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if you’re writing c or c++ and you don’t know how to do basic singly linked list operations then you are not capable of doing your job.
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Feb 12, 2018 18:44
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C maybe, but for C++ personally I care more about whether they they can code without causing memory leaks, whether they know how to debug properly, and whether they can effectively utilize c++11 features. I'm honestly not sure what I'd be looking for by asking them to do something they're never going to need to do on the job.
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Feb 12, 2018 19:02
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if you're writing C or C++ and don't use a suitable list library that your framework provides then you're masturbating on company time
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Feb 12, 2018 19:12
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Gazpacho posted:then you're masturbating on company time
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Feb 12, 2018 20:32
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The Management posted:if you’re writing c or c++ and you don’t know how to do basic singly linked list operations then you are not capable of doing your job. #include <forward_list>
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Feb 12, 2018 20:37
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I'm guessing if your company is kinda big on C++ they probably already have their own bespoke artisanal library with a linked list implementation in there
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Feb 12, 2018 20:54
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c++ and its standard library are godawful
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Feb 12, 2018 21:03
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Symbolic Butt posted:I'm guessing if your company is kinda big on C++ they probably already have their own bespoke artisanal library with a linked list implementation in there My old company had this but only because their codebase is older than the STL
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Feb 12, 2018 21:03
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Sapozhnik posted:c++ and its standard library are godawful Elaborate
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Feb 12, 2018 21:04
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qhat posted:Elaborate https://www.google.com/search?q=why+is+c%2B%2B+bad plenty of detail is available in the TP thread and the PL thread
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Feb 12, 2018 21:14
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Oh wow yeah stunning arguments from the Google search results. My counter point then: c++ and its standard library is actually fine.
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Feb 12, 2018 21:23
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in most cases you are better off with an array anyways since traversing a linked list ends up being O(n) cache misses
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Feb 12, 2018 21:31
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The_Franz posted:in most cases you are better off with an array anyways since traversing a linked list ends up being O(n) cache misses Fact
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Feb 12, 2018 21:35
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Sapozhnik posted:tbf reversing a singly-linked list in place is a useful part of a lock-free queue please dont diy lock-free data structures
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Feb 12, 2018 21:36
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Progressive JPEG posted:please dont diy lock-free data structures I cannot stress this enough
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Feb 12, 2018 21:38
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they're really not lol. they have a lot of inertia, that doesn't make them in any way good. c++ wasn't designed, it was congealed. features were added haphazardly, then they interacted in unforeseen ways, then those unexpected interactions were resolved by piling more poo poo on top of the existing poo poo. a fairly fundamental misfeature is the fact that you have manual memory management and unconstrained exceptions in the same language making it very difficult to reason about an application's resource management and error paths. no, raii and smart pointers are not a magic bullet here. the standard library is a special kind of awful. it did recently get directory traversal and threading but it still doesn't do sockets. the goddamn string type is worthless because it isn't aware of unicode or character encodings in any useful way. oh, there's std::wstring, which consists of wchar_t elements. ok, what is a wchar_t? it's a 4-byte integer on unix and a 2-byte integer on windows. did you just tell me to go gently caress myself? string formatting is horribly verbose and un-internationalizable and littered with poo poo syntax gimmicks. "oh good, i'm glad my standard string type is a generic type parameterized on what integer type is incorrectly used to store its characters", said nobody ever. containers all take an idiotic "allocator" type parameter because "what if you want to make a container type specialization that allocates shared memory!". the stdlib just has the most bizarre and worthless mis-features that nobody could ever possibly want and critical deficiencies in the sorts of things people actually do want, like the ability to serialize and deserialize utf-8 text, or format text, or do multiplexed io, or interact with that new fangled "internet" thing in any way whatsoever.
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Feb 12, 2018 21:40
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The Management posted:I cannot stress this enough agreed, but this particular case is something i'm just doing for shits and giggles.
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Feb 12, 2018 21:41
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The Management posted:I cannot stress this enough then stop putting it in interviews
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Feb 12, 2018 21:47
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I'm reading the 'cracking the coding interview" book just now, very slowly
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Feb 12, 2018 21:52
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Valeyard posted:I'm reading the 'cracking the coding interview" book just now, very slowly it still makes me sad there's a whole cottage industry around this stuff well beyond cottage now, that stuff has venture funding anymore as they're blurring the lines between help guides and practice sites and hiring boards
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Feb 12, 2018 22:00
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I can agree that the fact the stdlib doesn't have a unicode string class in 2018 is a scandal and the standards committee should be lined up against a wall for it. Manual memory management isn't really a criticism of the language, just like it's not a criticism of C, it's just an inherent fact. The only people who complain about this are worthless p/j-langers who can't for the life of them understand how there are valid use cases for loving around exactly with how memory is managed on the most fundamental level of the program. C++ attempts to appeal to the widest variety of programmers, from driver implementations to higher level high performance algorithms. It's not a perfect language by any means, but it still has a level of practicality that no other language on the planet has come close to replicating.
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Feb 12, 2018 22:04
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hobbesmaster posted:then stop putting it in interviews I would never ask anyone to implement a lock free algorithm in an interview because I would never be able to hire anyone.
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Feb 12, 2018 22:04
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i assume you ask them that so you have a not illegal reason for only hiring white male stanford grads
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Feb 12, 2018 22:09
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The Management posted:I would never ask anyone to implement a lock free algorithm in an interview because I would never be able to hire anyone. Seriously. Everyone I've interviewed so far struggled just to do a basic dfs, you'd be crazy to ask something like that unless you're hiring for something very specific and difficult.
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Feb 12, 2018 22:12
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hobbesmaster posted:i assume you ask them that so you have a not illegal reason for only hiring white male stanford grads
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Feb 12, 2018 22:12
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hobbesmaster posted:i assume you ask them that so you have a not illegal reason for only hiring white male stanford grads I’d never hire a Stanford grad
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Feb 12, 2018 22:16
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that’s nice, I’ve literally been asked to implement lock free data structures like that at an interview
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Feb 12, 2018 22:17
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i've only worked with one stanford grad in my career so far he was very sure to let everyone know how he was from stanford and was also easily in the bottom 10% in skill amongst everyone i've worked with
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Feb 12, 2018 22:35
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Rex-Goliath posted:i've only worked with one stanford grad in my career so far he was very sure to let everyone know how he was from stanford and was also easily in the bottom 10% in skill amongst everyone i've worked with Except for the only skill that mattered: reminding people of being from Stanford (which is also beaconing). 
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Feb 12, 2018 22:38
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Rex-Goliath posted:i've only worked with one stanford grad in my career so far he was very sure to let everyone know how he was from stanford and was also easily in the bottom 10% in skill amongst everyone i've worked with Shocking. It's like there's no correlation between academic performance and industry competence.
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Feb 12, 2018 22:41
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qhat posted:Shocking. It's like there's no correlation between academic performance and industry competence. i have an abet accredited degree in Good Posting and could not agree with u more on this
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Feb 12, 2018 22:55
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cool anecdote. wow!
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Feb 12, 2018 22:57
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asking someone to implement a lock free queue in an interview could be interesting because it can be interesting to see how somebody flails in a high-pressure situation where they know they are going to fail
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Feb 12, 2018 23:20
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Bloody posted:asking someone to implement a lock free queue in an interview could be interesting because it can be interesting to see how somebody flails in a high-pressure situation where they know they are going to fail It turned out that the real Kobayashi Maru was the friends we made along the way!
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Feb 13, 2018 00:02
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Bloody posted:asking someone to implement a lock free queue in an interview could be interesting because it can be interesting to see how somebody flails in a high-pressure situation where they know they are going to fail that’s just being an rear end in a top hat.
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Feb 13, 2018 00:27
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Bloody posted:asking someone to implement a lock free queue in an interview could be interesting because it can be interesting to see how somebody flails in a high-pressure situation where they know they are going to fail “i don’t know what that is”
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Feb 13, 2018 00:44
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getting owned by online applications that want a minimum number of references. I've stopped talking to almost everyone this past year and have no personal references (who are also professional). I don't have any contact info for any of supervisors from before my last job but it isn't like you'd remember some no-name kid from ~5 years ago anyway r i p
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Feb 13, 2018 01:32
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Poniard posted:I've stopped talking to almost everyone this past year and have no personal references (who are also professional). I don't have any contact info for any of supervisors from before my last job but it isn't like you'd remember some no-name kid from ~5 years ago anyway 
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Feb 13, 2018 02:18
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Poniard posted:getting owned by online applications that want a minimum number of references. I've stopped talking to almost everyone this past year and have no personal references (who are also professional). I don't have any contact info for any of supervisors from before my last job but it isn't like you'd remember some no-name kid from ~5 years ago anyway nonono don't worry about this at all, just send an e-mail to your old boss/company and tell them that you need past references and ask them to provide some e-mail or phone number if you are slightly braver, just go through your old companies' websites and provide their public contact information do not worry about this at all, it is industry standard practice* * - maybe worry if you are an rear end in a top hat who hosed up badly at a past job
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Feb 13, 2018 02:40
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keep your old offer letters. i needed to get employment verification letters from all the places id worked for the last 10 years for a visa application, and thank god all the companies in question were still in existence, otherwise it'd have been a lot harder to show that doesnt hurt to keep your old employee reviews around either, assuming you can get them in some written form. ive found a good strat is to grab a couple quotes from those and put em on my resume
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Feb 13, 2018 05:58
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