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Nah, I was being facetious. I know that'd just lead to overalls being the number one search term on Pornhub 2020.
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Mar 16, 2018 15:36
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Bolingbroke posted:Yeah in case it wasn't clear, I'm not arguing that it's kids' dress codes that are the problem here, but until we as a culture move past men being loving atrocious to children those children shouldn't be forced to dress in a way that so many men sexualise. I'm sure if we give them alternatives men will just start sexualising those as well but, eh, you do what you can. I suppose my complaint here is less with the nature of school uniforms and more that kids are forced to dress that way. You're really putting the cart before the horse here though (or something like that) by arguing that "schoolgirl trope = sexualized image to lots of men = therefore underage girls shouldn't be made to dress that way for school." You're arguing that the uniform itself has a uniquely sexy quality that certain men appreciate, when the reality is that it's what the uniform represents that is so taboo- and the root of its appeal. The "catholic schoolgirl" ensemble isn't really all that different from any other button shirt + skirt combo (like what many women might wear to work) aside from the fact that it's associated with students. This is treated as a sex trope by adults for reasons ranging from legit pedophilia (or at least a "preference for women on the younger side") to the fact that most adults in our sex-phobic, rear end-backward society got their first taste of sex by "breaking the rules" as students, and they fetishize those experiences and that period of their lives. Our society is also obsessed with the idea of virginity and innocence - and the idea of deflowering or corrupting that innocence, along with the implied power imbalance, is similarly fodder for many a sex trope. To build off of Desperado Bones' post, a middle school I used to work at in a really, really poor district had (by design) the cheapest, most unappealing uniforms you could imagine: baggy, 90's-style navy sweatshirts and sweatpants. The kids all looked like giant, dark blue bags of potatoes walking around. That didn't stop the construction workers on a job site down the street from hollering at my 7th and 8th graders every afternoon as they walked home. And these kids were 11 to maybe 15 at the very oldest. Eventually the dean, a rugby playing dire bear of a dude, had to start walking out with the students at dismissal just to deathstare at these guys until everyone got safely past. You could put teenagers in full hazmat suits, and as long as society understood that a hazmat suit was now what teenagers wore you would have some men behaving inappropriately toward them. Because to those guys it's about loving teenagers, full stop- or at minimum, it's about getting their rocks off harassing somebody they assume would be powerless to get them in real trouble.
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Mar 16, 2018 19:59
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One of our high school administrators, in a speech to our class, suggested that girls not covering up is like "putting steak in front of a dog", which was met with hearty agreeable laughter and should tell you a good deal about what the actual problem is here.Ubik_Lives posted:A healthy train of thought if ever I've seen one. Ah! A participant.
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Mar 16, 2018 20:07
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https://twitter.com/variety/status/974731526918123520?s=21quote:Director Terry Gilliam is speaking out against the #MeToo movement, saying that in Hollywood, “mob rule takes over; the mob is out there, they are carrying their torches and they are going to burn down Frankenstein’s castle.” Ugh
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Mar 16, 2018 20:50
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Yeah ok Terry.
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Mar 16, 2018 21:03
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Wow. Yikes.
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Mar 16, 2018 21:05
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Looks like we've landed on what's gonna kill his Don Quixote movie this time!
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Mar 16, 2018 21:06
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Oof the actual interview is not any better https://www.yahoo.com/news/hollywood-director-gilliam-hits-metoo-mob-rule-112742135.html quote:"It's how you deal with power -- people have got to take responsibility for their own selves."
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Mar 16, 2018 21:07
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The stuff about a mob mentality wasn't even that horrible but then he goes and says that thing about Weinstein which makes me want to barf. Edit: Aaaand of course it's much worse when you get the full interview.
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Mar 16, 2018 21:08
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Well that's rather disappointing. One of my favorite childhood films is Time Bandits. . In fact I'm just going to go ahead and assume he accidentally touched a chunk of Evil that someone left lying around.
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Mar 16, 2018 21:11
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He's always been an edgy iconoclast with a grueling cynical streak so this seems par for the course.
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Mar 16, 2018 22:08
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That is massively disappointing.
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Mar 16, 2018 22:11
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Magic Hate Ball posted:He's always been an edgy iconoclast with a grueling cynical streak so this seems par for the course. "You do what you gotta do" is more defeatist than cynical. I guess sympathizing with Ol' Harv is the cynical part.
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Mar 16, 2018 22:21
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:"You do what you gotta do" is more defeatist than cynical. I guess sympathizing with Ol' Harv is the cynical part. Cynicism is often defeatism with more deflection. When he wields it artistically, it can be refreshing and excoriating, but in conversation he tends to be super insufferable. See also Rich Hall.
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Mar 16, 2018 22:25
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what an enormous pile of poo poo.
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Mar 16, 2018 22:26
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welp, taking "Brazil" and "12 Monkeys" off of the "need to watch" list. how disappointing.
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Mar 16, 2018 22:44
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Magic Hate Ball posted:He's always been an edgy iconoclast
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Mar 16, 2018 23:23
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Electric Bugaloo posted:You're really putting the cart before the horse here though (or something like that) by arguing that "schoolgirl trope = sexualized image to lots of men = therefore underage girls shouldn't be made to dress that way for school." You're arguing that the uniform itself has a uniquely sexy quality that certain men appreciate, when the reality is that it's what the uniform represents that is so taboo- and the root of its appeal.
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Mar 16, 2018 23:35
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the escape goat posted:welp, taking "Brazil" and "12 Monkeys" off of the "need to watch" list. You can do whatever you want, but you are going to miss out on some interesting art if you can't separate the creator from the works. It hasn't come out that Gilliam has been a party to sexual harassment yet, so for the time being he strikes me in the category of someone with a lovely opinion. I guess that won't stop some people from reflexively losing their poo poo, but hey.
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Mar 16, 2018 23:36
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I'd rather miss art from lovely people than support them, thanks
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Mar 16, 2018 23:41
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Magic Hate Ball posted:He's always been an edgy iconoclast with a grueling cynical streak so this seems par for the course. Nah his opinions just loving suck.
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Mar 17, 2018 00:31
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God-loving-dammit, Terry.
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Mar 17, 2018 00:36
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Electric Bugaloo posted:Welp, boobs are for Adults Only and she should’ve thought about the consequences of her choices before she put those adult boobs on in seventh grade. I tell you, in my day we had responsibility.[/i] esperterra posted:I can get behind dress codes when it comes to the girls who are legit dressing way beyond their age, This country loves to talk poo poo about how Muslims "make their women cover themselves," and then we apply religious-minded puritanical bullshit onto young women "tempting" people. It's not young women's fault people creep on them and they don't deserve it for wearing whatever, and we're attacking the problem all wrong. The creepers are the problem and this notion of "dressing beyond your age" is just a roundabout way of giving the creepers more shelter. School uniforms, too. It's just tacit admission that we flatly refuse to teach men to not be loving horrible and blaming it on the women to whom they are horrible. Nudity isn't even inherently sexual. Why would clothes be?
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Mar 17, 2018 00:43
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Why couldn't it have been a Terry that people already hated, like Terry Richardson?
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Mar 17, 2018 00:47
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GrandpaPants posted:Why couldn't it have been a Terry that people already hated, like Terry Richardson? Because we live in a lovely world 
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Mar 17, 2018 00:53
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exquisite tea posted:Nah his opinions just loving suck. I’m not saying his opinions don’t suck, just that he’s always been like this and only getting worse the older and more embittered he becomes.
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Mar 17, 2018 01:00
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Magic Hate Ball posted:I’m not saying his opinions don’t suck, just that he’s always been like this and only getting worse the older and more embittered he becomes. kind of like the edgy comic who, over the years, becomes less aware of where the line is and just becomes an rear end in a top hat
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Mar 17, 2018 01:10
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The director intended this scene about choosing which carrot to buy at the grocery story to be about the duality of man and also you have to separate the artist from his work
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Mar 17, 2018 01:16
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MiddleOne posted:School uniforms are stupid and are a solution to absolutely nothing. I'd argue they're good for cutting down on the kind of bullshit bullying kids of lesser means get for not having nice/designer clothes tbf
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Mar 17, 2018 01:17
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LividLiquid posted:My ex-wife was a teacher, and this poo poo is so true and painful and it drives me absolutely nuts. The poo poo we do to young women to excuse the lovely behaviors of young men is loving bizarre once you apply any amount of critical thinking to it. fwiw I don't think boys at school should be running around shirtless. I'm an equal opportunity prude when it comes to thinking kids in school shouldn't be wearing super revealing stuff. e: though you're right w/r/t the root issue being people thinking nudity is inherently sexual, especially in north america. it would be lovely to live in a world where a girl wearing barely anything isn't seen as inherently a sexual or slutty thing to do, but we unfortunately have a lot of work to do to make that dumb mindset a thing of the past esperterra fucked around with this message at 01:26 on Mar 17, 2018 |
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Mar 17, 2018 01:23
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esperterra posted:I'd argue they're good for cutting down on the kind of bullshit bullying kids of lesser means get for not having nice/designer clothes tbf Nope. In Canberra, where I live, there's strict zoning rules, so a portion of every suburb is public housing. It's a measure to avoid slums. It works pretty well. However, the poorer kids, even at schools with uniforms, have grubbier uniforms, they'll wear a jumper instead of a shirt, if they're really unlucky, they'll smell. When everyone is supposed to look the same, the people that don't stand out even more.
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Mar 17, 2018 01:27
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Snowman_McK posted:Nope. In Canberra, where I live, there's strict zoning rules, so a portion of every suburb is public housing. It's a measure to avoid slums. It works pretty well. However, the poorer kids, even at schools with uniforms, have grubbier uniforms, they'll wear a jumper instead of a shirt, if they're really unlucky, they'll smell. When everyone is supposed to look the same, the people that don't stand out even more. Ugh yeah, that sounds worse. I guess it's a solution in theory more than in practice.
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Mar 17, 2018 01:32
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Phylodox posted:That’s awfully naive, really. 
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Mar 17, 2018 01:40
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Snowman_McK posted:kind of like the edgy comic who, over the years, becomes less aware of where the line is and just becomes an rear end in a top hat Or the funny uncle who’s engagingly caustic when you’re a teenager, but by the time you’re an adult he’s just scathingly bitter. A Buttery Pastry posted:Pretty sure the #1 job of an iconoclast is to challenge institutions, not defend them. Iconoclasty isn’t anathema to moral turpitude, martyrdom, or just garden variety wrongheadedness. Gilliam absolutely believes himself to be tilting at an oppressive institution, that doesn’t mean he isn’t a clod.
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Mar 17, 2018 01:45
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Snowman_McK posted:Nope. In Canberra, where I live, there's strict zoning rules, so a portion of every suburb is public housing. It's a measure to avoid slums. It works pretty well. However, the poorer kids, even at schools with uniforms, have grubbier uniforms, they'll wear a jumper instead of a shirt, if they're really unlucky, they'll smell. When everyone is supposed to look the same, the people that don't stand out even more. This is a good point, I hadn't really thought about it like that, primarily because in North America we tend to notice the problems with the system we're most familiar with (no uniforms) so we don't really see the problems with the alternative as clearly.
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Mar 17, 2018 01:52
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Magic Hate Ball posted:Or the funny uncle who’s engagingly caustic when you’re a teenager, but by the time you’re an adult he’s just scathingly bitter. I cannot wait to be that guy, it's going to be awesome. PT6A posted:This is a good point, I hadn't really thought about it like that, primarily because in North America we tend to notice the problems with the system we're most familiar with (no uniforms) so we don't really see the problems with the alternative as clearly. I was sort of on the other end of it, so I can see it. I spent one year at a very expensive boarding school. Most of the students were from the area, and so boarders stood out. After all, I was 11, and essentially neglected, and, being an 11 year old, not up on clothing etiquette. So, my uniform was always a bit grubbier, shirt rarely tucked in as neatly, ditto on the tie. My parents realised they were spending a fortune to have me look like the poor cousin. When I went to a public high school, which I did for the rest of my schooling, the poor kids were more or less invisible, because almost no one was wearing designer clothes. The only people that did put a lot of work into their outfits were the designated 'hot girls' who, ironically, were mostly from poor families.
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Mar 17, 2018 01:59
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LividLiquid posted:My ex-wife was a teacher, and this poo poo is so true and painful and it drives me absolutely nuts. The poo poo we do to young women to excuse the lovely behaviors of young men is loving bizarre once you apply any amount of critical thinking to it. Pretty much. At my school, the senior management is largely dominated by women, and I'm only one of two male teachers in my department (2 men in a department of 16 teachers), with a female deputy principal as our line manager, and of the two mentor teachers I had at the school, 1 was also a woman. Naturally, we take that poo poo seriously. I had a trio of boys in my English class last year that were utter creeps towards the girls - trying to surreptitiously film them, saying sexist poo poo to them, that sort of thing. One of them snapped out of it after I ripped them apart in front of their peers, another stopped turning up to class half the time, but the third would have a big old moan all the time, and constantly act like a martyr, to the point where I'd just kick him out of class because "I was picking on him for being a boy." I called home, and his dad - a former military guy, apparently - was absolutely appalled by his son's behaviour and he did pull his head in or a bit but he'd go back to his lovely attitude in no time flat. This little shithead actually whined that I was picking on him because I'm "a feminist." It got to a point where I did make it clear to his heads of house (my school uses a house system like in Harry Potter. Each house at my school has two heads - one male, one female) that unless he could stop being a creep, he was no longer welcome in my classroom. He was only allowed back in under very strict conditions, which amounted to "if he looked at any of the girls in a way they didn't like, he's gone. If I see his phone being used for anything other than typing assessments on Google Docs, he's gone. If he sneezes and I, or the girls who had complained to me about him and his friends had an issue with it, he's gone. If he doesn't like that, he should have thought about that first before being a creepy loving poo poo who wouldn't stop whining about how oppressed he was when pulled up for being a creeper." When a young, fairly photogenic teacher got him for English this year, I did warn her about him and I think he's being kept on an even shorter leash with her than he was with me.
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Mar 17, 2018 03:21
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http://variety.com/2018/biz/news/john-bailey-sexual-harassment-academy-president-1202728864/amp/?__twitter_impression=true President of the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences has been accused of sexual harassment.
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Mar 17, 2018 04:21
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Tars Tarkas posted:The director intended this scene about choosing which carrot to buy at the grocery story to be about the duality of man and also you have to separate the artist from his work Clearly the solution is to take a microscope to every person who ever made a piece of art, to be sure they are morally acceptable before consuming said work.
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Mar 17, 2018 04:49
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UnknownMercenary posted:http://variety.com/2018/biz/news/john-bailey-sexual-harassment-academy-president-1202728864/amp/?__twitter_impression=true This would go a long way towards explaining the dearth of sincere anti-harassment content at the Academy Awards. sigh
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Mar 17, 2018 05:06
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