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Docjowles posted:Horror The good ol days
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Aug 11, 2017 06:22
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Hot drat! posted:Also, I'm not saying this is a good idea, but I refused to put any effort at all into studying IPv6 and it totally paid off. IPv6, especially for the ICND1, isn't that bad or hard. There is basically no subnetting, there are so many god drat addresses in the space it's basically a /64 everywhere in the CCNA world. There are like 3 important prefixes you need to know, and that is just the first four characters. EUI-64 is literally just take mac address and slam 4 characters in the middle. The addresses look long but for study purposes they are almost always abbreviated to something like 2001::1:1. The routing portion of IPv6 is actually easier, I think. Basically replace ip with ipv6 everywhere, and put the network commands on the interface instead. You probably got lucky that you didn't get a bunch of questions on it. I rememer getting quite a few on my ICND1 not long ago, but not as many popped up on the ICND2.
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Aug 11, 2017 13:58
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So I've been working (slowly) on the MCSA SQL 2012/2014 cert, passed the 461 and 462. When I started studying for the last one the 411 was listed as an alternative to the 463 so I decided to do that. Went to schedule it today and there are no longer any alternate exams listed at all. Can't find any announcement or notice about changes to that policy, it's just not there anymore. Fuckers I called support and the guy said it was discontinued as a valid alternative on 7/6, but if I pass within 60 days of that to call them up and they'll add the certificate to my transcript. So not completely screwed, but drat this is a lot more pressure not to fail.
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Aug 11, 2017 17:20
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Question for you long term CISSPs: how am I meant to enter CPE's for conferences? I'm at USENIX security and it's five days of talks. Do I enter each talk as a CPE, each block of talks separately, each day individually, or just all five days as one entry? The guidelines don't seem to be much help here. I'm probably going to do each block of talks as one entry since it's usually three to four talks which are thematically linked. Thoughts?
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Aug 17, 2017 02:45
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I've been to 2 conferences since I got my CISSP and I've just entered the time I spent at talks and panel discussions in a single entry under the (Group A) multiple domains type. No issues. I guess you can hedge against 10-12 hours being locked up in an audit by splitting them up but it's definitely not necessary.
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Aug 17, 2017 13:41
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Ok thanks. I'll go for a daily entry, that way at least my 6-7 hours are somewhat broken out vs just lumped in as one big thing.
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Aug 17, 2017 16:20
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Going on 3 weeks now unemployed, havent been able to study hardly at all. Applied at well over 30 places, have received 1 real interview and talked to 1000 recruiters. Every single loving one of them is all "we are very impressed with your core skill set, but what about this X that you dont have because you havent studied it or been exposed to it in any way or capacity that we really want you for and not for the network engineering job for which you applied" 
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Aug 17, 2017 17:30
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What's the general route for someone finishing up a C.S. degree who wants to get into infosec? Seems like most of the jobs I'm seeing require CISSP or some other security cert along with a bachelors. I've taken a bachelor's level Networking class and most of the stuff in the Network+ book looks self evident. Should I just start with the CCNA/Security+ and start knocking out certifications focusing on infosec stuff? These job listings all seem written for people who already have +10 years of experience ie. degree, CISSP, OSCP, etc... for a infosec engineering position. Is there just no such thing as an actual entry level position in the field?
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Aug 17, 2017 18:43
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Entry level InfoSec is being a SOC slave which you definitely don't want to do. Your best bet to avoid SOC is, unfortunately, the "who you know" approach. You may get lucky and find someone outside of a SOC looking to hire an entry level infosec analyst -- we hired one a few months ago -- but your competition will be people looking to escape from a SOC so you'll be behind the ball already :/ CCNA is great for network fundamentals. Can't comment on Sec+. CEH is apparently okay I guess but I haven't looked into that as well. OSCP is a jump up in ability and seeing as how it's a practical exam I think you should be able to prove yourself once you have that under your belt. No real easy answer, sorry. My experience was a total "who you know" situation which was a lateral move from IT with heavy network leaning to InfoSec/Policy/Governance. I'm trying to pivot myself now from governance to audit and compliance but that's another complete skillset I need to develop.
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Aug 17, 2017 18:57
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Portland Sucks posted:Is there just no such thing as an actual entry level position in the field? I don't know what part of infosec you want to go into, but I have these comments to offer. 1: Infosec generally loving sucks. It's 95% paperwork, policy, and powerpoint, with 5% report reading. Yeah there are some awesome guys in the field, but they work for boutique firms or big rear end companies. The "infosec" people we hire don't do poo poo but look at reports, and try to write policy that makes us compliant with various rules and regulations 2: There isn't a lot of entry level jobs, because infosec is usually something you pivot into later in your career. If you have no background with the systems you're supposed to be monitoring, auditing or securing, what value are you bringing to the table? Look, I clearly have issue with "infosec". I think a lot of people have unrealistic expectations about the job field and want to go into the field because it pays well right now and they think it's gonna be super cool. Those awesome red teamers, white hats, and uber infosec dudes on the blogs and twitter make up a hilariously small portion of the "infosec" field. You're much more likely to be running down checklists and running automated audit tools and reading reports than you are doing cool poo poo. edit: Look I know I'm coming across as a dick, I just really want folks to have realistic expectations. skipdogg fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Aug 17, 2017 |
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Aug 17, 2017 20:05
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Echoing what Martytoof said, I know there's plenty of talent coming out of school in the security field but I don't necessarily think "entry level" exists unless you want to be a L1 analyst at like SecureWorks. Even most of the smaller MSSP SOC bodyshops Ive seen have been farming out the entry level analyst roles to Israel and ex-IDF. Actually, most SMB security firms I've seen tend to stock up on ex-military, if only for the optics. Entrance to the industry typically means doing your bit in systems or network engineering or even software development before finding a new passion and moving into security. I did 10 years in systems and VMware infrastructure before moving into security to support HIPAA compliance. Now, I do security for fintech and regulatory compliance. It's a lot of loving compliance. I'd like to move more towards the sexier offensive side. OSCP is next but had to cancel plans with a kid coming soon, not enough time to work the labs. skipdogg posted:You're much more likely to be running down checklists and running automated audit tools and reading reports than you are doing cool poo poo.
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Aug 17, 2017 20:13
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Cautionary tale: I was in the same situation (bachelor's CS, looking to get into infosec) and did an internship in IT audit. You really need to flesh out what part of infosec you want to do before going further. The application security/ network security folks we audited started off in those fields (app development/ network admin/engineer type roles) before pivoting towards their respective security roles. You can start off entry-level in audit and risk/control, but be aware that you will likely not use very many/ any of the CS skills you picked up in school, and will instead spend a lot of time looking for gaps in policy and documentation. Not necessarily a bad thing if policy and compliance is your poo poo, and there are certifications such as CISA which are desirable. But definitely be aware that you won't be doing mr.robot poo poo.
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Aug 17, 2017 20:38
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But what if I wanted to blow up a paper shredding company. fake edit: I /guess/ they do some other stuff too.
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Aug 17, 2017 20:41
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Martytoof posted:Entry level InfoSec is being a SOC slave which you definitely don't want to do. Your best bet to avoid SOC is, unfortunately, the "who you know" approach. You may get lucky and find someone outside of a SOC looking to hire an entry level infosec analyst -- we hired one a few months ago -- but your competition will be people looking to escape from a SOC so you'll be behind the ball already :/ Yeah we've got a local infosec company that is always hiring for their SOC. I've been silently waiting for a developer position to open to get my foot in the door, because that SOC position isn't going to pay the bills. Other than that I guess it makes sense that there isn't really an "entry level" engineer position. I guess I'l just start working on some certs to demonstrate networking competency and stay on as a software engineer until something pops up. Yeah I'm a dweeb and really want to see what working in offensive security or something like malware analysis is like. It's interesting. 
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Aug 17, 2017 23:20
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Like everyone else said, you really have to know the tech inside and out before you can specialize that deeply. Securing your equipment is something every admin is expected to do, so dedicated security jobs are similar to consulting jobs - people too specialized and expensive to do the grunt work. Edit: There are exceptions - if you don't mind getting into more of the presales side of things, you can get in the field that way. Just know you'll be less like Mr. Robot and more like a glorified geek squad employee. There's also digital forensics, but that usually involves spending hours searching through half-erased hard drives looking for traces of kiddie porn. So yeah. KillHour fucked around with this message at 12:37 on Aug 18, 2017 |
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Aug 18, 2017 12:26
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I'm a more audio/video learner and do better "hunting" for info that I need to know the answer for (example: taking a quiz and then finding the info on Q's I got wrong) Right now I'm trying to drag my rear end through the A+ book which is condescending as gently caress. What strategies have worked for y'all to make the info stick? I'm learning disabled with some memory issues as well (mostly related to numbers) so I'm wondering if they allow for reasonable accommodations in your experiences? Edit: I am also a filthy poor and taking the tests are pretty $$$ for my price range so any resources for low income individuals would be pretty sweet.
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Aug 18, 2017 16:56
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I'm someone who has a terrible time with printed material. See if there are any associated video tutorials or video courses that teach your desired material. Audio/visual works much better for me, and I pick up concepts much faster if they're demonstrated or explained verbally in a classroom or presentation setting. When I was doing my CCNA way back when, I had a terrible time with Odom's material. Once I went through the cbtnuggets stuff that was available at the time I found that going back through the printed book was easier because I was learning additional material and not the base concepts themselves.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:03
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The Big Whoop posted:I'm a more audio/video learner and do better "hunting" for info that I need to know the answer for (example: taking a quiz and then finding the info on Q's I got wrong) Right now I'm trying to drag my rear end through the A+ book which is condescending as gently caress. https://www.professormesser.com/free-a-plus-training/220-901/comptia-220-900-course/ It's harder with tests like A+ because it's mostly rote memorization as opposed to things where you can set up a lab and work your way through with practical information that you need to learn. You might consider setting up a VM on your personal computer and just following along videos like this, though. There's also sites like Pluralsight and CBTNuggets, but they aren't cheap. Pluralsight's $30-something a month and CBTNuggets is $100+. You might also look at Udemy, you can get a full course on there for $5-12. Honestly though I'd take a good look at Professor Messer's A+/Net+/Sec+ stuff first if you're going the CompTIA route. They're as good as paid resources that I've seen out there. I used them - watched the videos, jotted down notes while watching, and then read over the notes I'd read. And followed along on my computer doing the things he showed, like I said. ...I still can't believe A+ requires two exams.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:03
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Japanese Dating Sim posted:https://www.professormesser.com/free-a-plus-training/220-901/comptia-220-900-course/ These are such good resources! Thank you, my google-fu keeps referring me to expensive training sites that just seem like rip-offs. 5-10 bucks I can probably swing though. Edit: I am good at computer
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Aug 18, 2017 17:07
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I'm doing A+ right now, just fished hardware and taking software on Monday. Professor Messer is really good if you're looking for some video-based learning. He goes through the material very clearly and at a fast enough pace where you won't get bored. He also has two study guides for purchase for $10 each that are pretty good for review and memorization if that's your thing. He also does a Youtube Live every week on his youtube channel where you can ask him questions directly. Highly recommended.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:09
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If you have a local library, see if they provide a free subscription to Lynda.com. Mine does and it has lots of neat courses. I honestly don't know if they have any A+ material but even outside of A+ it's a great resource for learning a lot of stuff at a basic level.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:10
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What's a good resource for labs for CCNA?
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Aug 18, 2017 17:11
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MF_James posted:What's a good resource for labs for CCNA? There's basically Boson's NetSim, Packet Tracer, or GNS3. Or did you mean setup guides, scenarios, etc.?
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Aug 18, 2017 17:12
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Japanese Dating Sim posted:There's basically Boson's NetSim, Packet Tracer, or GNS3. Or did you mean setup guides, scenarios, etc.? scenarios and such, I just want to know what to really hammer at, scheduled my test for the 22nd of September and want to make sure i'm prepped, plus I am fairly certain work will pay for something.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:30
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MF_James posted:scenarios and such, I just want to know what to really hammer at, scheduled my test for the 22nd of September and want to make sure i'm prepped, plus I am fairly certain work will pay for something. If work will pay for it I'd spring for NetSim, then. They've got scenarios for basically every topic and it's well structured. http://www.boson.com/ccna-labs NetSim is what finally made a lot of stuff click for me after I had been working with both GNS3 and PacketTracer. I benefited from it being guided and more structured. I'm sure there's free resources out there though.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:40
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Japanese Dating Sim posted:If work will pay for it I'd spring for NetSim, then. They've got scenarios for basically every topic and it's well structured. http://www.boson.com/ccna-labs Yeah I have packettracer and GNS3, but I enjoy the structure of more formalized things, plus I want to milk work for every dime they'll give me
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Aug 18, 2017 18:50
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gns3vault.com has some labs and configs you can download after a (free?) registration. It looks like it's trying to sell you something so I'm not sure whether there's a paywall you hit eventually or what; I haven't really looked into it that closely other than a cursory glance.
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Aug 18, 2017 20:48
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Udemy is very hit and miss but stuff is always going on sale for $10-15. The Mike Meyers videos are great, he does A+, Net+ and Sec+ on there currently. He's one of the very few IT training videos that are actually fun to watch.
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Aug 19, 2017 16:09
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Anybody have an opinion on the ICND1 vids from Udemy?
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Aug 22, 2017 00:44
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I think I got laid off at the perfectly wrong time. 3.5 years of Networking experience is just not opening any doors. 2 CCNAs, R&S and Data Center, is not opening any doors. 4 year goddamn BS in Comp Sci, is not opening any doors. Unemployed a month now, thousands of recruiters submitting my info and only 1 real interview, no feedback yet. Every single one of them, as stated "we are impressed with your core knowledge, but how but this other stuff you dont know about?" Had a prelim Amazon interview, but she said I dont have enough for their network engineering team so she is trying me for "network technician" and I have no clue on the salary range from her. Only 1 Glassdoor submission for $64k, which is barely what I make now and would require a relocate. Pending a tech interview, if I pass that they fly me out to Oregon for an in person interview. I dont know how to proceed/what to do. Ive basically been pure Network Engineer for a few years, no cross functionality was available at the previous employer, they had their own server, storage, vm guys, network guys, etc. I have no programming/scripting (python, etc, wouldn't even know where to start) Had been studying CCNP SWITCH but that got jacked with the job elimination and subsequent search.
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Aug 22, 2017 02:25
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MrBigglesworth posted:I think I got laid off at the perfectly wrong time. 3.5 years of Networking experience is just not opening any doors. 2 CCNAs, R&S and Data Center, is not opening any doors. 4 year goddamn BS in Comp Sci, is not opening any doors. Unemployed a month now, thousands of recruiters submitting my info and only 1 real interview, no feedback yet. Every single one of them, as stated "we are impressed with your core knowledge, but how but this other stuff you dont know about?" I'm really starting to hate how the middle ground is disappearing in this industry. Either you're an entry level computer janitor, or a guru who knows every system. People who need the help up to be an SME, or are an SME in only one or two things, are poo poo out of luck.
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Aug 22, 2017 03:08
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skooma512 posted:I'm really starting to hate how the middle ground is disappearing in this industry. Either you're an entry level computer janitor, or a guru who knows every system. People who need the help up to be an SME, or are an SME in only one or two things, are poo poo out of luck. This isn't really true, you can still do fine by being broad and somewhat shallow, and you can get by knowing one or two things very very well, but if you try to specialize too early you run the risk of being both narrow and shallow and that makes you significantly less employable. Anyone getting into IT now should try to avoid specializing until they've got a good base in a number of skills. It will give you more options when you need to look for a new job, it will make you a better specialist, and most importantly modern IT is rapidly becoming cross disciplinary because you really can't support modern applications by treating the infrastructure as discrete silos. It makes problem discovery and resolution too slow. It's also much easier to build resilient infrastructure, because the hardware and software required to do so is cheaper and easier to deploy and manage than it ever has been. It just doesn't make sense to pay someone to just manage a VMware cluster or a handful of switches and some basic routing and firewall.
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Aug 22, 2017 04:11
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MrBigglesworth posted:I think I got laid off at the perfectly wrong time. 3.5 years of Networking experience is just not opening any doors. 2 CCNAs, R&S and Data Center, is not opening any doors. 4 year goddamn BS in Comp Sci, is not opening any doors. Unemployed a month now, thousands of recruiters submitting my info and only 1 real interview, no feedback yet. Every single one of them, as stated "we are impressed with your core knowledge, but how but this other stuff you dont know about?" You open to relocation? DFW isn't that far away, and job prospects would probably be better. I'm not sure if OKC is still being hit hard with the slump in oil and all that.
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Aug 22, 2017 05:14
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Welp not feeling very excited about pursuing a network admin degree now. Maybe I should just go software dev instead.
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Aug 22, 2017 07:37
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I don't know wtf a 'network admin' degree is but if your choice is between that and being a dev and you chose that you hosed up
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Aug 22, 2017 11:54
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If you can transition between networking and dev easily, you shouldn't have any problems finding jobs out there. I've tried learning the dev side of things. I can write scripts in powershell and python, I understand Java and sql. But actual development grates my brain in a way I can't explain other than "I don't feel comfortable doing it". I suspect there are a lot of networking guys like me out there who can't make the transition.
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Aug 22, 2017 15:58
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MrBigglesworth posted:I think I got laid off at the perfectly wrong time. 3.5 years of Networking experience is just not opening any doors. 2 CCNAs, R&S and Data Center, is not opening any doors. 4 year goddamn BS in Comp Sci, is not opening any doors. Unemployed a month now, thousands of recruiters submitting my info and only 1 real interview, no feedback yet. Every single one of them, as stated "we are impressed with your core knowledge, but how but this other stuff you dont know about?" I was in the same boat. Networking and load balancer experience, which isn't needed unless it's a really big company with dedicated networking engineering teams. Most places I found wanted LDAP experience too, but that's not something I'd ever touch in my technical fork. It took me about 4 months to find work. I finally got a NOC job which is pretty nice, but I haven't worked in a NOC since 2005 and I had to lie and tell my interviewer how much I missed shift work.  I need to probably learn code since that's apparently what everyone wants. I interviewed for a Security Engineer position and was told straight up they didn't want firewall people and instead needed python coders to automate firewall alerts. WTF? It's a weird market. I picked up some Kindle books and Udemy courses and will hopefully get a beginner's baseline that I can expand on from there. Krispy Wafer fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Aug 22, 2017 |
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Aug 22, 2017 16:17
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milk milk lemonade posted:I don't know wtf a 'network admin' degree is but if your choice is between that and being a dev and you chose that you hosed up I haven't set a concrete path yet, I'm still getting a feel for what I wanna do. I am employed as a QA Technician for a hardware company. I work with automated windows scripting just running tests on PC components. The job is good, especially for someone with no degree, but I'm hitting the promotion ceiling. I did 4 years at the community college getting my AS in Computer Languages (there was no CS until I finished, they just added an assembly class) and through the process I realized I liked hand-on stuff more than just programming all day. I just started WGU in July and went with the BS -IT Security track (which is mainly networking) because it a) seems like it would be more hand-on type work and b) comes with a bunch of certs that would boost my education. I studied the IT - Software Dev track which seems decent but has no industry certs or anything behind it. I guess my concern is that I'm not really "in IT" where I am now. If I do go looking for a job related to my degree and certs I'd probably be starting at or near entry level positions, maybe in an IT position not related to my education. I have tons of experience "with computers" but vendor specific stuff is out of my scope. Where if I go down the software dev track, it's an easier transition from QA automation technician to QA automation engineer, where I start writing the tests that I'm running now. Work is paying for all of this so the only thing it's costing me is time.
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Aug 22, 2017 16:31
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I'm finishing up my capstone for the wgu IT Security track right now. It's a little network heavy, but certainly not a 'network admin' track. You will do just fine learning Linux, project management, Java, sql, and the CompTIA basics on top of the dual CCNAs to land a job anywhere you want. I transitioned from a systems admin to a 'wear every hat' IT Manager halfway through the degree program. Once I finish and lock down two years of generalized IT Management experience I can transition to just about any IT specialty. Don't worry about your specialization until after that WGU degree is finished, because it's more well-rounded than you think.
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Aug 22, 2017 16:49
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There's a difference between being a software developer and knowing how to write some code in a scripting language like python or powershell. You don't need to be a full on developer to find work in IT, but no matter what you want to focus on you drat sure should be learning how to do functional automation using a popular scripting language.
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Aug 22, 2017 17:11
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