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Zesty posted:The later the swap, the more dependent people get on their original tribe's identity and that just leads to pagonging. Yeah. When people stick to their original tribes for the whole game it's boring. Like people that refuse to make friends beyond their first semester freshman year group
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Mar 30, 2018 21:34
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Zesty posted:The later the swap, the more dependent people get on their original tribe's identity and that just leads to pagonging. Maybe in theory, but in practice no recent season (after, say, 24) with a swap in Ep 5 or later has had a Pagonging along original tribe lines. In practice, ~4 rounds or so seems like an ideal time to swap because the original tribes have had enough time to establish a pecking order and a big chunk of people will feel on the outs of their tribe. Earlier than that and the pecking order is too murky, later than that (or no swap at all) and the people at the bottom just get voted off.
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Mar 30, 2018 21:40
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Tribal identity is nothing, but people need a reason to realize that. If your tribe blindsides your ally and you are clearly on the bottom, what do you care about voting tribe strong? Without time for the pecking order to become clear, or the ironclad proof of tribal council, people have no reason to vote along anything other than tribe lines. The proof is in the pudding.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:41
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Tribal Identity is obviously not nothing. If the swap is delayed the weaker social players will get hopelessly stuck to tribal lines. If you had a swap every episode, people wouldn't default to their original tribe. There would be more incentive to make connections with everyone they meet. Zesty fucked around with this message at 23:52 on Mar 30, 2018 |
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Mar 30, 2018 23:47
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Zesty posted:Tribal Identity is obviously not nothing. If the swap is delayed the weaker social players will get hopelessly stuck to tribal lines. While they may not default to their original tribe, I think something similar would still happen. I think with that little stability you would just see one big 12-14 person alliance of safety trying to ride the wave to the merge. Even if you knew you were on the bottom of that giant alliance, it would be way too risky to turn against it because of its sheer size and because you have no idea who you are voting with next round. Why socialize with the 6-8 outsiders when it's almost impossible they will form a majority on your tribe-of-the-week (and, on the off chance they do, the other tribe can just throw it to save you). This is kind of how the modern giant seasons of Big Brother play out, where there's just so much uncertainty from round to round that people gravitate towards some big giant alliance hoping to ride the wave as long as possible.
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Mar 31, 2018 00:20
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Three tribes would be ideal if there was a swap every week then.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:02
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Zesty posted:Three tribes would be ideal if there was a swap every week then. With new beach every time along with new idols to be found.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:18
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Zesty posted:Tribal Identity is obviously not nothing. If the swap is delayed the weaker social players will get hopelessly stuck to tribal lines. A swap every episode would make the show loving impossible to follow. Tribal identity is nothing because tribes are arbitrary assignments. Richard Hatch said it in season loving one; Rattana, Tagi, Pagong, they're all meaningless. They could be made up words for all anyone knows. They mean only what people attribute to them, and when people realize that-- when they realize they are on the bottom of the pecking order and they _do not have to stay there_, that's when the game gets interesting. We have seen this, repeatedly. But they need a chance to realize that, and that takes either time or tribal.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:39
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Or if you have only one beach so everyone knows each other, but immunity challenge tribes swap up often. Make reward challenges individual from the start so that social groups form over who gets picked to go on rewards.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:42
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Spergatory posted:A swap every episode would make the show loving impossible to follow. Tribal identity is nothing because tribes are arbitrary assignments. Richard Hatch said it in season loving one; Rattana, Tagi, Pagong, they're all meaningless. They could be made up words for all anyone knows. They mean only what people attribute to them, and when people realize that-- when they realize they are on the bottom of the pecking order and they _do not have to stay there_, that's when the game gets interesting. We have seen this, repeatedly. But they need a chance to realize that, and that takes either time or tribal. Okay, Sperg. Nexal posted:With new beach every time along with new idols to be found. Don't need new beaches. It's all about your ability to hustle in a new situation. Original tribe is more meaningless than ever. I think it would be fun in practice.
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Mar 31, 2018 04:55
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They could call it "Survivor: Drop Your Buffs" and do a tribe swap every week until the merge, which they could do later than ever before.
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Mar 31, 2018 06:45
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They should do a split after the merge and move the contestants back to tribes.
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Mar 31, 2018 06:47
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They should start with a sole survivor and then vote people onto the island.
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Mar 31, 2018 06:56
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Zesty posted:They should start with a sole survivor and then vote people onto the island. Start with Lil as the sole survivor and vote in all the worst people like Colton, Rupert and Donald Trump to make her miserable.
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Mar 31, 2018 07:00
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ApplesandOranges posted:They should do a split after the merge and move the contestants back to tribes. Start with 20 people on one tribe. First 2 boots are individual immunities. Have a reward challenge at 18 people where the 3 winners get split into 3 tribes and get to pick their tribe. Then don’t swap until merge.
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Mar 31, 2018 07:59
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clone jeff
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Mar 31, 2018 12:43
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Spergatory posted:Tribal identity is nothing because tribes are arbitrary assignments. Richard Hatch said it in season loving one; Rattana, Tagi, Pagong, they're all meaningless. They could be made up words for all anyone knows. They mean only what people attribute to them, and when people realize that-- when they realize they are on the bottom of the pecking order and they _do not have to stay there_, that's when the game gets interesting. We have seen this, repeatedly. But they need a chance to realize that, and that takes either time or tribal. military/ loving Catholic" etc happens every season. The fact that in-game assigned tribal affiliation is used to twist the arm of less canny players to great effect even though that assignment was extremely recent is practically Stanford Prison Experiment level role acceptance. It might not be the most important thing but tribe definitely matters.
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Mar 31, 2018 14:30
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It was really funny this week when people were all  I'M LOYAL TO MY TRIBE  referring to the one they spent 6 days in, and not the one they spent 9 days in after that.
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Mar 31, 2018 15:30
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blue squares posted:clone jeff Survivor: Jeff Island 39 days 16 Jeff Probsts 1 Survivor
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Mar 31, 2018 16:36
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Jeff has no idea how to play Survivor.
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Mar 31, 2018 17:00
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Have Jeff run color commentary for himself. "Jeff really struggling out there!"
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Mar 31, 2018 17:04
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OK I made a thing...
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Mar 31, 2018 18:58
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Mar 31, 2018 19:39
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I’ve been watching Australian Survivor and it’s amazing how easily replaced Jeff is outside of tribal council. It’s really driving home how Jeff just repeats the same things during challenges season after season. The Australian guy is doing a perfectly fine job of copying his lines word for word. Admittedly during tribal is where the difference starts to show, but during challenges it’s basically a Jeff Probst sound board.
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Mar 31, 2018 20:53
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Australian Survivor’s challenges are so good.
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Mar 31, 2018 21:55
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I’m blown away by how good the show is. Half way through season three and I’m definitely starting season four once I’m done. It reminds me a lot of middle-era American Survivor around the time of Panama/Cook Islands/Fiji/China/Micronesia that I loved so much.
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Mar 31, 2018 22:04
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I has some really dumb production choices and 55 days/24 people is a bit insane but the longer episodes means the characters are much more developed than the American edition.
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Mar 31, 2018 22:16
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I'm watching Blood vs. Water (27) and it's enjoyable but the whole Redemption Island thing slows the whole thing down. What a dumb concept. edit: haha holy poo poo Gervase is unhinged clown shoes fucked around with this message at 02:10 on Apr 1, 2018 |
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Mar 31, 2018 23:48
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I hate all returnee/newbie mix seasons.
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Apr 1, 2018 00:12
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The only good one was Micronesia.
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Apr 1, 2018 01:42
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Blood vs Water 1 was pretty good too! If they have to do mixed seasons going forward it’d be nice if the newbies were vets of other shows like Big Brother or Amazing Race. I don’t have any problem with Hayden competing against returning Survivors. It feels pretty one sided when it’s true newbies.
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Apr 1, 2018 01:54
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clown shoes posted:OK I made a thing... It's beautiful. We'll have a whole programming block soon. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9g3--WYH8SY
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Apr 1, 2018 02:19
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Dugong posted:I has some really dumb production choices and 55 days/24 people is a bit insane but the longer episodes means the characters are much more developed than the American edition. It really was a fresh take on Survivor in many ways. The longer episodes meant that even in the first episode, they gave some screen time to all the castaways, and most episodes just about everyone got at least 1 confessional. Although it did drag out toward the end when they gave all the 6 people remaining confessionals and lots of time to discuss what was going on. Also, the Jar of Cookies and Jar of "lollies" they did in season 2 made for some interesting strategy decisions.
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Apr 1, 2018 03:42
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BGrifter posted:Blood vs Water 1 was pretty good too! That’s exactly it. Micronesia might be liked, but the newbies are always absolutely hosed. Returnees are just much better equipped in every way. Hell, a returnee won in a season with only two returning players.
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Apr 1, 2018 04:42
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Zesty posted:That’s exactly it. Micronesia might be liked, but the newbies are always absolutely hosed. Returnees are just much better equipped in every way. It's honestly gonna depend on the cast. Sure Boston Rob won, but Russell got absolutely screwed because everyone was so determined to cut him off that they threw a challenge. For every Redemption Island, we have Palau, Philippines, South Pacific, etc. And hey, South Pacific is the greatest example of a newbie stomping two veterans into the dirt.
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Apr 1, 2018 05:18
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Zesty posted:That’s exactly it. Micronesia might be liked, but the newbies are always absolutely hosed. Returnees are just much better equipped in every way. Entirely fair. As a general rule I hate the mix, but I think there are ways to do it that could work. Load up a cast with half Survivor players and half Big Brother/maybe a couple Amazing Race and I'd watch the hell out of that. Dan Gheesling could run circles around 98% of Survivor players without ever having played a day in his life. I'd have zero hesitation putting him into a game with Boston Rob and Parvati.
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Apr 1, 2018 05:23
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I actually question whether Gheesling would be good at Survivor since so much of his gameplay is about is about the sort of mind gently caress and social game that really takes a week of absolutely nothing to do and no one to talk to it with. You just don't get that kind of time and solitude with Survivor. Plus he'd actually have to win some challenges now and then. This is a weird thing for me to be talking about. I clearly need sleep.
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Apr 1, 2018 06:12
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Dan would probably be pretty solid in challenges. At least on the level of a Rob Cesternino or someone. Not a challenge beast by any stretch (and as such less of a target) but a solid middle of the pack contributor that can maybe pull out a key individual immunity or two.
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Apr 1, 2018 06:29
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I'm watching Survivor: Philippines (25) now and Michael Skupin is injuring himself left and right. It's very amusing. I keep expected him to fall hands first into some troubles.
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Apr 1, 2018 15:55
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clown shoes posted:I keep expected Michael Skupin to fall hands first into some troubles. 
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Apr 1, 2018 16:20
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