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Kim Justice
Jan 29, 2007

Lightning Knight posted:

“Niche” here meaning “is aimed at Star Wars nerds.” Not “people who like Star Wars.” I would argue spending 300 million dollars on a film about Han Solo is a dumb idea on its face anyway since it manifestly shows one doesn’t understand why people liked Han Solo in the first place, especially since they decided to make it in a world where he couldn’t actually be played by Harrison Ford.

He also brings up the “why wasn’t this movie just about Lando?” question which I agree with.

It's just clearly so far from right as a conclusion though. The budget is enough to make it one of the most expensive films ever made, they released it on Memorial Day Weekend...like, clearly Disney wanted it to be more of a summer blockbuster that everyone was going to like as opposed to something purely for the Star Wars fans - because as you say, that's really really REALLY dumb. I'd also argue that if it was going to be some sort of niche thing they might have stuck with the original pair who were going to direct it and apparently were going to make it some sort of comedy, rather than Ron Howard who is the definition of a safe pair of hands.

Also I'd probably disagree with MovieBob or at least desperately want to even if he said that the sky was blue

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DoubleCakes
Jan 14, 2015

It's lit time!

https://twitter.com/PBSDS/status/1003686570946449408?s=20

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


that's easy in the case of the giver: yes.

the biggest question solo raises is how does emilia clarke keep getting work.

Lightning Knight
Feb 24, 2012

Pray for Answer

Kim Justice posted:

Also I'd probably disagree with MovieBob or at least desperately want to even if he said that the sky was blue

These (the longer part I cut for space) are things Bob talks about. He’s basically saying they hosed up but that it doesn’t really matter because it’s still Star Wars and they’ll keep making them, but that reading into it that Solo didn’t do well because of TLJ’s politics is dumb. You don’t have to like him but I don’t think he’s wrong here (though his video is overwrought and overwritten as is usual).

Kim Justice
Jan 29, 2007

Lightning Knight posted:

These (the longer part I cut for space) are things Bob talks about. He’s basically saying they hosed up but that it doesn’t really matter because it’s still Star Wars and they’ll keep making them, but that reading into it that Solo didn’t do well because of TLJ politics is dumb. You don’t have to like him but I don’t think he’s wrong here (though his video is overwrought and overwritten as is usual).

Yeah I don't think he's wrong about that. As I say, I think Disney are making too many Star Wars movies and diluting the franchise.

Hel
Oct 9, 2012

Jokatgulm is tedium.
Jokatgulm is pain.
Jokatgulm is suffering.

khwarezm posted:

Grey Goo, Halo Wars 2, Starcraft 2 and Homeworld Deserts of Kharak are recent and put a lot of emphasis on their campaigns (but all of them had a lot of problems with them at the same time). In addition all of the recent AoE2 expansions have tons of extra missions and even stuff like Dawn of War 3, for all of its issues, has a campaign. I think the problem with modern RTS games has little to do with too much emphasis on Multiplayer but that's a commonly hit upon reason for people who just want to chill with giant armies, the issues as I see it is that the whole genre has kind of hit a cul-de-sac where it's not clear what real innovation can happen mechanically, and as a result titles like DOW turn into this unholy amalgamation of RTS and MOBA games that satisfies nobody, or else, in an effort to make them less micromanagement focused, the games become so streamlined and automated that player input becomes almost pointless. RTS games were never incredibly popular but they've especially had their lunch eaten in recent years by MOBA titles and the whole genre absolutely does not work in the console realm despite repeated efforts which is really hobbles them, meanwhile it harder to make the games with current current graphical standards while also having the amount of content they had in the past, which is something I always see criticized about newer RTS games.

Finally, from my experience, it seems like old school fans just tend to stick with the old classics rather than move on to later titles, probably because of the aforementioned issues. I play lots of AoE2 and it's endlessly fascinating how that game still has a very healthy playerbase after almost 20 years, so healthy that active development has started for it again and tons of new content has been added since it went on steam which I've never seen before, but then you look at the later titles in the Age Of series and the playerbase drops off dramatically, which is a shame since I actually really like Age of Mythology.

I'll look into those.
MP focused doesn't just mean no or bad SP campaigns , it also means stuff like balance patches to make things fair for VS but removes fun/interesting things from the singleplayer modes.

It's funny you bring up both innovation and lack of fan base for post AoE2, because as I recall a lot of fans really disliked AoE3 because it was too different and the same could probably be said for the AoMythology as well. Rise of Nations was called the "real AoE3" because it was less innovative/different than the games people liked. And while I do agree that stagnation might be bad, it feels like games have a higher spoken burden placed on them to be innovative than other media, at least until GoTY list where most games have no stuff young than the 90's/00's.
You can just tell good stories with games, they don't have to revolutionize the media to be worth anything. How many of the books and films actually bring something really new that changes the medium?

DEEP STATE PLOT
Aug 13, 2008

Yes...Ha ha ha...YES!



khwarezm posted:

The trouble with this is that the idea that recent RTS games don't put a lot of time and effort into their single player is really not true at all, most of the ones released in the last five or so years have extensive single player components like campaigns or skirmishes. I think the genre has always just been niche and hard to do properly and now it gets crowded out since there's so much else out there.

on the one hand yeah, on the other this isn't always a good thing. starcraft 2's solo campaign was some kind of nonsense, like in a vacuum it woulda kinda ruled because it was so insane and stupid but starcraft 1 had a much more serious tone to it that sc2 just shits all over. it's also hard to tell how much of sc2's story being hilarious was intentional and how much was them trying and failing to be serious and profound. that whole thing was some indigo prophecy poo poo.

DoubleCakes
Jan 14, 2015

Natalie also released a Twitter thread clarifying some things on her Tiffany Tumbles video:

https://twitter.com/ContraPoints/status/1003696329783115776?s=20

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


even though a lot of people don't play vs people online multiplayer is what gives rts games legs. tooth and tail had an interesting control scheme and a full campaign but i bet it not doing well was due to the multiplayer being bad.

DEEP STATE PLOT
Aug 13, 2008

Yes...Ha ha ha...YES!



back in my day, lan parties gave rts games legs.

...gently caress i just realized how much i missed those even with the headache of setting it all up.

Jonas Albrecht
Jun 7, 2012


Arcsquad12 posted:

I'm not going to link it because gently caress MovieBob but he's got a video out on Solo's box office performance which seems less like he wants to talk about Solo than he does to bitch about millennials.

I appreciated the obvious dig at Jeremy Jahns, but lol at MovieBob for being a guy born in 1982 and really digging into GenXer as an identity.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?

Jonas Albrecht posted:

I appreciated the obvious dig at Jeremy Jahns, but lol at MovieBob for being a guy born in 1982 and really digging into GenXer as an identity.

Except that apart from the editing, Jeremy is actually not terrible. He's pretty fun most of the time.

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

Hel posted:

I'll look into those.
MP focused doesn't just mean no or bad SP campaigns , it also means stuff like balance patches to make things fair for VS but removes fun/interesting things from the singleplayer modes.

When you mention this, what kind of thing are you thinking about exactly? Because I'm not sure if I've played many RTS games where I feel like multiplayer balance deprived me in the singleplayer.

E; I guess DoW3 actually.

quote:

It's funny you bring up both innovation and lack of fan base for post AoE2, because as I recall a lot of fans really disliked AoE3 because it was too different and the same could probably be said for the AoMythology as well. Rise of Nations was called the "real AoE3" because it was less innovative/different than the games people liked. And while I do agree that stagnation might be bad, it feels like games have a higher spoken burden placed on them to be innovative than other media, at least until GoTY list where most games have no stuff young than the 90's/00's.
You can just tell good stories with games, they don't have to revolutionize the media to be worth anything. How many of the books and films actually bring something really new that changes the medium?

Well AoE3 and AoM are interesting since they took the campaigns much, much more seriously than you saw in the first two games, the objectives were far more complex, the AI was better, they had a much more coherent story with real characterization and there were lots of gameplay elements like units and scripted events that did not exist at all in the multiplayer or skirmishing setting, which didn't happen much in AoE2. They have a lot streamlining to make things more approachable, for example in both games you don't need to reseed farms, you can trade with yourself for infinite gold and in AoE3 (and for one of the civs in AoM) they got rid of drop points when villagers are gathering resources so you can leave them to work without any of the oversight demanded in previous games, but ironically I think stuff like that made them actually less engaging than previous games. It's why I find it interesting how people, myself included, tend to always go back to AoE2 and it might the genre's big issue that people gravitate towards the original classics and mechanics and as such there isn't much compelling them to get the new hotness. Like there's an AoE4 coming out but does anyone really need it? Online I commonly see people say 'make it as much like AoE2 as possible and it'll be good' which begs the question whats even the point.

DEEP STATE PLOT posted:

on the one hand yeah, on the other this isn't always a good thing. starcraft 2's solo campaign was some kind of nonsense, like in a vacuum it woulda kinda ruled because it was so insane and stupid but starcraft 1 had a much more serious tone to it that sc2 just shits all over. it's also hard to tell how much of sc2's story being hilarious was intentional and how much was them trying and failing to be serious and profound. that whole thing was some indigo prophecy poo poo.

Very true, but there was certainly a lot of time and effort put into it at least.

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005


The Star Wars side story movies really seem like they're leaning hard on the fanservice to appeal to traditional fans, to the detriment of anything resembling storytelling. Like, obviously you could slap a Star Wars logo on footage of a tree in a field and it'll get a shitload of butts in seats, but I think the lack of any real development in the stories hurts them in ways that don't affect the sequels, which at least have dynamics. It's an especially odd decision, since character development is about the only thing you could have some control over in these, since everything else is set in stone by necessity.

Though IMO it would be pretty funny to have like Solo be secretly an AU where he dies at the end.

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

Puppy Time posted:

The Star Wars side story movies really seem like they're leaning hard on the fanservice to appeal to traditional fans

It's weird to see this being said after TLJ was so divisive.

Like they clearly didn't lean that hard on fanservice for that film, if they had, it probably wouldn't have been such a giant shitshow of reactions.

Lightning Knight
Feb 24, 2012

Pray for Answer

Puppy Time posted:

Though IMO it would be pretty funny to have like Solo be secretly an AU where he dies at the end.

I wish more stories would do this. One of the reasons I really enjoyed Inglorious Basterds the first time even though it’s one of Tarantino’s films I like the least is because I was convinced the main characters were doomed to failure because history and then they... weren’t. And it was amazing. :allears:

Hel
Oct 9, 2012

Jokatgulm is tedium.
Jokatgulm is pain.
Jokatgulm is suffering.

khwarezm posted:

When you mention this, what kind of thing are you thinking about exactly? Because I'm not sure if I've played many RTS games where I feel like multiplayer balance deprived me in the singleplayer.

E; I guess DoW3 actually.

I don't remember exact RTS examples but generally it's stuff that by changing prereqs or cost of things they are no longer possible to do at a time where they might actually work, because they weren't necessarily the best way but they were fun.
One non-RTS example from Diablo 2 though is that around patch 1.08 or 1.09 they reduced the necromancers max amount of minions from 61 to like 15 because it worked better with the way people played multiplayer. this killed a big part of the fun for me with that class.

Fake Edit: I think C&C General did something like quadruple the build time of tunnel networks, which stopped you from doing fun hit and run stuff or emergency evacuations.

khwarezm posted:

Like there's an AoE4 coming out but does anyone really need it? Online I commonly see people say 'make it as much like AoE2 as possible and it'll be good' which begs the question whats even the point.

I mean isn't the AoE2 HD expansions functionally AoE 4? they just don't use the name but after all these years I feel like it's not the same work as the original AoE2. Do you feel the same thing about books or movies? What's wrong with actually just wanting more of the same thing? Do you feel the same about other media? Should the author of a book overhaul their vocabulary and voice when they make a sequel?
Sure sequels don't have to be exactly the same and stagnation can be pretty bad but on the flipside I think that if you aren't going to do something similar, why even use the same name? A name tells people to expect certain things because it has connotations, that's what brands are.

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

DEEP STATE PLOT posted:

back in my day, lan parties gave rts games legs.

...gently caress i just realized how much i missed those even with the headache of setting it all up.

me and my dingus friends thought our RTS lan parties were like, the loving Matrix level future. We were dumb nerd kids who thought the fact that we could do RISK but ON THE COMPUTER with UNITS and BUILDINGS was absolute madness. That chunk of internet history was a weird but kinda beautiful time where we had a lot of wonder at what was happening. Obviously there's tons to be amazed about now and God help me I'd never trade my crappy wi-fi for the old dialup days or whatever but it is insane to think how rapidly the shift from 'my university has a computer, it takes up a room and you need five boxes of punch cards to do one thing (no poo poo my boyfriend's mom took that class, she worked with punchcards and all and thought she was getting ready for the fuckin space age)' to 'now we can have computers...IN OUR HOUSE...Look I can download a picture that some dude in China put up holy poo poo' to 'I carry a computer in my pocket and yell at it when it takes ten seconds to show me the hellsite I go to get called a human being on'.

Max Wilco
Jan 23, 2012

I'm just trying to go through life without looking stupid.

It's not working out too well...

Kim Justice posted:

People seem so eager to make up all these bullshit reasons as to why the new Star Wars movie didn't well, when it's kinda obvious that Disney are crapping out way too freaking many Star Wars movies. There's one every year, all these sub-movies, a Boba Fett one soon that's probably going to tank as well...there's too many of them. I never thought I would see a time when a freaking Star Wars film would be just another movie. Even in the prequel years, a new Star Wars film was still an event. Disney are focusing on quantity, not quality, pumping out bang average films and audiences are getting sick of it.

I was thinking about that the other day. Both the original and prequel trilogy has a gap of three years between each film (1977, 1980, 1983) (1999, 2002, 2005). Now there's been a Star Wars film every year since 2015. It gets exhausting.

Hel
Oct 9, 2012

Jokatgulm is tedium.
Jokatgulm is pain.
Jokatgulm is suffering.

sexpig by night posted:

me and my dingus friends thought our RTS lan parties were like, the loving Matrix level future. We were dumb nerd kids who thought the fact that we could do RISK but ON THE COMPUTER with UNITS and BUILDINGS was absolute madness. That chunk of internet history was a weird but kinda beautiful time where we had a lot of wonder at what was happening. Obviously there's tons to be amazed about now and God help me I'd never trade my crappy wi-fi for the old dialup days or whatever but it is insane to think how rapidly the shift from 'my university has a computer, it takes up a room and you need five boxes of punch cards to do one thing (no poo poo my boyfriend's mom took that class, she worked with punchcards and all and thought she was getting ready for the fuckin space age)' to 'now we can have computers...IN OUR HOUSE...Look I can download a picture that some dude in China put up holy poo poo' to 'I carry a computer in my pocket and yell at it when it takes ten seconds to show me the hellsite I go to get called a human being on'.

The march of technology is pretty weird, my parents summer cottage in the woods doesn't have year-round water but this summer they are getting a 100/100 fibre connection because mobile internet just isn't enough for them. It's OK to have to go to the outhouse in the middle of the night, just as long as you have unlimited high speed internet.

stillvisions
Oct 15, 2014

I really should have come up with something better before spending five bucks on this.

CYBEReris posted:

Ultimately who's more of a weirdo, the weirdo or the person incessantly prodding and stalking the weirdo?

Back in the day I had to deal with fallout from the ljdrama going after a person because it intersected with events I was staffing; she was legitimately stalking some D-list celebrity, but in turn they were stalking her, posting photos of her house, calling social services, and trying to get her banned from the local conventions and events by inventing people and incidents. Turns out at the same time the person leading this charge was herself an ljdrama subject for impersonating celebrities online within the same fandom and sending bogus takedown notices to people for fanfiction she didn't approve of. It was obsessive stalker turtles all the way down.

DoubleCakes posted:

Really sucks that Nick is/was at a loss for inspiration. Really crunchy post-horror like Marble Hornets and Unedited Footage are rare and if that's the thing that Nick needs to really get his passion burning then its plain as day why he's frustrated. Unfortunately it's because content of that quality and complexity are so scarce that Night Mind's livelihood is vulnerable. I almost wonder if in the future Night Mind will have to focus on more traditional horror moreso than it does now.

He's hit the problem that plagues a lot of content creators - he got where he was by mining the good stuff and now that he's got a following, he needs to dig deeper. Unlike a lot of creators he hasn't picked a particularly deep well to drink from. I hope he finds his swagger again; I also feel like he probably needs to start working his review muscles a bit more. He's got obsessive detail down, but I feel he could beef up on more classical review skills to get more to work with.

This also feels like a bit of a cautionary tale of "job versus passion", and the pitfalls if you can only do the former if it's also the latter.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

WampaLord posted:

It's weird to see this being said after TLJ was so divisive.

Like they clearly didn't lean that hard on fanservice for that film, if they had, it probably wouldn't have been such a giant shitshow of reactions.

They leaned pretty hard on fan service there to, they just got obsessed with being subversive..

Not for any real reason or for any real point p, just subversive for subversive sake

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005


WampaLord posted:

It's weird to see this being said after TLJ was so divisive.

Like they clearly didn't lean that hard on fanservice for that film, if they had, it probably wouldn't have been such a giant shitshow of reactions.

I said side stories, bro. As opposed to the main story stuff like TFA and TLJ.

rvm
May 6, 2013

WampaLord posted:

It's weird to see this being said after TLJ was so divisive.

Like they clearly didn't lean that hard on fanservice for that film, if they had, it probably wouldn't have been such a giant shitshow of reactions.

Subversion, for the most part, relies on audience's familiarity with whatever it is being subverted.

TLJ is mildly subversive, but it still operates within a box of toys like 'non-threatening nazis', 'US marine rebels', etc. Its subversiveness pretty much only gets in the way of pulpy fun without making the movie any more profound.

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

Puppy Time posted:

I said side stories, bro. As opposed to the main story stuff like TFA and TLJ.

Totally missed that, apologies. And you're 100% right, the side stories have definitely leaned into the fanservice hardcore.

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

Hel posted:

The march of technology is pretty weird, my parents summer cottage in the woods doesn't have year-round water but this summer they are getting a 100/100 fibre connection because mobile internet just isn't enough for them. It's OK to have to go to the outhouse in the middle of the night, just as long as you have unlimited high speed internet.

same, tbh. I'll poo poo in a hole but I'll be goddamned if I'll tolerate slow posting.

stillvisions
Oct 15, 2014

I really should have come up with something better before spending five bucks on this.

sexpig by night posted:

me and my dingus friends thought our RTS lan parties were like, the loving Matrix level future. We were dumb nerd kids who thought the fact that we could do RISK but ON THE COMPUTER with UNITS and BUILDINGS was absolute madness. That chunk of internet history was a weird but kinda beautiful time where we had a lot of wonder at what was happening. Obviously there's tons to be amazed about now and God help me I'd never trade my crappy wi-fi for the old dialup days or whatever but it is insane to think how rapidly the shift from 'my university has a computer, it takes up a room and you need five boxes of punch cards to do one thing (no poo poo my boyfriend's mom took that class, she worked with punchcards and all and thought she was getting ready for the fuckin space age)' to 'now we can have computers...IN OUR HOUSE...Look I can download a picture that some dude in China put up holy poo poo' to 'I carry a computer in my pocket and yell at it when it takes ten seconds to show me the hellsite I go to get called a human being on'.

As a child one of my earliest memories of experiencing technology culture shock was my grade school teacher telling me not to type my rough drafts out because I'd have to retype the entire thing after she made spelling corrections; the concept of editing a document was completely alien to her and it was up to me as a know-it-all eight year old having to explain to her I could just fix the word and reprint the entire thing.

Starting with that, going over to a modem and BBS stuff, it's an amazing shift that just a few decades later I can be screamed at by 14-year-olds for not furthering their dreams of being a star Overwatch player by ruining their ranking.

Max Wilco
Jan 23, 2012

I'm just trying to go through life without looking stupid.

It's not working out too well...

Ema Nymton posted:

This weekend I watched some reviews by Bobsheaux having not really heard of him before. I liked some of his reviews but I can't seem to get beyond his... cringe factor. He seems arrogant, does the "angrily screaming at movie" thing a lot, and integrates his furry lifestyle into his videos. I do not need commentary from his furry bird girlfriend's fursona nor references to yiffing nor cutaway gags to furry art.

Am I being a kink-shaming bitch to feel this way?

I'm watching one of his videos now. He reminds me of the Blockbuster Buster, but maybe that's not a fair assessment.

Funniest thing I've seen in it so far is that at the 11 minute mark, he's talking over a clip from the movie, and a little ticker scrolls along the bottom advertising his Zazzle store.

Terrible Opinions
Oct 18, 2013



stillvisions posted:

He's hit the problem that plagues a lot of content creators - he got where he was by mining the good stuff and now that he's got a following, he needs to dig deeper. Unlike a lot of creators he hasn't picked a particularly deep well to drink from. I hope he finds his swagger again; I also feel like he probably needs to start working his review muscles a bit more. He's got obsessive detail down, but I feel he could beef up on more classical review skills to get more to work with.

This also feels like a bit of a cautionary tale of "job versus passion", and the pitfalls if you can only do the former if it's also the latter.
I hope he starts leaning more into written fiction and movies if only to give himself some variety to avoid similar burnout in the future.

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

Hel posted:


I mean isn't the AoE2 HD expansions functionally AoE 4? they just don't use the name but after all these years I feel like it's not the same work as the original AoE2. Do you feel the same thing about books or movies? What's wrong with actually just wanting more of the same thing? Do you feel the same about other media? Should the author of a book overhaul their vocabulary and voice when they make a sequel?
Sure sequels don't have to be exactly the same and stagnation can be pretty bad but on the flipside I think that if you aren't going to do something similar, why even use the same name? A name tells people to expect certain things because it has connotations, that's what brands are.

They aren't, the HD version of the game has exactly the same mechanics as it was back in 1999 and the expansions only add some more civilizations and campaigns, all of which hew closely to what we saw in the base game and don't overhaul the game in terms of mechanics or visuals, like we're talking about things like a Malian civilization where the infantry are more resistant to arrows and you get a free mining upgrade, nothing revolutionary, they don't even change the stuff that would widely be considered outdated, frustrating design today, like having to constantly reseed farms or the way the default aggression setting will cause units to chase enemies all the way across the map. Its still old school pixel art after all this time, the game proudly looks 20 years old. For comparison in AoE3 they had dramatic overhauls where each civilization had much more distinctiveness in terms of the units and bonuses available to them, they each had a home city where they could requisition upgrades and units in exchange for experience points (the whole game revolved around this, you could even upgrade the city itself and organize cards to tweak your options in later games), you could make alliances with otherwise neutral native american tribes for more gameplay options and units, the villagers no longer needed drop points which vastly changed the economy, units took up different amounts population based on their power and the whole game was in full 3D. That's the kind of stuff people come to expect with sequels.

On a personal level I do expect that sequels put a twist on the old ways and don't just rethread old ground, people are also talking about Star Wars here and one of the most ever present criticisms of the new movies is that they feel like they're going through the same plot beats and visual language of the first three movies in such a way that it gets tiring and deprives the Disney Star Wars movies of their own, independent identities. But it's not just about what I like, I'm theorizing about what the issue could be with RTS games since it feels like RTS fans tend to stick with the old rather than moving to the new and I think the fact that the genre hasn't really changed that much in a long time (or when it has that such change is often poorly received like in AoE3 or DOW3) could be part of that.

khwarezm fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Jun 4, 2018

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.
E; oops.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.
Maybe it's just because I'm biased on account of being bad at both genres, but I feel like RTSes ended up in a similar place to fighting games where aside from the bare minimum of tutorials and difficulty sliders, neither genre bothered to cross the accessibility gap and suffered for it after a point.

Edit: Another genre that probably ate into the popularity of RTSes was tower defense games. Those took off in a pretty noticeable way, are easier to make than RTSes, and the genre grew to the point of supporting a wide variety of variants and complexity levels.

John Murdoch fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Jun 5, 2018

BigRed0427
Mar 23, 2007

There's no one I'd rather be than me.

DoubleCakes posted:

Natalie also released a Twitter thread clarifying some things on her Tiffany Tumbles video:

https://twitter.com/ContraPoints/status/1003696329783115776?s=20

Yeah. This is a Proclick. I don't think a lot of Cis and Straight people realize that there are a lot of Milos and Blairs out there. People who try so hard to be respected by the people who will never respect them at the end of the day unless they play by their rules of what they should be.

If you wanna REALLY stare into the abyss, go look at 4chan's /lgbt/ board some time.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006


A+ on a quote from Pauline Kael that isn’t cruel. Also, god drat that’s a sprint through a lot of material, not that too much. PBS must demand things cut down to the second—that hand-wipe animation seems essential.

One thing I always wonder about is whether there has ever been a book adaptation of a movie that’s worth talking about. The only one I ever think about is the Buckaroo Banzai novelization, which is written as one volume of a memoir by one of the characters, with references to the events of earlier volumes and more famous Buckaroo Banzai films and stories. It just carries on the joke of there being a long, storied multimedia Buckaroo Banzai franchise that everyone already knows.

I guess Orson Welles wrote an adaptation of Confidential Report, to get people to go see the movie.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

BigRed0427 posted:

Yeah. This is a Proclick. I don't think a lot of Cis and Straight people realize that there are a lot of Milos and Blairs out there. People who try so hard to be respected by the people who will never respect them at the end of the day unless they play by their rules of what they should be.

If you wanna REALLY stare into the abyss, go look at 4chan's /lgbt/ board some time.

It seems like a survival strategy that appears in a lot of variations beyond trans identity or sexuality, ie the “I’m not like other girls”/“I hate girls” girl. Or a black republican on tv yelling at the kids to pull up their pants.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Lightning Knight posted:

“Niche” here meaning “is aimed at Star Wars nerds.” Not “people who like Star Wars.” I would argue spending 300 million dollars on a film about Han Solo is a dumb idea on its face anyway since it manifestly shows one doesn’t understand why people liked Han Solo in the first place, especially since they decided to make it in a world where he couldn’t actually be played by Harrison Ford.

He also brings up the “why wasn’t this movie just about Lando?” question which I agree with.

as someone who was down as gently caress on solo from the beginning. i liked the movie. its nice little story about hans early days. happy it didn't do " its a ________. I CLAPPED" fan service poo poo. when it was there it came back around to something and served a purpose.


Lightning Knight posted:

So I watched this and other than his horrible over-long joke at the beginning, the thrust of the main video is actually that Solo doing just ok is not evidence of some kind of backlash against SJWs, but rather just that it’s a niche film in a competitive market that’s more so aimed at super fans rather than casual audiences. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

ehh. i mean he is right sorta but its not that niche. their is some namedrops to old canon stuff but thats it. its pretty much just a small story movie.

Lightning Knight
Feb 24, 2012

Pray for Answer

Dapper_Swindler posted:

as someone who was down as gently caress on solo from the beginning. i liked the movie. its nice little story about hans early days. happy it didn't do " its a ________. I CLAPPED" fan service poo poo. when it was there it came back around to something and served a purpose.


ehh. i mean he is right sorta but its not that niche. their is some namedrops to old canon stuff but thats it. its pretty much just a small story movie.

Oh I have no opinions on whether or not Solo is good, I haven’t seen it and I have no intention to, because I think it’s a pointless movie and Han Solo will always be Ford to me. I think the core point is supposed to be more focused on “it’s not because of the SJWs you assholes,” but it’s Bob so he meanders and lacks focus and it’s full of hyperbole and tangents.

Lightning Knight fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Jun 5, 2018

DoubleCakes
Jan 14, 2015

BigRed0427 posted:

Yeah. This is a Proclick. I don't think a lot of Cis and Straight people realize that there are a lot of Milos and Blairs out there. People who try so hard to be respected by the people who will never respect them at the end of the day unless they play by their rules of what they should be.

If you wanna REALLY stare into the abyss, go look at 4chan's /lgbt/ board some time.

There's something fascinating about the people on /lgbt/ trying to win the favour of the alt-right like the losers at school trying to get in with the cool kids. There's a lot of that kind of mentality in the discourse.

Soup du Jour
Sep 8, 2011

I always knew I'd die with a headache.

business hammocks posted:

A+ on a quote from Pauline Kael that isn’t cruel. Also, god drat that’s a sprint through a lot of material, not that too much. PBS must demand things cut down to the second—that hand-wipe animation seems essential.

One thing I always wonder about is whether there has ever been a book adaptation of a movie that’s worth talking about. The only one I ever think about is the Buckaroo Banzai novelization, which is written as one volume of a memoir by one of the characters, with references to the events of earlier volumes and more famous Buckaroo Banzai films and stories. It just carries on the joke of there being a long, storied multimedia Buckaroo Banzai franchise that everyone already knows.

I guess Orson Welles wrote an adaptation of Confidential Report, to get people to go see the movie.

I recall (it’s been well over a decade since I read them) that the Star Wars prequel novelizations, while not making those sow’s ears into silk purses, at least make them into like a tote bag to torture the metaphor a bit.

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achillesforever6
Apr 23, 2012

psst you wanna do a communism?

Hel posted:

I'll look into those.
MP focused doesn't just mean no or bad SP campaigns , it also means stuff like balance patches to make things fair for VS but removes fun/interesting things from the singleplayer modes.

It's funny you bring up both innovation and lack of fan base for post AoE2, because as I recall a lot of fans really disliked AoE3 because it was too different and the same could probably be said for the AoMythology as well. Rise of Nations was called the "real AoE3" because it was less innovative/different than the games people liked. And while I do agree that stagnation might be bad, it feels like games have a higher spoken burden placed on them to be innovative than other media, at least until GoTY list where most games have no stuff young than the 90's/00's.
You can just tell good stories with games, they don't have to revolutionize the media to be worth anything. How many of the books and films actually bring something really new that changes the medium?
Wait I thought Age of Mythology is regarded pretty well in the RTS community both contemporary and today :psyduck:

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