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Does charge bonus affect the disruption and damage you get from impact or is that all mass and speed?
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Aug 28, 2017 18:51
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| # ? May 21, 2024 10:10 |
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Also important to note that the bonus damage you get from charge bonus is armor piercing, so cycle charging is how you damage dwarves if you're using something like goblin spider riders that don't really have any AP naturally. It's a big part of what makes Skarsnik and Goblin Big Boss really good lords even if they are not great at lord vs lord punch-ups like the orc bosses are. Night Goblin Big Boss' red line talents buff attack and charge bonuses to a ridiculous degree so you can turn that 20-something attack gobbo with single digit charge bonus into a 60ish attack block with 35-40 charge bonus, so your mewling shitling monsters have a charge bonus like a medium cavalry unit. It's generally not as effective in practice because goblins have next to 0 unit mass and don't penetrate the enemy lines at all, but it still makes them mean as poo poo when they close in for a scrap, especially when you add in all the poison being thrown around due to the NGBB poison trait. Generally speaking when I'm rolling Skarsnik or a goblin big boss, I don't even bother with night gobbos or spider riders because Regular gobbos and wolf riders get all the poison benefits while still having the better leadership scores (for the infantry) and better speed (for the wolf riders vs spiders). Goblin chariots are still criminally bad though. Edit: I also wish we would get a orc nob hero for the +public order bonuses and assaulting armies and whatnot. DeathSandwich fucked around with this message at 19:02 on Aug 28, 2017 |
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Aug 28, 2017 18:59
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StashAugustine posted:Does charge bonus affect the disruption and damage you get from impact or is that all mass and speed? That seems to be based on unit type vs unit type, whether the unit getting charged is moving or not, whether the unit getting charged has a defense against charge, and for chariots unit depth plays a part too. I believe chariots can bust through a unit that is <7 ranks deep but get bogged down if it's 7 or more. I have not really experimented with unit depth and cav charge damage / disruption amount. So basically the weight / type of the unit charging vs the weight / type of the unit getting charged, and whether that unit that got charged was standing still, seem to be the major factors for that disruption from what I've seen
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Aug 28, 2017 19:00
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Gonkish posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/6wfx44/til_use_j_to_supercharge_your_cyclecharging/  
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Aug 28, 2017 19:08
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Charge defense requires the unit to brace, which takes a couple seconds and is only effective in the direction it's facing. Doing so negates the numerical charge bonuses against them, but otherwise has no benefits. Units getting knocked around happens as a function of the mass/momentum of the various units which is independent of the "charge defense" trait. When units are more tightly packed, the units don't get launched because there is more mass/momentum of the defending units as a result of their placing. Spears generally are also able to be tightly packed but Peasants, for example, can't. This is why 160 peasants get knocked around and barely stop knights but 90 spears stop them dead in their tracks but giving the peasants a charge defense trait won't really affect that knock-around mechanic. If you have units with charge defense, you want them thick and dense. They might get knocked around on the charge, but the cavalry will be hitting them without bonuses and ultimately the charge will be a wet fart. jokes fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Aug 28, 2017 |
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Aug 28, 2017 19:13
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As a rule of thumb, I just look at the status indicator of the charging unit to guess if they still have charge bonuses applied. If it's not saying "Charging" anymore, I give it about 10 secs or something before pulling them out and readying for another one if they're a fast unit.
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Aug 28, 2017 19:52
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Does anyone else wish that greenskins got a orc shaman lord outside of Wurrzag? I kind of don't care about the night goblin shaman lords and I wish they got the night goblin big boss red line instead of the generic orc one. I want Night Goblin Shamans to be really worthwhile for a Skarsnik campaign and as of right now he's kind of not, at least compared to what NGBB brings to an all goblin army.
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Aug 28, 2017 19:58
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I haven't played the Beastmen yet, but I do know they're all about the charge. So is it to your benefit to try cycle-charging even your frontline of infantry, or does the lost DPS/extra casualties make it not worth the micro?
Mordja fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Aug 28, 2017 |
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Aug 28, 2017 20:00
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beastmen just gonna run away so you can charge again later when they rally I just keep doing that
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Aug 28, 2017 20:02
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I'm surprised that Charge Defense vs all is such a rare trait compared to Charge Defense vs large, and I haven't seen Charge Defense vs Infantry at all. Most non-large targets don't have the same degree of charge bonus anyway, so being resistant to it would be a comparatively minor bonus. Also note that nearly every Dwarf Infantry unit or Lord/hero has charge defense vs Large.
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Aug 28, 2017 20:28
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Mordja posted:I haven't played the Beastmen yet, but I do know they're all about the charge. So is it to your benefit to try cycle-charging even your frontline of infantry, or does the lost DPS/extra casualties make it not worth the micro? Once your bulls mop up the pinned down enemies you probably won't even have time to cycle charge the front.
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Aug 28, 2017 20:33
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i hope they add the pirate vampire faction 
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Aug 28, 2017 20:39
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juggalo baby coffin posted:i hope they add the pirate vampire faction Only if they get ruffs like so: 
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Aug 28, 2017 20:51
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DeathSandwich posted:Also important to note that the bonus damage you get from charge bonus is armor piercing, so cycle charging is how you damage dwarves if you're using something like goblin spider riders that don't really have any AP naturally. Incorrect. Theres 2 additional sources of damage from charging -From your charge bonus. How much of this is armor piercing is proportional to the AP of your regular attack. A unit with zero AP will still do zero AP on the charge from this, a unit with 100% AP gets its entire charge bonus as AP. Anti-large and anti-Infantry work the same way. -Physics/Collision damage. This damage is AP but its also independent from your displayed charge bonus or damage. When you charge a unit, the collision itself adds damage based on comparative weights and speeds. So heavy and fast units do alot of damage this way and slow and light units do very little. Unlike charge bonus damage, which keeps effecting units for 15 seconds, albeit for decreasing amounts, this only applies to the initial hit.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:12
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Mordja posted:I haven't played the Beastmen yet, but I do know they're all about the charge. So is it to your benefit to try cycle-charging even your frontline of infantry, or does the lost DPS/extra casualties make it not worth the micro? Don't do that. Your troops will break when the enemy starts getting free hits in and the morale debuff for being attacked in the rear kicks in. If you can't break the enemy very quickly after the initial charge you are at best going to suffer heavy casualties and at worst are going to watch your entire frontline start running for the hills while the enemy refocuses and smashes what you have left.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:33
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Any goon down with with a coop game? My usual partner just got nioh so he's gonna be gone for a while. Only caveat: I like using SFO and a few other mods.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:47
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Glenn Quebec posted:Any goon down with with a coop game? My usual partner just got nioh so he's gonna be gone for a while. Any goon down to gently caress? Only caveat: i had AIDS and the croup
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Aug 28, 2017 21:50
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So, just as a fun thought experiment, what are some other theoretical ways that you could have a Total Warhammer 2 Tilea/Estalia/Merchant Princes subfaction and have it be distinctly different from a reskinned empire? My personal thoughts would be thus: - Slightly less effective line swords/spears than Empire, though maybe a bit more effective than Brett. Mostly as a balance consideration for... - Marginally more effective Crossbows and Free Company Militia equivalent in the form of corsairs. Give them better armor than their Empire equivalent and maybe slightly better range/ap. - Demigryphs out, Knights of the Blazing sun bumped down to T4 to take their place considering KotBS is much more of a Tilean thing. - Addition of light cannon cavalry, give them siege attacker and the ability to move and reposition much faster than regular artillery, though much slower than regular cavalry. - Paymaster's cart: a Grail Reliquary / Corpse Cart style unit that gives a pretty stout +leadership and +attack bonus to nearby friendly units. - Ogre Leadbelcher mercenaries available as the T5 superunit, probably in lieu of a siege tank but filling a similar role in the "monstorous hellcannon running towards right at you to bash you in the face repeatedly with said cannon, after he already shot you with it as well"
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Aug 28, 2017 21:51
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DeathSandwich posted:So, just as a fun thought experiment, what are some other theoretical ways that you could have a Total Warhammer 2 Tilea/Estalia/Merchant Princes subfaction and have it be distinctly different from a reskinned empire? My personal thoughts would be thus: Make them a horde faction that gets random missions to pillage a town for loot or explore a ruin for treasure. Also give them the DaVinci Birdman guys,
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Aug 28, 2017 21:54
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Can recruit a random set of units from other factions as (very expensive) mercenaries.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:55
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juggalo baby coffin posted:Any goon down to gently caress? Lmao
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Aug 28, 2017 21:55
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juggalo baby coffin posted:i hope they add the pirate vampire faction A pirate faction would be kind of lame with no real naval combat system.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:56
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DeathSandwich posted:So, just as a fun thought experiment, what are some other theoretical ways that you could have a Total Warhammer 2 Tilea/Estalia/Merchant Princes subfaction and have it be distinctly different from a reskinned empire? My personal thoughts would be thus: I'd like to re-propose my idea of the non-Empire/Bretonnia humans getting much stronger veterancy bonuses to compensate for lower base stats/tech bonuses, but they don't get easy sources of veterancy like Captains and what not. Any dude that can survive whatever the Old World can throw at them without being a citizen of the Empire and Bretonnia ought to be a real loving badass.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:01
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Glenn Quebec posted:Lmao Sorry that was mean I just wanted to say someone had a baby disease
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Aug 28, 2017 22:02
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Tabletop wise Dogs of War/Tilea was a weird mish mash force that could also draw from the table top RoR, here's a quick run down: Main infantry is based around Pike and Crossbow. Skirmishers came in the form of Duelists, who had two swords and throwing weapons. Cavalry is mostly light and ranged, although some RoR were Knights. Their cannons were more light but mobile. They have a flying ranged unit which are men with mechanical bird wings strapped to their backs. Also it's really worth emphasizing the amount of units/races that could be taken on as mercs: Dwarfs, Norscans, Pirates, Elves (Dark and High), Ogres (Maneaters would be the fun elite monster elite), Giants, Greenskins, Halflings, Amazons, Giants, Undead. It depends how heavy they want to go into the hordes idea, but Tilea could easily be very distinct even without them. Also know they're being saved for game three, but it feels weird to not have Ogres yet given they are literally everywhere in the Old World.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:03
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Lassitude posted:A pirate faction would be kind of lame with no real naval combat system. i dont think they actually do piracy, the vampire just tricks pirates into getting shipwrecked then raises them from the dead
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Aug 28, 2017 22:09
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Blooming Brilliant posted:Tabletop wise Dogs of War/Tilea was a weird mish mash force that could also draw from the table top RoR, here's a quick run down: I imagine if Tilea or Southern Reals comes as a faction for game 2 the two starts are going to be Pirates of Sartosa and New World Colonies in the Vortex campaign, with the four lords having different starts in the Combined Map. So I can sort of see CA running with the Crossbow and Pikes line force and adding units of conquistadores and pirates as flavour to fatten up the relatively bare-bones faction, plus units aligned with Myrmidia. Plus oddball units from other factions through a mercenary system, but limited somehow. I wouldn't be surprised if they just do a full Southern Realms thing, so that in the Combined Map you get a start in Sartosa, another in Lustria, another in Estalia and a fourth in Tilea itself. I'd say Pizarro is definitely going to be a LL given his Lost Legion's flag is used as the banner for the New World Colonies.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:12
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Tilean mercenaries do sound like a good way to add in units from factions that are never going to have their own roster, eg Amazons, Albions, Halflings.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:15
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juggalo baby coffin posted:i dont think they actually do piracy, the vampire just tricks pirates into getting shipwrecked then raises them from the dead Nah, in the setting they definitely have ghost ships crewed by zombies and stuff.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:18
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Maybe by some miracle, Chaos Dwarves will make it in.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:52
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SkySteak posted:Maybe by some miracle, Chaos Dwarves will make it in. CD will make it in, but there will be a hat dlc.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:56
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SkySteak posted:Maybe by some miracle, Chaos Dwarves will make it in. Chaos Dwarfs are almost dead certain to be either a core or DLC faction for Game 3.
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Aug 28, 2017 22:58
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Mordja posted:Tilean mercenaries do sound like a good way to add in units from factions that are never going to have their own roster, eg Amazons, Albions, Halflings. Umm, halflings have an official army list. They have swan riders, tree men, angry house wives, and soup-based siege weapons. They even have a knockoff Gandalf, Aragorn, and Gimli as heroes. Def a game 3 core race.
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Aug 28, 2017 23:30
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The Great Swan Rider Charge against the horrors of the Skaven
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Aug 28, 2017 23:37
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Lol if you don't want to gently caress up eldritch horrors from beyond reality with a bunch of midgets riding pigs
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Aug 28, 2017 23:41
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The last thing Archaon sees before Chaos is defeated:
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Aug 28, 2017 23:46
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Kainser posted:The last thing Archaon sees before Chaos is defeated: SOUP CITY HERE I COME O-OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH
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Aug 28, 2017 23:56
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Kainser posted:The last thing Archaon sees before Chaos is defeated: See this poo poo owns and should absolutely be in the game haters gently caress off
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Aug 28, 2017 23:58
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Necroskowitz posted:Umm, halflings have an official army list. They have swan riders, tree men, angry house wives, and soup-based siege weapons. They even have a knockoff Gandalf, Aragorn, and Gimli as heroes. Def a game 3 core race. So, I know Warhammer is a silly setting, and it's strongest when it acknowledges that. But I guess for me Halflings have always been a step too far. Having a lizard wizard named tic tac toe is fine, but units of angry hobbit wives isn't. Throwing excited goblins in wings is fitting, but pots of soup are just too goofy.  I would be totally happy if Halflings never made it in as a full faction. A unit of mercenaries would be fine, just don't go too far into their list
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Aug 28, 2017 23:59
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Kainser posted:The last thing Archaon sees before Chaos is defeated: Please tell me they also have a cutlery catapult. Archaon being ended by either or both soup and a pile of spoons would the best.
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Aug 29, 2017 00:05
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