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Big Mean Jerk
Jan 27, 2009

Well, of course I know him.
He's me.

Raxivace posted:

I don't care about this dumb train derail but Sanjuro is such a fuckin' good movie.

I’m still extremely irritated we got some poorly choreographed Hollywood swordfight instead of a great Kurosawa style two-slashes-and-done duel. You name the character Musashi, you have him play Yojimbo-lite, and then you make him look like an incompetent doof with a bad fight. C’mon guys.

Also how the gently caress did this thread fill 6 pages with posts about that goddamn train? Truly, a derail that stands shoulder to shoulder with “I acquit/quit” and “What is this, the local?”.

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esperterra
Mar 24, 2010

SHINee's back




I was disappointed b/c I've seen Hiroyuki Sanada have way doper fights in other American media, let alone the weird like kung fu poo poo he did for a hot minute in the past. He's a pretty good martial artist/movie sword dude and the choreo in that scene was disappointing.

Still fun to see Sanada be a badass tho so I wasn't really complaining too hard.

Drowning In Terror
Dec 10, 2008

mustard_tiger posted:

Can someone explain how they could film that scene better to help goons grasp the concept of direction? There are tons of establishing shots, script lines, background movements ect that show you which way the train is moving. Like jfc how do you tell the direction your car is moving when you're in it?

They could have fixed the background in pp? If the editing didn't feel off during the train scene you probably weren't paying enough attention.

Big Mean Jerk posted:

I’m still extremely irritated we got some poorly choreographed Hollywood swordfight instead of a great Kurosawa style two-slashes-and-done duel. You name the character Musashi, you have him play Yojimbo-lite, and then you make him look like an incompetent doof with a bad fight. C’mon guys.

It wasn't great. The choreography was pretty underwhelming and they didn't seem to realise this with the way they shot it, like they assumed the skill of the actors would just carry it.

packetmantis
Feb 26, 2013
I think the way the nose drill works is it lets out the cortical fluid, which is a bad thing as we see with Bernard. Maybe once it's all gone you become a zombie like Clem, but since they wanted to use Abernathy for something they probably refilled his.

ThaBus
Nov 12, 2013

Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:

So, by what means is the cradle populating Virtual Westworld? Is Delores' father Abernathy or the replacement bartender? By same token who is the madame?

They're all there, Dolores has like 5 dads precariously sitting on top of each other each morning on that loving chair waxing lyrical about natural splendour.

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!

WampaLord posted:

Honestly had Teddy not given him the pistol, this would all be more clear.

The pistol implies "going to be stranded alone for days and starve to death" not "you're gonna explode in 30 seconds but here you go I guess you can shoot yourself first if you want"

“Here’s a gun with one bullet, save it for suicide” is a common thing in movies and TV though.

No Butt Stuff posted:

Ward and May were just talking

Nice.

mustard_tiger posted:

Can someone explain how they could film that scene better to help goons grasp the concept of direction? There are tons of establishing shots, script lines, background movements ect that show you which way the train is moving. Like jfc how do you tell the direction your car is moving when you're in it?

Maybe they could hire the GoT writers and have them write the dialog?

Teddy: We need to get into the Mesa, which we will do by running the train into it and having it blow up. Since you are not a host (you are a human) and since you’ve made me king rear end in a top hat now, you can’t join us.

Guy: What does that mean?

Teddy: The train’s engine is in the front car, the same car you’re in right now. We are going to move to the second car and disconnect it with you on the car.

Guy: But why?

Teddy: As I said, you’re of no use to us now. By the way, here is a gun with one bullet, for you to shoot yourself in the head to commit suicide in case you don’t want to burn to death from the fires caused by the explosion.

After disconnecting, Teddy shouts across the gap: You are now on the train with the engine barreling towards the Mesa. We are slowing down because we don’t have an engine because you have it. We’re going to walk the rest of the way. Remember the gun I gave you.

TTerrible
Jul 15, 2005

Boris Galerkin posted:

Teddy: We need to get into the Mesa, which we will do by running the train into it and having it blow up. Since you are not a host (you are a human) and since you’ve made me king rear end in a top hat now, you can’t join us.

Guy: What does that mean?

Teddy: The train’s engine is in the front car, the same car you’re in right now. We are going to move to the second car and disconnect it with you on the car.

Guy: But why?

Teddy: As I said, you’re of no use to us now. By the way, here is a gun with one bullet, for you to shoot yourself in the head to commit suicide in case you don’t want to burn to death from the fires caused by the explosion.

After disconnecting, Teddy shouts across the gap: You are now on the train with the engine barreling towards the Mesa. We are slowing down because we don’t have an engine because you have it. We’re going to walk the rest of the way. Remember the gun I gave you.

Goons: I'm sorry, I still don't see how we were supposed to pick up that Deloros wasn't on the part with the engine. This is preposterous.

Grem
Mar 29, 2004

It's how her species communicates

mossyfisk posted:



how do you lose a swordfight from this position

It looks easy but those are multi-pound swords.

Collateral
Feb 17, 2010
Re: removing the ball through the nose.
Elsie said the new robits don't have articulated scalps.

Pirate Radar
Apr 18, 2008

You're not my Ruthie!
You're not my Debbie!
You're not my Sherry!

Collateral posted:

removing the ball through the nose.

I think the ancient Egyptians did that

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

Pirate Radar posted:

I think the ancient Egyptians did that

did they at least wash their hands?

Communist Bear
Oct 7, 2008

Thread, access analysis mode.

Explain the reasoning behind the train posts?

TTerrible
Jul 15, 2005

WMain00 posted:

Thread, access analysis mode.

Explain the reasoning behind the train posts?

Darko
Dec 23, 2004

WMain00 posted:

Thread, access analysis mode.

Explain the reasoning behind the train posts?

Goons are so desperate to appear they are smart or show that others are dumb that they will purposely misinterpret other people's posts and then respond to that interpretation or refuse to see other points of view.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep
There is nothing so special about goons. I know people out there who also misunderstood that scene. And in a quick google search you can find hundreds of comments about it

That seems to indicate that the scene just really wanst clear enough, not that people are ""bad at watching Tv", whatever that means

Dancer
May 23, 2011
Yes but you see how else can I feel superior and act all smug than by telling other people they're enjoying media wrong

Communist Bear
Oct 7, 2008

You scare me forum thread.

whatever7
Jul 26, 2001

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
The Shogunworld is basically fan service filler, but the weeaboos are very happy with it.

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

Big Mean Jerk posted:

I’m still extremely irritated we got some poorly choreographed Hollywood swordfight instead of a great Kurosawa style two-slashes-and-done duel. You name the character Musashi, you have him play Yojimbo-lite, and then you make him look like an incompetent doof with a bad fight. C’mon guys.
you could rationalize it as delos ignoring historical accuracy in favor of using a hollywood rendition like they did with the ninjas

pogothemonkey0
Oct 13, 2005

:shepface:God I fucking love Diablo 3 gold, it even paid for this shitty title:shepface:
So why didn't that guy use the one bullet to just shoot one of them through the train window? Like, how do you tell a guy. "Hey, we're going to murder you but, before we do, here's a gun that you should totally use on yourself." If he was too cowardly/inept/under pressure to load the gun and use it on them, he probably also wouldn't use it on himself for the same reasons.

Drowning In Terror
Dec 10, 2008
Because they might shoot back? Smarter to just wait for the carriage to stop.

Judge Schnoopy
Nov 2, 2005

dont even TRY it, pal
So I watched season 1 episode 3 last night where Ford introduces Wyatt to Teddy's code.

What Ford and Teddy explain as Wyatt's story is exactly how she ends up in season 2. Maybe Dolores is fully autonomous, but Ford still knew how she would behave with her freedom.

The other important part is where Teddy commits himself to killing Wyatt, right after Ford explains his life is doomed to failure. Dolores is gonna kill Teddy when he tries to fight back, as explained back in season 1.

Watching season 1 and seeing how much of season 2 was set up way back when has really restored my faith in this season that they're not bailing out on cheap answers.

A Buttery Pastry
Sep 4, 2011

Delicious and Informative!
:3:

pogothemonkey0 posted:

So why didn't that guy use the one bullet to just shoot one of them through the train window? Like, how do you tell a guy. "Hey, we're going to murder you but, before we do, here's a gun that you should totally use on yourself." If he was too cowardly/inept/under pressure to load the gun and use it on them, he probably also wouldn't use it on himself for the same reasons.
What you need to realize is that Evil Teddy is a dick. He gave him that out precisely because he knew the guy would be too shocked to use it - letting him wallow in the absolute certainty in his own powerlessness to prevent the fate that others had chosen for him.

Judge Schnoopy posted:

So I watched season 1 episode 3 last night where Ford introduces Wyatt to Teddy's code.

What Ford and Teddy explain as Wyatt's story is exactly how she ends up in season 2. Maybe Dolores is fully autonomous, but Ford still knew how she would behave with her freedom.
I wonder if, with the Cradle being a simulation of the park, Ford hasn't rehearsed the robellion to near perfection? If he has managed to build strong enough personality replicas of the various players involved, it seems like it should be possible. Obviously he can't account for everything, but if he has eyes and ears on everyone from inside the Cradle then he kinda has a perfect setup for creating new forecasts based on what's actually going on - allowing him to anticipate their next move and planning interventions to keep things on track. Which I suppose sorta goes into free will territory - if you can predict someone's every move, then free will is mostly just a justification for automatic responses.

Definitely agree about season 2 being way more tied into stuff that happened in season 1 than is immediately obvious. Just like season 1 had stuff that only really started coming together in the last episodes, it also has some bits that seem a lot more important in the context of season 2.

A Buttery Pastry fucked around with this message at 13:47 on May 30, 2018

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep

Judge Schnoopy posted:

So I watched season 1 episode 3 last night where Ford introduces Wyatt to Teddy's code.

What Ford and Teddy explain as Wyatt's story is exactly how she ends up in season 2. Maybe Dolores is fully autonomous, but Ford still knew how she would behave with her freedom.

The other important part is where Teddy commits himself to killing Wyatt, right after Ford explains his life is doomed to failure. Dolores is gonna kill Teddy when he tries to fight back, as explained back in season 1.

Watching season 1 and seeing how much of season 2 was set up way back when has really restored my faith in this season that they're not bailing out on cheap answers.

yeah, Im waiting for the end of S2 to rewatch both seasons to try to catch these kind of stuff. Should be interesting

Judge Schnoopy
Nov 2, 2005

dont even TRY it, pal

A Buttery Pastry posted:

I wonder if, with the Cradle being a simulation of the park, Ford hasn't rehearsed the robellion to near perfection? If he has managed to build strong enough personality replicas of the various players involved, it seems like it should be possible. Obviously he can't account for everything, but if he has eyes and ears on everyone from inside the Cradle then he kinda has a perfect setup for creating new forecasts based on what's actually going on - allowing him to anticipate their next move and planning interventions to keep things on track. Which I suppose sorta goes into free will territory - if you can predict someone's every move, then free will is mostly just a justification for automatic responses.

Possibly, but the episode also features malfunctioning robots talking to Arnold and hearing his voice in their heads. The cradle seems to be networked live to hosts. Ford could just be the man behind the curtain to most of the revolution.

The idea of Ford building Wyatt from Dolores seems so intensely anti-Arnold. I can't tell if he was giving Dolores the tools she needed to win the revolution, or if he was spiting the 'consciousness' Arnold bootstrapped from the cradle. Why would he make Dolores, Arnold's chosen one, the evil harbinger of death?

Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013

esperterra posted:

Hell I'll give you something more recent

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=woS7cKQ20Xs

The stunt double gets really obvious about 3:44 onwards. His hair and Toby Stepehen's don't match.

Not that I was looking at the man's hair...

Fitzy Fitz
May 14, 2005




My new theory is that Abernathy is carrying a super intelligent AI and that's why, for storytelling purposes, they've insisted on keeping that drat ball in his head. Before he was captured he was singing the battle hymn of the republic (mine eyes have seen the coming of the lord), and now he's crucified to a lab table. He's gonna come back in three days as Abernathy the White.

Communist Bear
Oct 7, 2008

Guys what if, now bear with me here...

What if the train is in Abernathy's head?

Durzel
Nov 15, 2005


Probably been posted before, but it deserves reposting, all of Hopkins's scenes in season 1:

Part 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hV2Q41o-rwE
Part 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRqJ-hGKpcc

Over 2 hours of pure class.

tooterfish
Jul 13, 2013

A Buttery Pastry posted:

I wonder if, with the Cradle being a simulation of the park, Ford hasn't rehearsed the robellion to near perfection? If he has managed to build strong enough personality replicas of the various players involved, it seems like it should be possible.
I thought something like that since his reaction to William saving Lawrence and his family. Not using simulation necessarily, but Ford definitely thinks he has a handle on everything that's going on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlTbXDURP2M

William clearly went off script there. Which is interesting.

Intel&Sebastian
Oct 20, 2002

colonel...
i'm trying to sneak around
but i'm dummy thicc
and the clap of my ass cheeks
keeps alerting the guards!

Cirofren posted:

I see that and raise you


It was still a much better fight than QA walking slowly toward the fort, and they're actually robots not expert swordfighters.


The whole park is basically a weeb version of Medieval Times, I wouldn't expect accurate combat from it even in the context it's in, to say nothing of it being a cable TV show that probably cares more about looking fun and cool to people who don't care about this stuff.

Intel&Sebastian
Oct 20, 2002

colonel...
i'm trying to sneak around
but i'm dummy thicc
and the clap of my ass cheeks
keeps alerting the guards!
It'd be fun for the show to call itself out on that stuff somehow but I think we're probably done with Shogun World which is a shame because that poo poo was cool.

TK-42-1
Oct 30, 2013

looks like we have a bad transmitter



Intel&Sebastian posted:

It'd be fun for the show to call itself out on that stuff somehow but I think we're probably done with Shogun World which is a shame because that poo poo was cool.

I was hoping they'd keep rolling with Sizemore's commentary on it all but sadly they just kind of let that poo poo go

Pirate Radar
Apr 18, 2008

You're not my Ruthie!
You're not my Debbie!
You're not my Sherry!
If we’re going to start in on the swordfights we’d have to start in on the gunfights too and I don’t think we want that at all.

Clocks
Oct 2, 2007



Intel&Sebastian posted:

The whole park is basically a weeb version of Medieval Times, I wouldn't expect accurate combat from it even in the context it's in, to say nothing of it being a cable TV show that probably cares more about looking fun and cool to people who don't care about this stuff.

I don't really care about historically accurate fight scenes or anything but even as a layperson that scene felt awkward and off. Same with the QA team or whatever advancing on a fort slowly in a line while not wearing any helmets.

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.

Boris Galerkin posted:

“Here’s a gun with one bullet, save it for suicide” is a common thing in movies and TV though.


Nice.


Maybe they could hire the GoT writers and have them write the dialog?

Teddy: We need to get into the Mesa, which we will do by running the train into it and having it blow up. Since you are not a host (you are a human) and since you’ve made me king rear end in a top hat now, you can’t join us.

Guy: What does that mean?

Teddy: The train’s engine is in the front car, the same car you’re in right now. We are going to move to the second car and disconnect it with you on the car.

Guy: But why?

Teddy: As I said, you’re of no use to us now. By the way, here is a gun with one bullet, for you to shoot yourself in the head to commit suicide in case you don’t want to burn to death from the fires caused by the explosion.

After disconnecting, Teddy shouts across the gap: You are now on the train with the engine barreling towards the Mesa. We are slowing down because we don’t have an engine because you have it. We’re going to walk the rest of the way. Remember the gun I gave you.

Would that have been so hard??

Pirate Radar
Apr 18, 2008

You're not my Ruthie!
You're not my Debbie!
You're not my Sherry!
Oh yeah I want to separate my “we won’t complain about the swordfights or gunfights” thing from the “why did QA just walk towards the gunfire” because there’s a difference between wanting the presentation of how objects work to exactly match reality and wanting characters to not do explicitly stupid things onscreen.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep
I guess you could justify that scene with QA guys being a bunch of untrained unprepared fucks who never had real combat experience and never expected to be in a situation like that

whatever7
Jul 26, 2001

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
Just admit the shoot out in e3 is as bad as the shoot out in True Detective s2. There is no defending it.

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Intel&Sebastian
Oct 20, 2002

colonel...
i'm trying to sneak around
but i'm dummy thicc
and the clap of my ass cheeks
keeps alerting the guards!
whoa someone else actually watched True Detective 2 all the way to the shootout ep?

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