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Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

##vote Jamuraan

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Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer
Oh, also I don't think all of them are scum, but I don't like people realistically suggesting that Max is the fake masonry partner. Maybe he is, but there are so many unknowns to this situation: maybe one or both of Somber and Bif are lying, maybe it's Sara, it could be any number of people faking it. Is it possible? Sure, I guess. Is it worth entertaining in the slightest as a reason to think someone is or isn't scum? Absolutely not.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer

Hal Incandenza posted:

Haha guess you beat me too it. I'm still waking up so yeah maybe I'm being dumb but I'm not scum

I mean I can understand forgetting someone made a post. I forget things all the time. But you were voting based on her case while making the same case, and I think that goes beyond just forgetting.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Asiina posted:

Oh, also I don't think all of them are scum, but I don't like people realistically suggesting that Max is the fake masonry partner. Maybe he is, but there are so many unknowns to this situation: maybe one or both of Somber and Bif are lying, maybe it's Sara, it could be any number of people faking it. Is it possible? Sure, I guess. Is it worth entertaining in the slightest as a reason to think someone is or isn't scum? Absolutely not.

Meh I agree up to a point but I think it's also worth discussing a bit what might be happening. I do think if someone is still actively faking a masonry that person is scum but you are right we don't have enough info to know who might be doing that

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer
Sorry, you weren't voting.

loving hell, this game.

I think my point still stands because you were still casing her, but holy poo poo good job me.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Asiina posted:

I mean I can understand forgetting someone made a post. I forget things all the time. But you were voting based on her case while making the same case, and I think that goes beyond just forgetting.

I wasn't voting her but yeah it seems suspicious when put that way, but I was more along the point that "well I do this as scum so this person is probably doing the same thing I would" is something a lot like what I said about Max saying "I would be terrible scum if I did this" in that I'm immediately suspicious of that as an easy way to make or discredit a case. I wasn't even paying that much attention to the post she was quoting if I'm being totally honest

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Asiina posted:

Sorry, you weren't voting.

loving hell, this game.

I think my point still stands because you were still casing her, but holy poo poo good job me.

Jeez I am just gonna stop posting until I check if you have posted the same thing right before me. Get out of my head asiina

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


I don't think it's Jamuraan, I don't see the case on him at all, apart from he's lurking? And I still don't like MT's mounting of a case, and don't find Hal's slowly escalating waffling to be particularly persuasive.

Somberbrero
Feb 14, 2009

ꜱʜʀɪᴍᴘ?
skimming, not feeling particularly compelled by these cases.

max, how would i know when bif is asleep? checking the doc today, all other-bif has posted in it since then is this:

:o)
(o:


but like two dozen times.

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


That makes me think Fauxbif is pera.

Somberbrero
Feb 14, 2009

ꜱʜʀɪᴍᴘ?

Sandwolf posted:

That makes me think Fauxbif is pera.

it fits, i guess, but i don't think even pera would do that to a game.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer

Somberbrero posted:

skimming, not feeling particularly compelled by these cases.

max, how would i know when bif is asleep? checking the doc today, all other-bif has posted in it since then is this:

:o)
(o:


but like two dozen times.

Bif is in Australia, so it's a pretty drastically different schedule.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer
Also lol, I mean keep talking in that doc now if you want, but with all this out in the open it will be pure WIFOM so I wouldn't put any stock into what they're saying.

Somberbrero
Feb 14, 2009

ꜱʜʀɪᴍᴘ?

Asiina posted:

Bif is in Australia, so it's a pretty drastically different schedule.

uuuuuGHHHHHH

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Asiina posted:

Bif is in Australia, so it's a pretty drastically different schedule.

If it really is pera she would probably only post when bif would

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


I reckon this masonry poo poo isn't gonna bring us any answers anytime soon, so, why don't we pay attention to the deadline coming up.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer
Since we are narrowing down for deadline, people I'd be willing to vote for today: Hal, Sandwolf, Jam.

I don't have super strong town reads on anyone enough that I wouldn't vote someone to avoid a no lynch, but I'd be pretty unhappy voting for anyone other than those three.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Reckon you're right pardner, I'm pretty happy with my vote where it is.

I think everything that has happened today makes me think Asiina and Somber are town. I don't think Somber would do this as scum and I think asiinas posting is totally townie and genuine today

I'd also vote Max, both because I didn't like the defense of himself and the weird caginess with the masons and his PM. Feels off.

Somberbrero
Feb 14, 2009

ꜱʜʀɪᴍᴘ?
if we're not dunking mmt i guess i need to think harder about my choices today. i am really not feeling her for town though.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Oh I'd also probably vote MMT. Even though we are basically saying the same thing about Jam I still get bad feelings from the tone of her posts and I generally trust those feelings. She could also be bussing he absent scumbuddy Jam

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


I really don't find the case on Jamuraan to be compelling, and the more I look at Hal's second vote there, the more uneasy it makes me.

MT's vote reasoning is extremely flimsy and mostly illusion, there's no real desire to find scum there, just apathy.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Sandwolf posted:

I really don't find the case on Jamuraan to be compelling, and the more I look at Hal's second vote there, the more uneasy it makes me.

MT's vote reasoning is extremely flimsy and mostly illusion, there's no real desire to find scum there, just apathy.

Why does my vote make you uneasy? If nothing else I've been consistent on my thoughts about Jam going back to yesterday. Even if you don't agree with my points I don't see why my vote being on him would seem off to you

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


Seriously, don't take my word for it, go read through Murmur Twin's post history, it's less than a page.

Pay attention to every post, even innocent ones like this:

Murmur Twin posted:

I've also never played flipless and agree with the sentiment of "wait, doesn't that mean we're stuck in perpetual d1?" but am always down for a challenge :j: I haven't really seen anything from Jam that's made me change my mind there yet but I guess there's still plenty of time in the game day for that.

Right now my gut leans towards Flam and Pod both having been town - I feel like the d1 lynch resulting in scum is almost as rare as the NK doing it.

The rehashing of the flipless dilemma, light suspicion on Jam (no reasoning), and then some assurance that the two dead are both town.

That's a scummy fuckin' post, dangit!!

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


Hal Incandenza posted:

Why does my vote make you uneasy? If nothing else I've been consistent on my thoughts about Jam going back to yesterday. Even if you don't agree with my points I don't see why my vote being on him would seem off to you

Just the way it was dropped without restating the reasoning and 12 hours before deadline. I'm not tryna lynch you over it, just explaining that it getting plonked down there at that time was a little eye-catching.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Sandwolf posted:

Seriously, don't take my word for it, go read through Murmur Twin's post history, it's less than a page.

Pay attention to every post, even innocent ones like this:


The rehashing of the flipless dilemma, light suspicion on Jam (no reasoning), and then some assurance that the two dead are both town.

That's a scummy fuckin' post, dangit!!

Yeah that's pretty much how I've felt about her posts too, they have never said much and just don't feel like there is any weight behind what she is saying

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Sandwolf posted:

Just the way it was dropped without restating the reasoning and 12 hours before deadline. I'm not tryna lynch you over it, just explaining that it getting plonked down there at that time was a little eye-catching.

Yeah I probably should have had that vote in an earlier post where I was talking about Jam, I ended up voting once I finished with all my catching up after waking up.

Jamuraan
Oct 10, 2005

Jamuraan, J.D. in Critical Reasoning and Logic
Ask me about how good I am at party games! Please god ask me about how good I am at party games!

Hal Incandenza posted:

Has jam even posted today? My phone is being a pain but I don't remember him saying anything. I would definitely vote Jam today, I feel like after being called out yesterday he's hiding today because he's scared scum. He's certainly posted plenty in another game so he definitely isn't just not around

I'm sorry, I'm playing in another game and that is taking up most of my attention. I really am trying to keep up with the thread and I have a few ideas I want to think about before I speak them out lest I be even slightly wrong about something and someone hounds me for it forever.

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


Jam I wish we were masons in this game.

Jamuraan
Oct 10, 2005

Jamuraan, J.D. in Critical Reasoning and Logic
Ask me about how good I am at party games! Please god ask me about how good I am at party games!

Hal Incandenza posted:

Yeah I probably should have had that vote in an earlier post where I was talking about Jam, I ended up voting once I finished with all my catching up after waking up.

Your whole campaign against me seems opportunistic. You even said yesterday you didn't think I was scummy. The sudden shift is pretty flippy-floppy.

Sandwolf
Jan 23, 2007

i'll be harpo


Sandwolf posted:

Jam I wish we were real masons in this game.

Mafia edit as mafia joke

Jamuraan
Oct 10, 2005

Jamuraan, J.D. in Critical Reasoning and Logic
Ask me about how good I am at party games! Please god ask me about how good I am at party games!

Sandwolf posted:

Jam I wish we were masons in this game.

It's never too late.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Jamuraan posted:

Your whole campaign against me seems opportunistic. You even said yesterday you didn't think I was scummy. The sudden shift is pretty flippy-floppy.

Well now that you are here change my mind.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004

Jamuraan posted:

I'm sorry, I'm playing in another game and that is taking up most of my attention. I really am trying to keep up with the thread and I have a few ideas I want to think about before I speak them out lest I be even slightly wrong about something and someone hounds me for it forever.

I await these ideas with bated breath

Somberbrero
Feb 14, 2009

ꜱʜʀɪᴍᴘ?
Jam, max, and mith are all not voting. Come on, get some skin in the game. We need something to happen.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

Sandwolf posted:

The rehashing of the flipless dilemma, light suspicion on Jam (no reasoning), and then some assurance that the two dead are both town.

That's a scummy fuckin' post, dangit!!

I was just stream of conscious'ing after catching up on the game. You omit the both the case I made earlier (here) and the part where I later make a vote and case:

Murmur Twin posted:

The silver lining to choking as bad as I did in FF5 is that I think I can see it when other people are going through similar stress trying to scum. :ohdear:

##vote Jam for now. I'm going to sleep but look forward to figuring out what's up with that masonry.

To be fair, my case was a reference to a game you weren't in so I can see where it wouldn't have made sense to some people. I'm going to put it in my next post.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

Jamuraan posted:

Been living my life, sorry for not being here and for not participating much, I'll try to get my top 3 leads.

I'm really surprised I'm getting chastised for trying to take a more reasoned approach to the game instead of taking the cheap way out and using emotional appeal.

I've been skimming the thread and not really making any connections because I'm being lazy, but I'll turn it around asap, please trust I'm not scum.

---

I'm not trying to interject too much RL into this but I've been struggling with :effort: lately. I slept like 10 hours into the day after playing Civ 5 until 8am. I didn't reread anything from before today, sorry I lied and said I would. I'm not part of a masonry either and without any flips I really have no clue where to start. Like someone said, WIFOMing the kill probably won't lead to much.

Y'all can lynch me if you want, I know a few of you still think I'm the best choice, but I'm not scum and unfortunately you won't even gain any information from lynching me.

I think if anyone else has more info about the setup it can only help us. This masonry hint from Max doesn't seem dishonest, but it seems strange that no one else has backed him up.

---

I'm sorry, I'm playing in another game and that is taking up most of my attention. I really am trying to keep up with the thread and I have a few ideas I want to think about before I speak them out lest I be even slightly wrong about something and someone hounds me for it forever.

What things do people see from Jam in these posts? Choose all that apply:

(a) a self-conscious awareness of how others perceive him
(b) effort put into explaining why he's not making cases
(c) cases and votes

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

Sandwolf posted:

I really don't find the case on Jamuraan to be compelling

What's your opinion of Jam's alignment and why?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

Max posted:

Why not ask for clarity on that?

Sandwolf posted:

You read that entire post and decided he was scum without muster? Wouldn't he be more likely to replace out? I don't like this vote either.

Did I miss some mafia memo where you can't vote for someone unless you're super-duper sure they're scum?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

Somberbrero posted:

skimming, not feeling particularly compelled by these cases.

max, how would i know when bif is asleep? checking the doc today, all other-bif has posted in it since then is this:

:o)
(o:


but like two dozen times.

Hahaha I'll bet 100$ it's Birdstrike.

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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

Murmur Twin posted:

Hahaha I'll bet 100$ it's Birdstrike.

To clarify:

(a) I know from Myst that he likes bantering with pera
(b) It'd explain why faux-bif picked bif as the person to fakeclaim
(c) The weirdness of someone else from outside the game playing a role seems consistent with a twist I could see pera using
(d) It sounds like (from the smiley-face spamming) that it's a shitposter, but definitely doesn't sound like bif

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