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Daztek
Jun 2, 2006



Also happy first anniversary Star Citizen thread :toot:

Pledge more posts

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Daztek
Jun 2, 2006



Daztek posted:

Also happy first anniversary Star Citizen thread :toot:

Pledge more posts

JUST DO IT

trucutru
Jul 9, 2003

by Fluffdaddy

Loxbourne posted:

Although apparently ship ideas come from Ben, actually making him work for that "Director of Spaceships" title?

Successful ship ideas come from Roberts, unsuccessful ones from others.

Raskolnikov
Nov 25, 2003

Daztek posted:

JUST DO IT

Why? It will just get locked on page 6665 again. :mad:

Daztek
Jun 2, 2006



Raskolnikov posted:

Why? It will just get locked on page 6665 again. :mad:

Not if we post fast enough and the mods are asleep

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer

Loxbourne posted:

So CIG started selling land plots and the backers let them...


Excellent stuff.

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer

Raskolnikov posted:

Nobody does delusional pedantic quite like our warlord but I'm glad someone is giving it a go.

I dunno why Derek bugs people so much that they get so incredibly angry about him, I think it's hilarious. If that means I get flak too, I'm all for it because it's funny.

Raskolnikov
Nov 25, 2003

Lol

EmesiS
Feb 5, 2016

if Derek had five dicks his underwear would fit like a glove.

EmesiS
Feb 5, 2016

thats 5 hate boners

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016

Einbauschrank posted:

Man of many acres.

gently caress, so many pages behind, but this is cool and good. MoMA, who is Toast, will be proud.

EmesiS
Feb 5, 2016

drat...didn't work

Raskolnikov
Nov 25, 2003

EmesiS posted:

thats :five: hate boners

Daztek
Jun 2, 2006



MedicineHut posted:

gently caress, so many pages behind, but this is cool and good. MoMA, who is Toast, will be proud.

He's not Toast

He is Toast

VictorianQueerLit
Aug 25, 2017

AP posted:

If you've got a problem with me saying "At the time none of us suspected things were as bad as he said", then you just need to quote that bit and argue about it.

You could quote it properly too as that helps, this is referring to July 2015 when I don't recall thread regulars talking about both the most senior producers about to walk, a few months before 5 members of the LA office got fired/walked, Star Marine got cancelled the Escapist ran their racist piece and Chris Roberts had his 8 hour meltdown.

Maybe you remember the thread differently possibly, due to a head injury.

I just deleted a brutal takedown because I'm picking too many fights all over the forum and don't have energy for this one.

I keep calling you out because you have a long history of sucking up to Derek and it's annoying.

He's a ranting crazyperson and part of the disaster. If you want to tell him how he is a hero who changed everything or be salty toward anyone who disparages him his forums are probably a better place for that.

alf_pogs
Feb 15, 2012


thread has only been in development for one year and has produced more content than star citizen

(the other ten threads dont count)

CrazyLoon
Aug 10, 2015

"..."

AP posted:

I dunno why Derek bugs people so much that they get so incredibly angry about him, I think it's hilarious. If that means I get flak too, I'm all for it because it's funny.

He doesn't make most people ITT angry at all, he's just a pedantic rear end in a top hat that writes blogs, repeating the same tired poo poo over and over, making predictions that are sometimes true and sometimes not (same as any other rear end in a top hat on the internet with an opinion), who has as much idea of what he's talking about as Crobblers ever did, but who, for the exact same reason, will never realize his inadequacies due to his galactic-size ego. Which is why seeing you step up to bat for such a guy will always be funnier than whatever anger (real or imagined) there might be towards him.

Seriously, just chill the gently caress out commando! And I say this as someone who raised hell with a thread back in 2015 when he got refunded, he twittered and complimented that I was, and I quote, 'starting a revolution with no fear' and other than me keeping a screenshot of it to laugh at in memory, lmao if you think I'd ever defend him because of that faint praise like you seem to. Because, newsflash, he doesn't give a poo poo about anyone but himself. Plus, it also wasn't his stupid summer blog that got me to refund 2 months before the Escapist article, which is definitely when most of the folks here did theirs.

CrazyLoon fucked around with this message at 11:07 on Dec 2, 2017

Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
This thread is great because it gives the feeling I am in some sort of bar where everyone is gawking at some amazing trainwreck while drunken rants and odd tangents go on occasionally.

Spiderdrake
May 12, 2001



Pharohman777 posted:

This thread is great because it gives the feeling I am in some sort of bar where everyone is gawking at some amazing trainwreck while drunken rants and odd tangents go on occasionally.
Same but the bar is on a nice boat and it's slowly circling the slowly sinking wreck. Sometimes the wreck is on fire. When it's not on fire the boat gets rowdy.

SCtrumpHaters
Oct 28, 2017

by Nyc_Tattoo

VictorianQueerLit posted:

I just deleted a brutal takedown because I'm picking too many fights all over the forum and don't have energy for this one.

I keep calling you out because you have a long history of sucking up to Derek and it's annoying.

He's a ranting crazyperson and part of the disaster. If you want to tell him how he is a hero who changed everything or be salty toward anyone who disparages him his forums are probably a better place for that.

I just deleted a post too that would have owned everyone and blown this thread wide open

EmesiS
Feb 5, 2016

takes balls

alf_pogs
Feb 15, 2012


Pharohman777 posted:

This thread is great because it gives the feeling I am in some sort of bar where everyone is gawking at some amazing trainwreck while drunken rants and odd tangents go on occasionally.

you wanna go where people know
people are all the same
you wanna go where everybody
knows your name

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer

VictorianQueerLit posted:

I just deleted a brutal takedown because I'm picking too many fights all over the forum and don't have energy for this one.

I keep calling you out because you have a long history of sucking up to Derek and it's annoying.

He's a ranting crazyperson and part of the disaster. If you want to tell him how he is a hero who changed everything or be salty toward anyone who disparages him his forums are probably a better place for that.

I just deleted a brutal takedown :gary:

There should be a Derek action figure, he's got an entirely useless marvel superhero power of making people mad.

Mangoose
Dec 11, 2007

Come out with your pants down!

Spiderdrake posted:

Same but the bar is on a nice boat and it's slowly circling the slowly sinking wreck. Sometimes the wreck is on fire. When it's not on fire the boat gets rowdy.

I feel the bar is a restaurant at the end of the universe and we're just watching it over and over

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer

CrazyLoon posted:

He doesn't make most people ITT angry at all, he's just a pedantic rear end in a top hat that writes blogs, repeating the same tired poo poo over and over, making predictions that are sometimes true and sometimes not (same as any other rear end in a top hat on the internet with an opinion), who has as much idea of what he's talking about as Crobblers ever did, but who, for the exact same reason, will never realize his inadequacies due to his galactic-size ego. Which is why seeing you step up to bat for such a guy will always be funnier than whatever anger (real or imagined) there might be towards him.

Seriously, just chill the gently caress out commando! And I say this as someone who raised hell with a thread back in 2015 when he got refunded, he twittered and complimented that I was, and I quote, 'starting a revolution with no fear' and other than me keeping a screenshot of it to laugh at in memory, lmao if you think I'd ever defend him because of that faint praise like you seem to. Because, newsflash, he doesn't give a poo poo about anyone but himself. Plus, it also wasn't his stupid summer blog that got me to refund 2 months before the Escapist article, which is definitely when most of the folks here did theirs.

:gary:

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer
https://twitter.com/BlueFenrisulfr/status/936873637591650305

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer
https://twitter.com/NOOBLETSdotCOM/status/936763741642874880

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016

ManofManyAliases posted:

I've given this three times now. I want to see SQ42 drop in its entirety next year (2017) and real progress made with the (star)systems. That is to say, everything that alpha 4.0 was touted to be - should be in 2017.

Has someone quoted the poo poo out of this yet?

Daztek
Jun 2, 2006



MedicineHut posted:

Has someone quoted the poo poo out of this yet?

I think that's an old Toast goalpost

Nyast
Nov 14, 2017

BLAZING AT THE
SPEED OF LIGHT

trucutru posted:

How do you know they have 400 people?

IIRC they reported 470 excluding contractors, but then who knows what the truth is..

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016

VictorianQueerLit posted:

No way this lasts until 2019.

Even if you could theoretically develop a MMO on 10% of what the ship sales are with a smaller team you are talking about Star Citizen here. The entire thing is held up by the faith of people paying for it and how it's a sure thing they just have to wait for. Anything, at all, signalling trouble like a subscription model, layoffs, studio closures or whatever else would be completely disastrous.

I have no evidence but I think the reason they lasted this long is due to their invisible finances. Everyone predicting the giant idiot burning tens of millions on movie shoots would go bankrupt quickly has been wrong but I think it's due to outside factors.

My speculation would be that they got a huge surplus from 2013-2014-2015 ship sales. Sometime in late 2015 they began burning so rich that they got outside loans to burn through before hitting the surplus funding, then hitting the whale sales so hard that they needed to take tax advances out.

I think we hit peak whale a long time ago. Funding is down like 40% over this time last year and historically we are about to drop off a funding cliff which happens even in their best years.


So I'd say before the June-July drought of next year if they can't magic up more money we don't know about to fill the gaps. I originally thought they would collapse the end of this year but I didn't really think it through that they would obviously want to get their three biggest sales in the three biggest months out of the way. Hitting the bottom of the cliff in January and then going forward into the new year with 6-7 months of drastically reduced funding ahead would be when I would think things would happen.

We are going to be at <$1,000,000 per month for 3-4+ months soon. Even the wildest and most optimistic burn rate predictions make that a massive loss.

A complete financial accounting like they contractually promised would be pretty enlightening and might explain how something so obviously failed has persisted so long. There is no "Well a company of 50 could survive for ten years off of the ship sales!" at play. Once the mass delusion cracks they will be swamped in millions of dollars in lawsuits, refunds and bad press while they are still in pre-alpha.

If Crobberts was the type of person to adjust to realistic conditions to produce a realistic product we wouldn't have Star Citizen. This runs at Peak Dreams until it can't.

Yes, I also think so. What is holding the faithful is that "reasonable hope" that stems from the funding tracker. Everything else is going to the pits but the funding tracker is that one red hot beacon of light and hope that backers go back to to reassure themselves there is still hope. Weather in a conscious or unconscious level. And while there is still hope many will continue funding. If anything manages to shake the faith on that funding tracker that will be the real ELE.

Nanako the Narc
Sep 6, 2011


This guy keeps talking as if Squadron 42 was out and a real thing right now, it's really annoying.

TheLastRoboKy
May 2, 2009

Finishing the game with everyone else's continues
You have to admit "I just deleted a brutal takedown" is a very Derek Smart thing to say.

TheLastRoboKy
May 2, 2009

Finishing the game with everyone else's continues
Well, except he wouldn't have deleted it, and it wouldn't have been a brutal takedown anyway.

Mangoose
Dec 11, 2007

Come out with your pants down!

TheLastRoboKy posted:

Well, except he wouldn't have deleted it, and it wouldn't have been a brutal takedown anyway.

It would be so brutal he'd put it in his sig

SomethingJones
Mar 6, 2016

<3
Well this is me throwing my hands up in light of $6 million space dollah (allegedly) pulled in during a time when the project is technically and demonstrably a mess from start to finish.

It defies common sense and logic.

In terms of gameplay it is indefensible. In terms of technical achievement it is indefensible and unfixable. In terms of art it is all over the place, models can look stunning, planets look terrible, animation is janky and bad. Movement is bad. Physics are bad.

The only way I can understand it is to remove it entirely from the world of games and gaming. It doesn't belong. It is not a game nor a demo of a game, it's more like an interactive mocap session with QWOP style triggers of canned actions.

It's designed that you can clunk your way around and the resulting images onscreen may create something that afterwards you can sit closed eyed and piece together your own mini-drama of what happened.

It evokes the idea of a game without actually being one. It puts you in the mood for the game it is trying to be without ever becoming it.

The only way it ends is if whales stop wanting what it wants to be.

SCtrumpHaters
Oct 28, 2017

by Nyc_Tattoo

SomethingJones posted:

Well this is me throwing my hands up in light of $6 million space dollah (allegedly) pulled in during a time when the project is technically and demonstrably a mess from start to finish.

It defies common sense and logic.

In terms of gameplay it is indefensible. In terms of technical achievement it is indefensible and unfixable. In terms of art it is all over the place, models can look stunning, planets look terrible, animation is janky and bad. Movement is bad. Physics are bad.

The only way I can understand it is to remove it entirely from the world of games and gaming. It doesn't belong. It is not a game nor a demo of a game, it's more like an interactive mocap session with QWOP style triggers of canned actions.

It's designed that you can clunk your way around and the resulting images onscreen may create something that afterwards you can sit closed eyed and piece together your own mini-drama of what happened.

It evokes the idea of a game without actually being one. It puts you in the mood for the game it is trying to be without ever becoming it.

The only way it ends is if whales stop wanting what it wants to be.

I called it

TheLastRoboKy
May 2, 2009

Finishing the game with everyone else's continues

SomethingJones posted:

Well this is me throwing my hands up in light of $6 million space dollah (allegedly) pulled in during a time when the project is technically and demonstrably a mess from start to finish.

It defies common sense and logic.

In terms of gameplay it is indefensible. In terms of technical achievement it is indefensible and unfixable. In terms of art it is all over the place, models can look stunning, planets look terrible, animation is janky and bad. Movement is bad. Physics are bad.

The only way I can understand it is to remove it entirely from the world of games and gaming. It doesn't belong. It is not a game nor a demo of a game, it's more like an interactive mocap session with QWOP style triggers of canned actions.

It's designed that you can clunk your way around and the resulting images onscreen may create something that afterwards you can sit closed eyed and piece together your own mini-drama of what happened.

It evokes the idea of a game without actually being one. It puts you in the mood for the game it is trying to be without ever becoming it.

The only way it ends is if whales stop wanting what it wants to be.

I guessed 3.8 million but them hitting 6 million doesn't really shock me. There's pretty obviously always been a strong core of people with more money than brains who view their purchases as helping development. This isn't the first time they've managed to claw their way out of a hole like this. Everyone likes to remind Derek he'd predicted they'd run out of money a few years back, but then they managed to out-do themselves and suck people back in in no small part due to the PU, and even Derek admits he was surprised they managed it.

I doubt this is the last time they'll do it, but looking at what they've managed so far it's obviously not going to result in a game coming out. The only way the dream is going to die is if the dreamers die.



How dare you where did I put my brutal takedown I think I left it in my basement goddamnit where's the light switch oh gently caress bonk tonk crash bang thud crack pchunk creak.

SomethingJones
Mar 6, 2016

<3

I get it though, I'm looking at this through the eyes of a gamer and I see a total mess with 'this is never going to be fixed' all over the place.

Folks who make games for a living see the exact same thing, through the eyes of a coder.

Folks who own companies and hire staff see 'this is unsustainable' through the eyes of a business owner.

What you have to do is look at it through the eyes of the people funding it, and you can infer their social and professional experience well enough by reading r/starcitizen, r/ds and spectrum.

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SomethingJones
Mar 6, 2016

<3

TheLastRoboKy posted:

I guessed 3.8 million but them hitting 6 million doesn't really shock me.

I guessed 4.2, where they are now or at least where they claim to be is genuinely a shock to me.

Videos of 3.0 being played wouldn't get a kickstarter off the ground right now, not when Elite exists, Dual Universe exists as a slick, smooth alpha, especially not when it's unashamedly a p2w title and especially when it has a fraction of the gameplay that even the launch version of NMS had. With worse graphics than all of them, with worse performance than all of them, worse physics, worse animations.

The game is only one component of what these guys are buying into here, and it clearly, obviously is NOT the most important thing to them.

I want to stress that so much I'm going to do a fiddly phone c&p of it

The game is only one component of what these guys are buying into here, and it clearly, obviously is NOT the most important thing to them.

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