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Jamwad Hilder posted:I'm probably in the minority but I think I'd rather have McAvoy or Sergachev for the next decade or so than have Karlsson for a season and change, even if it gives the team a better shot at a Cup in that small window. McAvoy is a good young player, but what does he project to long term? A decent #2? I'd take eighteen months of arguably the best defenceman since Lidstrom over that every day. a false posted:i would take two decades of mediocrity in exchange for one stanley cup; and hell, i already have, and then some As a fan of a certified never gonna win one team, I'd be perfectly content with the Canucks being absolute dogshit for the rest of my life if it meant that I saw them win one cup before I died.
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Feb 8, 2018 17:01
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ThinkTank posted:McAvoy is a good young player, but what does he project to long term? A decent #2? I'd take eighteen months of arguably the best defenceman since Lidstrom over that every day. Trying to not be a homer here, but McAvoy is already a #1. Topping out as a decent #2 would be a surprise. The list of defensemen who play more even strength minutes than him is 8 guys long (Karlsson, Doughty, Jones, Suter, E. Johnson, Ristolainen, Gardiner, Green), and most of the articles I've read analyzing the Chara-McAvoy pairing have shown that it's actually McAvoy making Chara look good - not the other way around. Do I think McAvoy will ever be as good as Karlsson? No, absolutely not. But being a Doughty-type is not out of the question and having that caliber player for ~10 years vs 18 months of Karlsson is why I'd hesitate.
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Feb 8, 2018 17:31
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Jamwad Hilder posted:Trying to not be a homer here, but McAvoy is already a #1. Topping out as a decent #2 would be a surprise. The list of defensemen who play more even strength minutes than him is 8 guys long (Karlsson, Doughty, Jones, Suter, E. Johnson, Ristolainen, Gardiner, Green), and most of the articles I've read analyzing the Chara-McAvoy pairing have shown that it's actually McAvoy making Chara look good - not the other way around. Do I think McAvoy will ever be as good as Karlsson? No, absolutely not. But being a Doughty-type is not out of the question and having that caliber player for ~10 years vs 18 months of Karlsson is why I'd hesitate. I get that you watch him every night, but Doughty comparisons are probably pretty ambitious. Doughty was in the midst of a 59 point, Norris trophy nominated season at the same point in his career. I think you're looking at a player somewhere between Gardiner and Doughty. If you look at that list of players, all are good NHLers, only two are franchise defencemen that even come close to Karlsson: Doughty and Suter. Jones and Green are 1st pairing types, the others are 2nd pairing and below. If you take that list to be roughly indicative of the type of player McAvoy could be, a 1 in 4 shot of being a true #1 is trumped in my mind by the 100% chance of Karlsson being that while their best players are still at the top of their game. I mean, the Bruins don't need to make a trade for Karlsson but it sure would help and there will probably not be another chance for them to acquire a franchise defenceman in the next 3-5 years. Their core of Bergeron, Marchand, and Rask are quite likely coming to the end of their days as top quality players. They have a couple good pieces moving forward in McAvoy and Pastrnak, but is that enough to replace those who are aging out? If you assume that McAvoy will be in his prime from age 23-27, that's when Marchand is 34 and Bergeron is 38. I figure the Bruins window is very much open right now, so why not go for it? You have to give to get, and McAvoy is probably the cost of that.
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Feb 8, 2018 17:46
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CBJSprague24 posted:I for one am looking forward to another first-round bye for the Penguins before they meet the Caps in the second round again. Good job, Gary. Judging by how poo poo they were against the Devils the last time they played them I'm not sure that's a first round buy. I mean I'm sure they'd win when it mattered but I don't think the Devils are as big a pushover as some might think. They have a lot of team speed/system discipline and if healthy they have an elite goalie. That's exactly the type of team that can give the Pens problems.
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Feb 8, 2018 17:52
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Doughty had 27 points as a rookie.
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Feb 8, 2018 17:53
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Aphrodite posted:Doughty had 27 points as a rookie. He was also a year younger
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Feb 8, 2018 17:54
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The extra year in the NHL is way, way more of a factor than age. I'm not saying I think he'll score 60 next year or that I necessarily agree with Jamwad but at that age range playing in the NHL and more importantly having access to NHL quality training programs and equipment and all that is much more important than aging a bit. Aphrodite fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Feb 8, 2018 |
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Feb 8, 2018 18:05
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Jamwad Hilder posted:Trying to not be a homer here, but McAvoy is already a #1. Topping out as a decent #2 would be a surprise. The list of defensemen who play more even strength minutes than him is 8 guys long (Karlsson, Doughty, Jones, Suter, E. Johnson, Ristolainen, Gardiner, Green), and most of the articles I've read analyzing the Chara-McAvoy pairing have shown that it's actually McAvoy making Chara look good - not the other way around. Do I think McAvoy will ever be as good as Karlsson? No, absolutely not. But being a Doughty-type is not out of the question and having that caliber player for ~10 years vs 18 months of Karlsson is why I'd hesitate. Just from the last game Boston played vs. Leafs, Chara looked like 30-35 year old Chara where he was big and imposing but you couldn't just skate around him like you could for the last few years. I don't know how or why or if it was just the one game, but he seemed to be pulling his own weight to my own eyes.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:11
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I don't think Ottawa is going to get an impact player like McAvoy if they move Karlsson. I bet it ends up being heavily a futures deal.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:16
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https://twitter.com/reporterchris/status/961647107252797440 *looks at Isles defense situation* Brendan, how'd you like to stay in NY?
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Feb 8, 2018 18:17
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Aphrodite posted:The extra year in the NHL is way, way more of a factor than age. Yeah. With younger players it's a lot more useful to compare inaugural seasons, second years, etc., than raw age. Doughty had a great second year, but he had a year of NHL experience. McAvoy was in college last year and his rookie year is looking like it will be better than Doughty's (although team quality certainly plays into that too). I'm not saying he's going to be Doughty, but the potential is definitely there. Decent #2 is the very low end of his potential. Ultimately I'd probably accept him being part of a trade for Karlsson, but I certainly wouldn't be happy about it. Call Your Grandma posted:Just from the last game Boston played vs. Leafs, Chara looked like 30-35 year old Chara where he was big and imposing but you couldn't just skate around him like you could for the last few years. I don't know how or why or if it was just the one game, but he seemed to be pulling his own weight to my own eyes. A lot of it is because they don't have to play him 30 minutes a night anymore. Used to be the defense was garbage outside of Chara and Krug, but McAvoy, Carlo, and Grzelcyk have all been able to step in, and Kevan Miller isn't bad anymore.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:20
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Rotten Cookies posted:https://twitter.com/reporterchris/status/961647107252797440 This has *got* to be a precursor to some kind of trade, right? Making cap room for old Brooks Orpik I imagine? please god take Orpik and a draft pick for McDonagh
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Feb 8, 2018 18:23
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Rotten Cookies posted:https://twitter.com/reporterchris/status/961647107252797440 Hoooooly shittttttt pissssssss 
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Feb 8, 2018 18:23
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Matt Zerella posted:Hoooooly shittttttt pissssssss wow dude has struggled but I almost wonder if there's more going on. He seemed like he thought he needed to do more than just play the same simple game that got him signed and instead tries to make the difficult play time and time again.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:31
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Rotten Cookies posted:https://twitter.com/reporterchris/status/961647107252797440 Ken Holland: super genius. Give that man an 8-year extension.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:34
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Jamwad Hilder posted:A lot of it is because they don't have to play him 30 minutes a night anymore. Used to be the defense was garbage outside of Chara and Krug, but McAvoy, Carlo, and Grzelcyk have all been able to step in, and Kevan Miller isn't bad anymore. Also the minutes he is playing are probably a bit easier on his dusty old bones when he can let his partner take care of stuff sometimes and not have to do everything himself because he's beside god drat Trotman.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:34
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T-Bone posted:I don't think Ottawa is going to get an impact player like McAvoy if they move Karlsson. I bet it ends up being heavily a futures deal. Maybe McAvoy is a bit too high a price, but surely someone in the Sergachev range has to be the centre piece coming back? If not, why bother moving him unless he's asked out? I'm struggling to think of a comparable trade of a career peak superstar player with term remaining on their contract that wasn't a cap dump or moving a disgruntled player. Rick Nash? Phil Kessel? It's not an extensive list and neither of those guys were ever considered the best at their position. The only really comparable trade I can think of was Pronger to Anaheim and he returned Lupul (coming off a 28 goal season), Smid (9th overall pick two years prior), 2 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder. None of those players were McAvoy quality but Lupul at the time wasn't miles off as a young, high end NHL asset. Even then, Pronger asked out and the Oilers had no choice but to move him. As far as we're aware, Karlsson is happy in Ottawa (his wife is from the area). If you're not going to end up with an asset that could potentially replace the player you're moving out (albeit at a reduced level), what's the point of dealing a guy like that? A package of 3 or 4 futures might have two guys work out and none of them would even come close to offering what Karlsson does. If that's all you're going to get back, it's easier and safer to just sign him long term and hope the team improves.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:35
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https://twitter.com/TomUrtzJr/status/961647679376936960
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Feb 8, 2018 18:35
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loving savagery
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Feb 8, 2018 18:37
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are we sure Sather didn't call down for this one? Seems like something he'd do... I'd also say that AV's system is stupid hard for defensemen for some reason...probably because everyone is constantly guessing about where they need to be and who to cover and when a defenseman recovers the puck, he often has no support because the forwards are also guessing about where to be instead of being in position to provide support. That's not a total excuse for Smith because as I said he decided he had to make the difficult play every single time this season, but it frustrates me to no end that the Rangers started this season with a promising group of defenseman that should have been able to move the puck and push the play and the coaching staff immediately pulled it all down to play their same "concede the blue line give up a ton of shots play a difficult man defense that makes everyone look bad oh and your outlet/transition strategy is always the long stretch pass hope you don't look like piss trying to play that"
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Feb 8, 2018 18:40
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smith was good when he came over last year so i don't know what the gently caress happened
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Feb 8, 2018 18:42
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Jamwad Hilder posted:Yeah. With younger players it's a lot more useful to compare inaugural seasons, second years, etc., than raw age. Doughty had a great second year, but he had a year of NHL experience. McAvoy was in college last year and his rookie year is looking like it will be better than Doughty's (although team quality certainly plays into that too). Fair enough, I wasn't saying it would be a lopsided win for the Bruins just that it would be (to me) a justifiable move given the respective team situations. Jamwad Hilder posted:Grzelcyk I am 99% sure that Grzelcyk is the Gretzky stand in from one of those 90s SEGA Genesis hockey games that didn't have an NHL license.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:42
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Oh and apparently the Rangers have called a press conference later today? Unsure if that's about waiving Smith or something else (fire av)
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Feb 8, 2018 18:50
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announce trading everyone
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Feb 8, 2018 18:53
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a false posted:announce trading everyone "we're calling up the entire hartford wolfpack and sending down the entire rangers team"
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Feb 8, 2018 18:55
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a false posted:smith was good when he came over last year so i don't know what the gently caress happened He was alright, he was really only good in the Montreal series. I’m pretty sure all of RWAS is going “we warned you!” Still astonished he’s on waivers. Curious what this announcement is. It must be smith related, surely you could have moved him for a bag of hockey pucks at the trade deadline or something. Jovial Cow fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Feb 8, 2018 |
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Feb 8, 2018 18:55
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Levitate posted:"we're calling up the entire hartford wolfpack and sending down the entire rangers team" Into it.
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Feb 8, 2018 18:55
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Fire AV?
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Feb 8, 2018 19:01
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OldSenileGuy posted:Fire AV? Do it.
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Feb 8, 2018 19:02
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i have been summoned
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Feb 8, 2018 19:02
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Levitate posted:He seemed like he thought he needed to do more than just play the same simple game that got him signed and instead tries to make the difficult play time and time again. oh hey it's that thing I said last march
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Feb 8, 2018 19:04
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Teemu Pokemon posted:i have been summoned  Also, Pionk called up.
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Feb 8, 2018 19:06
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The Red Wings inability to draft and develop a defenseman since Kronwall is astounding
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Feb 8, 2018 19:21
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that'll happen when you trade all your draft picks away for erik coles and david legwands I'm finally glad they passed on Chychryn and any number of defensemen they could've taken instead of Rasmussen, it would've been torture watching them systematically destroy all of their potential
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Feb 8, 2018 19:26
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Have the red wings honestly given a poo poo about the draft at all in the last like 20 years?
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Feb 8, 2018 19:28
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Is Brandan Carlo actually good? He seemed like the obvious "cant teach size" bust when he was drafted.
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Feb 8, 2018 19:29
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Rangers media availability: https://www.facebook.com/nyrangers/videos/10155534931089858/
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Feb 8, 2018 19:32
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CBJSprague24 posted:Rangers media availability: 
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Feb 8, 2018 19:33
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CBJSprague24 posted:Rangers media availability: I'm like 90% sure this is going to be something boring like a "state of the team address" where they say "we're sorry they suck" but you never know could be something exciting e: random guy in a puffy coat walking in front of the camera
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Feb 8, 2018 19:33
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clean ayers act posted:The Red Wings inability to draft and develop a defenseman since Kronwall is astounding Jeez, I looked it up and the draft for the last decade or so has been rough for them. Jamwad Hilder fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Feb 8, 2018 |
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Feb 8, 2018 19:33
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