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James Totes
Feb 17, 2011
Is there an item unique more confused as to who it wants to benefit then the Desiccated Visage?

It gives CON, MAG and WILL, I believe. It gives minor SPELL CRIT and MIND POWER. It gives +Blight and +Arcane damage, but also +Temporal resist and +Temporal Resistance Penetration. Additionally, it grants VIM.

For the Paradox Mage / Archmage / Corruptor / Solipsist on the go, I suppose.

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Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

James Totes posted:

Is there an item unique more confused as to who it wants to benefit then the Desiccated Visage?

From the wiki:

quote:

Decayed Visage Helm Arcane 24-32 Generated with semi-random properties

Icetongue
Jun 22, 2015

James Totes posted:

Is there an item unique more confused as to who it wants to benefit then the Desiccated Visage?

It gives CON, MAG and WILL, I believe. It gives minor SPELL CRIT and MIND POWER. It gives +Blight and +Arcane damage, but also +Temporal resist and +Temporal Resistance Penetration. Additionally, it grants VIM.

For the Paradox Mage / Archmage / Corruptor / Solipsist on the go, I suppose.

That one and the Dream Malleus are uniques that are generated with a few random properties added to their fixed stats, so some weird combinations can come up.

James Totes
Feb 17, 2011
Huh! I never saw it much so I never looked closely and didn't realize.

Consider me fooled.

Falcon2001
Oct 10, 2004

Eat your hamburgers, Apollo.
Pillbug
So Brawler sure seems to have benefited a lot from the light armor buffs along from Rogue. I died ultimately but mostly from getting into dumb spots more than real class problems.

vdate
Oct 25, 2010
Got a question for you knowledge-having sorts in the thread - do the two-handed combat skills still work if you're wielding a 2H weapon in one hand thanks to rank 5 of the second Ogre racial skill?

MagusofStars
Mar 31, 2012



vdate posted:

Got a question for you knowledge-having sorts in the thread - do the two-handed combat skills still work if you're wielding a 2H weapon in one hand thanks to rank 5 of the second Ogre racial skill?
Yep. It's the primary reason to do Ogre actually - you can run a Normal 2H with the benefits of a shield or a mind star in your offhand.

Magitek
Feb 20, 2008

That's not jolly.
That's not jolly at all!

MagusofStars posted:

Yep. It's the primary reason to do Ogre actually - you can run a Normal 2H with the benefits of a shield or a mind star in your offhand.

Some classes have 2-hander skills with long cooldowns which hit like a truck. It can be quite worthwhile to block one turn prior to apply the Counterstrike debuff and then hit for a bajillion damage.

Think of it like a Parrying Dagger in Dark Souls -- you aren't really using it for its defensive properties, you're using it so you can more easily turn your enemy into a smear on the floor.

Affi
Dec 18, 2005

Break bread wit the enemy

X GON GIVE IT TO YA
Think I have my first winner. Nothing has challenged my temporal warden for the last thirty levels and I'm now in high peak busting heads.

Not too happy about my equipment but I can't really be bothered going through all the vaults and secret levels. Is there anything good tjere?

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Affi posted:

Think I have my first winner. Nothing has challenged my temporal warden for the last thirty levels and I'm now in high peak busting heads.

Not too happy about my equipment but I can't really be bothered going through all the vaults and secret levels. Is there anything good tjere?

The Orc Pride vaults have the best loot in the game, it's basically pages of artifacts -- even on Normal, if I remember correctly.

Affi
Dec 18, 2005

Break bread wit the enemy

X GON GIVE IT TO YA

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

The Orc Pride vaults have the best loot in the game, it's basically pages of artifacts -- even on Normal, if I remember correctly.

Yea i feel like I have every artefact there is after those vaults. I'm talking about high peaks vaults . Horrible places.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Affi posted:

Yea i feel like I have every artefact there is after those vaults. I'm talking about high peaks vaults . Horrible places.

High Peak's vaults are basically just the same vaults you see in earlier portions of the game (so the loot is tier 5, but not particularly good otherwise) combined with ludicrous level scaling on the monsters so I probably wouldn't.

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!
After I ran into an enemy that created another doomed clone of my insanely powerful archer in High Peak I immediately popped my movement infusion, ran away, and refused to enter another High Peak secret level again.

vdate
Oct 25, 2010
It's nice to see that you've absorbed more about good play from reading this thread than I have in all my years of playing the game. (I almost never book it when I should.)

...wait, if you were running from a clone of your dude, wouldn't the clone have popped its own movement infusion and run you down?

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!

vdate posted:

It's nice to see that you've absorbed more about good play from reading this thread than I have in all my years of playing the game. (I almost never book it when I should.)

...wait, if you were running from a clone of your dude, wouldn't the clone have popped its own movement infusion and run you down?

I was 5 steps from the stairs since it showed up very quickly from when I climbed down the collapsed hole that leads to the vaults.

Affi
Dec 18, 2005

Break bread wit the enemy

X GON GIVE IT TO YA

Artificer posted:

After I ran into an enemy that created another doomed clone of my insanely powerful archer in High Peak I immediately popped my movement infusion, ran away, and refused to enter another High Peak secret level again.

Yeah, those vaults man. Made me question my sanity. Those loving wildfire demons and their 400 dpt burnings in tight spaces.

Luckily the sorcerors were pushovers and my only problem was keeping Aeryn alive. Got my first chicken dinner and on nightmare too!

Temporal Wardens are pretty overpowered.

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!
Your first win was on Nightmare? poo poo. What was your TW build?

Edit: honestly if I wasn't so close to the stairs I would have had to pop Evasion and all my defensive abilities and hope I could make it to the stairs before taking a Vital Shot to the skull.

Artificer fucked around with this message at 23:16 on Aug 21, 2017

Affi
Dec 18, 2005

Break bread wit the enemy

X GON GIVE IT TO YA

Artificer posted:

Your first win was on Nightmare? poo poo. What was your TW build?

Edit: honestly if I wasn't so close to the stairs I would have had to pop Evasion and all my defensive abilities and hope I could make it to the stairs before taking a Vital Shot to the skull.

https://te4.org/characters/223913/tome/b77d7d8c-2f32-4815-97cb-dd2c23e92697ah=06291a6c-4c53-4261-ba45-0526330c2b9ead=223913 Huh, link doesn't work? Weird.

It ran itself really, I kinda sorta followed some outdated guide with some tweaks. Basically had good gear and my temporal clones did massive amounts of damage and procced lots of debuffs.

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!

Affi posted:

https://te4.org/characters/223913/tome/b77d7d8c-2f32-4815-97cb-dd2c23e92697ah=06291a6c-4c53-4261-ba45-0526330c2b9ead=223913 Huh, link doesn't work? Weird.

It ran itself really, I kinda sorta followed some outdated guide with some tweaks. Basically had good gear and my temporal clones did massive amounts of damage and procced lots of debuffs.

Hmmm. Gimme your TOME 4 account name and maybe I can find him in your vault manually?

edit: Wow sometimes your escorts just get screwed huh? Portal was right next to multiple thunderers and boulder throwers with a chieftain or two. RIP

Artificer fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Aug 22, 2017

Affi
Dec 18, 2005

Break bread wit the enemy

X GON GIVE IT TO YA

Artificer posted:

Hmmm. Gimme your TOME 4 account name and maybe I can find him in your vault manually?

Should be Affi and the charname znorelag.

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!
Yeah given how much damage that combo of giants can do I don't think I could've done much. No way I would've been able to tank for him long enough to kill all the giants on the path to the portal. :(

Edit: Yeah I got your TW. Looks kind of similar to the one I'm building towards.

No Safe Word
Feb 26, 2005

Affi posted:

https://te4.org/characters/223913/tome/b77d7d8c-2f32-4815-97cb-dd2c23e92697ah=06291a6c-4c53-4261-ba45-0526330c2b9ead=223913 Huh, link doesn't work? Weird.

It ran itself really, I kinda sorta followed some outdated guide with some tweaks. Basically had good gear and my temporal clones did massive amounts of damage and procced lots of debuffs.

https://te4.org/characters/223913/tome/b77d7d8c-2f32-4815-97cb-dd2c23e92697

you got some extraneous poo poo in your URL, this works

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!
Wow uh I got utterly crushed by my future self. Was that supposed to happen? I got a sweet looking bow out of the ordeal after my death sent me to an out of time zone?

Edit: I wish the combat log told you what the sources of damage were because I feel like I am doing inexplicably large amounts of damage. Is it my procs? Is it just my physical power?

Edit: huh I am fairly certain I died to the future self but it sent me to the fight with Epoch anyways. I unlocked paradox mage and got the achievement when I got sent to fight Epoch but when I returned my future self was nowhere to be seen. I also got the achievement for 6k damage done in a single attack so did my future self crit me for insane damage, kill me, then die to my damage reflect?

Artificer fucked around with this message at 02:20 on Aug 22, 2017

Affi
Dec 18, 2005

Break bread wit the enemy

X GON GIVE IT TO YA
So.. how do I play a yeek possesionist?

What's the gameplan here?

vdate
Oct 25, 2010

Affi posted:

So.. how do I play a yeek possesionist?

What's the gameplan here?

Step 1: Find the Watcher in the Water
Step 2: Inhabit its corpse
Step 3: Pr-

no, wait, that's something else. I genuinely have no idea how Possessors work in this game. I assume you Mind Crush anything that you don't want to possess and might pose a threat, though.

Falcon2001
Oct 10, 2004

Eat your hamburgers, Apollo.
Pillbug

vdate posted:

Step 1: Find the Watcher in the Water
Step 2: Inhabit its corpse
Step 3: Pr-

no, wait, that's something else. I genuinely have no idea how Possessors work in this game. I assume you Mind Crush anything that you don't want to possess and might pose a threat, though.

Possessors appear to be pretty nuts. Bpat recommended this guide: http://forums.te4.org/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=47900 which basically made me go 'oh okay I guess I'm not ever playing possessor'. It seems way too complicated.

Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
The guide in three sentences:

1: Invest in the weapon tree you like

2: Invest in the skill that lets you possess better things

3: Possess things that are good and strong and cool

Possessors are a little hard to get running, but it's not rocket science.

jsoh
Mar 24, 2007

O Muhammad, I seek your intercession with my Lord for the return of my eyesight
the biggest advice is that you should asap run to last hope and drown some guards and possess them right before they die

No Safe Word
Feb 26, 2005

vdate posted:

Step 1: Find the Watcher in the Water
Step 2: Inhabit its corpse
Step 3: Pr-

no, wait, that's something else. I genuinely have no idea how Possessors work in this game. I assume you Mind Crush anything that you don't want to possess and might pose a threat, though.

Oh man now I want to go play ToME 2.3.x again. Deathmold LostSoul Possessors always seemed like such a hilarious gimmick that I could never pull off.

e: and of course the first one I look up on the angband ladder has the Watcher

No Safe Word fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Aug 22, 2017

Icetongue
Jun 22, 2015

Artificer posted:

Wow uh I got utterly crushed by my future self. Was that supposed to happen? I got a sweet looking bow out of the ordeal after my death sent me to an out of time zone?

Edit: I wish the combat log told you what the sources of damage were because I feel like I am doing inexplicably large amounts of damage. Is it my procs? Is it just my physical power?

Edit: huh I am fairly certain I died to the future self but it sent me to the fight with Epoch anyways. I unlocked paradox mage and got the achievement when I got sent to fight Epoch but when I returned my future self was nowhere to be seen. I also got the achievement for 6k damage done in a single attack so did my future self crit me for insane damage, kill me, then die to my damage reflect?

Your future self basically severs your lifeline which deals several hundreds of thousands points of temporal damage to you, killing you more of less instantly, but since your future self killed its past self (you), there is no future self to be killed by, thereby creating a paradox. But that is all okay since messing with space and time is what Paradox Mages do best.

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!

Icetongue posted:

Your future self basically severs your lifeline which deals several hundreds of thousands points of temporal damage to you, killing you more of less instantly, but since your future self killed its past self (you), there is no future self to be killed by, thereby creating a paradox. But that is all okay since messing with space and time is what Paradox Mages do best.

But I didn't kill him. At least I don't think I was close to taking him down when I exploded and unlocked paradox mage, and then arrived at the fight with Epoch. My future self was gone when I killed Epoch; I thought I was supposed to fight him again after returning from the Paradox Zone?

Glidergun
Mar 4, 2007

Artificer posted:

But I didn't kill him. At least I don't think I was close to taking him down when I exploded and unlocked paradox mage, and then arrived at the fight with Epoch. My future self was gone when I killed Epoch; I thought I was supposed to fight him again after returning from the Paradox Zone?

He killed you. It's just that with you dead, there is no you from the future to go back and become the him that killed you. Chronomancy!

(The future paradox mage you meet as a timecop has a special spell than goes off after a middling-long amount of turns that deals enormous damage.)

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!

Glidergun posted:

He killed you. It's just that with you dead, there is no you from the future to go back and become the him that killed you. Chronomancy!

(The future paradox mage you meet as a timecop has a special spell than goes off after a middling-long amount of turns that deals enormous damage.)

Ooooooooooh. Thanks.

Unimpressed
Feb 13, 2013

Yessss, finally got my first win, Normal/Adventure Archer. Died three times, twice in a random fortress farportal and once to a bad orc patrol.

https://te4.org/characters/194270/tome/c4982850-4965-4177-aa3b-644775a74b88

Magitek
Feb 20, 2008

That's not jolly.
That's not jolly at all!
Well, that's unfortunate. I fought my way to the bottom level of the Halfling Complex, opened the door to the Yeek Wayist and found... Subject Z's golem servant standing where the Yeek would normally be. Either he spawned there and overwrote the Yeek or activated early and killed the Yeek before I could intervene.

No free confuse resistance for me.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Magitek posted:

Well, that's unfortunate. I fought my way to the bottom level of the Halfling Complex, opened the door to the Yeek Wayist and found... Subject Z's golem servant standing where the Yeek would normally be. Either he spawned there and overwrote the Yeek or activated early and killed the Yeek before I could intervene.

No free confuse resistance for me.

If anything gets in there besides Subject Z himself, it'll kill the Wayist and he won't even defend himself. It sucks, I've had teleporting skeleton mages get in there and murder him two games in a row.

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Is it a known issue that Medical Injectors don't trigger Arcane Shield?

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!
Does global speed slows on hit from multiple pieces of equipment stack? 15% + 15% = 30%?

I assume arcane resource burn on-hits stack?

vdate
Oct 25, 2010
I'm pretty sure multiple mana(ish)-burn on-hits do stack, since they each generate an instance of Arcane damage that nukes the appropriate amount of a Magic resource. I'm somewhat less sure that multiple global slow on-hits only refresh each other (to little avail since they're all getting applied in the same turn); if they do stack at all it's probably multiplicatively.

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LtSmash
Dec 18, 2005

Will we next create false gods to rule over us? How proud we have become, and how blind.

-Sister Miriam Godwinson,
"We Must Dissent"

I'm pretty sure multiple slows on hit stack but they are multiplicative. You can always check an enemies character sheet before and after you hit them to find out for sure.

I decided to step up from nightmare to insane and its mostly not been too bad. But I think Paradox Mage is covering for me since I was able to clear the room of death at 43 without much trouble.

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