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I prefer the rounded faces of Rebels to the angular faces of TCW, apart from Yoda who looks wrong. Also, Obi Wan always had a really silly plasticine beard. Can someone explain to me why they think Rebels looks cheaper? Because I don't understand. NTRabbit fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Mar 7, 2018 |
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Mar 7, 2018 21:25
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NTRabbit posted:I prefer the rounded faces of Rebels to the angular faces of TCW, apart from Yoda who looks wrong. Also, Obi Wan always had a really silly plasticine beard. Rebels looks cheaper because it was produced cheaper. Lucas poured a ton of money into TCW. Models in Rebels tend to be simpler and less detailed than their TCW counterparts and the animation style is much less fluid. Rebels tried to hide this a little by adopting a cleaner style and grabbing from the soft, clean McQuarrie concepts, but you can still tell it was made for less from time to time.
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Mar 7, 2018 21:32
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NTRabbit posted:Can someone explain to me why they think Rebels looks cheaper? Because I don't get it. Because it was cheaper and thus looks more empty/simple? George dumped extra money into the budgets for Clone Wars to ensure it looked great. Supposedly 2-3 times the normal budget for some episodes. When you don't have Papa George personally financing those extra computers for rendering and modeling, it affects the end product. Both Clone Wars and Rebels looked better as the seasons went on, just because they could start re-using models more over time. Clone Wars was able to get some more grandeur though with the extra money.
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Mar 7, 2018 21:32
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I know they spent less on the Rebels series, but I haven't been able to tell where they cut corners. Things like the plasticine hair and beards make TCW look cheap to me in comparison.
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Mar 7, 2018 21:35
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NTRabbit posted:I know they spent less on the Rebels series, but I haven't been able to tell where they cut corners. Things like the plasticine hair and beards make TCW look cheap to me in comparison. The models in The Clone Wars had more texture to them, for one. Everything looked hand-painted, to match the vaguely marionette inspired aesthetic. Rebels, on the other hand, stuck with mostly bright, solid, easier to render colours, which made everything look a bit more cartoony and two-dimensional.
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Mar 7, 2018 21:41
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Looks at the backgrounds. Places like Lothal (especially early on) are pretty vacant. Marketplaces have a few stalls and some boxes around. While TCW the backgrounds, even in open areas, tended to have a lot more stuff in them.
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Mar 7, 2018 21:41
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NTRabbit posted:I know they spent less on the Rebels series, but I haven't been able to tell where they cut corners. 
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Mar 7, 2018 22:06
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I did feel like the last 2 episodes had a lot more money put into em. There was more textures to various things and people compared to past episodes. 
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Mar 7, 2018 22:18
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I never realized Gregor totally has a burger on his tanktop.
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Mar 7, 2018 22:29
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Part of it, I'm sure, is that you're watching season 1 of Rebels after coming off the last seasons of Clone Wars and those CW seasons had some really amazing looking animation/sequences in them. Take this Season 4 sequence https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcfV6yUUMhs and compare it to what you're seeing here in the Rebels premier. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKeet-Kee9k&t=28s The lighting, the number of moving pieces in each action, the stuff going on in the background, etc. There's a lot more going on in a later Clone Wars episode than an early Rebels one. You'd be forgiven for being a bit disappointed. Now, Rebels did get better as time goes on. Just look at the Ahsoka/Vader fight from the Season 2 finale. Thwomp fucked around with this message at 22:32 on Mar 7, 2018 |
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Mar 7, 2018 22:29
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just watched the finale, i eagerly await the adventures of old grizzled hardass sabine and ahsoka
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Mar 7, 2018 22:29
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site posted:just watched the finale, i eagerly await the adventures of old grizzled hardass sabine and ahsoka Grizzled 23 year olds are a step up from the usual grizzled veterans of the long war 16 year olds we often get.
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Mar 7, 2018 22:33
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Rebels was produced cheaper, but it had strong art direction. The texture detail and animation fidelity in Clone Wars is considerably better because more money was thrown at it. Compare the quality between the Ahsoka/Vader fight to the Barriss/Anakin fight. They both look really good, but CW's animation was more fluid/dynamic, and had a bit more punch behind it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4erSphTd3Rs&t=66s vs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tMQyJCKLcw&t=84s teagone fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Mar 7, 2018 |
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Mar 7, 2018 22:34
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twistedmentat posted:Grizzled 23 year olds are a step up from the usual grizzled veterans of the long war 16 year olds we often get. Wouldnt sabine be in her late 20s and ahsoka be in her mid/late 30s post rotj granted thats still not old but yeah site fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Mar 7, 2018 |
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Mar 7, 2018 22:56
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Supposedly Ahsoka was born 36 BBY. Which means she would be around 41 post-Battle of Jakku. Which means get ready for Susan Sarandon Ahsoka in Episode IX.
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Mar 7, 2018 23:06
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You know what's hosed up? The Empire never uses child soldiers, but the Republic and Rebels do all the time.
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Mar 7, 2018 23:07
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What do you mean, there was that whole episode where ezra joined the imperial academy with a bunch of other teens
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Mar 7, 2018 23:12
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teagone posted:Rebels was produced cheaper, but it had strong art direction. The texture detail and animation fidelity in Clone Wars is considerably better because more money was thrown at it. Compare the quality between the Ahsoka/Vader fight to the Barriss/Anakin fight. They both look really good, but CW's animation was more fluid/dynamic, and had a bit more punch behind it. Not relevant to the art discussion, but the story arc for Barriss was my favorite in TCW. Was disappointed she didn't show up in Rebels as an Inquisitor, it's not like old Sheevy P to just toss away a fallen Jedi.
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Mar 7, 2018 23:15
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site posted:What do you mean, there was that whole episode where ezra joined the imperial academy with a bunch of other teens They were in an academy, military schools and cadets programs aren't considered war crimes. Ahsoka was seeing front line combat at what, 14?
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Mar 7, 2018 23:15
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site posted:Wouldnt sabine be in her late 20s and ahsoka be in her mid/late 30s post rotj I though she was 20 in the last season, and if the finale happens in the same year as Scarif/Yavin its only 3-4 years until Endor. I mean Jacen only looked 3 or 4 years old. Also I'm surprised they never paid off any of the Ezra/Sabine thing that was suggested through the entire series.
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Mar 7, 2018 23:24
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Teek posted:Supposedly Ahsoka was born 36 BBY. Which means she would be around 41 post-Battle of Jakku. Which means get ready for Susan Sarandon Ahsoka in Episode IX. Rosario is 38 thats close enough LongDarkNight posted:Not relevant to the art discussion, but the story arc for Barriss was my favorite in TCW. Was disappointed she didn't show up in Rebels as an Inquisitor, it's not like old Sheevy P to just toss away a fallen Jedi. Bariss was already pissed at the jedi for getting militaristic i doubt shed join a fascist sith regime WhiskeyWhiskers posted:They were in an academy, military schools and cadets programs aren't considered war crimes. Ahsoka was seeing front line combat at what, 14? Well, the jedi were pretty poo poo about that you'll get no argument from me and there was that whole thing where they trained the forest whitaker character to be a terrorist in clone wars. But like, when youre running a resistance cell of dozens or hundreds against a literal galactic spanning army of probably millions then you take em where you can get em i guess
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Mar 7, 2018 23:24
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twistedmentat posted:I though she was 20 in the last season, and if the finale happens in the same year as Scarif/Yavin its only 3-4 years until Endor. I mean Jacen only looked 3 or 4 years old. Also I'm surprised they never paid off any of the Ezra/Sabine thing that was suggested through the entire series. Mmm yeah looks like you're right according to wookie if thats still worth anything she was born 21 years before the battle of yavin, i was thinking she was a couple years older than that
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Mar 7, 2018 23:34
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twistedmentat posted:Also I'm surprised they never paid off any of the Ezra/Sabine thing that was suggested through the entire series.
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Mar 7, 2018 23:39
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site posted:Bariss was already pissed at the jedi for getting militaristic i doubt shed join a fascist sith regime The Dark Side has cookies, Order 66 cookies.
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Mar 7, 2018 23:42
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DancinBrud posted:Do you mean a romance storyline? Unless I’m forgetting something, I don’t think there was much suggested there other than Ezra’s very early crush on her. They’ve seemed way more like siblings over the past three seasons. Filoni specifically said after the finale that their relationship was about supporting each other as friends. Yeah in Rebels Recon he specifically calls out people who thought there would be a romance by saying that they wanted to show that boys and girls could be friends and supportive of each other without needing romantic attachments.
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Mar 8, 2018 00:07
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LongDarkNight posted:Was disappointed she didn't show up in Rebels as an Inquisitor, it's not like old Sheevy P to just toss away a fallen Jedi. I'm pretty sure Vader would destroy her the moment he found out.
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Mar 8, 2018 00:33
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Honestly, I'm 99% certain this is just an intentional design choice to make 'faceless' imperials', rather than a cost saving measure. I mean, I guess it does both, but I think the latter is just a bonus.
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Mar 8, 2018 00:36
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Oh hey, shout out to Filoni for Thrawn’s pathos. I love that he calls out the Jedi, not for being weak, but for using their power through a moral code. He’s not like a “I hate puppies and sunshine” evil mustache twirler. Nor is he some kind of fallen idealist. He knows exactly what he wants: power. And will use and ally with whatever accomplishes his goals to achieve more power. He’d feel right at home next to Jedi if they were less moralistic in their use of their powers. I’m trying to remember if he was like that in the original Zahn books. All I remember was brilliant tactician and studier of cultures.
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Mar 8, 2018 00:49
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DancinBrud posted:Do you mean a romance storyline? Unless I’m forgetting something, I don’t think there was much suggested there other than Ezra’s very early crush on her. They’ve seemed way more like siblings over the past three seasons. Filoni specifically said after the finale that their relationship was about supporting each other as friends. I missed that. And they did have some weird akward teenager meeting their crushes dad stuff in the early part of the season, which is why I though they were going that way.
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Mar 8, 2018 02:15
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I appreciate that Clone Wars had more money, and had busier backgrounds and everything, but I just can't watch it. It just looks bad to me. Rebels looks fine though. I don't know if it's the OT aesthetic vs the PT or what, but Rebels looks way better to me.
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Mar 8, 2018 02:51
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MichiganCubbie posted:I appreciate that Clone Wars had more money, and had busier backgrounds and everything, but I just can't watch it. It just looks bad to me. Rebels looks fine though. I don't know if it's the OT aesthetic vs the PT or what, but Rebels looks way better to me. Clone Wars also had much better writing overall and was willing to actually explore the Star Wars universe in ways Rebels simply couldn't. Lothal kinda sucked compared to Umbara, Mandolore's glass cities, and Onderon. The scale of the show also allowed for a lot more freedom in the kinds of stories that could be told.
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Mar 8, 2018 03:07
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I always remember that really tedious arc in CW about the planet with the super pacificist aliens who refused to stand up aginst the CIS even upon their deaths. It was also bad because the only other place I've seen such a storyline is that terrible Sword of Truth novel.
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Mar 8, 2018 03:17
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twistedmentat posted:I always remember that really tedious arc in CW about the planet with the super pacificist aliens who refused to stand up aginst the CIS even upon their deaths. It was also bad because the only other place I've seen such a storyline is that terrible Sword of Truth novel. There are several episodes of Star Trek and I think Stargate like that. Also that star wars episode had George Takei in it.
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Mar 8, 2018 03:20
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The Baradium explosion or whatever it was is the best animated sequence in Clone Wars or Rebels. Even if it came from an awful arc, it was incredibly pretty. A certain scene from TLJ reminded me a little bit of it.
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Mar 8, 2018 03:25
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NTRabbit posted:Can someone explain to me why they think Rebels looks cheaper? Because I don't understand. Ignoring personal preference and addressing why people complain it looks cheaper. The textures in TCW are all either hand-painted or procedurally generated to look hand-painted to go with the actual hand-painted stuff. Even in the old/new character image comparison, you should be able to see that there are more man-hours in the hand-painted texturing of the TCW show than in the characters of Rebels, regardless of how good they look in a vacuum. Compare this: With this:  One has a very flat fabric texture with a few brush strokes to add some tonal variation, but since there are not a lot of high-frequency details in Rebels there's not a lot of custom paint job on the texture (or the facial texture). In contrast, you can see the individual strokes in the cloaks from the characters in the background of TCW. If you zoom in you can see some painted details on the fabric and tonal variation, and that's for the background characters. Anakin's robe is pretty much entirely hand-painted with a lot of high and middle frequency details, good tonal variation and coloring. That quick, flat texturing style is used not only by nameless faceless imperial soldiers, but main characters in Rebels as well. In general, TCW has a more rich lighting and coloring. The backgrounds in Rebels are all very flat and have very flat textures. Compare the background for Tarkin in this image:  Everything has a foundation texture but TCW builds upon it with details, ornaments, and so on. You see the ship texture behind Tarkin? That's a procedural texture that's used for almost everything, and I mean it, in Rebels. Every metallic surface uses it. I published a similar procedural texture in 2012 and modified it in 2016, you can see it here. And here's a comparison of it and a ship in Rebels:  That kind of pattern is used everywhere in Rebels, not just metal plates. The Sith Inquisitors' faces also use it. Last but not least, prop/doodad/greeble density is very small in Rebels and most environments, especially cities, look dreadfully empty. TCW solves it by having details kinda baked in the buildings through visible strokes, which is a painfully longer process but it works in making the scenes richer. It's the same reason why hatching is used by good artists and artists coloring in Photoshop doing shadows or tonal variance with soft airbrushes look awfully amateur and lacking something. Rebels' artists are doing a great job with what they have and the art direction given but yeah, these are the main reasons why it looks cheaper.
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Mar 8, 2018 04:23
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LongDarkNight posted:The Dark Side has cookies, Order 66 cookies. Order 66 cookies now and get a blaster bolt in the back at no extra charge I wonder if the Galaxy has Girl/Boy Scout-esque organizations... Wars started over a box of thin mints or chocolate caramel popcorn would be a sight to see
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Mar 8, 2018 05:23
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The trade federation blockades started as a reaction to the girl scouts of naboo's tax exempt status
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Mar 8, 2018 06:54
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site posted:Rosario is 38 thats close enough Shaak Ti was 38 when she died, she was looked aiight for a Togruta
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Mar 8, 2018 11:40
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Even after jumping to hyperspace with the windows open which I assume should be fatal, isn't the entire rest of the crew of that ISD (which should be in the like, thousands) still aboard? I mean I shouldn't nitpick really, I love the idea of Gillian's Island with Ezra as Gilligan and Thrawn as the skipper.
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Mar 8, 2018 15:47
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They said the ships in orbit just disappeared. So I presume there are 10 or so ISDs and a few support ships all together in the unknown regions. A tidy little fleet (without many supplies) to form some sort of order out there.
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Mar 8, 2018 15:59
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