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Kyte
Nov 19, 2013

Never quacked for this

Conspiratiorist posted:

Shirou had a fundamental misunderstanding of how magic circuits worked, believing he had to assemble a magic circuit from scratch each time he wanted to practice magecraft. This made his daily training regime incredibly painful, dangerous, and inefficient. Rin does berate him for this, explaining magic circuits are something that's already there, so once you've identified and activated them the first time, you should be able to just turn them on and off like a switch whenever you wish.

In UBW he doesn't get to practice magecraft with Rin, instead, it is Archer who identifies what's wrong with his method and corrects him after Rin asks him to check him out (when Shirou loses sensation and fine motor control of his left side following the first time he projects K&B).

Note that he wasn't actually creating magic circuits during his training: the number and quality of magic circuits is something normally fixed at birth. What he was actually doing through his assbackwards training was causing his magic circuits to gradually fuse with his real nerves.
IIRC he was basically repurposing his nerves into crappy not quite circuits, with the obvious potential for irreparable damage that involves..

I imagine Kerry got to Step 1: How To Start Using Magic but never got around to teaching him Step 2: How To Keep Using Magic so Shirou just kept doing step 1 over and over.

-

When he's using his circuits right (we never see him do that, the best we see is him using 2 out of 27 at max capacity) it shouldn't hurt at all (beyond the standard magus baseline). EMIYA for example has zero issues doing magic, and he can even pull off some basic non-swordy spells.

Kyte fucked around with this message at 06:04 on Aug 1, 2017

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taser rates
Mar 30, 2010
Then you have Aoko who has a lower amount than average, but they just happen to be incredibly efficient.

Nyaa
Jan 7, 2010
Like, Nyaa.

:colbert:
It's like magic power cost reduction vs larger mp pool

Pierson
Oct 31, 2004



College Slice
I was under the impression Aoko could do pretty much whatever she wanted since Blue lets her move events around in her own personal timeline. Didn't she already use it to say "when am I most powerful? In a decade? Okay I'm moving that to 'now' instead."

Nyaa
Jan 7, 2010
Like, Nyaa.

:colbert:

Pierson posted:

. Didn't she already use it to say "when am I most powerful? In a decade? Okay I'm moving that to 'now' instead."
She will have a period of weakness in her future. Unless she became immortal, her powerful period are a limited resource.

Pierson
Oct 31, 2004



College Slice
Yeah I assumed that would be the case. Presumably future Aoko is gonna have a rough time at some point if anyone figures that out.

Most of Aoko's stuff is in Mayoho right? I only know of her appearances in Tsukihime and MB.

Compendium
Jun 18, 2013

M-E-J-E-D
Yup, her real crazy magic is on display in Mahoyo.

Nyaa
Jan 7, 2010
Like, Nyaa.

:colbert:
Mahoyo have amazing mage vs mage battle.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010

"According to Wikipedia" there is a black hole that emits zionist hawking radiation where my brain should have been

I really should just shut the fuck up and stop posting forever
College Slice

Lord Koth posted:

I wouldn't say he has a huge number, but he does have a well above average amount - they're just of garbage quality. And it's actually on top of this that they're terrible for anything other than Projection, so even in his specialized field he's damaging his body to do what he does, along with needing an external power source (contracting with Rin in UBW, or Archer's arm in HF) to really do much.

As for where the information comes from, Nasu once tossed out that an average magus has ~20 circuits, whereas Shirou has 27. For comparison, both to him and an average magus, Rin has 40, of very high quality.

IIRC Shirou can eventually train himself to use UBW without a battery or hurting himself.

ugh its Troika
May 2, 2009

by FactsAreUseless

cheetah7071 posted:

I remember reading somewhere that Shirou has a huge number of magic circuits but only like 2 of them are capable of doing anything but casting UBW, and they both suck at it

The second half of that is directly in the text of F/SN but I dunno where the fact that he has way more than most magi comes from

More like he thought he only had two, until he managed to successfully use UBW and found out there were more. Using it without an external supply of energy from Rin (or someone) like EMIYA can requires decades of training so he can maximize his ability to use every single one of his circuits.

ugh its Troika
May 2, 2009

by FactsAreUseless

Raenir Salazar posted:

IIRC Shirou can eventually train himself to use UBW without a battery or hurting himself.

Well, technically speaking, he already did :v:

Nyaa
Jan 7, 2010
Like, Nyaa.

:colbert:
When you pump all skill point into one skill and turn it into a mass version...

Pierson
Oct 31, 2004



College Slice
"I like swords, they're comfy and easy to use." - Emiya Shirou, 20XX.

GhostStalker
Mar 26, 2010

Guys, find a woman who looks at you the way GhostStalker looks at every bald, obese, single 58 year old accountant from Tulsa who managed to win $4,000 by not wagering on a Final Jeopardy triple stumper.

So remember when we all laughed at that ANN review that gave this thread it's title? Its author interviewed the President of Aniplex, the Creative Director of Delightworks, and Kawasumi regarding F/GO at AX and tries to low key play down the stuff she said about UBW and Fate in general when asked if she's a Fate fan. People in the comments aren't letting it go though.

Interview here: http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2017-07-31/interview-the-staff-of-fate-grand-order/.119365

Tribladeofchaos
Jul 2, 2008

IT'S SHOWTIME!

GhostStalker posted:

So remember when we all laughed at that ANN review that gave this thread it's title? Its author interviewed the President of Aniplex, the Creative Director of Delightworks, and Kawasumi regarding F/GO at AX and tries to low key play down the stuff she said about UBW and Fate in general when asked if she's a Fate fan. People in the comments aren't letting it go though.

Interview here: http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2017-07-31/interview-the-staff-of-fate-grand-order/.119365

Ahaha I had no idea that was the same woman!

The worst writing and most heinous misogyny huh? :allears:

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012

Tribladeofchaos posted:

Ahaha I had no idea that was the same woman!

The worst writing and most heinous misogyny huh? :allears:

IIRC, that UBW rant was because she loved Fate/Zero and was very disappointed by UBW. Isn't getting super mad about bits of the franchise pretty normal for Fate fans?

Rody One Half
Feb 18, 2011

oh boy let's dig this corpse up again I guess


Ekens' argument was based on the nonsensical twin notions that 1. FSN should owe something to FZ, a companion piece and 2. that FZ is a feminist work and FSN is more sexist than it

Fate IS sexist in a variety of ways, mind, but the idea of taking Urobuchi's towering ode to DEEP MAN FEELINGS and hold it up as some beacon meant to show that no-goodnik Nasu the ways of gender equality is uh... ridiculous on every possible level


let's just pretend that we had another 15 page argument about this and then don't actually do it

Freak Futanari
Apr 11, 2008
Who would win in a fight between Magical Amber and Heroic Spirit TOHSAKA

Nyaa
Jan 7, 2010
Like, Nyaa.

:colbert:

Freak Futanari posted:

Who would win in a fight between Magical Amber and Heroic Spirit TOHSAKA

Feminism

Shinjobi
Jul 10, 2008


Gravy Boat 2k
Where is my Nasu servant

Randallteal
May 7, 2006

The tears of time
If someone compiled all of the posts, comments and tweets from the last two years kvetching about how it's actually only pretty bad writing and misogyny, do you think it would be longer than the VN?

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

Freak Futanari posted:

Who would win in a fight between Magical Amber and Heroic Spirit TOHSAKA

Ambers like the strongest being in the nasuverse

Pierson
Oct 31, 2004



College Slice

Randallteal posted:

If someone compiled all of the posts, comments and tweets from the last two years kvetching about how it's actually only pretty bad writing and misogyny, do you think it would be longer than the VN?
Normal brain: Nasu is a bad writer
Big brain: Nasu is a good writer
Powerful brain: Nasu's concepts are so large his writing has trouble communicating them.
Galaxy brain: Nasu is a bad writer, and that's good.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010

"According to Wikipedia" there is a black hole that emits zionist hawking radiation where my brain should have been

I really should just shut the fuck up and stop posting forever
College Slice
I think the important thing is that aside from a few quaint thoughts Nasu at least tries really hard and puts a lot of thought into it.

Plutonis
Mar 25, 2011

He's probably one of the best worldbuilders out there, even if the rest of his writing might be shaky sometimes.

Bakanogami
Dec 31, 2004


Grimey Drawer

Freak Futanari posted:

Who would win in a fight between Magical Amber and Heroic Spirit TOHSAKA

Why did we get Ishtar in FGO instead of TOHSAKA


Also being EMIYA in FGO must be bizarre. His entire circle of family and acquaintances ahs been summoned only none of them are the real people.

ACES CURE PLANES
Oct 21, 2010



Bakanogami posted:

Also being EMIYA in FGO must be bizarre. His entire circle of family and acquaintances ahs been summoned only none of them are the real people.

Counterpoint:






:kimchi:

UchihaHirou
Mar 8, 2007

Active Skill:
Solves all problems.
That was so sweet that I got diabetes.

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.
It's missing Gudako dressed like Kotomine going YOROKOBE!

Pureauthor
Jul 8, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT KISSING A GHOST
'Are we missing somebody?'
'I can't think of anyone.'

And far away in the land of unreleased content, Sakura/Parvati dogezas.

Ashsaber
Oct 24, 2010

Deploying Swordbreakers!
College Slice

Pureauthor posted:

'Are we missing somebody?'
'I can't think of anyone.'

And far away in the land of unreleased content, Sakura/Parvati dogezas.

Well, I think that one was done before the CCC event. Now there's three.

El Burbo
Oct 10, 2012



niiice

Tarezax
Sep 12, 2009

MORT cancels dance: interrupted by MORT
So when does she get added to the gacha

Blockhouse
Sep 7, 2014

You Win!
how has morgan never shown up as a caster in something

Pureauthor
Jul 8, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT KISSING A GHOST
Odds on her being Saberface

Rody One Half
Feb 18, 2011

I mean

it would be fair if they looked similar, considering

Pierson
Oct 31, 2004



College Slice
People who played Mahoyo: Was there an explanation for who the red-cloaked figure at the Swirl of the Root was?

YggdrasilTM
Nov 7, 2011

Pierson posted:

People who played Mahoyo: Was there an explanation for who the red-cloaked figure at the Swirl of the Root was?

A manifestation of the counterforce. The red shadow kills anyone trying to reach the root.

Gamerofthegame
Oct 28, 2010

Could at least flip one or two, maybe.
Mild Fate Extella spoilers, I guess

My favorite part about Fate-verse is how this naming convention is just a thing

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AtheistMantis
Oct 5, 2014

YggdrasilTM posted:

A manifestation of the counterforce. The red shadow kills anyone trying to reach the root.

Then does this mean the Heaven's Feel ritual was always doomed to fail?

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