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Do the Wings even have any prospects that are expected to be 20G+ forwards or at least top pairing dmen?
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Feb 20, 2018 07:40
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AsInHowe posted:By the way, here's how the Red Wings' weekend went, according to a couple people and a generally pessimistic blogger. wtf, this team really is a total disaster.
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Feb 20, 2018 07:41
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holland will get fired, take a year off, then get named inaugural gm of the seattle expansion team e5
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Feb 20, 2018 07:48
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fits posted:holland will get fired, take a year off, then get named inaugural gm of the seattle expansion team You know what is gonna be great about Ken Holland going to Seattle? Vegas immediately being great, and setting huge expectations for Seattle, only for them to get Ken.
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Feb 20, 2018 07:50
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Drunk Canuck posted:Do the Wings even have any prospects that are expected to be 20G+ forwards or at least top pairing dmen? non joke answer is svechnikov maybe probably but the real honest true answer is lol wut
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Feb 20, 2018 08:26
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It's just amazing when you look at the capfriendly list of teams vs the cap and you see a team as loving rotten, top to bottom, as the Red Wings with a cap hit at 78 million loving dollars The return on that is awful. Cap Hit Per Win: Detroit: $3,258,924.96 Tampa: $1,873,702.58 Vegas: $1,723,245.54 Arizona: $3,466,049.00 At least Arizona has the excuse that they're 16 million under the cap.
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Feb 20, 2018 09:41
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Was Holland ever a good GM or was he just lucky with Lidström, Datsyuk and Zetterberg and an owner willing to throw money at FAs?
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Feb 20, 2018 12:18
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Emetic Hustler posted:Was Holland ever a good GM or was he just lucky with Lidström, Datsyuk and Zetterberg and an owner willing to throw money at FAs? when everyone wants to play for you and you have an unlimited budget
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Feb 20, 2018 12:41
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Emetic Hustler posted:Was Holland ever a good GM or was he just lucky with Lidström, Datsyuk and Zetterberg and an owner willing to throw money at FAs? Firmly the latter. Holland has zero idea how to run a team with a salary cap.
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Feb 20, 2018 13:10
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AsInHowe posted:By the way, here's how the Red Wings' weekend went, according to a couple people and a generally pessimistic blogger. For everyone else in the thread, this blogger makes up a lot of bullshit and has been peddling an absurd “Swedish mafia” narrative for years that is so over the top that, if true, literally no one would ever sign in Detroit. I mean, Detroit bad but look at this and tell me you actually believe that Henrik Zetterberg said “No, Xavier. I hope your mom dies tomorrow, actually. Also I lied about my dad and wanted to bring a bro along. We’re going to crush beers while talking about your dead mom.” edit: also Ken Holland’s decline came around 2010. He managed a perfectly fine cap team for 2006-2010 and then hosed up when he had no longevity plan in place for a post-Lidstrom(Rafalski, Franzen, Datsyuk) era and decided to give loyalty contracts out like crazy. It’s really hard to look at the 2000-2010 and say Holland was a bad GM even if he’s easily bottom 5 today. i am the bird fucked around with this message at 14:47 on Feb 20, 2018 |
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Feb 20, 2018 14:43
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Ryan Donato is having an incredible Olympics and if Sweeney is smart he'll use him as part of a package for someone like McDonagh, because Ryan Donato is not actually this good. He's a great college player and he's having a nice Olympics, but he's probably another Jimmy Vesey. His value will never be higher. Of course they're not going to do this because they're probably getting hyped up about his performance, and also because he's a Massachusetts kid.
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Feb 20, 2018 14:58
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https://twitter.com/TerryMarcotte/status/965936074726965249 Before we start this presser, I'd like to remind you that Mr. Melnyk has NO money problems and we will not be taking questions on that subject.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:04
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So what’s the better package for a playoff push? Erik Karlsson and Bobby Ryan or Ryan McDonagh and Rick Nash?
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Feb 20, 2018 15:16
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For only 19.8 million dollars in additional salary, Bobby Ryan has 24 more points for Ottawa than Silfverberg does for Anaheim. And worse defense. And an albatross of a contract that will reduce what we get for a generational talent player. Great. I hope Karlsson goes to a team I'm willing to cheer for.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:19
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i am the bird posted:edit: also Ken Holland’s decline came around 2010. He managed a perfectly fine cap team for 2006-2010 and then hosed up when he had no longevity plan in place for a post-Lidstrom(Rafalski, Franzen, Datsyuk) era and decided to give loyalty contracts out like crazy. It’s really hard to look at the 2000-2010 and say Holland was a bad GM even if he’s easily bottom 5 today. Holland's problem is that the scouting department is no longer turning up the Lidstroms/Datsyuks or Zetterbergs in the late rounds of the draft. Which sounds glib, but they had a legendary run of finding talent at the end of the draft, which allowed them to use first round picks as trade chips to get talent to supplement the core.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:25
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howe_sam posted:Holland's problem is that the scouting department is no longer turning up the Lidstroms/Datsyuks or Zetterbergs in the late rounds of the draft. Which sounds glib, but they had a legendary run of finding talent at the end of the draft, which allowed them to use first round picks as trade chips to get talent to supplement the core. For sure. But he still managed to run an excellent cap team during the 2000s in order to manage top end talent while also fitting in enough supplementary dudes that did not destroy their cap. It’s kind of amazing that he had a core of 4 good defenseman and two elite forwards and still managed his money right to have an excellent supporting cast.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:29
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Someone do something, preferably the Rangers, trade everyone, tank hard AF
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Feb 20, 2018 15:33
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i am the bird posted:So what’s the better package for a playoff push? I was thinking to myself “poo poo well Karlsson of course, duh!” Then I thought, well what is Bobby Ryan’s contract? 4 more years at $7 mil. 
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Feb 20, 2018 15:40
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howe_sam posted:Holland's problem is that the scouting department is no longer turning up the Lidstroms/Datsyuks or Zetterbergs in the late rounds of the draft. Which sounds glib, but they had a legendary run of finding talent at the end of the draft, which allowed them to use first round picks as trade chips to get talent to supplement the core. When you have one or more top end talents on your roster, moving picks and prospects for short term success is an entirely laudable strategy. The fact that the Wings found Datsyuk, Lidstrom and Zetterberg let him get away with that more than other teams. I don't think it's fair to criticize him for taking that route given the talent he had, but he certainly hasn't accepted the fact that sports teams have a natural ebb and flow of success. Wamsutta posted:Someone do something, preferably the Rangers, trade everyone, tank hard AF How much does the pending Gudbranson extension move your needle? Because that's something.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:41
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Wamsutta posted:Someone do something, preferably the Rangers, trade everyone, tank hard AF So that what Sam Hinkes been up to recently.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:48
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ThinkTank posted:How much does the pending Gudbranson extension move your needle? Because that's something. I'll hold my needle right here so you can pinch yourself and wake up from this nightmare.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:49
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Doesn't that limit the number of teams who can trade for Karlsson to like Arizona and whoever else is deliberately keeping payroll low?
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Feb 20, 2018 16:06
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Zodijackylite posted:I'll hold my needle right here so you can pinch yourself and wake up from this nightmare. https://twitter.com/TSNBobMcKenzie/status/965965225911492608 I'm ready to wake up now. Please god let me wake up. 
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Feb 20, 2018 16:07
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Have to think the ask for Karlsson would be huge but it’s Melnyk so if you take back enough money he might even throw in a few picks
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Feb 20, 2018 16:11
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buffalo sabres
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Feb 20, 2018 16:12
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If taking Ryan is a condition I wonder if the Devils don't just wait it out, since they have an absurd amount of cap space at seasons end
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Feb 20, 2018 16:25
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Yeah forcing teams to take on Ryan is dumb and is going to scuttle any real deals.
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Feb 20, 2018 16:38
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ThinkTank posted:I don't think it's fair to criticize him for taking that route given the talent he had, but he certainly hasn't accepted the fact that sports teams have a natural ebb and flow of success. Oh yeah, absolutely. Holland's problem is that the team wasn't able to turn guys like Nyquist, Tatar, and Erickson into the next wave of great Wings players, but they're paying them like they are because, well, I suppose the team felt they didn't have a choice since they didn't think they could plug the holes if those guys walked. Keeping the playoff streak going probably played a role. But I haven't followed the team super closely so what do I know?
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Feb 20, 2018 16:42
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Both Karlsson and Ryan have NTCs so that seems like an extra pain in the rear end to pull off
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Feb 20, 2018 16:54
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Look Around You posted:Yeah forcing teams to take on Ryan is dumb and is going to scuttle any real deals. Just keep some of the salary on the books. Still leads to money savings (the ultimate goal) and still counts towards the cap, so it's really a win-win. I'm sure we can do just fine by signing grinders out of europe. To be honest, I'd rather some 700k european grinder than Ryan & his albatross of a contract that forces the coach to give him extra undeserved minutes.
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Feb 20, 2018 16:57
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I imagine Ryan will only waive good on go to a potential contender, like a team looking to get EK.
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Feb 20, 2018 16:58
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Zodijackylite posted:I imagine Ryan will only waive good on go to a potential contender, like a team looking to get EK. Right, but what contender has room for both Ryan and Karlsson? Especially if they want to sign Karlsson going forward, it'll be hard as hell for a legit contending team to do that with that Ryan contract on the books, even if Ottawa somehow retains salary on it (which i don't see Melnyk approving anyway).
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Feb 20, 2018 17:03
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Karlsson is great and all but I don't see how a trade happens for him mid season. Cap space is too big a hurdle.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:06
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Ginette Reno posted:Karlsson is great and all but I don't see how a trade happens for him mid season. Cap space is too big a hurdle. letang for karlsson at the draft e3
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Feb 20, 2018 17:08
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Ginette Reno posted:Karlsson is great and all but I don't see how a trade happens for him mid season. Cap space is too big a hurdle. Cap hits are prorated right now.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:15
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There are a lot of teams with the cap space to make a deal where Ottawa retains salary. Karlsson doesn’t make that much right now (or next year). Vegas, Nashville, CBJ, Colorado, Anaheim, SJS, LA, Winnipeg could probably all make it work. God if I was McPhee I’d be going after that so hard.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:16
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Ginette Reno posted:Karlsson is great and all but I don't see how a trade happens for him mid season. Cap space is too big a hurdle. Teams really should be going after him now, especially teams like Pittsburgh or Tampa Bay who could get two shots at a Cup with him instead of just one if he gets traded in the offseason and the team that gets him doesn't re-sign him. Edit: ^^ and yeah Vegas makes a ton of sense too.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:18
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Aphrodite posted:Cap hits are prorated right now. I'm aware of that. It's still a huge cap hit even with that. The Pens for example are struggling to clear enough cap space just to add the likes of Brassard. Bruins Caps etc have no space as well. I guess some of the other teams with a ton of space like the Devils might be able to make something happen but they'd probably want assurances Karlsson would want to stay there. Mind_Taker posted:Teams really should be going after him now, especially teams like Pittsburgh or Tampa Bay who could get two shots at a Cup with him instead of just one if he gets traded in the offseason and the team that gets him doesn't re-sign him. Him on Pittsburgh or Tampa would be hilarious just for how upset SAS would get at how stacked they'd be. Pens would have to move a ton of salary to make it happen though so it's not happening.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:25
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There has to still be a bunch of real money well below cap hit contracts out there too. Melnyk would love to take one of those back.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:25
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Jordan7hm posted:To be honest, I'd rather some 700k european grinder than Ryan & his albatross of a contract that forces the coach to give him extra undeserved minutes. Like Loui Eriksson who is objectively so forgettable that he make Brendan Gaunce look like an electrifying player but still gets 16 minutes a night because he's paid $6M. Sven Baertschi who is considerably less sucky gets scratched in favour of him. Or Erik Gudbranson who is on track to sign a $16-18M deal today and never gets his minutes reduced in any way despite the fact that 1) he sucks 2) he really sucks 3) he really really sucks. Ben Hutton has been scratched 10 times in the last 23 games even though he's way better. Mostly because Gudbranson is a 'vet' and Hutton is a 'kid' because of the whopping 15 month age difference between the two. Or Brandon Sutter. Or Sam Gagner. Or Derek Dorsett until his neck broke. Or Alex Biega. Or Michael Del Zotto. Or Derick Pouliot for some bizarre reason. Or Jayson Megna. Or Alex Chaput. God this team is such a bore.
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Feb 20, 2018 17:26
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