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Rand Brittain posted:Imagine if Vampire was written by somebody who literally thought that there was nothing wrong about drinking people's blood and that vampires were cool and froody rebels who were the victims of prejudice by lame, non-sex-having losers who are completely incompetent and terribly evil and dangerous all at once. oh i thought it was about being a big scary monster who has fun being evil and maybe i guess some players could try and play the more tragic "but i want to be good" route that does sound kinda lame
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Apr 24, 2017 19:30
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Xinder posted:oh It's loving horrendous and until the business with V20 and M20 the most disappointing thing OPP and WW had done in recent memory.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:32
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Xinder posted:oh It also has some severe issues in terms of the consistency of its themes, and tries to promote itself as prone to cross-splat compatibility for some reason--to the point of suggesting Hunters are more likely to work with Beasts against the ineffectual-but-somehow-dangerous Heroes that antagonize Beasts. Beast is a goddamn mess.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:48
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Beast should have been called Columbine: The Romanticizing
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Apr 24, 2017 19:48
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Ironslave posted:It also has some severe issues in terms of the consistency of its themes, and tries to promote itself as prone to cross-splat compatibility for some reason--to the point of suggesting Hunters are more likely to work with Beasts against the ineffectual-but-somehow-dangerous Heroes that antagonize Beasts. This sounds really ridiculous to me. If they wanted a game that's all about cross-splat they should have held out for Deviant, which would have made way more sense. Beasts just don't seem like the type who would get along with others. It's why my group learned you don't mix vampires with changelings. Vampires are not nice and they will abuse how naïve the Changelings are and manipulate the poo poo out of them. I love mixing templates but some of them just don't fit together thematically.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:54
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Beasts is basically "I am a hurt individual who believes that I can fix people by causing fear within them, and its okay if I physically abuse/emotionally abuse them, because they deserved thus justifying my entire abusive nature. But oh look there is a group that are against us called Heroes, they are the douchebags of the world who dare to try and stop me. They are jackasses who deserve death.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:57
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Ironslave posted:It also has some severe issues in terms of the consistency of its themes, and tries to promote itself as prone to cross-splat compatibility for some reason--to the point of suggesting Hunters are more likely to work with Beasts against the ineffectual-but-somehow-dangerous Heroes that antagonize Beasts. Most of that can be probably traced to Beast's creator Matt McFarland doubling down on everything Senior Scarybagels said while the rest of the writing staff try to work things in a Vampire-like direction. The Hunter supplement from the Kickstarter ranged from the Union explaining exactly why they're no better than child abusers to Cheiron grinding them up to make super-viagra for Trump.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:02
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Xinder posted:What's the deal with Beast? I fell out a bit before it came out and now that I'm back in I don't understand why the op snubs it. I haven't actually looked at it in detail but I'm curious as to what makes it so bad. At a glance it just seems kinda okay but not that interesting. I have been summoned. http://projects.inklesspen.com/fatal-and-friends/kurieg/beast-the-primordial/ Though that doesn't include the book full of utterly horrible Heroes that are 90% victimized homosexuals by volume and the Double-Beasts who poo poo eggs out of their genitals. Or the book with the beast-viagra for nega-trump.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:02
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Kurieg posted:Or the book with the beast-viagra for nega-trump. That was the good one
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Apr 24, 2017 20:16
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Xinder posted:how naïve the Changelings are Maybe oWoD Changelings, but new Changelings have been slaves to actual soulless monsters and have no real metaphysical questions about the state of their soul. They absolutely know for a fact it's been mutilated. They can also trivially be made of fire, and every single one of them can control fate. Any Vampire that starts messing with Changelings has profoundly hosed up. Profoundly.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:18
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Mulva posted:Maybe oWoD Changelings, but new Changelings have been slaves to actual soulless monsters and have no real metaphysical questions about the state of their soul. They absolutely know for a fact it's been mutilated. They can also trivially be made of fire, and every single one of them can control fate. One of the sample Beasts in Conquering Heroes is one who's best friend was a Changeling. A Changeling who encouraged her friend to accept the fact that she was forever changed and that embracing her newfound power was a good thing. It then goes on to describe how much of a colossally bad idea this was for everyone involved and for those in a 10 mile radius.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:33
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There's an amazingly bad line in Beast just one or two quotes above the one about "what would happen if we removed your masks" re: Demons. I believe the appropriate response is a lengthy "fuuuuuuuuck yooooouuuuu"
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Apr 24, 2017 20:45
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Kurieg posted:Or the book with the beast-viagra for nega-trump. I've filed this idea away for a future Hunter session where the group goes up against Seers of the Throne using testosterone supplements as mind control enhancers under the guise of a Men-aissance in masculinity titled Menergy Corp.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:45
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Emy posted:There's an amazingly bad line in Beast just one or two quotes above the one about "what would happen if we removed your masks" re: Demons. Don't forget that The Gentry are alternately scared shitless of Beasts or think that they're the best thing ever and let them ride along on Wyld Hunts. And that a Beast in the Hedge affects things like a max wyrd changeling or member of the Gentry would.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:51
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Emy posted:There's an amazingly bad line in Beast just one or two quotes above the one about "what would happen if we removed your masks" re: Demons. Hmm... their power is in the blood, now I think about it. Checks out.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:51
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Kurieg posted:Don't forget that The Gentry are alternately scared shitless of Beasts or think that they're the best thing ever and let them ride along on Wyld Hunts. And that a Beast in the Hedge affects things like a max wyrd changeling or member of the Gentry would.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:55
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Beasts are louder, angrier, and have access to a time machine. Whenever they're not on-screen, all the other supernaturals ask "where's the Beast?"
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Apr 24, 2017 20:57
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Rand Brittain posted:Imagine if Vampire was written by somebody who literally thought that there was nothing wrong about drinking people's blood and that vampires were cool and froody rebels who were the victims of prejudice by lame, non-sex-having losers who are completely incompetent and terribly evil and dangerous all at once. Actually it's worse. A vampire can, at least theoretically, feed while minimizing the harm they do. Beasts are all about abusing people to the point of damaging their Integrity, maiming or killing them for minor infractions. The example play in the main book gives an example of a Beast choking a frat boy with a plastic bag to the point he passes out for stealing Halloween candy. It's worth noting in the first draft he was actually a teenager - this was changed, as the readers didn't take it well.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:57
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F&F writeups tend to be overlong but all you need to do is scan over the art to understand that Beast is explicitly an otherkin game
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Apr 24, 2017 20:58
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Nessus posted:Maybe Beasts are actually like little The Gentries? Kind of, but like many things about Beasts, if it's not plain poo poo it's still redundant: high-Wyrd Changelings are already on their way to becoming True Fae.
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Apr 24, 2017 20:59
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Otherkin: The Grudgening
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Apr 24, 2017 20:59
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Basic Chunnel posted:F&F writeups tend to be overlong but all you need to do is scan over the art to understand that Beast is explicitly an otherkin game otherkin by way of Witch Girl Adventures
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Apr 24, 2017 21:55
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Don't make me link that one too. 
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Apr 24, 2017 22:16
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Basic Chunnel posted:F&F writeups tend to be overlong but all you need to do is scan over the art to understand that Beast is explicitly an otherkin game this. on top of feeding on emotional abuse and disproportionate harm, beasts are just ordinary people with a monster's soul in place of their own. their main magical deal is a non-portable magical lair. they are furries: the r9king.
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Apr 24, 2017 23:06
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crime fighting hog posted:I've filed this idea away for a future Hunter session where the group goes up against Seers of the Throne using testosterone supplements as mind control enhancers under the guise of a Men-aissance in masculinity titled Menergy Corp. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRuNxHqwazs
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Apr 25, 2017 00:47
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Oh, having just finished W:tF, don't forget Uratha are super buddy-buddy with Beasts. But if a Beast steps into the shadow, they immediately become ground zero for a maelstrom of pain, suffering and other bad spirits/essence. Which would be aggressively bad for a pack to have happen in their territory as it makes their job harder, and lets every other pack that can sense it know they can't take care of their turf, therefore they are weak and should not be holding onto it.
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Apr 25, 2017 01:55
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All that aside, beasts are kin to werewolves and they get together for HUGE parties
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Apr 25, 2017 02:00
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Nooooope. Maybe Hunters in Darkness, because they love anything that keeps nubby mortals away from sacred places, but basically every other tribe sees Beasts as hazards to be avoided at best and targets of the Siskurh-dah at worst.
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Apr 25, 2017 02:23
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Xinder posted:oh  Beast is so bad at its own elevator pitch that for the most part you don't get to be an actual scary monster in physical form. You feel like a dragon. (A dragon that perpetuates abusive relationships to "teach lessons" but is also supposed to be the good guy.)It absolutely is an unintentional parody of the worst Tumblr otherkin bullshit. It's like someone read nothing but watchful-entity and then said "Yes, this would both be fun to pretend to be and would be complimentary to the subject." Otherkin and Tumblr deserve better.
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Apr 25, 2017 03:44
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it also means there'll never be a good world of darkness splat for being dragons and krakens and poo poo, which kind of sucks
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Apr 25, 2017 04:34
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I noticed in the Monday notes that Geist is in it's second draft. Have we gotten any info on the changes? I know it was one of the less liked splats, but I really enjoyed the idea and the premise of Geists.
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Apr 25, 2017 05:57
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There is a thread on the Onyx Path forums that has some of the changes hinted at by the developer. That's about all that is out there right now.
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Apr 25, 2017 06:33
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Xinder posted:This sounds really ridiculous to me. If they wanted a game that's all about cross-splat they should have held out for Deviant, which would have made way more sense. Beasts just don't seem like the type who would get along with others. It's why my group learned you don't mix vampires with changelings. Vampires are not nice and they will abuse how naïve the Changelings are and manipulate the poo poo out of them. Ironslave posted:Beasts are louder, angrier, and have access to a time machine. Whenever they're not on-screen, all the other supernaturals ask "where's the Beast?"
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Apr 25, 2017 07:58
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Zereth posted:Beasts sure do seem like everybody else would hate them, but they have a magical effect (of the always-on variety) which makes all the other splats have a good impression of them. Except, apparently, Demons.
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Apr 25, 2017 08:05
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Soonmot posted:I noticed in the Monday notes that Geist is in it's second draft. Have we gotten any info on the changes? I know it was one of the less liked splats, but I really enjoyed the idea and the premise of Geists. Will Life Will Change play when we enter the underworld?
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Apr 25, 2017 09:03
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Tasoth posted:Oh, having just finished W:tF, don't forget Uratha are super buddy-buddy with Beasts. But if a Beast steps into the shadow, they immediately become ground zero for a maelstrom of pain, suffering and other bad spirits/essence. Which would be aggressively bad for a pack to have happen in their territory as it makes their job harder, and lets every other pack that can sense it know they can't take care of their turf, therefore they are weak and should not be holding onto it. Aye, no. Beasts may think that, but... WtF: The Pack posted:For their part, werewolves think of Beasts the same way they think of everyone: prey or not-prey. Though Beasts have a talent for ingratiating themselves with supernatural beings, to the People, the Children are often difficult to peg. Some are true monsters, people-eating trolls and gorgons turning victims to stone, all in need of a Siskur-Dah. Others are relatively benign, but packs who encounter Heroes may see the Beast slayers as confirmation that the Begotten have little value, and might see fit to join those Heroes on their hunt.
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Apr 25, 2017 10:26
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It would have made for a better splat crossover if heroes were just, you know, other splats. Hunter being the most obvious, but you can see tons of potential for others (and that Werewolf quote is a perfect setup, or a Guardian of the Veil donning the Heroe's Mask to put down a Beast etc).
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Apr 25, 2017 10:50
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Zereth posted:Beasts sure do seem like everybody else would hate them, but they have a magical effect (of the always-on variety) which makes all the other splats have a good impression of them. Sounds like a medical case of Mary-Suesm if there ever has been any. What a stupid splat.
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Apr 25, 2017 10:58
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The Unlife Aquatic posted:Except, apparently, Demons. More evidence that Demon is objectively the best splat. What's that stereotype quote Beast has for demons? 'What would you do if I took off your mask?' The answer is 'become a sixteen-foot tall mechanical monstrosity with a thousand eyes on my dozen wings, surrounded by rings of fire, yelling 'BE AFRAID' at you.' (gently caress 'BE NOT AFRAID' in this context, even if what's angels are meant to yell.) Demons are even better at turning into actual monsters than Beasts are. Loomer fucked around with this message at 12:24 on Apr 25, 2017 |
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Apr 25, 2017 12:20
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Loomer posted:The answer is 'become a sixteen-foot tall mechanical monstrosity with a thousand eyes on my dozen wings, surrounded by rings of fire, yelling 'BE AFRAID' at you.' (gently caress 'BE NOT AFRAID' in this context, even if what's angels are meant to yell.) Demons are even better at turning into actual monsters than Beasts are. Angels only say BE NOT AFRAID when it's true, and do so because the inherent human reaction to encountering a higher being from a level of existence that is simply beyond them, even aside from the whole flaming wheel thing. Even when they come 'like a son of man' (disguised, basically) they still inspire that raw dread. The idea of a biblical angel that is not sent as a messenger and actually has a very good reason to gently caress you up is the kind of thing that gives me the willies.
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Apr 25, 2017 13:12
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