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MourningView posted:Is your position somehow that the union is going to somehow lead to the team sites getting paid less? It's not like they were doing great before and now the evil labor union is coming in to steal all their money. I don't know what their position will be. Just that it's in their members best interest that those sites not only not get paid more, but produce more cheap content. MourningView posted:They wanted to include the team sites as part of the bargaining unit but dont have a legal means to do so, that doesn't mean that the full time staffers should just abandon their right to collectively bargain. Anyone who has to opportunity to unionize should do so I didn't say they shouldn't unionize. Just that they are in the weird position of profiting off the unpaid labor just like the execs and shareholders. That all the solidarity talk and praise of Vox's "progressive management" rings hollow when those union members are demanding some site manager making $100/month hit his quota.
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May 17, 2018 19:59
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That's coming down from the corporate side. If you have an issue with how the team sites are treated that's where the blame ultimately lies, not with the comparatively powerless full time writers and editors. And don't crap all over them for unionizing and then turn around and pretend that's not what you're doing, come on MourningView fucked around with this message at 20:07 on May 17, 2018 |
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May 17, 2018 20:02
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Niwrad posted:I don't know what their position will be. Just that it's in their members best interest that those sites not only not get paid more, but produce more cheap content. Shut the gently caress up.
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May 17, 2018 20:06
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Wow this corporation makes large profits off of contractors that can't join unions! Shame on the union for cheating them 
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May 17, 2018 20:07
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This is some real "You criticize capitalism and yet you own an iPhone. Hypocrite much?!?!?!?" level poo poo.
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May 17, 2018 20:08
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If the Vox Union cannot force the United States to change it's labor laws then it's being explotative and shouldn't exist is a truly impressive galaxy brain take though so credit to you there I guess
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May 17, 2018 20:10
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I think Niwrad is saying that the Vox Union probably isn't going to make decisions to help community writers that are explicitly not part of the Union, which doesn't sound like a controversial statement. If the Union is given a chunk of money to distribute to it's membership, it'd be their job to make sure as much of that goes to members (IE, not community content creators) as is reasonable. That's not them being evil, it's the Union doing it's job. But it doesn't help the community creators.
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May 17, 2018 20:15
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Lockback posted:That's not them being evil, That was very much not what his posts implied, and he also seemed to blame them for how the team site writers are treated or for them not being part of the bargaining unit, both of which are things completely out of their control.
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May 17, 2018 20:18
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Jackie D posted:Not to mention UFC and WWE WWE and UFC follow the combat sports/pro wrestling models that have been around for decades at this point. It's not really anything new. The talent should be unionized, but that's an entirely separate can of worms.
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May 17, 2018 20:21
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exploded mummy posted:WWE and UFC follow the combat sports/pro wrestling models that have been around for decades at this point. It's not really anything new. Still hope if/when wrestlers unionize they keep the name "Union of People You OUghtta Respect, Son".
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May 17, 2018 20:27
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Most of the talent are extremely libertarian gently caress you got mine and would fight unionization anyway.
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May 17, 2018 20:27
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I wish Grant Brisbee would just leave SBN entirely so I never have to go there again. Hate their business model but he's really funny and writes about my favorite team.
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May 17, 2018 20:33
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The Pussy Boss posted:I wish Grant Brisbee would just leave SBN entirely so I never have to go there again. Hate their business model but he's really funny and writes about my favorite team. I don't even like baseball and I love Grant Brisbee
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May 17, 2018 20:38
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MourningView posted:That's coming down from the corporate side. If you have an issue with how the team sites are treated that's where the blame ultimately lies, not with the comparatively powerless full time writers and editors. Most of the brand managers are writers and editors themselves. They're in the union. They're also the one's sending out the e-mails pushing for crossposting because it helps get the video numbers up. When those sites do well it means more traffic to their articles as they routinely promote the national stuff. I don't have a problem with the union. It's great. Everyone involved in journalism should try and form one at their outlet so they don't get hosed as hard. But that union benefits a great deal from the labor being exploited throughout that network. When Matt Brown e-mails the college sites to tell them to link more, specifically to the SBNation content and podcasts, it's not an editorial decision. It's telling some guy getting $30/month to throw some traffic to those full-time employees. All those SBNation writers get a lot of traffic and promotion from those other sites written by people not in the union. Again, nothing is wrong with the union. It's good. But it's also used to cover up what the real problem is at sites like Vox. They pay a handful of full-time writers and editors real money, pretend to be labor friendly by working with a tiny union, then make their profit off the people they don't have to pay.
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May 17, 2018 21:37
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None of that is the fault of the people in the union. They might send the actual emails but they're not the ones who came up with the business model, set the content demands, determine compensation, or refuse to classify team site writers as employees. That's all from Vox corporate. If you want to blame someone that is who you should blame. The union is protecting the interests of the writers they can, they can't change labor laws
MourningView fucked around with this message at 21:54 on May 17, 2018 |
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May 17, 2018 21:52
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https://twitter.com/ESPNPR/status/997173760657690624
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May 17, 2018 22:35
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He loving sucks.
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May 17, 2018 22:37
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Isn't that the guy who admitted he was a paid UFC shill
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May 18, 2018 03:04
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i thought he was the guy UFC kept on banning from events because he was reporting less than positive things about them. Or maybe I was getting worked.
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May 18, 2018 03:14
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DJExile posted:Isn't that the guy who admitted he was a paid UFC shill not exactly he had a full time gig writing for mmafighting.com he worked for Fox Sports part time for their MMA show and was paid by Fox for that show. but he also did work on the pre and post fight shows for Fox, where technically they are paid by Zuffa (UFC's parent) because it wasn't the MMA show, but all that money for these pre and post shows came from Fox anyway, so you basically had Fox paying Zuffa to pay Helwani and the other talent on those shows. basically it was a way for UFC to keep a muzzle on some of the journalists closest to their talent eventually Helwani got canned from Fox because UFC hated his reporting and it not being pro-UFC enough then a few months after that he got banned for life and his entire staff were thrown out of UFC 199 because he announced that Brock Lesnar was going to be back for UFC 200 before it could be revealed on the show then everyone lit dana white a new one and he unbanned ariel then Ariel was set to do pool coverage for McGregor/Mayweather for Showtime and Dana had him banned again, just after Ariel took a cross country redeye.
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May 18, 2018 03:24
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ariel helwani is a massive dweeb and also absolutely awful and loving with him is one of the best things dana white has ever done
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May 18, 2018 05:19
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exploded mummy posted:WWE and UFC follow the combat sports/pro wrestling models that have been around for decades at this point. It's not really anything new. Wwe wrestlers are in no way independent contractors though. They are salaried employees with no benefits.
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May 18, 2018 06:07
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Jota posted:ariel helwani is a massive dweeb and also absolutely awful and loving with him is one of the best things dana white has ever done He is a giant dweeb but also Dana is a piece of poo poo who shits on reporters that do their job when it inconveniences him so it all evens out.
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May 18, 2018 06:09
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algebra testes posted:He is a giant dweeb but also Dana is a piece of poo poo who shits on reporters that do their job when it inconveniences him so it all evens out. Yeah agreed Dana making GBS threads on him is cool and he deserves it
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May 18, 2018 06:34
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Ariel has atrocious opinions but with fact-based reporting is actually pretty good IMO
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May 18, 2018 16:10
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they promised more soccer coverage it's here https://twitter.com/TheAthleticSCCR/status/997145254561173504
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May 18, 2018 16:12
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sportsgenius86 posted:Ariel has atrocious opinions but with fact-based reporting is actually pretty good IMO mma woj
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May 18, 2018 16:14
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Ariel sucks rear end and it's bad to paint him in the same paint as journos who actually working for a job
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May 19, 2018 09:27
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Vertical Lime posted:they promised more soccer coverage I don't understand why people would visit the Athletic for the big European leagues when there are like, European websites in English that already have tonnes of excellent paid journalists covering all this?
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May 19, 2018 12:41
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I know it's already been said a bunch of times but my thing with The Athletic and why I'm not really into paying for it is, what I want to read on the internet is good, thoughtful, entertaining analysis. What I don't want is bog standard beat reporting, not even if it's really good beat reporting. But it seems like that's mostly what TA sells.
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May 19, 2018 13:51
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Eric the Mauve posted:I know it's already been said a bunch of times but my thing with The Athletic and why I'm not really into paying for it is, what I want to read on the internet is good, thoughtful, entertaining analysis. What I don't want is bog standard beat reporting, not even if it's really good beat reporting. But it seems like that's mostly what TA sells.
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May 19, 2018 17:44
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Eric the Mauve posted:I know it's already been said a bunch of times but my thing with The Athletic and why I'm not really into paying for it is, what I want to read on the internet is good, thoughtful, entertaining analysis. What I don't want is bog standard beat reporting, not even if it's really good beat reporting. But it seems like that's mostly what TA sells. I joined because a specific journalist provides good constant insight. It’s not “entertaining” but it’s solid and not just rote copy.
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May 19, 2018 19:08
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algebra testes posted:I don't understand why people would visit the Athletic for the big European leagues when there are like, European websites in English that already have tonnes of excellent paid journalists covering all this? American sports sites are desperately trying to make soccer A Thing.
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May 19, 2018 19:15
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I mean, I would pay 4 bucks a month or whatever it is if Andrew Gross covered the Rangers again since he was their best beat guy, but they hired Rick Carpinello who is just very bland so I read more of the other stuff on the site. so it depends on the beat writer for me
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May 19, 2018 20:20
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Deadspin has now officially Gone Too Far: doxxing PFTCommenter and calling him out because of their "feud" with Barstool.
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May 22, 2018 19:28
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Troy Queef posted:Deadspin has now officially Gone Too Far: doxxing PFTCommenter and calling him out because of their "feud" with Barstool. PFTC and his fans wanted very badly to think you could separate him from barstool's typical bullshit. You can't have it both ways.
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May 22, 2018 19:38
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Troy Queef posted:Deadspin has now officially Gone Too Far: doxxing PFTCommenter and calling him out because of their "feud" with Barstool. I don't think that's a doxx. This is definitely not the first time I've seen PFTCommenter's real name, I think it used to be on his podcast site. Criticizing PFTCommenter for being the face of Barstool seems pretty justifiable to me.
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May 22, 2018 19:41
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I know people poo poo on him for going to Barstool but were there really any other media companies lining up to hire a sports satirist? He was at SBNation who doesn't pay jack poo poo. Gawker was circling the drain. And most of the major companies (ESPN, SI, Fox Sports) weren't dabbling in that kind of content because it mainly takes aim at them and the leagues they have large financial stakes in.
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May 22, 2018 19:47
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 Having a hard time arguing with this
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May 22, 2018 19:50
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Niwrad posted:I know people poo poo on him for going to Barstool but were there really any other media companies lining up to hire a sports satirist? He was at SBNation who doesn't pay jack poo poo. Gawker was circling the drain. And most of the major companies (ESPN, SI, Fox Sports) weren't dabbling in that kind of content because it mainly takes aim at them and the leagues they have large financial stakes in. the answer is: probably not, partially for the reasons you argued, partially because Deadspin has changed from a site that would have hired him in the past into a very much Sports Are Serious Business site (especially under noted lovely Media Man Tommy Craggs, who was still editor when PFTC went to Barstool) and also because Barstool is the only new sports media site to be both spending and making serious money.
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May 22, 2018 19:54
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