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tsob posted:Good people aren't born inherently good, they learn to be good via consequence. Which is why removing consequence is a potential problem. Maybe people are just inherently good or bad. How else would you decide the eternal fate of a stillborn? The whole system is literally rigged from the start.
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Oct 26, 2017 19:16
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They get to the Good Place finally, and it's one giant violent fetish club out of "San Junipero," as the end result of people living in a universe with on-demand fulfillment of all desires.
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Oct 26, 2017 19:26
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tsob posted:Good people aren't born inherently good, they learn to be good via consequence. Which is why removing consequence is a potential problem. If people have to learn to be good, that doesn't mean they'll stop being good once consequence is removed. Keeping the same behavior patterns outside the environment you developed them in is sort of the definition of learning. Also, the idea that people aren't born inherently good is questionable too. Being good feels nice. Seeing people smile when you help them is wonderful, petting cats is great. Lots of bad behaviors are learned, either because you do something lovely once, get rewarded for it and just keep running with it, or because you feel unsafe somehow and start doing lovely stuff looking for some misguided sense of security. In a place where you can't be hurt and all your wants and needs are instantly provided, there's no incentive to be bad either. Most importantly, don't forget to factor in that people apparently go to the bad place for being French. Would people in the good place start speaking French if they knew it didn't have any consequences?
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Oct 26, 2017 19:35
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Otherkinsey Scale posted:Keeping the same behavior patterns outside the environment you developed them in is sort of the definition of learning. You also don't stop learning once you go to the Good Place, or else the show's entire premise would fail. If you can learn to be good, you can learn to be less good or outright bad afterwards, and having no consequences for eternity is a good way to facilitate that. Otherkinsey Scale posted:Also, the idea that people aren't born inherently good is questionable too. I didn't mean to imply they're born bad; just that they're born ambivalent.
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Oct 26, 2017 19:47
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The idea that exploring altered states in heaven would the corruption of a good person is the most baffling "drugs are bad on principle" thing I've ever heard. "What if a good person went to heaven, but then they tried drugs!!! What an ethical oxymoron"
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Oct 26, 2017 22:39
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Even caffeine alters your perceptions and behavior. There is literally no such thing as unaltered consciousness, our brains are swimming in chemicals all the time, both internally produced and externally introduced. Yeah I don't know why "drugs are inherently bad" is coming up here.
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Oct 26, 2017 22:52
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I assume this show inevitably will be used to teach the basics of moral philosophy to high school and college kids
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Oct 26, 2017 22:55
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BlueBayou posted:I assume this show inevitably will be used to teach the basics of moral philosophy to high school and college kids Do good deeds to be rewarded with never ending shrimp in eternity?
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Oct 27, 2017 00:00
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precision posted:Even caffeine alters your perceptions and behavior. There is literally no such thing as unaltered consciousness, our brains are swimming in chemicals all the time, both internally produced and externally introduced. Yeah I don't know why "drugs are inherently bad" is coming up here. It came up as a simple example because drugs like cocaine are associated with annoying or bad behavior in general, but was never meant to serve as more than a simple extrapolation of how someone could start trying simple things out of curiosity because of a lack of consequence and become worse in general over time due to the lack of consequence itself rather than because of drugs specifically.
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Oct 27, 2017 00:07
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Oh poo poo Janet flashback episode!
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Oct 27, 2017 01:31
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About the what-would-good-people-do thing, I figure that since motive is factored in to good/bad punishments, the actually-good people aren't tempted to be Bad because "good things to avoid being considered bad" is considered a bad thing. Let the Good People in the Good Place do whatever, and they'll still be Good because they don't have the motivation to be Bad. Unrelated, how long after airing do new episodes go on the site / app? I have only the Fox stuff to go on (new Orville episodes come out not long after airdate), in this respect.
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Oct 27, 2017 01:35
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I'm super excited about diving deep into the psyche of a Janet
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Oct 27, 2017 01:41
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This cast is so amazing.
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Oct 27, 2017 01:52
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AWWWWW
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Oct 27, 2017 01:52
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ZOUKS!
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Oct 27, 2017 01:59
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holy poo poo
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Oct 27, 2017 01:59
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This episode was delightful holy poo poo
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Oct 27, 2017 02:01
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Ah so this is how God came into existence, that makes sense.
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Oct 27, 2017 02:01
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Holy poo poo The guest star I didn't know I wanted In the most perfect possible role 
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Oct 27, 2017 02:01
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"No blood. That's good." absolutely slayed me.
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Oct 27, 2017 02:05
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JethroMcB posted:The guest star I didn't know I wanted Shouldn't everyone want Jason Mantzoukas in every guest star role, in every possible condition of things? I can't wait for this to be on their website so I can watch it. I need my Zouks.
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Oct 27, 2017 02:10
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gently caress, I just found out the next episode is the last one this year.
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Oct 27, 2017 02:11
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Arist posted:gently caress, I just found out the next episode is the last one this year. Boo i hate that they do that
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Oct 27, 2017 02:19
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Unrelated to anything specific, I would love to see a Bad Place Neighborhood that's the antithesis of Michael's, in that it's supremely efficient. Wouldn't have to show anything graphic, just a dude sitting at desk with a tablet, monitoring featureless blocks that are optimally torturing billions of people inside. Someone who can't understand why the Boss lets Michael run a punishment that employs a couple hundred folks to force four - four - people into torturing themselves.
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Oct 27, 2017 02:55
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You have to kill me 
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Oct 27, 2017 03:03
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MisterBibs posted:Shouldn't everyone want Jason Mantzoukas in every guest star role, in every possible condition of things? He's terrible, he plays the same drat character on everything and it gets old SOOOOOO drat quickly. The moment he showed up with his back to the camera I thought "oh no please dont let that be Jason Mantzoukas." and audibly groaned when he turned around. I like him in things like the How did this get made podcast but his tv roles are so annoying. I guess I'm in the minority though.
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Oct 27, 2017 05:22
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I Tought I Saw a Puddin Vat
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Oct 27, 2017 05:23
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I'm a little sad that even though we saw Janet get a new outfit every time she was rebooted, she didn't have the same outfit she started with when Michael originally booted her up or any other than the one this current iteration Janet was wearing in flashbacks. Janet's wardrobe is great.
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Oct 27, 2017 05:38
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Oct 27, 2017 06:12
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DurosKlav posted:He's terrible, he plays the same drat character on everything and it gets old SOOOOOO drat quickly. The moment he showed up with his back to the camera I thought "oh no please dont let that be Jason Mantzoukas." and audibly groaned when he turned around. I like him in things like the How did this get made podcast but his tv roles are so annoying. I guess I'm in the minority though. Look at how wrong one person can be.
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Oct 27, 2017 07:16
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 They initially put real needles in Chidi's face  but ended up using prosthetics instead.
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Oct 27, 2017 07:40
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I was staring at the episode list for so long just going "who the gently caress is Derek, is he a new character or one I forgot" I was not prepared for the answer.
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Oct 27, 2017 08:22
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MisterBibs posted:About the what-would-good-people-do thing, I figure that since motive is factored in to good/bad punishments, the actually-good people aren't tempted to be Bad because "good things to avoid being considered bad" is considered a bad thing. Let the Good People in the Good Place do whatever, and they'll still be Good because they don't have the motivation to be Bad. I, at least, am not solely defining "consequences" as "eternal damnation" or "people thinking you're bad." Murder is bad, for example, because it kills a person. If someone doesn't murder because they find the thought of permanently ending someone's life abhorrent, that's not really a bad reason; transplant that person to the Good Place, where everyone's already dead and "murder" at worst just means the person gets put back together and rebooted, and if they think about it they might no longer find it as abhorrent and might go shoot someone in the face for shits and giggles because it will carry no actual consequence. e: like, I would think being in the afterlife genuinely changes the ethical calculus on a lot of stuff we'd ordinarily consider bad. Theft, for another example, is actively pointless due to Janet, but also lacks any kind of meaningful consequence due to Janet; whatever property gets stolen can simply be instantly replaced via Janet pulling it from Michael-knows-where. It goes from "extremely bad thing to do to another person" to "kind of dickish I guess." WeedlordGoku69 fucked around with this message at 08:30 on Oct 27, 2017 |
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Oct 27, 2017 08:27
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Also, watching the new episode and writing my thoughts live: - Holy gently caress Bad Janet pretending to be good and melting from it  - Janet's weird-rear end physiology owns. - Tahani and Jason are so loving adorable. - Holy gently caress Jason is amazing in this episode. I wasn't quite on board with them swerving him from "both Cheech and Chong combined into one person" to "a small child in the body of a 20-something" at first, but this is loving hilarious. - Oh my god the noise Janet makes when she's barfing coins - I think someone called that Janet was gonna flip poo poo over Jason and Tahani. - "Ohhhh.... nuts." D'arcy Carden is giving the performance of her goddamn life in this show and I really hope she blows up from it. - Custard's Last Flan is an amazing pun. - "Janet's made a lot of talk-talk into my ear-holes..." I hate this guy already. - That's a hell of a spot to end the episode on.
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Oct 27, 2017 09:07
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Seriously, is Jason Mantzoukas always this grating? He's nearly approaching Lemongrab levels of grating as this character.
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Oct 27, 2017 09:12
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:Seriously, is Jason Mantzoukas always this grating? He's nearly approaching Lemongrab levels of grating as this character. he's the loving worst
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Oct 27, 2017 09:32
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So many bad opinions about Zouks in this thread, good lord
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Oct 27, 2017 09:37
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GobiasIndustries posted:So many bad opinions about Zouks in this thread, good lord Denied the Glory of the Zouk : -190000 per instance
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Oct 27, 2017 09:41
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Snak posted:Why would using drugs without consequences be bad? The worst part is having to buy them, if drugs were free there would be less crime.
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Oct 27, 2017 10:57
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This was the best episode.DurosKlav posted:He's terrible, he plays the same drat character on everything and it gets old SOOOOOO drat quickly. The moment he showed up with his back to the camera I thought "oh no please dont let that be Jason Mantzoukas." and audibly groaned when he turned around. I like him in things like the How did this get made podcast but his tv roles are so annoying. I guess I'm in the minority though.
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Oct 27, 2017 12:32
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