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Astroman posted:Part of me wonders if AD might not be a victim of it's own success: when it came out it was a new level of smarter comedy on tv, there was nothing like it. In the past 15 years more shows emulate it, and even drama tv has become smarter and more serial. Even if AD didn't actually get worse it could seem quaint by comparison. The new seasons really don't feel like AD though. I think A LOT of it comes from not being able to get the cast together. The formula often involved Lucille or George setting off their kids plotting against each other. I think when someone doesn't get a ton of screen time or spends all their screen time with outside players, it indicates a scheduling issue. How many episodes in these seasons had Lucille talking to her kids?
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Jun 3, 2018 17:02
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PostNouveau posted:The new seasons really don't feel like AD though. I think A LOT of it comes from not being able to get the cast together. The formula often involved Lucille or George setting off their kids plotting against each other. I think when someone doesn't get a ton of screen time or spends all their screen time with outside players, it indicates a scheduling issue. How many episodes in these seasons had Lucille talking to her kids? I would say that season 4 didn't feel like AD, but only through the limitations they had to work with. But the creators still knew what made AD good and tried to find a creative way to achieve that with what little they had to work with (YMMV on whether or not they succeeded). Season 5 just feels like they've forgotten what made the show work in the first place.
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Jun 3, 2018 17:32
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Season four was funny, and it made up for not feeling like the original show in being ambitious.
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Jun 3, 2018 17:36
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Data Graham posted:Seriously? It only works if you pronounce DA as "dah", which nobody in real life would. Nor would they tack it on to her name like that. Who refers to their local DA as "Joe Schmoe Dah"? https://www.amazon.com/My-Name-Not-Bob-Loblaw/dp/0879490713/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1528044437&sr=1-1&keywords=john+velchak
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Jun 3, 2018 17:47
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Nichael posted:I don't even know if Tambor is a sexmonster, but just about all of the male cast, certainly including Tambor, are giant assholes. I read all of that, including the follow up piece about Jason Bateman and Tony Hale getting poo poo on Twitter and apologizing. I'm glad for that follow up because I didn't see the problem. Tambor sounds like a dick, but I'm not sure what you're expecting of the others, especially in a group setting. Shawkat is to be commended for being correct and a bit brave with it, but that's as far as I can take it. Hashtag me too needed to happen, but things like taking that interview and lambasting five humans with it undermine the movement's credibility.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:09
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Propaganda Machine posted:I read all of that, including the follow up piece about Jason Bateman and Tony Hale getting poo poo on Twitter and apologizing. I'm glad for that follow up because I didn't see the problem. Tambor sounds like a dick, but I'm not sure what you're expecting of the others, especially in a group setting. Shawkat is to be commended for being correct and a bit brave with it, but that's as far as I can take it. Maybe we were expecting the others not to trip over their own dicks to support Tambor, while simultaneousy dismissing the woman he admitted to verbally abusing, who is sitting in front of them crying? Radical idea, I know. E: also anyone who read Bateman's half-assed apology, or the interview where David Cross basically used whataboutism as a defense, and thinks that these guys have "learned" anything from this is deluding themselves.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:16
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Eh I thought Bateman's apology was fine. Cross can suck one though. Arnett didn't do anything wrong.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:26
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Sydney Bottocks posted:Maybe we were expecting the others not to trip over their own dicks to support Tambor, while simultaneousy dismissing the woman he admitted to verbally abusing, who is sitting in front of them crying? Radical idea, I know. Or they're good actors and thus empathetic and Tambor was sat there too? I'm happy to chalk that up to awkwardness.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:35
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Bateman's apology seemed fine to me, too. The interview was a loving bad look for most people involved, but I don't think it's worth villifying everyone over. Promo interviews are probably stressful/awkward enough without having to answer questions about Tambor's recent accusations, and it just went south real drat fast. I feel terrible for Jessica Walter, though. It was wrong of Bateman to keep talking over her like that and handwaving it as actors and acting being an atypical job, but I kind of feel like his heart was in the right place in trying to explain why poo poo like Tambor having a yelling fit happens on sets. He just ended up painting it in a very handwaving light and like it didn't matter it happened to Walter b/c it happens to all sorts of actors and actresses on set. He seems to have recognized this in his apology, and I'm fine with that. David Cross we already know is an rear end in a top hat tho so gently caress him lmao
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Jun 3, 2018 19:37
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Propaganda Machine posted:Or they're good actors and thus empathetic and Tambor was sat there too? I'm happy to chalk that up to awkwardness. So it's OK they were eagerly empathetic to Tambor, but not to Walter? E: esperterra posted:Bateman's apology seemed fine to me, too. To me Bateman's apology smacked of "oh poo poo" and damage control. Maybe he was sincere about it, I'm not a mind reader, but after that interview I'm not really willing to give him or any of the others present the benefit of the doubt (especially Cross, who as you say we already know is a smug prick). As to the interview being "awkward" or whatever, the correct response would have been for the others to remain neutral, offer statements saying they felt it was an issue between Walter and Tambor, and let them work it out, and say that they love and support them both. By all but telling Walter to shut the gently caress up, they basically made it quite clear that they were going to take Tambor's side no matter what, and that they didn't give two shits whether Walter (or Shawkat, the only other woman present) liked it or not. That's a bit different than them just offering awkward answers to a difficult question. Sydney Bottocks fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Jun 3, 2018 |
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Jun 3, 2018 19:38
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Awkward situations rarely go well. And I can attest that being on set is stressful and can easily get heated without everybody concentrating on good behavior so for better or worse I agree with the argument. It's very similar to working in a kitchen that way, and it's not like girls shy away from that job for being bad cooks.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:44
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Propaganda Machine posted:Awkward situations rarely go well. And I can attest that being on set is stressful and can easily get heated without everybody concentrating on good behavior so for better or worse I agree with the argument. It's very similar to working in a kitchen that way, and it's not like girls shy away from that job for being bad cooks. See my reply just above yours. You may be willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. I am not.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:48
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Sydney Bottocks posted:As to the interview being "awkward" or whatever, the correct response would have been for the others to remain neutral, offer statements saying they felt it was an issue between Walter and Tambor, and let them work it out, and say that they love and support them both. By all but telling Walter to shut the gently caress up, they basically made it quite clear that they were going to take Tambor's side no matter what, and that they didn't give two shits whether Walter (or Shawkat, the only other woman present) liked it or not. That's a bit different than them just offering awkward answers to a difficult question. You're right, the correct response would have been to remain neutral, let Walter say her piece, and move on from the question entirely. But unfortunately they weren't blessed with the hindsight of how much of a mess this would end up being. Humans make mistakes, especially in stressful situations like a promo tour. Now, I'm not saying you're wrong to be wary about the cast after that or to not forgive them for bungling the whole interview like that. But for me, personally, Bateman at least handled it very well afterward. His apology seemed sincere and his lack of making it a proper twitter thread made me think he may have actually written and posted it himself, rather than handing it off to his PR dude. It seemed sincere and in general he seems like a nice dude. I'm fine believing he just made a hugely dumb mistake in how he handled the question in the moment.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:53
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The response from Bateman and the others seemed more to me that there’s another side to the situation that isn’t public knowledge other than the internet pretending it’s “mansplainjng”
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Jun 3, 2018 19:55
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Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)?
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Jun 3, 2018 20:02
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Also, it's hard to nail a friend to the wall, even if you know they've behaved badly on another set, or had a bad moment on the set/workplace you shared with them. Talking over Walter was bad and dumb, but did anyone really expect the cast to start in about how much of a piece of poo poo Tambor is, a man they've called friend and worked with for so many years now? It's tough to face bad deeds at times, especially when those bad deeds come in the form of someone you love and respect. Like, had Bateman et al not talked over Walter and given us this horribly awkward and bad situation, would we then be discussing how they're all horrible people for not crucifying Tambor during the interview? Seemed to me like Tambor had apologized back when it happened. Walter seemed upset Tambor had even mentioned the incident in another interview because for all we know it was behind them, and his bringing it up elsewhere opened old wounds. There's just too much we don't know. I'll take Bateman's apology and accept it and be fine with it, myself. Cross I'm less likely to forgive, we've heard too much of him being a dick in recent times anyway.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:02
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punk rebel ecks posted:Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)? Will & Grace.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:02
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Empress Brosephine posted:The response from Bateman and the others seemed more to me that there’s another side to the situation that isn’t public knowledge other than the internet pretending it’s “mansplainjng” "pretending" Jason Bateman literally told a woman who's been acting before he was born how Hollywood works. That's perfectly fine and not at all a textbook example of mansplaining. Sydney Bottocks fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Jun 3, 2018 |
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Jun 3, 2018 20:05
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punk rebel ecks posted:Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)? Arguably Twin Peaks.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:09
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punk rebel ecks posted:Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)?
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Jun 3, 2018 20:10
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New Twin Peaks is amazing, but it's also a very diff beast from the original series.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:11
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Steve2911 posted:I've only heard good things about the new Twin Peaks (which I haven't seen yet, but the original run was only 50% good anyway). Even though I was around for its' initial run, I had never actually gotten around to watching Twin Peaks all the way through, so I sat down and watched the first two seasons last year (I still need to watch the newest season, life got in the way of me getting around to that). The first season was amazing and made me an instant fan. The second season was just a complete chore to get through, I nearly gave up on it at several points.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:14
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esperterra posted:New Twin Peaks is amazing, but it's also a very diff beast from the original series. Yeah, Twin Peaks The Return is like a landmark TV show for me, but it's not quite the same thing. Then again it wouldn't have been nearly as impactful without the original show, so I would say it counts.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:16
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Hakkesshu posted:Yeah, Twin Peaks The Return is like a landmark TV show for me, but it's not quite the same thing. Then again it wouldn't have been nearly as impactful without the original show, so I would say it counts. Oh, for sure. I would have answered the intial question with Twin Peaks if not for it feeling so different. But it absolutely does not work without the original seasons and FWWM, so it counts in its own way. But as for shows returning successfully with more or less the same tone/formula I'd pick Will & Grace over it. Gilmore Girls was also good imo for that kind of return.
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Jun 3, 2018 20:17
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punk rebel ecks posted:Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)? 
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Jun 3, 2018 20:55
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I don't think sequel series count, that's a different thing completely.
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Jun 3, 2018 21:08
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punk rebel ecks posted:Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)? Doctor Who
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Jun 3, 2018 21:08
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Cobra Kai is pretty fuckin legit. If that counts
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Jun 3, 2018 21:12
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punk rebel ecks posted:Has there ever been a series that was canceled but then resurrected years later and was just as good as the initial season(s)? MST3K
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Jun 3, 2018 21:23
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The rebooted season of Beavis and Butt-Head is probably the gold standard for revivals tbh. As far as keeping the original spirit of the show goes anyway
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Jun 3, 2018 21:28
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Escobarbarian posted:The rebooted season of Beavis and Butt-Head is probably the gold standard for revivals tbh. As far as keeping the original spirit of the show goes anyway Well except that they couldn’t do the music video commentary interstitial stuff the same way, and that was arguably the lifeblood of the show.
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Jun 3, 2018 21:30
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Davros1 posted:Doctor Who  Art is subjective and all, but couldn't disagree more. I can rewatch classic DW all day long. NuWho has had some good episodes here and there but overall it just leaves me cold. Escobarbarian posted:The rebooted season of Beavis and Butt-Head is probably the gold standard for revivals tbh. As far as keeping the original spirit of the show goes anyway This is very correct, however. It's a pity that MTV literally had no idea or interest in trying to market it or keep it around, since they're just a terrible reality show network these days.
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Jun 3, 2018 21:31
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Hey have we talked about how bad that whole old-timey silent film bit in 508 is yet? gently caress it’s so bad
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Jun 3, 2018 21:39
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Escobarbarian posted:Hey have we talked about how bad that whole old-timey silent film bit in 508 is yet? gently caress it’s so bad gently caress I forgot about that. Why did they do that?
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Jun 3, 2018 21:44
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It's because the joke relied on the Keystone Cops which was a silent film era thing. I didn't much care for it and was surprised to see it earn a ton of praise in this thread earlier. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keystone_Cops EDIT: Oh, I have a feeling that they're setting up Sally Sitwell to be the real murderer. She was in bed with Tony Wonder who recently bit the dust and was connected to Lucille 2 through election stuff. Maybe it was about financing the competition. Superrodan fucked around with this message at 21:52 on Jun 3, 2018 |
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Jun 3, 2018 21:48
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There’s a small part of me that hopes that the second half of this season will make the first half retroactively seem much better. My reaction to it right now is how I probably would have reacted had they split Season 4 in half. Maybe it just needs the punchlines to complete the setups? Or maybe it’s just time to spin it off into “Maeby” and retire the old bear.
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Jun 3, 2018 21:54
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Any Maeby spinoff should be called Maeby Fünke.
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Jun 3, 2018 22:09
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TealShark posted:There’s a small part of me that hopes that the second half of this season will make the first half retroactively seem much better. My reaction to it right now is how I probably would have reacted had they split Season 4 in half. Maybe it just needs the punchlines to complete the setups? I didn't even know we were calling it "old bear."
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Jun 3, 2018 22:19
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Finished the season this morning rning and I hope they realize the magic is over and end it after the next 8 episodes. Maebe can get a spin-off show where she scams people with George Michael as a do-gooder who wants to help his cousin and ends up an unwitting accomplice. I'd watch that.
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Jun 3, 2018 22:34
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axeil posted:Maebe can get a spin-off show where she scams people with George Michael as a do-gooder who wants to help his cousin and ends up an unwitting accomplice. I'd watch that. clown shoes posted:Any Maeby spinoff should be called
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Jun 3, 2018 22:36
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