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blue squares
Sep 28, 2007

You can't vote split in a live tribal very easily.

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ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

Thankee kindly.
Lauren's exit press is up, so:

quote:

Holmes: You gave half of your idol to Mike, was that a “You’re safe. If I vote you out, you can chuck this into the ocean” kind of play?
Rimmer: Yeah, it was to keep Mike as close to me as I could. There are so many things that Mike felt like he was left out of. And I didn’t want him to feel like he was being left out of the situation. It was really a last-minute thing. I’d just found out that Ben was gunning for me and I had to make sure that Mike was with me and voting the way he needed to vote. And then when he threw it in the fire I was just dumbfounded.
Holmes: And you couldn’t have dug it out with your torch?
Rimmer: Looking at it now I’m thinking; why didn’t I just try to grab the idol back? Would Jeff have accepted it? I was in such shock.
Holmes: I don’t think there are any rules against it. And would a shell even burn up?
Rimmer: It wouldn’t have burned, if anything it would turn black a little bit. I should’ve got it. And I’ve talked to Dr. Mike a little bit since then and neither one of us had even thought about digging it out of the fire. He’s like, “Why didn’t you think about that?” And I said, “Why didn’t you think about it?! Why’d you even throw it in?!” (Laughs)
Holmes: Do you at least still have the leather string as a souvenir?
Rimmer: Yes, I do.

Holmes: You said you left the extra vote back at camp. What was the reasoning behind that?
Rimmer: It was actually in my pocket. I was trying really hard not to use it at that point. Things never work out the way you want them to. Once I went with, “I don’t have it, I’m not using it.” I kind of had to stick with that. I needed to convince them that it wasn’t in my pocket. And if they were all going to switch their votes, I had to run with it.

But more importantly, the question we all wanted an answer to:

quote:

Holmes: I’ve gotta ask; what was with the redhead hatred early on in the season?
Rimmer: I have a lot of friends who are redheads. When I’m fishing, there are three or four guys who are redheads. And it’s always been a running joke, and I forgot that the world didn’t know about this running joke, that I can’t trust a redhead. These guys, half of them are sneaky and they’re always playing jokes. And Patrick, I was trying to get under his skin because he was doing such a good job of getting under mine.

The Bloop
Jul 5, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
I accept that her redhead comments were just her being a drat inept bumpkin rather than a south park racist.


That sure was a series of enormous fuckups though

Spergatory
Oct 28, 2012
I'm pretty sure they all just thought that Lauren's idol was the only idol in play. The thought that Ben had an idol too didn't even occur to them. I don't really blame them because the sheer number of idols this season has been actually loving absurd.

ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

Thankee kindly.
This season was going on while Game Changers was still airing, so they probably hadn't received the backlash of Advantagegeddon yet.

Now if the next season has this many advantages still, then we have a problem.

Also I'm not sure which would have been worse - Lauren being voted out with an extra vote in her pocket, or her using it and having it be eaten up by Ben's idol anyway. I'd go with the second because it makes Ben look even better for cancelling out an advantage.

The Bloop
Jul 5, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
That was certainly OTT but that tribal where everyone but Cirie was immune was hilarious none the less.

Pinterest Mom
Jun 9, 2009

#survivormeltdown

Fast Luck posted:

She wouldn't have used it though because they weren't playing around a potential Ben idol at all.

I mean, there's not really a cohesive "they" there. Obviously Devon/Ashley/Lauren couldn't afford to throw votes at Ben. Maybe Ryan and Chrissy should have thrown Devon some votes, that might have worked.

xbilkis
Apr 11, 2005

god qb
me
jay hova

Dugong posted:

A modern day Gabon~

I agree, this is a real good season

AWarmBody
Jul 26, 2014

Better than a cold one.
Loved Ones episodes are usually my least favorite , but this was an exception.

Chrissy's monologue during the Loved Ones Challenge seemed like a "I decided I want to be a stay-at-home mom again, so please give me the million" speech.

When Chrissy and Ashley were talking strategy on the log while their loved ones flanking them was a little strange to watch. The loved ones just stared and Chrissy's husband had a very camera-aware smile. I wonder if Ashley would've been as receptive to Chrissy had their loved ones not been present to put an extra layer of social pressure on.

Also I've never heard vocals in the music during the LOC before like there was when Ben hugged his wife. It was surprisingly dramatic, but so was the second round of rock pulling. As crappy as the challenge was, one of my favorite Survivor shots was from this challenge: when Ben held up his rock with shaking hands in the foreground as his wife held out her arm and revealed her (not-matching) rock in the background and winced immediately.

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

I actually didn't really care about the non-challenge because like the Loved One thing is all about the greetings and emotion and I don't really care that there wasn't a bad challenge where loved ones struggled to figure out what was happening and still came down to 1 person winning and then choosing half the people. That Ben hand shake and Chrissy deciding to not only be petty but to be proud about it was basically what that segment is always going for.

Lone Goat
Apr 16, 2003

When life gives you lemons, suplex those lemons.




We flew you across the planet so you could do a live coin flip. Ok you failed to use the Frozen Envelope method, get back in the plane.

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

I mean, yeah, it was dumb in that way for them but I was just talking about as a viewer. Its all pretty random anyway so I didn't care, but like if the Survivors or loved ones got upset they didn't get to throw water at each other and make some attempt to control their fate I wouldn't argue with them. I'm just not that invested in that part of it.

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

IcePhoenix posted:

I enjoyed last night's episode after the terrible loved ones stuff was out of the way. Fortunately I was watching on a delay so I was able to just skip most of it.

I have no idea what Lauren was thinking throughout a lot of that episode, but she definitely deserved to go home. I'm glad she went out gracefully. I could see her coming back in a returnees season, and might be the only one in this whole cast who would be able to keep up (idol idiocy aside).

It is hard to judge though because this cast is not very good at the game. But that also makes for some pretty drat entertaining television the last few weeks! I'm still hopeful that Devon makes it to the end. I think he could beat Ben if they both make it to FTC, though it would be close.

If Lauren hadn't thrown her idol away and played it, what happens if all votes are cancelled? Do they just completely revote with everyone that played an idol + II being immune? That would have been a fun scramble.

I'm glad someone else hates the loved one stuff. At this point I fast forward past it all on default. You could tell it was a good episode though because instead of going past 30 minutes it was like one segment of family.

TheCenturion
May 3, 2013
HI I LIKE TO GIVE ADVICE ON RELATIONSHIPS

Rick posted:

I'm glad someone else hates the loved one stuff. At this point I fast forward past it all on default. You could tell it was a good episode though because instead of going past 30 minutes it was like one segment of family.

The loved-one stuff is awesome when it's things like 'Ok, loved-ones, you get to do the eat disgusting stuff challenge while the Survivor players sit and watch.' This coin-flip thing was just stupid.

They also didn't bother with any of the actual post-challenge loved-one interactions, which was awesome.

Nihonniboku
Aug 11, 2004

YOU CAN FLY!!!
I don't really understand all the Chrissy hate. She's no less dumb or self-entitled than any of the other remaining players this season. If anything, she's been an underdog all season, which I'm always sympathetic towards an underdog.

I don't want her to win. But I don't understand why she gets so much vitriolic hate than any of the other morons playing this season.

xbilkis
Apr 11, 2005

god qb
me
jay hova
I am like the no. 1 defender of unfairly maligned older women characters, and I can't fathom anyone not understanding why people hate Chrissy

I like her as a character but she's basically a tamped-down Kass minus the self awareness

Nihonniboku
Aug 11, 2004

YOU CAN FLY!!!

xbilkis posted:

I am like the no. 1 defender of unfairly maligned older women characters, and I can't fathom anyone not understanding why people hate Chrissy

I like her as a character but she's basically a tamped-down Kass minus the self awareness

Maybe it's because I tuned out most of the time for most of the season until recently because of how dull it was at the start. All I see now is a bunch of fools, no one more foolish than the other.

Nihonniboku fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Dec 9, 2017

AWarmBody
Jul 26, 2014

Better than a cold one.
How do I pay CBS to show me the unaired footage of Devon making out with his mom?

Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist

Nihonniboku posted:

I don't really understand all the Chrissy hate. She's no less dumb or self-entitled than any of the other remaining players this season. If anything, she's been an underdog all season, which I'm always sympathetic towards an underdog.

Goldfish memory, huh?

She was on top for a long time and instantly went petulant when things turned for her... two episodes ago?

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

She kind of summed it up herself why people dislike her. She freaked out when she got blindsided and admitted she can't stand being out of control and then she got blindsided a second time and called it "inhuman" and boasted about how much she wanted to get revenge for it by denying the guy time with his wife. Then there's also the funny thing where on two separate occasions she went to someone and was all "I've always wanted to work with you" and they pointed out how she hadn't spoken to them until she needed them.

And yeah, she's only been an "underdog" for 2 weeks. 2 weeks ago the show started with her and Ryan gloating how they had the whole thing under control.

Nihonniboku
Aug 11, 2004

YOU CAN FLY!!!

STAC Goat posted:

then she got blindsided a second time and called it "inhuman"

The Chrissy hate was going on well before that. She was just blindsided by Ben, she asked him what happened, and he was completely rude and dismissive of her. I would be upset with him too.


STAC Goat posted:

and boasted about how much she wanted to get revenge for it by denying the guy time with his wife.

The guy just blindsided her, and was a complete rear end when she confronted him about it. Why would she reward him for all of that?

STAC Goat posted:

And yeah, she's only been an "underdog" for 2 weeks. 2 weeks ago the show started with her and Ryan gloating how they had the whole thing under control.

I remember the first few weeks where she was being threatened with being voted off her tribe simply for being one of the older ladies. Maybe she did have a few weeks where she was in the core alliance, but she didn't start that way, and she certainly isn't that way now.

She sort of reminds me of the ultimate older lady underdog, Kathy Vavrick O'Brien. Constantly being targeted, makes alliances where she needs to, and squeaks on by each week when a more obvious threat rears their head.

Evrart Claire
Jan 11, 2008

Nihonniboku posted:

The guy just blindsided her, and was a complete rear end when she confronted him about it. Why would she reward him for all of that?

That and it's not like she had some obligation to pick certain people for that.

Born_to_Lose
Oct 26, 2007
You guys seriously can't understand why people dislike Chrissy? Are we watching the same show :confused: Virtually everything she says is dripping with arrogance and condescension, and the second things don't go her way she immediately slips into the role of the unjustly persecuted victim. I've hated her since the beginning of the show and it has nothing to do with her being old or a woman, it's because she's an unbelievably conceited jerk.

Vernacular
Nov 29, 2004
I'm not as low on Chrissy as others are, but there's clearly a lot not to like: the regular, blatant shunning of non-alliance members until she needs their vote. The steadfast belief that the alliance of 7 was going to mindlessly fall into step until it came time to vote off one of their own. The obvious, complicit whispers between her and Ryan, Ben, etc. that served to reinforce her air of exclusivity. Her relative lack in grace in handling blindsides and the shift of power (though I do get her frustration with Ben). I mean, at the end of the day, she's just a bit of a socially clueless gamebot type without the easygoing charm of a Kim Spradlin or Cochran needed to smooth the edges of the strategic side of her game.

Ryan has ended up being a really interesting foil for her. He's handled the shift of power with a lot of grace, and without burning any bridges. If he can organize and take credit for Ben/Devon boots in the next few episodes, and be sitting next to Mike and Chrissy at the end, he might win. He would have to really throw Chrissy under the bus at FTC, though, voicing his awareness of her social ineptitude and claiming he aligned with her due to her ability to attract unwanted attention.

Vernacular fucked around with this message at 06:55 on Dec 9, 2017

Bolivar
Aug 20, 2011

Is there a history in this show of telling people about your idols and advantages being a good and wise thing towards winning a million? Because as long as I remember, it always follows the same pattern:
1) Jimmy finds an idol
2) Jimmy is high and excited
3) Jimmy overdoses on his own ego by thinking he's a strategic mastermind and tells his buddy Billy about the idol in order to "gain trust"
4) Jimmy and Billy are best friends forever for the next 20 hours
5) Billy has been thinking about this in his head last night and decides that it's his time to step up his game and tells Molly about the idol in order to "gain trust"
6) one hour later, everyone on camp knows

It's easy to dismiss it as hindsight but every time someone does it (like Ryan this season) I shout in my head NOOOOOOOOO because it's just so drat obvious what happens next. And Lauren could have just noted the spot of the (part) idol and come back later for it. Instead she decides in 0,5 seconds that she wants everyone on camp to know. She was like a poker player who goes all in, all in, all in, all in every round and it goes really well all the way until some one actually has a hand.

I don't like Ben but I don't think I'll mind if he wins a million because he's the only person who can keep his own god drat secret to himself (was that his own words? Might be).

Bolivar fucked around with this message at 12:09 on Dec 9, 2017

CODChimera
Jan 29, 2009

Fedelm posted:

So this crazy tribal happened all because Ben overheard his alliance at the well discussing whether to vote him out before or after Chrissy. And the final nail was when they clammed up as soon as he showed himself. Like they couldn't even continue

Yeah they were SO bad when Ben walked up to them but maybe it was just the editing. Hard to imagine people would act like that so late into a season.

ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

Thankee kindly.

CODChimera posted:

Yeah they were SO bad when Ben walked up to them but maybe it was just the editing. Hard to imagine people would act like that so late into a season.

They've spent 30 days out there without access to a constant supply of food, hygiene or comfort. Sometimes people make baffling decisions when they're running on empty.

Bolivar posted:

Is there a history in this show of telling people about your idols and advantages being a good and wise thing towards winning a million? Because as long as I remember, it always follows the same pattern:

I mean there was Yul in Cook Islands, but idols were different then.

Spergatory
Oct 28, 2012
To me, that stuff is more excusable later in a season because constantly mounting paranoia, hunger, and stress are pretty taxing on the mind and it only gets worse as the game nears its end. It's wearing on you all the time and you're not really allowed to recover from it until your game is over.

The funny thing about the well scene is that what Ben actually heard was Devon talking everyone out of voting him out at this point. I mean, that's still awkward and kind of hard to explain, but it's still pretty funny (and makes Devon the only sensible person in that group).

Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist
It's not what they were talking about. It's that they all stopped the moment he arrived.

mancalamania
Oct 23, 2008

Bolivar posted:

Is there a history in this show of telling people about your idols and advantages being a good and wise thing towards winning a million? Because as long as I remember, it always follows the same pattern:

I think part of the reason the early post-Russell seasons were so dull is the players became terrified of the idols, so letting other players know about your idol lead to (1) them being less likely to betray you out of fear, (2) them feeling happy that they are aligned with a powerful aggressive player that might burn bridges and lose in the end.

Thankfully, the show got over this hump once people realized that willingly giving the Idol holder full control of the game generally led to that Idol holder winning or coming very close to winning, and responding appropriately.

ETA: To be more specific, players I have in mind that seemed to more or less gain full control of the game once people knew or suspected they had an idol are (spoilers for the seasons 21-27 era, just in case) Boston Rob in 22, Coach in 23, Kim in 24, Malcolm in 25 and almost 26 too, and Tyson in 27; you could also make the case for Na'Onka, Chase, and Sash in 21 too.

mancalamania fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Dec 9, 2017

Lone Goat
Apr 16, 2003

When life gives you lemons, suplex those lemons.




So Ben is guaranteed to be win immunity here.

DurosKlav
Jun 13, 2003

Enter your name pilot!

This better not be another idol found.


Morons, Ashley seems most likely to flip. She was fairly quiet at the start of the episode when they were discussing how Ben was definitely the one going. Chrissy not very good at this game.

DurosKlav fucked around with this message at 02:17 on Dec 14, 2017

Codependent Poster
Oct 20, 2003

That's a terrible move to not take Ashley.

DurosKlav
Jun 13, 2003

Enter your name pilot!

"I'm not worried about Ben finding an idol"

*Ben will find a poorly hidden idol 2 seconds later.

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

The first half of this episode has me convinced that Devon is gone tonight which makes me sad.

Codependent Poster
Oct 20, 2003

IcePhoenix posted:

The first half of this episode has me convinced that Devon is gone tonight which makes me sad.

Him just dumping Ashley for no reason is going to bite him on the rear end. And Ben is gonna keep scraping by because the others keep eating each other.

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

Codependent Poster posted:

Him just dumping Ashley for no reason is going to bite him on the rear end. And Ben is gonna keep scraping by because the others keep eating each other.

I think they'd all still vote out Ben if he lost immunity, but I feel like they're setting him up to win it.

Shneak
Mar 6, 2015

A sad Professor Plum
sitting on a toilet.
Chrissy's reasoning for her targets are so schizophrenic.

DurosKlav
Jun 13, 2003

Enter your name pilot!

I really hate the "we dont have to rush to vote out this obvious super major threat because we can do it any time" bullshit. It always loving bites you in the rear end.

Though its not going to matter when Ben wins immunity.


Now get rid of the threat while you have the chance.

DurosKlav fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Dec 14, 2017

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TMMadman
Sep 9, 2003

by Fluffdaddy
This episode really seems like it's setting up a huge Chrissy fall.

I mean, she'll get her way tonight, but I feel like it's about to turn on her.

Or it could be the obvious setup for her winning.

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