Murgos posted:I thought the Marseillaise was a song from a group rebelling against the revolutionary government? Ah, the old trousers as the British soldiers used to nickname it. Oddly enough very hard to find in the media trying to cover the Napoleonic Wars, some of the Polish (or Turkish?) reinactors gave it a go with the Sharpe TV series. I got a clip of it right here. Must of been terrifying with hundreds of dudes doing it. JcDent posted:Don't have the time to read any responses I got, just have to post and say that Dendra panoply is stupid as gently caress: AND NOW I WRITE THIS BATTLES FINAL CHAPTER WITH THE BLOOD OF MY ENEMIES!
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Sep 22, 2017 15:47
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Lol at that one confused swamp mongol
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Sep 22, 2017 15:47
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JcDent posted:Lol at that one confused swamp mongol Nenonen posted:What is that speck in Bumfuck, Finland? Frankfurt-am-Siikajoki? HEY GUNS fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Sep 22, 2017 |
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Sep 22, 2017 15:56
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Malachite_Dragon posted:I'm still like a hundred pages back to catch up on, but now that I have a proper Kindle to read poo poo on at work , is there a list of goon-recommended milhist ebooks I can start spending money on instead of model kits? I've already read both WW1 Day By Day books and I need more historical input, dammit The kindle versions of Schwerpunkt and Red Steamroller go on sale regularly for something like a dollar.
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Sep 22, 2017 16:05
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 My research was on this dude. He was a cabinet minister in the mid-late 19th century in the UK, the head of a prolific Scottish clan, and wrote books about loving everything. Like the full gammut from land reform to theology to 1000 page responses to Darwin. I wrote about the books. Weird because most of my time at university I was a medieval intellectual historian. I mostly just read his published materials but that amounts to tens of thousands of pages.
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Sep 22, 2017 18:24
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Alchenar posted:5. b) Early in the war the attacking column would be preceded by an enormous swarm of skirmishers (like, regiment sized) as a screening force to protect the column from fire and help fix positions. Later on the decline of infantry standards meant the screen had to be foregone. What exactly are skirmishers in the Napoleonic era? I know in the days before gunpowder it was mainly just a bunch of dudes throwing poo poo at the enemy and then scurrying away when the enemy tries to engage with them directly, but I thought the whole point of Napoleonic era drill and formations was that it wasn't practical to use gunpowder weapons outside of highly-regulated line formations.
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Sep 22, 2017 18:25
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I also previously indicated interest in this knowledge. Also, lol at the Scottish wikipedia editor
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Sep 22, 2017 18:28
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SlothfulCobra posted:What exactly are skirmishers in the Napoleonic era? I know in the days before gunpowder it was mainly just a bunch of dudes throwing poo poo at the enemy and then scurrying away when the enemy tries to engage with them directly, but I thought the whole point of Napoleonic era drill and formations was that it wasn't practical to use gunpowder weapons outside of highly-regulated line formations. Voltigeurs (tr. 'Vaulters') we're originally conceived as more or less parasite infantry meant to ride along on the rear end-end of the cavalry horses (yes, tandem with the actual cav) but that, albeit awesome, did not loving work so they kept the name and just became light, mobile infantry. They'd basically operate in an irregular fashion relative to the main force and do stuff like screen movements and just piss off the other guy's soldiers so they couldn't concentrate their efforts cleanly. Later on they got Zouaves around the middle of the 19th century, and Zouaves are basically harlem globetrotter infantry and dressed like MC Hammer while running around the battlefield keeping the enemy's eyes anywhere but forward. Even the US had Zouaves during the ACW and yep they rolled with the parachute pants and the piped-up vest and tasseled cap and all. The French version at least drew nominally Arab or North African Zouaves from their colonies but lol not in the US.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:02
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FAUXTON posted:Voltigeurs (tr. 'Vaulters') we're originally conceived as more or less parasite infantry meant to ride along on the rear end-end of the cavalry horses (yes, tandem with the actual cav) but that, albeit awesome, did not loving work so they kept the name and just became light, mobile infantry. 
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Sep 22, 2017 20:10
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Yes, but how does light infantry do the irregular stuff, and what is irregular stuff in Napoleonics? How do they help shape the battle when they are deployed in one as opposed to loving aboot raiding? Meanwhile, people ressurecting the "AK was actually made by Germans" myth because an AK monument mistakenly included plans for STG. The new spin is that even if STG and AK are different, AK was produced by lies and slave labour, and the gun was simplified to match lovely Soviet industry, and Kalashnikov didn't do much more than attach his name to it.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:18
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It kind of depends. Mostly your job is to be disruptive or to fight the other guys skirmishers on the battlefield. But some skirmishing is just done by detachments of line infantry, some infantry do both (e.g. Austrian Grenzers) and sometimes they do perform regular infantry duties (I can recall Austrian jaegera holding a ditch against a frontal assault). I think you just need to examine your initial assumption that you have to fire muskets (or rifles) en masse for them to be useful.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:27
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Disinterested posted:
Interesting. What did this guy have to say to Darwin?
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Sep 22, 2017 20:33
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JcDent posted:The new spin is that even if STG and AK are different, AK was produced by lies and slave labour, and the gun was simplified to match lovely Soviet industry, and Kalashnikov didn't do much more than attach his name to it. Nazis: not at all known for slave labour
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Sep 22, 2017 20:59
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Late 1944 German armaments industry: Not at all known for being poo poo.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:05
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The Ottomans had Akinji and Bashi-Bazouks as irregular skirmishers until the reforms, and even after those I think some units still remained?
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Sep 22, 2017 21:19
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Naw, you see, this is a hot take against Russians/Soviets that can only steal, enslave and never produce anything themselves! *quietly ignores Operation Paperclip and such*
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Sep 22, 2017 21:24
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feedmegin posted:Nazis: not at all known for slave labour Clean Wehrmacht Arms Manufacturers.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:28
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Nebakenezzer posted:Interesting. What did this guy have to say to Darwin? So he was an amateur biologist with a particular interest in birds, but his primary concerns were twofold: ensuring that evolution by natural selection didn't eliminate space for religion, and ensuring that some commentators on Darwin (not Darwin himself) didn't misuse the theory to claim that non-European races were members of other species (which was a live debate at the time). He also took some technical interest in Darwin's work because of his birding around, which led to Darwin further developing his theory of sexual selection. Big time anti-slavery campaigner (his first wife was a Sutherland, a big time anti-slavery family), and by far the most pro-union member of the cabinet during the ACW. Did a lot to ease tensions by permanently talking Sumner off a cliff.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:30
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JcDent posted:Yes, but how does light infantry do the irregular stuff, and what is irregular stuff in Napoleonics? How do they help shape the battle when they are deployed in one as opposed to loving aboot raiding? I'm following the drama as it develops. The latest retort from the sculptor is a) who even is this Pasholok, I bet he's not real b) he should have told us in the first place. Meanwhile the schematic was scrubbed from the monument.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:33
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JcDent posted:Naw, you see, this is a hot take against Russians/Soviets that can only steal, enslave and never produce anything themselves! It's a well known fact that our captured Nazi scientists were better than their captured Nazi scientists 
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Sep 22, 2017 21:45
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Ensign Expendable posted:I'm following the drama as it develops. The latest retort from the sculptor is a) who even is this Pasholok, I bet he's not real b) he should have told us in the first place. So wait, the guy was pointing to a recent sculpture as proof? How? What? I don't get it.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:58
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Disinterested posted:It kind of depends. Mostly your job is to be disruptive or to fight the other guys skirmishers on the battlefield. But some skirmishing is just done by detachments of line infantry, some infantry do both (e.g. Austrian Grenzers) and sometimes they do perform regular infantry duties (I can recall Austrian jaegera holding a ditch against a frontal assault). They'd even mix in sharpshooters so they could bag officers and drummers.
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Sep 22, 2017 22:01
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FAUXTON posted:They'd even mix in sharpshooters so they could bag officers and drummers. Were bassists considered off limits or something
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Sep 22, 2017 22:17
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Murgos posted:So wait, the guy was pointing to a recent sculpture as proof? How? What? I don't get it. The sculpture of Kalashnikov was built recently. According to proud tradition of the Russian Military Historical Society, instead of having proper consultants, they googled "AK exploded diagram" and put in the first image into the background of the pedestal. The diagram was of the Stg.44. Pasholok found out and pointed it out, and it blew up into a huge thing. Nobody is considering this proof of the AK being a copy of the Stg.44, but the topic periodically resurfaces, and this is as good a reason as any.
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Sep 22, 2017 22:53
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SU-76 precursors Queue: ZIK-7 and other light SPG designs, SU-26/T-26-6, SU-122 precursors, SU-122 competitors, Light Tank M5, Medium Tank M3, Tankbuchse 41, s.FH. 18, PzVII Lowe, Tiger #114, Chrysler K, A1E1 Independent, Valentine I-IV, Swedish tanks 1928–1934, Strv 81 and Strv 101, Pak 97/38, 7.5 cm Pak 41, Czechoslovakian post-war prototypes, Praga AH-IV, KV-1S, KV-13, Bazooka, Super Bazooka, Matilda, 76 mm gun mod of the Matilda, Renault FT, Somua, SU-122, SU-122M, KV-13 to IS, T-60 factory #37, D.W. and VK 30.01(H), Wespe and other PzII SPGs, Pz38(t) in the USSR, Prospective French tanks, Medium Tank M7, Churchill II-IV, GAZ-71 and GAZ-72, Production and combat of the KV-1S, L-10 and L-30, Strv m/21, Landsverk prototypes 1943-1951, Pz.Sfl.V Sturer Emil, PzII Ausf. G-H, Marder III, Pershing trials in the USSR, Tiger study in the USSR Available for request:  IM-1 squeezebore cannon 45 mm M-6 gun IS-2 (Object 234) and other Soviet heavy howitzer tanks T-70B  25-pounder PIAT Lee and Grant tanks in British service NEW  105 mm howitzer M2A1  15 cm sIG 33 10.5 cm leFH 18 PzII Ausf. J VK 30.01(P)/Typ 100/Leopard  47 mm wz.25 infantry gun  SAu 40 and other medium SPGs NEW  Strv m/40 Strv m/42 Strv m/21 Strv m/41 pvkv m/43
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Sep 22, 2017 22:55
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Ensign Expendable posted:The sculpture of Kalashnikov was built recently. According to proud tradition of the Russian Military Historical Society, instead of having proper consultants, they googled "AK exploded diagram" and put in the first image into the background of the pedestal. The diagram was of the Stg.44. Pasholok found out and pointed it out, and it blew up into a huge thing. Nobody is considering this proof of the AK being a copy of the Stg.44, but the topic periodically resurfaces, and this is as good a reason as any. Reminds me of when the Democrats or Republicans used an image of Chinese destroyers as emblematic of US naval power.
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Sep 22, 2017 23:08
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Don't go after the regimental band, the majors have terrifying mace batons and will brain you.
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Sep 22, 2017 23:16
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HEY GAIL posted:there are several people from the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth but none from what is now Lithuania. A bunch of Livonians. Here is a zoom-out of my first map. I ended up not using it because at this resolution, Germany is just a blob. Did the people from the non-Germanic areas know some variety of German going in, or would they just pick up what they needed to know along the way?
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Sep 22, 2017 23:22
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Disinterested posted:It kind of depends. Mostly your job is to be disruptive or to fight the other guys skirmishers on the battlefield. But some skirmishing is just done by detachments of line infantry, some infantry do both (e.g. Austrian Grenzers) and sometimes they do perform regular infantry duties (I can recall Austrian jaegera holding a ditch against a frontal assault). Yeah, keep in mind the formations were there to maintain control of troops and keep them together to assault/repel assaults. They didn't have radios and had a lot less trust that men wouldn't just disappear back then, so command required men to stay formed. In reality, firing drills were more to make men shoot faster and not have them shoot at things way outside their range(though they did this anyway quite often).
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Sep 22, 2017 23:39
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JcDent posted:Meanwhile, people ressurecting the "AK was actually made by Germans" myth because an AK monument mistakenly included plans for STG. The new spin is that even if STG and AK are different, AK was produced by lies and slave labour, and the gun was simplified to match lovely Soviet industry, and Kalashnikov didn't do much more than attach his name to it. Simplifying weapon manufacture: a bad thing.
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Sep 23, 2017 00:19
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"The most complicated solution is the best"-Occam's hosed up German brother.
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Sep 23, 2017 01:01
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Elyv posted:Did the people from the non-Germanic areas know some variety of German going in, or would they just pick up what they needed to know along the way?
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Sep 23, 2017 01:17
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meme incoming
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Sep 23, 2017 01:30
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HEY GAIL posted:there are several people from the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth but none from what is now Lithuania. A bunch of Livonians. Here is a zoom-out of my first map. I ended up not using it because at this resolution, Germany is just a blob. 1. That's cool, you can kind of make out the Ottoman borderlands from the heat map. 2. Why do random Scots show up in every European war? Ghetto Prince fucked around with this message at 01:37 on Sep 23, 2017 |
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Sep 23, 2017 01:31
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Ghetto Prince posted:2. Why do random Scots show up in every European war? Much like soccer hooligans or orks, they're always up for a good fight.
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Sep 23, 2017 01:35
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Ghetto Prince posted:1. That's cool, you can kind of make out the Ottoman borderlands from the heat map. There were lots of small Scottish crises in this period over the usual issues of religion, who gets to be monarch, and parliamentary power. These issues alongside the usual petty crime and feuds between lairds keep a steady stream of exiles flowing out of the country, with not much else to do. I've also heard it mentioned the various wars in Ireland saw the development of a somewhat professional Gaelic military class among the Scottish clans of the western islands and Argyllshire, who would seasonally cross the Irish sea to work in the employ of the Crown. Joining a continental mercenary outfit would be be a natural career transition.
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Sep 23, 2017 02:30
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My family is Latvian, and it looks like there's one sad, drunk, potato-eating rear end in a top hat in HEY GAIL's map. 
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Sep 23, 2017 04:27
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Wallenstein's killer was a Scot mercenary as well!
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Sep 23, 2017 04:32
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Plutonis posted:Wallenstein's killer was a Scot mercenary as well!
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Sep 23, 2017 04:39
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FAUXTON posted:Voltigeurs (tr. 'Vaulters') we're originally conceived as more or less parasite infantry meant to ride along on the rear end-end of the cavalry horses (yes, tandem with the actual cav) but that, albeit awesome, did not loving work so they kept the name and just became light, mobile infantry. They'd basically operate in an irregular fashion relative to the main force and do stuff like screen movements and just piss off the other guy's soldiers so they couldn't concentrate their efforts cleanly. So basically lovely bargain bin dragoons.
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Sep 23, 2017 04:41
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