthorion screwed up and lost control of the realm, Drakacanus is pretty much leaving him stranded and powerless. Likewise, if 3327 ever failed to earn a profit, then his Darkness Device would abandon him in a hot second. It's something that doesn't come up often because the Devices are more plot devices than NPCs.
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Feb 7, 2017 20:09
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I feel strongly that Pharaoh Dr. Mobius' device should be Hitler's brain in a pyramid-shaped jar inside a crocodile idol on top of a robot.
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Feb 7, 2017 20:12
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Halloween Jack posted:I feel strongly that Pharaoh Dr. Mobius' device should be Hitler's brain in a pyramid-shaped jar inside a crocodile idol on top of a robot. And the robot is a giant sphinx that can vomit out biplanes.
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Feb 7, 2017 21:15
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That reminds me that when TORG 2E actually comes out I may have to run: ESCAPE FROM CROCODILOPOLIS Because of course Moebius would turn Fayum back into Crocodilopolis if at all possible.
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Feb 7, 2017 21:16
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Doresh posted:And the robot is a giant sphinx that can vomit out biplanes. Ridden by Two-Tank Omen.
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Feb 7, 2017 21:21
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Halloween Jack posted:
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Feb 7, 2017 22:31
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Strange Matter posted:So what I'm getting from that is that Das Tragheit is basically the result of a player super min-maxing his character to be able to do exactly one thing that can kill anybody without Zed resistance. What a jerk.
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Feb 7, 2017 22:47
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Evil Mastermind posted:You laugh, but some of the NPCs in Progenitor were basically Greg Stolze seeing how badly he could break the Wild Talents power system in terms of dealing damage in one capacity or another.
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Feb 7, 2017 22:53
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Strange Matter posted:So what I'm getting from that is that Das Tragheit is basically the result of a player super min-maxing his character to be able to do exactly one thing that can kill anybody without Zed resistance. What a jerk. The one who really scares me is Der Schildkröte (The Turtle). His power was to create and control invincible force bubbles. As a hardened combat veteran, he had no compunction about creating bubbles inside people and expanding them. Mechanically, touch-only powers are hard to use in Godlike. Talent powers require concentration, so you either have to first succeed on a hand-to-hand attack to grab your target, or make a multiple action. Idunno if any supplements provide his character sheet, but his power could be simulated by a specialized Disintegrate. (Disintegration is expensive and touch-only by default. But it doesn't deal damage; if it works, the target is just gone.) There are some stats provided in the corebook, and I'll discuss the design sense behind them. Halloween Jack fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Feb 7, 2017 |
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Feb 7, 2017 22:54
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Really digging the TORG illustration aesthetic of "drawings from the margins of a Class of '86 high school yearbook (P.S. MAIDEN RULEZ)"
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Feb 8, 2017 00:15
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occamsnailfile posted:Rifts World Book 8: Japan Part 9: ‘We somehow forgot all the other directions’ Look, Siembieda did the research, he read both the Player's Handbook and Oriental Adventures. 
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Feb 8, 2017 00:29
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Chernobyl Peace Prize posted:Including the biggest disaster of the late 20th century in-setting, the "this is what you can make if you just designed someone with a very simple, very limited power, very horrible power" (the robo seed guy). Simian_Prime posted:Really digging the TORG illustration aesthetic of "drawings from the margins of a Class of '86 high school yearbook (P.S. MAIDEN RULEZ)" 
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Feb 8, 2017 00:33
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I think a major handicap the Living Land had from the start is that if you're going to make a setting that's almost entirely focused on the landscape, you have to make the landscape interesting. Whether that means inventing an intensely detailed but interestingly insane monster-based ecology or putting crystal caves and giant glowing dinosaur ghost graveyards every four feet, it's up to you, but you have to make it interesting because almost all the politics and factions in the Living Land are either really simple (the edeinos you encounter are/are not assholes) or brought in from outside, and that means the cosm itself has to provide a lot of the fascination. And the best they can do is make it inconvenient in a very restrictive and dull way ('things a, b, and c do not work here and will never be permitted' - I guess that's a TORG problem in general, but nowhere gets it like here) and fill it with a bunch of creature cruft that could be D&D leftovers for all I can tell. So all you can really do in there is the oldest lost world plot imaginable: escape it, sometimes with refugees/a generic shiny. And there aren't even that many things that can BE the shiny, because the cosm prohibits dead stuff/worked objects. Evil Mastermind posted:
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Feb 8, 2017 01:40
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quote:Instead, Kaah brings Rec Pakken deep under the Earth to a strange multifacited crystal called "The Nexus of All Realities" and attempts to throw the Darkness Device into it. I wasn't gonna point out that the Nexus of All Realities is named after where Howard the Duck and Man-Thing live in the comics until I saw that Death & Return of Superman reference. Tho I already like Skippy better than that plot. He's a dinosaur who rides a motorcycle! Does he surf? I wrote a song about surfing dinosaurs. Wait is the Living Land TORG's version of The Savage Land from X-Men?
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Feb 8, 2017 01:58
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occamsnailfile posted:
Michigan not Wisconsin, we're mainly drunks but not that deranged.
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Feb 8, 2017 03:31
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Count Chocula posted:I wasn't gonna point out that the Nexus of All Realities is named after where Howard the Duck and Man-Thing live in the comics until I saw that Death & Return of Superman reference. Tho I already like Skippy better than that plot. He's a dinosaur who rides a motorcycle! Does he surf? I wrote a song about surfing dinosaurs. quote:Wait is the Living Land TORG's version of The Savage Land from X-Men?
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Feb 8, 2017 03:41
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Evil Mastermind posted:Yes, but without the mutants, lost civilizations, or anything that made the Savage Lands interesting. 
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Feb 8, 2017 03:52
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Humbug Scoolbus posted:Michigan not Wisconsin, we're mainly drunks but not that deranged. Palladium was formed in Detroit and is now in Westland, Michigan, yeah. Wisconsin was TSR, though, so I wouldn't sell your state short. Evil Mastermind posted:Yes, but without the mutants, lost civilizations, or anything that made the Savage Lands interesting. Needs more pterodactyl vampires, certainly.
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Feb 8, 2017 03:56
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I'm not saying that everything Sauron has done is justified, but you have to admire his commitment to his principles.
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Feb 8, 2017 05:05
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Doresh posted:It is a price I am willing to pay if I can make all the other splats go "WTF is going on?!" even more so than usual. Most of them are probably just going to go "loving Mages" for a while.
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Feb 8, 2017 09:06
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You could just give the Living Lands the aesthetic from the Monster Hunter games. I guess their technology is slightly higher than Forced Primitivism but a lot of it is biological living weapon poo poo.
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Feb 8, 2017 10:11
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SirPhoebos posted:I think at this point we have to seriously consider whether McFarland is gaslighting readers.  Hunter: Tooth and Nail – Part Two: Gaslighting the Reader So now we have the intro fiction out of the way, I can show you the cover art!  Discount Cthulhu fighting a Hunter in a hospital. I think they're meant to be from the last Compact in the book, the Merrick Institute, so that makes this a dream hospital  The point is that the art sucks. The Hunter's expression is one of mild surprise and concern, and the poses are extremely stiff and have no action lines. It's not very good. You can see the outline of Cthulhu's dong, though, if you're interested. You weirdo.In as far as the book is divided into sections, it has the fluff up front, the crunch in the middle, and the new Compacts at the back. Most of this part is going to be about the fluff, and the first part of the fluff section is all about what Beasts really are. Something to note is that the three Hunter books dealing with Vampires, Werewolves/Spirits, and Mages – Night Stalkers, Spirit Slayers, and Witch Finders – were very much toolboxes that you could use to construct whatever kind of vampire, werewolf, or magician you wanted for your game. Vampire: the Requiem Vampires aren't repelled by holy symbols, and Werewolf: the Forsaken Werewolves don't spread their condition by biting humans, but the books weren't necessarily detailing the Vampires and Werewolves from the official game lines, and you could easily make a vampire or werewolf who had those traits and weaknesses if you wanted to, with the books' support and blessing. Tooth and Nail is not like that. For all that it and the Beast core book claim that Beasts represent some sort of universal archetype in the human consciousness, Tooth and Nail has to spend quite a lot of space explaining to you, very specifically and in a manner that brooks no argument, exactly what a Beast is and what they do. This is emphatically not a 'design your own Beast' book; if you want to try to use this book to create a kraken or dragon that's a kraken or dragon in the real world (not just the spirit of a monster hanging out in some poor schmuck's head), or a Beast that just loving eats people like a good monster, instead of trying half-heartedly to teach some hinky lesson to humans about the nature of fear or something, you're looking in the wrong place. You could use some of the mechanics in this book to represent a monster like that, but unlike with the three Hunter books I mentioned above, this book has a very clear idea of what a Beast is, and doesn't offer any kind of support for deviating from this idea. If you want your Hunters to just go on a trip to Crete to kill the offspring of the Minotaur, you'd probably be better off using different NWoD books, like Predators from Werewolf or something, or even just the basic monster making rules and Dread Powers from the Chronicles of Darkness core book. So what is a Beast, then? You can find out in depth in Kurieg's Beast: the Primordial F&F, because Tooth and Nail presents basically the same information. Just be sure to heed that content warning, though. Beasts have monster souls made from nightmare-stuff, but they look human; they have powers based largely on fear; they are defined by a specific sort of hunger, that's individual to each Beast; they have lairs, which are somewhat psychoreactive and are coloured by the nature of the strongest Beast (or other supernatural entity) in the area, and you have to destroy the lair to actually permanently kill the Beast; they think of all the other monsters, weirdoes, and assorted supernatural flotsam and jetsam of the World of Darkness as “one huge family, with Beasts at the centre.” The section that talks about family is interesting, actually; although there's nothing inherently supernatural about most Hunters, many Beasts apparently think of Hunters as kin too, and while “even the most jaded Beast can at least understand why hunters take up the Vigil,” they regard the profit- or pleasure-motivated actions of groups like Cheiron or Ashwood Abbey as betrayal of one's family. Why Hunters, who as I said are mostly just ordinary people, are seen by Beasts as family is a mystery, but probably not an intentional one on the part of the designers. As you'll see later, the group that gets singled out most for the "We Are Family" treatment is the Lucifuge (aka the Conspiracy of people descended from Demons), which makes no sense given how Beasts react to Demons themselves, but that's a subject we'll tackle when we get to it. This section also assumes a lot about the nature of Beasts in relation to the human world, especially the conceit that, compared to other types of monsters, Beasts are actually kind of harmless. We know this to be quite false, but Tooth and Nail makes quite some hay with the idea that Beasts aren't inherently violent, Beasts are victims, anything that a Beast does to harm you is either to teach you a lesson or because you wronged it or the broader supernatural “family” in some way. Almost all of the examples in this book where a Beast harms someone are because they harmed the Beast first. The Beast that Zeke killed offscreen in When The Calling Comes, the one that's murdering people, is a rarity; the other example of a Beast that the book acknowledges is just hurting people is in the background fluff for one of the three Compacts, Yuri's Group. The rest of the book treats Beasts as a moral grey area, terrifying but not actually harmful, even when previous sections will blithely say things like “A person who loses a hand to a Beast’s nightmarish hellscape is just as crippled as a person who lost a hand in a tractor accident. Sometimes his hand might still be there, but something in the brain disallows movement,” as if losing the ability to use a hand isn't major harm, or talks about Beasts clawing someone's face off as “a means of terrorising victims.”  A lot goes into presenting Beasts as the moral grey area here, and humanity as the real villains????, which seems a poor approach to a book that is supposed to be presenting Beasts as something for Hunters to go after. Luckily, Tooth and Nail has a more villainous group for you to hunt, whom I've been avoiding mentioning up till now even through elements of their description are mixed in among the bits describing Beasts throughout this whole section. In fact they get a prize paragraph on the very first non-fluff-or-credits page of the book, before we get all but the most vague description of what a Beast actually is or what they do. Here it is:  For all that this description uses the words “things aren't so black-and-white,” the language it's using to describe Heroes is way harsher than that which it's been using to describe Beasts so far, or indeed that Tooth and Nail will use to describe Beasts throughout this whole section. In the “About Heroes” section on page 9, they are compared to governments who sanction torture: quote:Heroes, by virtue of being Heroes, can do no wrong. Heroes internalize this, and it reinforces their darkest traits. This is a world where people redefine torture to excuse their governments’ behavior – clearly, their elected officials are not monsters who torture people. The truth is more complicated than that rationalization, but it’s also far less comfortable. We will see similar comparisons and language later on in the book as well. Again, this language and these metaphors are way more extreme than anything that's being used to describe Beasts. Tooth and Nail is not holding back here on wanting the reader to see Heroes as gung-ho, egotistical, and dangerous to everyone around them, more so than Beasts. It sets this up as a moral dichotomy, with Beasts being less human but Heroes being more destructive. Who is the real enemy, you Hunters? The thing is, if one assumes that Tooth and Nail's target audience is Hunter players who might not own or have ever read Beast: the Primordial, it almost works in this book, entirely because no individual Beast ever gets a write-up of any kind in this book, and nor do any Heroes. You don't get to see how horribly self-absorbed and carelessly destructive to human lives, sanity, and wellbeing individual Beasts as written up in Beast: the Primordial are, so you don't get the sense that all Beasts are (unintentionally) written as being actually humungous dickbags; nor do you get to see how individual Heroes are written up as pretty much always the specific victims of horrible Beast fuckery, and mostly after pretty well-justified revenge (that Heroes are basically Hunters, in other words), so you don't get to see how Heroes in practice usually wind up (again, unintentionally) being far more sympathetic than Beasts. This is a theme you will note throughout this book. It gives the impression of not really being written as a book for Hunters who want to fight Beasts; sticking to Beast's crossover party theme, it's a book for Hunters who want to team up with Beasts, specifically to fight Heroes. Anyway, Heroes. This section mentions that Heroes are sort-of made by Beasts (or is it the other way around? Dun-dun duuuun), but it's extremely coy as to how that happens; only a careful reading of some of the later stuff, in the crunch section, would reveal to a reader who's not familiar with Beast: the Primordial that Heroes are created as victims of Beast predation. The fluff section doesn't mention this at all. It's almost like the writers realised that putting that rather important information in might make Beasts look bad to someone who hasn't already bought the premise of Beast! But that's just crazy talk, obviously. The Heroes section on page 11 (I told you the Hero write-up was dispersed; you need to do a lot of paging back-and-forth to get all the information here) emphasises that they are egotists who believe themselves the centre of their own personal epic, and they have a sense of being “alone and unique in persecution, in their ability, and in willingness to take the fight to the monsters.” quote:To the reader of a Hunter: The Vigil book, this idea should be laughable. But to the Hero, it’s the only possible logic. The write-up seems very much designed to discourage Hunters from working together with Heroes, even though it also says that the Hero rules as presented in Tooth and Nail have been tweaked significantly from those in the Beast core book “to give disproportionate attention to rules that would facilitate engagement with hunters.”  I wonder why it is that Hunters aren't meant to be working with Heroes in a crossover-type situation, even though they both theoretically have the same goals. Surely it cannot be because the writers actually want us to be working with cool, sexy, misunderstood Beasts, instead of mean, dumb, probably sports-playing Heroes? There is also some discussion of Anathemata (I didn't learn ancient Greek just to sit on my hands while someone treats “Anathema” as both a singular and a plural noun. It's singular only; deal with it), the powers Heroes have to weaken Beasts, and how they can only use them on Beasts who aren't currently raging monsters, but are content and well-fed. quote:This often means that Heroes must strike hardest against Beasts causing the least immediate harm. This isn’t too challenging for the Hero – he’s already rationalized everything he’s doing. See what I mean about Beasts always being presented as the victims? And Hunters as the abusers? I genuinely think the target audience for this book is Hunter players and STs who haven't played/read Beast and don't know better, but if it is meant for people familiar with Beast... yeah, SirPhoebos was right. This is 100% trying to gaslight the reader. At the end there's also the same note that appeared in the revised Beast: the Primordial about how some Heroes don't hunt Beasts but do other things. This makes no sense as Heroes are created by Beasts and the principle that creates them supposedly explicitly drives them to kill Beasts, but whatever. We won't touch that one. There's also some stuff about Nightmares and what happens when you die in a dream (spoilers; you don't actually die for reeeeal, Morty, but you can get pretty hosed up and you do lose most of your Willpower). It's not very interesting. You use ghost/spirit rules (so three stats not nine, etc.) and some of the damage you take crosses over when you wake up, downgraded by one level – so aggravated damage becomes lethal, lethal becomes bashing, bashing is ignored. Conditions like Arm Wrack don't follow you back into the real world, though, so that thing the book said earlier about how if a Beast bites your hand off in a dream, you lose the ability to use that hand? Kiiiinda not true, whoops. The book advises you to use Beast: the Primordial and, hilariously, Mage: the Awakening if you want more information on dream rules and the dreaming world, even though some of this stuff outright contradicts Mage's rules about being hurt or killed in the Astral Realms. This entry was originally going to include all of the fluff, but altogether it is probably too long, so I had to cut the second part about how the Compacts and Conspiracies see Beasts for now. Tune in next entry for America's favourite new game show, Hunter: the Vigil Compacts and Conspiracies: What Do They Know [About Beasts]? Do They Know Things? Let's Find Out! (Cheiron  )
The Sin of Onan fucked around with this message at 12:16 on Feb 8, 2017 |
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Feb 8, 2017 10:59
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Tooth and Nail is entirely worth it just for what Cheiron is up to. It's just so perfect.
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Feb 8, 2017 11:05
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The Sin of Onan posted:As you'll see later, the group that gets singled out most for the "We Are Family" treatment is the Lucifuge (aka the Conspiracy of people descended from Demons), which makes no sense given how Beasts react to Demons themselves, but that's a subject we'll tackle when we get to it. And also their powers do not reflect being associated with the titular Demons of that gameline or the God-Machine?
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Feb 8, 2017 11:33
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Zereth posted:Doesn't the Lucifuge claim to be descended from christian-type demons for Actual Hell, which does not describe the PCs in Demon: the Descent at all? You'd think so, but the actual Mortal Remains book makes it fairly clear in its Demon section that the Greater Demons, the demons the Lucifuge are related to, are indeed the Demons of Demon: the Descent. They've got Cover and talk about the God-Machine and there's Angels running around building/maintaining Infrastructure and everything. Trust me, I read that section while I was doing the Lucifuge treatment that you'll see next entry, because I had the same thought as you.
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Feb 8, 2017 11:49
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