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I have only gotten into the second episode of this, but has anyone else noticed that James Purefoy is slowly becoming William Shatner?
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Feb 22, 2018 04:46
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Rhyno posted:LoL, you're not dragging me into this bro. Everyone turn down the lights and be real quiet. Maybe Zaphod will think no one's home.
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Feb 22, 2018 04:52
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Omg I'm watching episode 6 right now, what is going onnnnn with these action sequences Edit: Just finished....this show's absurdity has really hit a new level Jay-V fucked around with this message at 06:58 on Feb 22, 2018 |
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Feb 22, 2018 06:50
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AlternateAccount posted:I have only gotten into the second episode of this, but has anyone else noticed that James Purefoy is slowly becoming William Shatner? Breathes a deep sigh of relief THANK YOU
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Feb 22, 2018 06:52
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Rhyno posted:LoL, you're not dragging me into this bro. Oh god no, that was not my intent. Xealot said exactly what I was trying to convey much better anyway. Jay-V posted:Omg I'm watching episode 6 right now, what is going onnnnn with these action sequences Oh you sweet innocent  .Let us know when you're done with episode 7  .
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Feb 22, 2018 07:08
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AlternateAccount posted:I have only gotten into the second episode of this, but has anyone else noticed that James Purefoy is slowly becoming William Shatner? That's not right, you never seen Shatner's swinging dong.
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Feb 22, 2018 07:09
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I've been thinking about the opening scene in the "welcome back" hall with the girl who was killed. Do they only resleeve from criminal stock? I can't think of many 7 year olds being sent to jail, so there would never be any age appropriate sleeves for that girl. You would have thought the parents would have known this. Or that age appropriate clones would be made available in these unusual cases, especially considering it is a child.
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Feb 22, 2018 11:38
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Young Freud posted:That's not right, you never seen Shatner's swinging dong. Well actually... #metoo Collateral posted:I've been thinking about the opening scene in the "welcome back" hall with the girl who was killed. Do they only resleeve from criminal stock? I can't think of many 7 year olds being sent to jail, so there would never be any age appropriate sleeves for that girl. You would have thought the parents would have known this. Or that age appropriate clones would be made available in these unusual cases, especially considering it is a child. Yeah criminals are the vast majority of 'free' sleeves (hence why they just sleeve crimers into whatever the gently caress bodies are on hand rather than their original) and clones are expensive as all loving get out even for meths. Its simply not feasible for underfunded government departments to bother with 'kid' sleeves. Plus lets not even touch on the horror show that likely permeates 'child sleeves' in the marketplace Basically: ITS A DYSTOPIA, BABY Motherfucker fucked around with this message at 11:43 on Feb 22, 2018 |
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Feb 22, 2018 11:39
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Collateral posted:I've been thinking about the opening scene in the "welcome back" hall with the girl who was killed. Do they only resleeve from criminal stock? I can't think of many 7 year olds being sent to jail, so there would never be any age appropriate sleeves for that girl. You would have thought the parents would have known this. Or that age appropriate clones would be made available in these unusual cases, especially considering it is a child. Clones are in the "obscene luxury car" range of expensive. It's actually probably cheaper to get something corporate-made than a clone, just for being mass-produced. Motherfucker posted:Well actually... #metoo It's not quite that far in the books, that's kinda more of the series going "LOOK HOW NON-METH PEOPLE SUFFER DUE TO STACKS!!!  " The books just have insurance on sleeves like for anything else. Generally enough to cover something other than "lol, here's something random from what's on-hand in a prison, have fun being an old woman, little girl!"
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Feb 22, 2018 11:57
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Jay-V posted:Omg I'm watching episode 6 right now, what is going onnnnn with these action sequences The first 6 episodes are absurd and meandering but then I realized they're all just the prologue, the set up for Dichen Lachman's character, who is the real hero of the series. She pulled herself up from being a scared & lonely orphan to a rich, powerful meth, while Takeshi spent 250 years sleeping. Reileen should be the central figure of the show, she has the more compelling story, autonomy, and is far more proactive than Tak.
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Feb 22, 2018 12:05
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I interpreted that scene as “the little girl got shot and her original body died, the court ruled that it was a murder and gave her a sleeve, but they are poor so they gave her a menopausal woman instead of a little girl”
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Feb 22, 2018 12:40
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While everyone getting shot in the stack was silly - reminded me of Dirk Gently and its ridiculous amount of head shots - I imagine it would have killed the pacing if there was a laborious shot of someone rummaging about and disposing of the stack afterwards.
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Feb 22, 2018 12:47
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Clones are in the "obscene luxury car" range of expensive. It's actually probably cheaper to get something corporate-made than a clone, just for being mass-produced. Yeah, I really think the book did it better than the show as far as the consequences of stacks for everyday people. To me, it’s more interesting that the reason most people only live twice isn’t because it’s only available to the super rich, but because that’s exhausting. And financing your body, with all the consequences you would expect if you don’t keep current on payments. It makes more sense, too- there’s way more money to be made with high, high volume over only selling to the richest of the rich. Instead the show went with RDs for everyone with no one blinking an eye, synths being weird shapeshifting superbodies instead of cheap crap for the poor and parole hearings... they really skipped out on a lot of storytelling potential.
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Feb 22, 2018 12:55
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Bust Rodd posted:I interpreted that scene as “the little girl got shot and her original body died, the court ruled that it was a murder and gave her a sleeve, but they are poor so they gave her a menopausal woman instead of a little girl” well yeah but the underlying reason is because poor people can't afford a decent replacement and the government is ludicrously unequipped to handle reparations.
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Feb 22, 2018 12:56
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poptart_fairy posted:While everyone getting shot in the stack was silly - reminded me of Dirk Gently and its ridiculous amount of head shots - I imagine it would have killed the pacing if there was a laborious shot of someone rummaging about and disposing of the stack afterwards. Unlike the whole Caligula-esque take with Meths in the series killing people for fun and buying them new sleeves "so it's all okay", the general setting is supposed to be that sleeve death is still murder. You have killed someone, even though they're back in a new sleeve and quite upset with you, and the law still punishes accordingly (and the series seems to forget this is the basis for Resolution 653 given how every character get RD'ed). Inflicting Real Death on someone is generally considered more like an extra level of "sweet jesus, they REALLY wanted them gone  ". Especially when it take a lot of dedication to either pull the stack out of the spinal column and destroy it somehow (the little buggers are quite durable by design), or a high-powered handgun aimed at the right spot. Ugly In The Morning posted:Yeah, I really think the book did it better than the show as far as the consequences of stacks for everyday people. To me, it’s more interesting that the reason most people only live twice isn’t because it’s only available to the super rich, but because that’s exhausting. And financing your body, with all the consequences you would expect if you don’t keep current on payments. It makes more sense, too- there’s way more money to be made with high, high volume over only selling to the richest of the rich. The baseline problem is the series seems to think there's a clear divide between Meths and poors living regular lifespans. And yet still somehow Psychasec are marketing custom sleeves to people, not to mention talking about the combat sleeves the married couple have. Or even the Freak Fighters and other available sleeves in the Fight Dome.  .
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Feb 22, 2018 13:30
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Tricking someone into letting them kill you because they believe they won’t really die is like the most demonic thing I’ve ever read a human character do in a work of fiction, so Altered Carbon seems sweet in that regard. I also wonder how trans people work in AC society. Is it preferable to reassign your birth sleeve’s gender or would you rather just hop over to a completely different body with the right parts? What if you’re in your mid 20s and the only male sleeve you can afford is a 30 year old with a different skin color than yours? Is it worth the change? Bust Rodd fucked around with this message at 13:41 on Feb 22, 2018 |
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Feb 22, 2018 13:39
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Neddy Seagoon posted:The baseline problem is the series seems to think there's a clear divide between Meths and poors living regular lifespans. And yet still somehow Psychasec are marketing custom sleeves to people, not to mention talking about the combat sleeves the married couple have. Or even the Freak Fighters and other available sleeves in the Fight Dome. Don't these two trounce all over the "more than ten sleeves frags your brain (or whatever)" hard rule? They've been fighting to the death, regularly, for years, and are super casual about it. You'd think they'd be more wary, given that they're using up a limited resource.
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Feb 22, 2018 15:07
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Open Source Idiom posted:Don't these two trounce all over the "more than ten sleeves frags your brain (or whatever)" hard rule? They've been fighting to the death, regularly, for years, and are super casual about it. You'd think they'd be more wary, given that they're using up a limited resource. That's a rule the series introduced (and I'm pretty sure promptly forgot somewhere along the way), and that sounds about right. Honestly the best way I can think to explain the dissonance and tone of Stacks between the books and the series is like if you tried to tell a story about smartphones and the internet to people in the, oh... let's say 1970's (And I fully admit in advance this is a half-assed analogy, pick away at it as you please). Our book talks about the internet, social media, all about the uses of this neat little thin panel of glass and plastic that is ubiquitous in modern society. The series declares that they must be like 1980's carried phones with a chunky battery and a physical keyboard (because people won't understand the little glass rectangle is a phone that you touch to do stuff) and give you brain cancer if you use them long enough. The plot never gets past "the rich can talk to people around the world, poors can't afford to call international".
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Feb 22, 2018 15:13
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Rhyno posted:Kinneman has already said he's not doing season 2. 'Altered Carbon': Joel Kinnaman Won't Rule Out Season 2 Return season 2 is gonna be Kovacs and Ortega solving more murders lol
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Feb 22, 2018 20:53
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I think it would be neat if we only see his Asian body in flashbacks and his present day sleeve changed every season
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Feb 22, 2018 20:58
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hell, the fight club cloned his original body, just use that dna and stick him back inside his "original" body. Then I can watch Wei Shen be a cyberpunk investigator/ninja
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Feb 24, 2018 13:28
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So one thing that never got addressed or I missed: what happens to the original person’s personality? They put these 200 y/os like Kovaks into a body... what happens to the original “soul” or mind or whatever you want to call it? Like if they clone a custom sleeve for a rich person does the old soul get overwritten and effectively die?
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Feb 24, 2018 14:56
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Caganer posted:So one thing that never got addressed or I missed: what happens to the original person’s personality? They put these 200 y/os like Kovaks into a body... what happens to the original “soul” or mind or whatever you want to call it?
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Feb 24, 2018 15:00
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double nine posted:hell, the fight club cloned his original body, just use that dna and stick him back inside his "original" body. That was the Byron Mann body, not the Will Yun Lee one.
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Feb 24, 2018 15:02
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I rewatched this show with a friend and she loved it aside from pretty much every single scene with Quell. "What is this Sermon on Mount horseshit" was a choice reaction to one scene
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Feb 24, 2018 15:02
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Tiggum posted:There was no original person. The body was just grown in a vat with enough brain function to stay alive and no more. just because you’re in a vat doped up on benzos having your muscles stimulated like the guy from Shadows of the Empire doesn’t mean you have no soul - they’ve been killing (erasing?) loads of people ☹️
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Feb 24, 2018 15:19
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Caganer posted:just because you’re in a vat doped up on benzos having your muscles stimulated like the guy from Shadows of the Empire doesn’t mean you have no soul - they’ve been killing (erasing?) loads of people ☹️ OK, if there's souls then you have to answer a whole lot of questions about what souls even are, how they work, what they do, what happens to them, etc. The position of the show is that there is no soul and you can grow a clone with no higher brain function, so there's no person to erase.
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Feb 24, 2018 15:49
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So the biggest plot hole is why does Kovacs care about the lady cop with the robot arm? This makes no sense what so ever. Am I missing something? Also, why doesn't his sister just say hey I backed up the cult leader when he is all pissy with her about blowing her up.
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Feb 24, 2018 15:59
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You should look up what plot hole means because those aren't plot holes.
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Feb 24, 2018 16:07
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Elephanthead posted:So the biggest plot hole is why does Kovacs care about the lady cop with the robot arm? This makes no sense what so ever. Am I missing something? Kovacs acts like, and on some level wants to be more of an arsehole that he actually is. In truth he has a soft centre, and even though he's been trained to treat the people around him as disposable assets, he can't help but care about the people he's putting in harm's way. (Which is ultimately what saves his life.) Elephanthead posted:Also, why doesn't his sister just say hey I backed up the cult leader when he is all pissy with her about blowing her up. Because the decades of resleeving has mutated her love for her brother into psychopathic and psychosexual obsession. She wants to be the only person he cares for, and sees Quell as the biggest threat to their future happiness. I can't remember why she backed would have backed up Quell tbh, though that could have been a hail mary play on her part.
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Feb 24, 2018 16:42
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Open Source Idiom posted:I can't remember why she backed would have backed up Quell tbh, though that could have been a hail mary play on her part. Because the writers wanted a cheap dangling plot thread that can be stretched out as long as they like across multiple seasons.
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Feb 24, 2018 16:46
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Elephanthead posted:So the biggest plot hole is why does Kovacs care about the lady cop with the robot arm? This makes no sense what so ever. Am I missing something? she is extremely hot  that and they bond through shared experience 
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Feb 24, 2018 16:49
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Because the writers wanted a cheap dangling plot thread that can be stretched out as long as they like across multiple seasons. Yeah, that's certainly part of it. But I imagine that the show was pitched as something of a reincarnation romance show -- and that the Quell/Kovacs drama is meant to be a big part of the show's overall through line. told through multiple different bodies and multiple different actors. I suspect that in future seasons we'll be meant to look back on the Rei conflict and see her obsession with Kovacs as a foil for Kovacs' obsession with Quell. How much has he changed because of his love for this woman, is he in danger of becoming another Rei, ect. But tbh I'm speculating as to why her character acted the way she did, rather than considering questions of structure, marketing or believability. (Which is to say, no, I don't really buy that she'd do it either.)
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Feb 24, 2018 16:55
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a foolish pianist posted:It is pretty telling that only people who venerate the books (like, they're decent scifi, but jeez) object so stringently to the show. Lol what the gently caress strawman argument is this. I haven't read the books and I agree completely with the book readers' complaints.
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Feb 24, 2018 16:55
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not having read the books i often felt like i was not fully equipped to infer things that weren't spelled out in the show
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Feb 24, 2018 16:57
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Open Source Idiom posted:Yeah, that's certainly part of it. But I imagine that the show was pitched as something of a reincarnation romance show -- and that the Quell/Kovacs drama is meant to be a big part of the show's overall through line. told through multiple different bodies and multiple different actors. I suspect that in future seasons we'll be meant to look back on the Rei conflict and see her obsession with Kovacs as a foil for Kovacs' obsession with Quell. How much has he changed because of his love for this woman, is he in danger of becoming another Rei, ect. Did anyone actually find any part of the
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Feb 24, 2018 16:59
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Honestly, my biggest problem with the show was set design. Like, how does a lovely cop who isn't on somebody's payroll afford that massive gently caress off apartment? Because, jeeze, her house is loving huge. To say nothing of that other family's beautiful, if cluttered, circular sun room. Did no one tell the set designers that severe income inequality would lead to shortages on space? Everyone lives in these enormous homes, but oh no, they must be poor because you have to duck between two artfully graffited shipping containers to get inside. That and that police station is an insanely over designed set. On top of having a fancy scifi desk, the police chief's office has two separate glowing walls that seemingly exist purely to project various shades of blue light into his office. It's insane. It's like he's working in two different discos. Neddy Seagoon posted:Did anyone actually find any part of the I liked the bit where they blew up. (And I didn't mind dream Quell tbh. Not the flashbacks, but the bit where she turns up and haunts him a bit were fine and occasionally moving when they underplayed things. i.e. not the last episode.) Open Source Idiom fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Feb 24, 2018 |
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Feb 24, 2018 17:08
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The only good part of the flashbacks is that you got to see more of Will Yun Lee who is a far better actor than Joel Kinnaman. They should have just switched the two actors' parts
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Feb 24, 2018 17:09
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Caganer posted:she is extremely hot She's got some rockin' tiddies. I was legit surprised in the nude scenes. I was a bit disappointed when Kristin Lehman was first announced, because she initially didn't look anything I pictured Mrs. Bancroft in the books. She's supposed to be looking like late teens-early twenties, thanks to cloning and medical science, and one of the memorable descriptions called her "pneumatic": the girl that Elliot meets in the club would actually be the closest to what I think Bancroft from the books looked like. But I think she looked great in the finished product. (sorry for being a creep)
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Feb 24, 2018 17:52
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Caganer posted:she is extremely hot the altered carbon future sucks but at least there's still mexican chicks.....
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Feb 24, 2018 18:13
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