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homullus posted:Reasonable. The writers did go out of their way with "just a dot" on the globe, though; if all they needed to communicate was "Chicago," they could have gone with a Robin drawing. A drawing of a single white sock
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May 21, 2018 21:26
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Gorilla Salad posted:And, for what it's worth, it definitely looks like the same room. Though given how cookie cutter the sets are in the Lighthouse, that itself doesn't mean too much. With the knife in the exact same position, too.
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May 21, 2018 21:34
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Bruceski posted:With the knife in the exact same position, too. And wasn't the room full of "stuff" before? If Deke vanishes, his previous work vanished too? Where did the twinkies that Deke had have had brought go?
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May 21, 2018 22:14
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jumba posted:And wasn't the room full of "stuff" before? If Deke vanishes, his previous work vanished too? Where did the twinkies that Deke had have had brought go? I thought he got all that stuff from the outside world. I'm guessing it went back to where he got it from.
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May 21, 2018 22:18
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Teek posted:I'm not sure this is right. If your "previous" timeline is the one we also see in the security camera footage of Daisy yelling at someone, then that doesn't really make sense unless Coulson also never took the serum that time around. What I think was different, was that he didn't take the serum, but left it behind in that timeline. This time around, he stashed it in the gauntlet. In this scenario, you have Daisy still yelling in the same exact way, allowing her to still fulfill the video. Though it's a bit fuzzy, because in my conceptual idea of the timelines, the video being exactly the same really doesn't matter ultimately, it's just a bit of a narrative device. I think the first time around Yo-Yo isn't wigging out during the debate about what to do with the serum, so May can't destroy the Kree Odium thing on the sly. They talk to Coulson, he orders them to make the serum, Daisy is still pissed when she leaves the plane, nobody realises the odium supercharges you and makes you crazy before you die, Talbot destroys the world. GreenNight posted:I thought he got all that stuff from the outside world. I'm guessing it went back to where he got it from. I think it's just a visual shorthand to signify that he's vanished and the earth has been saved, but you can't think about it for more than a second. Deke has been actively helping the team, and all of that stuff has stuck. The entire team took actions based on a timeline that no longer exists, should they all disappear and be replaced by non-time jumping versions of themselves? Shouldn't Fitz disappear once frozen Fitz will no longer be able to reach his destination? I mean, Fitz definitely can't reach a destroyed world future, but there is a tiny chance that Deke could still be born (and then just sent back in time because why not), so why choose him over Fitz. Why is the original multitool there? Did someone else put the multitool in Deke's room, and he put everything else in around it? Not to mention the whole Deke vanishing thing was Fitz's theory based on him trying to reconcile his immutable timeline theory with Gemma's belief that they can change the timeline, and as a result is a flawed assumption based on mutually exclusive ideas, where a change will just transition to a new, but still fixed timeline. It's basically the other side of the coin to Gemma's acid drinking experiment, where she tries to utilise the immutability of time so she can change it. I think Deke just took all his stuff and left.
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May 22, 2018 04:48
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Gorilla Salad posted:In the first shot of Deke's room they made a point of showing both future/present versions of Fitz's knives sitting on the bench amongst all the crap he had squirrelled away. It's still ambiguous -- in that earlier scene Deke says that he's a packrat by nature. He'd have taken his knife with him. (Of course, if Deke did vanish, then the Fitz that died should also have just vanished, and he didn't so...)
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May 22, 2018 06:25
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Azhais posted:A drawing of a single white sock 
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May 22, 2018 07:28
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Open Source Idiom posted:It's still ambiguous -- in that earlier scene Deke says that he's a packrat by nature. He'd have taken his knife with him. He took his knife. He left the newer one.
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May 22, 2018 08:47
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homullus posted:Graviton got less sane with time and more powerful with more gravitonium. I don't think he'd have to absorb Daisy to split the world if he kept scooping up all the gravitonium (cf. Robin being told to draw "a dot" everywhere there was gravitonium and subsequently covering half the globe in Sharpie) and going crazier as he did so. I get what you're saying, but the time loop result really doesn't require Daisy's involvement (other than presumably her death shortly after her last known footage). Graviton believed a number of things that were wrong, and "must absorb Daisy" might just be there to explain why he doesn't just crush her from a distance when they fight. My impression is that the quake powers had nothing at all to do with the actual destruction of the planet. I think the original timeline they chose to use the Centipede formula to deliver the Odium, supercharging Graviton to the point of him obliterating things; the prompt death from heart failure after eliminating him immediately following this. He likely obliterated Daisy in this timeline. The reason I think that this is what happened is ultimately May smashing the Odium based on what she was told about him 'putting the pieces together' is the moment things actually changed. Because she was outvoted: There were more people in favor of weaponizing it than saving Coulson. Ultimately by not weaponizing it, it lead to Coulson giving a non-suicide formula to Daisy instead. I mean it was always a terrible plan: Turn the super powerful being pulling up it's element out of the ground a thing to overclock them to 100 for 5 minutes.
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May 22, 2018 11:32
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One thing I would have liked to see from this episode was Daisy acknowledging that what Fitz did was wrong, but that he did it for the right reasons. Her powers saved the day several times during these last four episodes or so.
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May 22, 2018 11:33
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I feel that her not acknowledging that is in character for Daisy and her people skills.
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May 22, 2018 11:39
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I feel that her not acknowledging that is in character for someone who literally had painful unwanted surgery performed on them.
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May 22, 2018 11:41
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Oasx posted:One thing I would have liked to see from this episode was Daisy acknowledging that what Fitz did was wrong, but that he did it for the right reasons. Her powers saved the day several times during these last four episodes or so. But now she has to get over it. Fitzicle's last act was broing out with Hunter.
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May 22, 2018 12:10
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Masonity posted:He took his knife. He left the newer one. Yes. I'm not sure what your point is though? Why would he take his grandfather's stuff when he's got his own knife?
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May 22, 2018 17:28
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I kinda want to see Deke burst in though a door like Kramer in the first episode of next season.
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May 22, 2018 19:28
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Open Source Idiom posted:Yes. I'm not sure what your point is though? Why would he take his grandfather's stuff when he's got his own knife? The newer one would be his grandfathers, the old one is "his" because it has gone through time and was handed down to him. I think Deke will still be around next season, they left it sort of ambiguous but I think he's going to be key in finding Fitz (since he took that star map from the alien ship).
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May 22, 2018 19:30
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Cat Army
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twistedmentat posted:I kinda want to see Deke burst in though a door like Kramer in the first episode of next season. "Lemons, Mack! Lemons!"
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May 22, 2018 19:30
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Mack makes rash emotional decisions all the time, like refusing to leave the Framework because of his fake daughter. They should've made Davis the new leader.
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May 22, 2018 19:51
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I really liked Mack when he was helping Fitz recover. I really don't like "Captain America, but less pleasant and even more naive" Mack. Yo-yo in Cassandra Mode hasn't been fun, but she's at least been interesting. I hope they both move on to new places next season. Mack is going to have to make some hard decisions with his heaven/hell worldview, and it might get somebody killed.
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May 22, 2018 20:11
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I just realised that after more than a season of the team constantly having to defend Daisy whenever people accused her of trying to kill Talbot, she totally killed Talbot.
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May 22, 2018 20:21
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BreakAtmo posted:I just realised that after more than a season of the team constantly having to defend Daisy whenever people accused her of trying to kill Talbot, she totally killed Talbot. He'll get the last laugh in a few years when all that gravitonium causes the sun to go nova
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May 22, 2018 20:24
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The biggest letdown was not finding Jimmy Hoffa's body, 0/10 season finale, should be canceled. F-
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May 22, 2018 21:33
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So what's the over/under on Coulson returning as a Skrull next season. Not sure that plot hook works to get him back into the movies, but it should at least work for the show.
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May 22, 2018 21:35
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to be honest after LMD shenanigans I don't want another season of evil doppelgangers
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May 22, 2018 22:24
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Ouhei posted:The newer one would be his grandfathers, the old one is "his" because it has gone through time and was handed down to him. There are actually three knives in play. The chronologically youngest knife is the one Fitzicle currently has on him. It has never time-travelled. The middle knife is the one time-travelling Fitz brought to the future the slow way, and then back by time monolith, and which probably ended up in the empty room Jemma returned to. The third knife is the one that was eventually passed down to Deke, which he brought back by time monolith too, and most likely took with him when he left to enjoy Earth
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May 22, 2018 23:51
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Imagine four knives on the edge of a cliff.
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May 23, 2018 01:12
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Actually they're multitools 
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May 23, 2018 01:16
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sticklefifer posted:Mack makes rash emotional decisions all the time, like refusing to leave the Framework because of his fake daughter. Davis is a vet, he's been around since season 1.
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May 23, 2018 01:18
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twistedmentat posted:I kinda want to see Deke burst in though a door like Kramer in the first episode of next season. "I'm out!"
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May 23, 2018 05:12
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Teek posted:So what's the over/under on Coulson returning as a Skrull next season. Not sure that plot hook works to get him back into the movies, but it should at least work for the show. 4
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May 23, 2018 05:27
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Teek posted:So what's the over/under on Coulson returning as a Skrull next season. Not sure that plot hook works to get him back into the movies, but it should at least work for the show. This was the Skrullson that dies, we get the real son of Coul back next season
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May 23, 2018 07:17
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Coulson dies on that beach and then turns to dust because he’s been a clone of Peter Parker this whole time.
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May 23, 2018 14:40
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Bruceski posted:Fitz is dead, long live Fitz. Earlier in the show, they showed two copies of the knife on the table. After, they only showed the one. I think this means Deke was blinked out of existence.
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May 23, 2018 16:51
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it's Schrödinger's Deke, he is in a state of uncertainty until the writers and showrunners know whether they have the budget and narrative to include him as a cast member or even guest actor.
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May 23, 2018 16:57
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double nine posted:it's Schrödinger's Deke, he is in a state of uncertainty until the writers and showrunners know whether they have the budget and narrative to include him as a cast member or even guest actor. It wouldn't even make sense because Future Fitz didn't disappear, even though they're about to pull him out of his space pod. The only way it works is if it's the multiverse theory where all the timelines still exist on different branches/realities. That's my bet. Deke no disappear. JazzFlight fucked around with this message at 17:05 on May 23, 2018 |
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May 23, 2018 17:00
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JazzFlight posted:Exactly. They just left it up in the air, so you can believe what you want to believe until next season. He either went on his trip or he disappeared from reality. There would be a lot of paradoxes if he disappeared, though, right? Like, would all the stuff he affected be undone? That's why time-travel stories have like a billion plot-holes if they're not done in the exact right way. Did you not watch this last season or something? There's more than one way time travel works in speculative fiction, and one of those ways is that you can't undo your own past, and can have duplicates of yourself around.
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May 23, 2018 17:07
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homullus posted:Did you not watch this last season or something? There's more than one way time travel works in speculative fiction, and one of those ways is that you can't undo your own past, and can have duplicates of yourself around. Since they saved the world and "changed the future," it means that Fitz and Simmons were not invincible and that their original theory was wrong. I'm just confirming that the show ended this season acknowledging that "Back to the Future" style time-travel where you disappear from reality isn't the way they're doing things.
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May 23, 2018 17:10
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May 23, 2018 18:20
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JazzFlight posted:But this season they were putting forward two competing theories. Fitz and Simmons claimed the future can't change and that they're invincible because Deke is around. Meanwhile, Deke says the multiverse theory just means that he will stick around because he's from another dimension where the earth blew up. If they save the earth in this dimension, it won't affect him at all. If that's how BTTF time travel works then explain how old Biff gave himself the almanac in the past and then returned to the good future in the Delorean 
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May 23, 2018 20:05
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SpartanIvy posted:If that's how BTTF time travel works then explain how old Biff gave himself the almanac in the past and then returned to the good future in the Delorean I think that even they knew it was a mistake and tried to fudge it half-way.
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May 23, 2018 20:18
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