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Damned goons telling me to not short bitcoin and it drops 30% literally the next day!!!!! 
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Jun 16, 2017 12:39
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Sentient Data posted:Damned goons telling me to not short bitcoin and it drops 30% literally the next day!!!!! That was quite a drop. Still in the black though.
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Jun 16, 2017 17:32
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LethalGeek posted:Anyone who tries to tell me the blockchain is useful for something in computing could just tell me they're an idiot, cause it really is one in the same. I'm friends with someone at Deloitte consulting, they have a whole group doing blockchain stuff. I've never bothered to ask what.
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Jun 16, 2017 18:15
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Burt Sexual posted:I'm friends with someone at Deloitte consulting, they have a whole group doing blockchain stuff. I've never bothered to ask what. When people wave handfuls of cash at you shouting "SELL ME A BLOCKCHAIN! WHATEVER THAT IS!" any good consulting company knows what to do. This is easier than you might think, since the actually good bit is the tamper-evident ledger, and you get that using anything that chains hashes. You could put all your transactions into a Git repository and you'll have a hash that uniquely fingerprints the entire ledger and a hash to identify the version at any given time. (Some "distributed ledger technology" products are pretty much a simplified version of copying Git repositories around. Technically, a shared sheet in Google Docs is "distributed ledger technology.") When blockchain schemes do promise some specific outcome, it's usually the magic of full availability of properly cleaned up and standardised data. The actual problem is cleaning up the data in the first place, or getting legacy systems talking to each other at all; in finance in particular, the back-office systems are decades old and won’t interoperate without tremendous effort. But of course, it turns out "blockchains" won't fix your data for you, and they won't replace your back-office systems without as much work, time and money as any other software replacement project would be. The hype is spectacular bullshit, though. I sat in on one presentation by a Big Four accounting firm on the Blockchain in health care: three blokes (one with a tie, two without) talking about the hypothetical possibilities a blockchain might offer health care in the future, all of which was generic extruded blockchain hype, and much of it Ham Sandwich-level bitcoin hype with the buzzword changed. When an audience member, tiring of this foggy talk, asked if there was anything concrete that blockchains could offer the NHS, they responded that asking for practical uses of Blockchain was "like trying to predict Facebook in 1993." The main takeaway for the health care sector people I was with was swearing never to use said accounting firm for anything whatsoever that wasn’t accounting.
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Jun 16, 2017 20:34
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Isn't a Blockchain like a database then? It's just like, public or something I don't know, and I don't understand it, buy, buy, buy!
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Jun 16, 2017 21:14
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Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:Isn't a Blockchain like a database then? It's just like, public or something Not surprising. This is basically a lot of Silicon Valley investment.
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Jun 16, 2017 21:25
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Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:Isn't a Blockchain like a database then? It's just like, public or something Active Directory I would say is a similar product that exists and functions and does things that's pretty similar in my mind, and i'm sure there are dozens of other examples out there. My job's file repository/database isn't too different either.
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Jun 16, 2017 21:42
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Anyone know approximately how much hardware is dedicated to the lightning fast 3.24 transactions a second?
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Jun 17, 2017 00:17
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Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:Isn't a Blockchain like a database then? It's just like, public or something Actually I asked this exact question of our "financial innovation office" team at work. Specifically I asked how a blockchain is different than a centralized database. The answer that I got is that it's public. And yet what you hear most of the ethereum enterprise companies talk about is some kind of semi-private blockchain. Frankly no goddamn different than markitwire, in the derivatives world. I'm really really waiting for someone to justify to me how a non-governed non-centralized source of data/information is better than a centralized/governed source of data/information is, from an institutional finance perspective.
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Jun 17, 2017 00:29
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Sentient Data posted:Damned goons telling me to not short bitcoin and it drops 30% literally the next day!!!!! Hope you weren't thinking of using Coinbase because they were down for most of the day zmcnulty posted:Actually I asked this exact question of our "financial innovation office" team at work. Specifically I asked how a blockchain is different than a centralized database. The answer that I got is that it's public. That's exactly right; a blockchain is an append-only distributed database where you give untrusted parties the ability to make insertions, and you deal with untrustworthiness by requiring everyone to participate in a hardware arms race. If you get outspent and lose control of your own database to some competitor then that's just the free market deciding that you don't deserve to control your own blockchain anymore, and since it's the free market making the decision that means the decision is just If you want to set up a distributed database only on hardware that you already trust, and you don't want to give competitors access at all, then a blockchain is pointless. What good is a system that is only useful if you give a competitor a foot in the door to take control of your data, you ask? BLOCKCHAIN BLOCKCHAIN BLOCKCHAIN TO THE MOOOOOON
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Jun 17, 2017 01:04
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the next question for big finance is if blockchain is better than SWIFT or CLS. whoops
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Jun 17, 2017 01:22
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QuarkJets posted:That's exactly right; a blockchain is an append-only distributed database where you give untrusted parties the ability to make insertions, and you deal with untrustworthiness by requiring everyone to participate in a hardware arms race. If you get outspent and lose control of your own database to some competitor then that's just the free market deciding that you don't deserve to control your own blockchain anymore, and since it's the free market making the decision that means the decision is just for those who want the interlecktual bitcoin thread, it's on YOSPOS and we had a discussion a few pages ago about security issues in permissioned invitation-only blockchains. tl;dr you know your employees who get phished and cryptolockered and send passwords to boss@totally-your-company.ru? yeah, imagine them leaking your company key to said blockchain.
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Jun 17, 2017 01:26
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divabot posted:for those who want the interlecktual bitcoin thread, it's on YOSPOS and
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Jun 17, 2017 01:33
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QuarkJets posted:Hope you weren't thinking of using Coinbase because they were down for most of the day That sounds loving dumb, as I thought. Then I read stuff like this guy and his Siacoins and I wonder if there's something there: quote:David VorickFollow
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Jun 17, 2017 01:41
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I don't really care what kind of blockchain voodoo economics Sia's doing, but I'm only paying a fraction what I would be paying Amazon to store massive amounts of slightly better than worthless data using it so that's something.
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Jun 17, 2017 02:14
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Hahahha sia? As in the singer? She's hocking button?
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Jun 17, 2017 02:49
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Blockade posted:I don't really care what kind of blockchain voodoo economics Sia's doing, but I'm only paying a fraction what I would be paying Amazon to store massive amounts of slightly better than worthless data using it so that's something. It's the same as any other startup that massively undercuts the competition: tons of VC funding and relatively little overhead. Just look at Twitter; in the first 2 years they were operating they generated no revenue at all, much less profit, and despite having literally no plan for becoming a revenue-generating venture they secured hundreds of millions in VC funding. Today they regularly lose hundreds of millions each quarter and have no real roadmap for digging themselves out, yet they're estimated to be worth Billions. Tech startups make no sense and are funded almost entirely by rich idiots trying to be on the ground floor of The Next Google
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Jun 17, 2017 03:41
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Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:That sounds loving dumb, as I thought. Decentralized data storage != blockchains. Sia is decentralized data storage network with a blockchain transaction layer built on top; the Sia blockchain isn't handling the data storage at all, it's merely how payments for storage are getting made. This sounds reasonable but it's still relying on Proof of Work for transaction verification, which is excessively wasteful in terms of resources meaning that the whole thing is surviving purely on token speculation
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Jun 17, 2017 03:54
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I just listened to this week's Odd Lots podcast on ethereum and the bullshit that sits on top of it and laughed my rear end off as I rode bikes. Thanks for the humour crypto tards https://www.bloomberg.com/podcasts/odd_lots
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Jun 17, 2017 05:24
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That face just makes me irrationally angry, like I want to punch my screen, which is ironic since I did a GIS and recognized his name from that Let's Read: "Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality" thread I read a little of. I can't even remember many of his stupid opinions, I just wish I didn't have to see his face every time I read your posts I don't have time for all these words, I just need to know which cryptocurrency to give all my money to. Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:That sounds loving dumb, as I thought. "Help, I just did a git pull and now the software just says that the network has been shut down." "Help, I just did a git pull and now there's a nag screen saying that I have to pay if I keep using the software for 30 days." "Help, I just did a git pull and now all the files on my hard drive are encrypted and I need to send bitcoins to some address to decrypt them." Yeah you totally don't need to trust the guy who wrote the code you're running on your computer, you just read the specification/white paper and write your own implementation, or else do a line-by-line audit of the code prior to running it and prior to every time you do an update.
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Jun 17, 2017 05:34
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Buttcoin purse posted:That face just makes me irrationally angry, like I want to punch my screen, which is ironic since I did a GIS and recognized his name from that Let's Read: "Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality" thread I read a little of. I can't even remember many of his stupid opinions, I just wish I didn't have to see his face every time I read your posts I wish the same. I know who bought it for me and went "well played, goon" but I expect I'll be coughing up :5bux: so they can spend  to put it back againJohn Big Booty posted:it's almost as big as the blockchain. insert wacky Sir Mix A Lot pastiche
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Jun 17, 2017 09:34
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namaste faggots posted:I just listened to this week's Odd Lots podcast on ethereum and the bullshit that sits on top of it and laughed my rear end off as I rode bikes. Thanks for the humour crypto tards lol he literally says "imagine bitcoin is used for 10% of all remittances in the world, it would be worth so much!" as a way of evaluating the future value of bitcoin literally just picking an arbitrary number out of the air, poo poo there are so many idiots in this space it leaves no doubt in my mind that bitcoin's price will continue to grow even while its value continues to be 0
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Jun 17, 2017 12:17
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I thought the basis behind Bitcoin "going to the moon", was it replacing currency. Like, people would be buying groceries and paying bills and poo poo with Bitcoin. So far the only thing people use it for is making clandestine bank transfers.
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Jun 17, 2017 12:34
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LethalGeek posted:Someone way more computer scientisty than I could say better but yes that's all it actually boils down to. It's only notable thing there is no central system making the final call about things, but it pulls this off by mindlessly wasting electricity instead of any sort of actual security mechanism. forcing attackers to needlessly wasteelectricity is about the only efficient security mechanism out there have you ever heard of the term "heat death of the universe"
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Jun 17, 2017 12:43
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:lol like it takes speculating in a currency to observe 5 years of "hilarious", oblivious non-jokes about line graphs by people who were completely wrong newegg and steam accepting bitcoin thus giving you an avenue to at least get something back (ideal for an amount of money you put into bitcoin as a lark) doesnt actually change anything unless steam games and the computers to play them on are life (they are) LinYutang posted:Mocking something for five years straight is super cool and definitely a signal of greater mental clarity than bitcoiners shame on an IGA posted:E: the original bitcoin mock thread was started by an earnest booster too, all these years ago. This thread is a thread of destiny.
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Jun 17, 2017 13:59
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QuarkJets posted:You, like Ham Sandwiches, are missing the point. There's no way to know whether bitcoin will be up or down tomorrow or a week from now. The point is that the actual bitcoin system is wrought with fraud and hilariously inept security vulnerabilities, resulting in things like the huge bitfinex hack that happened last year, or popular ethereum wallet FreeWallet silently stealing $8M in user funds just a few days ago but at least even an early adopter still runs into the cashing out problem that only grows more difficult as the disparity between bitcoins self-evaluated market cap and the actual money prospective to be introduced to the exchange grows wider and wider
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Jun 17, 2017 14:09
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QuarkJets posted:lol he literally says "imagine bitcoin is used for 10% of all remittances in the world, it would be worth so much!" as a way of evaluating the future value of bitcoin Of course, I tracked this standard Bitcoin claim down: "The supply is limited, so the price can only go up!" Hal Finney posted in 2009: quote:As an amusing thought experiment, imagine that Bitcoin is successful and becomes the dominant payment system in use throughout the world. Then the total value of the currency should be equal to the total value of all the wealth in the world. Bitcoin advocates then immediately adopted this idle musing as something that would obviously happen. The problem is that Bitcoin is deflationary. Let's assume for a moment that Bitcoin's crank goldbug economic theories work (which they don't). As economic value traded in Bitcoins increases, the limited supply means the economic value per bitcoin goes up, which means that the price of things in bitcoins goes down. This means the dollar value of one bitcoin indeed goes up! However, it also means there's absolutely no incentive to spend your bitcoins if they’ll always be worth more tomorrow. This means economic activity goes down, and if there are alternatives - altcoins, or just using functional existing payment systems - Bitcoin loses users and interest. Back in real-world economics, the price of Bitcoin goes up when there's demand for it as a speculative commodity, drops when demand drops and is hugely volatile the rest of the time because trading is so thin. But it’s important to note that this idea - that limited supply equals MOOOON - wouldn’t work even in hypothetical Bitcoin economics. Instead of using their coins, Bitcoin holders keep holding waiting for the price to go to the moon, and even when merchants accept Bitcoin almost nobody buys with it. Prominent Bitcoin advocates have even worried that merchant adoption - people using Bitcoin as currency in the real world - might drop the value of their holding. Digital Gold by Nathaniel Popper, chapter 31, notes leading lights of Bitcoin expressing this precise worry at the Bitcoin Pacifica conference in 2014: quote:For the sake of Bitcoin as a whole, there were many who worried that the consumers who were buying things online through Bitpay were pushing the price of Bitcoin down; generally when online retailers accepted Bitcoins they immediately sold them off for dollars, creating a downward pressure on the overall price. edit: goddamn I hate that avatar
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Jun 17, 2017 14:23
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divabot posted:Of course, I tracked this standard Bitcoin claim down: "The supply is limited, so the price can only go up!" Hal Finney posted in 2009: Lemme sum that up for you: Inflation rests at an extremely gentle rate that makes you kinda think twice about hoarding it instead of putting it into the system to outpace inflation a bit. Too much inflation? People burn money to stay warm because it's worthless. Too little inflation? Extreme consumer anxiety and hoarding, if a dollar is two dollars tomorrow I shouldn't spend a cent unless I REALLY have to. Economy flips upside down and collapses. Bitcoin is extremely deflationary and only truly useful as a laundering vehicle or commodity gamble, it's not a true medium for long term wealth exchange by its nature.
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Jun 20, 2017 01:12
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Money functioning the way it does in the US is basically a loving miracle and no one has true control but printing money and quantitative easing is going tentatively "ok" except for the part where like 10 people literally command most of the wealth in the world
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Jun 20, 2017 01:15
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People incorrectly think that printing money is inherently bad or that the gold standard is good because gold == scarcity and scarcity == finite economy and a finite economy == the only true thing and thus good for some reason. Their logic is grounded in examples of failed or failing economies. In the past you basically had economists help pull places like Brazil out of the dumpster with some sweet magic tricks, but once that expertise is gone or the wrong people are in the wrong offices, that "expertise" can't get a word in edge wise and when Ergojohn McGusto sees a trend he doesnt like and his tea leaves spell out "print money to make money my man" he goes and does it and has no idea what's going on. As the world crumbles around him and can't pay off debts as his hyper inflated currency is worthless. A not crippled economy in a global "free market" is dependent on the right people having access to the right levers, which is really hard to do and is basically a temporary state to be in at any point in human history.
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Jun 20, 2017 01:28
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What I'm saying is you should invest all your money into CyberpunkGooseCoin because it's the future because I said so
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Jun 20, 2017 01:28
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so how do i turn this internet monopoly money into real money i'm ready to invest
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Jun 20, 2017 01:31
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Computer Serf posted:If you think bitcoin is going to be worthless you can actually bet against it though margin trading so... Hello fellow EVE player. It's actually called arbitrage, unless you're meaning some kind of short instrument.
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Jun 20, 2017 01:31
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And Tyler Too! posted:so how do i turn this internet monopoly money into real money i'm ready to invest Buy, buy, buy!
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Jun 20, 2017 05:04
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Sell, sell, sell!
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Jun 20, 2017 05:32
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Hold, hold, hold?
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Jun 20, 2017 05:44
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sia coins definitely are going to be used for illegal poo poo and will probably end up being worth something because of that.
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Jun 20, 2017 06:10
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Stealthgerbil posted:sia coins definitely are going to be used for illegal poo poo and will probably end up being worth something because of that. Oh no way, I'm sure business owners are going to love storing their information in distributed nodes instead of Dropbox or Google
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Jun 20, 2017 06:17
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Found in my spam email account, completely unsolicited:quote:Hello! Yes, you clearly care a great deal about the security of your wallets. 
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Jun 20, 2017 12:44
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Ruggan posted:Hodl, hodl, hodl? In true bitcoin spirit.
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Jun 20, 2017 14:28
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