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Bad Wolf
Apr 7, 2007
Without evil there could be no good, so it must be good to be evil sometime !

Ghostlight posted:

Starscream and Cobra Commander are the same person :ssh:

If you mean they had the same voice actor, sure. Though you're not far off otherwise too. It's just that Cobra Commander didn't (essentially) become Starscream until halfway through the original cartoon series, when they introduced Serpentor who took over and became Megatron to CC's Starscream.

This was also one of the only times in 80s cartoons where the bad guys realized their leader was a colossal fuckup, so they replaced him.

By the way, when I first saw Beast Wars and Dinobot challenged Megatron in the first episode, I thought "Ugh, they're just doing the whole Megatron-Starscream dynamic again, but with dinosaurs.", I was pleasantly surprised Megatron kicked Dinobot out of the team and he joined the Maximals out of spite.

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Leal
Oct 2, 2009

Dapper_Swindler posted:

i am amused how these morons just double down in their dumb awful bullshit. its sad.

Whats even sadder is people who will throw money at it to own the SJWs.

Also wasn't Lovecraft the guy who made a story where a black man knocks up a white woman and it causes the end of the world due to racial mixing?

Gonzo McFee
Jun 19, 2010
If Lovecraft was alive today he'd be a youtube rationalist.

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

"Hi Everybody!"

Bad Wolf posted:

By the way, when I first saw Beast Wars and Dinobot challenged Megatron in the first episode, I thought "Ugh, they're just doing the whole Megatron-Starscream dynamic again, but with dinosaurs.", I was pleasantly surprised Megatron kicked Dinobot out of the team and he joined the Maximals out of spite.

That's Terrorsaur's job, and he was actually half-decent at it.

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005


Gonzo McFee posted:

If Lovecraft was alive today he'd be a youtube rationalist.

More of a Youtube advice guy, really

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Leal posted:

Whats even sadder is people who will throw money at it to own the SJWs.

Also wasn't Lovecraft the guy who made a story where a black man knocks up a white woman and it causes the end of the world due to racial mixing?

Well they are morons. And I don’t think so?

Puppy Time posted:

Depends on the fans. There's still a general idea of "if I just don't acknowledge race existing, then nothing is racist and everything is fine!" still floating around from the time when we were convinced that Being Colorblind was the way to Solve Racism Forever. (Just in the current cultural climate that's a lot harder to maintain.) So of course there's going to be fans of the mythos/setting who get all "No no no don't bring reality politics into my fun squid monster stories!" here and there.

There's also the fans who will give a token "yeah, he was racist" but then want to pretend like it wasn't baked into a large swath of his stories or something.

Turns out, a lot of people struggle with "I like this thing, but it's got some serious inherent problems" and would rather avoid wrestling with the philosophical quagmire that is "how can I still like this thing when the creator is a garbage human whose attitudes are built in?" It can feel a lot like the only answer is "Completely abandon this thing you like, that may have given meaning to your life, because it has Bad Things," especially if you're not really experienced with the nuance of "basically everything is #problematic and the best you can hope for is to kind of mitigate some of it sometimes."


Yeah, deffo, just... those particular cited attitudes were not that extreme at the time.

Yeah pretty much. I honestly think his awful beliefs add a interesting layer to his stories. Part of it is because it adds a hosed up historical context to his writing and it also shows where the fear in his writing came from. It’s interesting from a cultural/academic point of view. If you go for history in college like I did you learn the “everything is hosed up or problematic” lesson early and then you try to learn both the positives and the negatives from whatever it is without too much judgement while critically interrogating what your reading. It’s different from art criticism in that regard. Plus I have read much more depressingly racist shot the lovecraft.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 15:47 on Jul 4, 2018

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005


Yeah, Lovecraft being a garbage guy just adds this interesting drinking game element to his stories, like a much less savory version of when a writer really obviously has a fetish or a specialized interest. Which in my opinion just improves on an already fun experience of neat monsters and weird poo poo totally loving everything up.

dbzfandiego
Sep 17, 2011
As someone who has a bachelor's in History we should absolutely condemn the mistakes and prejudices of the past, especially if those in question or their beliefs have influence in the present day. The point of judging within context in history is to well put them into their context while studying them. If you are focusing instead of what their beliefs and actions mean in the present day then making a judgement call is fine and expected. We are not reading Lovecraft or Jefferson, to make things current, in the 1910s or the 1800s we are in 2018 and what those people mean now is vary different than what they meant then.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

dbzfandiego posted:

As someone who has a bachelor's in History we should absolutely condemn the mistakes and prejudices of the past, especially if those in question or their beliefs have influence in the present day. The point of judging within context in history is to well put them into their context while studying them. If you are focusing instead of what their beliefs and actions mean in the present day then making a judgement call is fine and expected. We are not reading Lovecraft or Jefferson, to make things current, in the 1910s or the 1800s we are in 2018 and what those people mean now is vary different than what they meant then.

oh yeah, definitely. I was more just used to writing papers where outside your main theisis, your supposed to be a "neutral" as possible.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jul 4, 2018

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.
Dapper_Swindler, can you do me a favor and have less posts where you go 'yeah pretty much' to something someone else said and don't add anything, because you're reminding me of this guy in The Room.

Oh, also Jenny just posted this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRwI1unON7A

khwarezm fucked around with this message at 16:42 on Jul 4, 2018

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

khwarezm posted:

Dapper_Swindler, can you do me a favor and have less posts where you go 'yeah pretty much' to something someone else said and don't add anything, because you're reminding me of this guy in The Room.

Oh, also Jenny just posted this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRwI1unON7A

ok sorry.

also my girlfriend saw that movie, she said it was awful too. too bad it will make millions.

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005



It really weirds me out that a writer who's bad enough at their job that they don't grasp basic philosophical questions is allowed to write for a franchise that, albeit superficially, is intended to address those basic philosophical questions.

It's like if you had someone writing for Care Bears who didn't understand why Sharing is Nice and Being Mean isn't Nice, so they were just trying to guess at what lesson they were supposed to write.

TheMaestroso
Nov 4, 2014

I must know your secrets.

Puppy Time posted:

It really weirds me out that a writer who's bad enough at their job that they don't grasp basic philosophical questions is allowed to write for a franchise that, albeit superficially, is intended to address those basic philosophical questions.

It's like if you had someone writing for Care Bears who didn't understand why Sharing is Nice and Being Mean isn't Nice, so they were just trying to guess at what lesson they were supposed to write.

Yeah, Mike and Jay kinda hit the nail on the head in their review when they pointed out how the franchise has basically ignored the themes of the first film so that they can just keep making the same movie over and over.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.
i know i am thinking about it way to hard/literaly but I have never understood how "we can use them as weapons" poo poo would works. the best you could do is have raptors replace tracking/attack dogs but that seems like a waste since they are so hard to train. as someone who owns reptiles, the best you can do is get the normalized to your presence and not be worried/scared and they get "tame".

i mean i always find "the mega corporation/goverment weaponizing ______ " trope funny. but its just lazy after awhile.

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth
JW2 is one of my favorite terrible movies I've seen in a while

BigRed0427
Mar 23, 2007

There's no one I'd rather be than me.


Because I'm lazy, what the hell is thisgame suppose to be and how is it sticking it to the SJWs

Leal
Oct 2, 2009

BigRed0427 posted:

Because I'm lazy, what the hell is thisgame suppose to be and how is it sticking it to the SJWs

Well see, all SJWs are pussies, as you can't say anything mildly racist without them being offended. With this game that uses some fourth edition home rules version of DnD you can enjoy block chain mining that only benefits the creator as you have to sign a waiver to hand all notbitcoins to the creator.

With dark and gritty stuff like "friendship" and "kindness" being low powered words meanwhile "kike" and "friend of the family" are high power words.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Leal posted:

Well see, all SJWs are pussies, as you can't say anything mildly racist without them being offended. With this game that uses some fourth edition home rules version of DnD you can enjoy block chain mining that only benefits the creator as you have to sign a waiver to hand all notbitcoins to the creator.

With dark and gritty stuff like "friendship" and "kindness" being low powered words meanwhile "kike" and "friend of the family" are high power words.

why don't they just play Fantasy Adventure to Adult Lechery. that has enough horrible poo poo in it.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

Neddy Seagoon posted:

I THINK that was Tigerhawk? He lasted all of about 3 episodes.

Yup. And then they went ahead and made the toy after all.

Yardbomb
Jul 11, 2011

What's with the eh... bretonnian dance, sir?

Dapper_Swindler posted:

why don't they just play Fantasy Adventure to Adult Lechery. that has enough horrible poo poo in it.

FATAL is fuckin awful in an amusing way at least, where a couple guys added all the dumb garbage they could think of to keep upping the horrible ante, that crap above just sounds like yet another pathetic effort to grub cheap bigotbux.

Karloff
Mar 21, 2013

Dapper_Swindler posted:

i know i am thinking about it way to hard/literaly but I have never understood how "we can use them as weapons" poo poo would works. the best you could do is have raptors replace tracking/attack dogs but that seems like a waste since they are so hard to train. as someone who owns reptiles, the best you can do is get the normalized to your presence and not be worried/scared and they get "tame".

i mean i always find "the mega corporation/goverment weaponizing ______ " trope funny. but its just lazy after awhile.

I guess it could be good for weakening an enemies morale. I'd rather be shot or blown up than be torn apart by a T-Rex.

achillesforever6
Apr 23, 2012

psst you wanna do a communism?

Arcsquad12 posted:

GeekGroup has a follow-up video to their Stegosaurus episode of Your Dinosaurs Are Wrong.

It's really cool to see how skeleton mountings change over time to better match current scientific discoveries.
Yeah what most people don't realize that most dinosaurs you see in museums are actually composite specimens and just a hodgepodge of different specimens all put together

E: Its amazing how much the Jurassic Park franchise fell off a gigantic cliff at The Lost World, the only thing I can compare it to is The Terminator Franchise.

Then again maybe Jurassic Park just wasn't meant to be a franchise and should have just stayed one perfect film (as much as I love The Lost World it basically is Spielberg making a high budget B-movie)

achillesforever6 fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Jul 4, 2018

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?
Lost World has merit for not trying to repeat the first movie and for being really well filmed. Some of the camera work in that movie is incredible and there's a bunch of neat scene transition tricks they use. It's Spielberg flexing his director's skills and getting fun performances out of his actors, even if the story is just there as an excuse to string together a collection of elaborate suspense moments.

Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Jul 5, 2018

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Karloff posted:

I guess it could be good for weakening an enemies morale. I'd rather be shot or blown up than be torn apart by a T-Rex.

Yeah, they would be good terror weapons I guess.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

achillesforever6 posted:

Yeah what most people don't realize that most dinosaurs you see in museums are actually composite specimens and just a hodgepodge of different specimens all put together

E: Its amazing how much the Jurassic Park franchise fell off a gigantic cliff at The Lost World, the only thing I can compare it to is The Terminator Franchise.

Then again maybe Jurassic Park just wasn't meant to be a franchise and should have just stayed one perfect film (as much as I love The Lost World it basically is Spielberg making a high budget B-movie)

yeah. One is the only great one. honestly i kinda prefer the books. the dinosaurs are alot more hosed up looking and hammond was some andrew ryan type rear end in a top hat who cut tons of corners and gets ripped apart by tiny dinos.

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.
The new JW films lost me when they didn't give the Dinosaurs feathers. :colbert:

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?
At least BD Wong gave an rear end pull explanation: dna splicing hosed up the genetics if the dinos

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.
I want my angry giant rainbow chickens.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

They should include a scene with Laura Dern or Sam Neill complaining that the bottom fell out of paleontology and they have to be adjuncts at 65 because of Jurassic Park, even though real dinosaurs are totally different and worth studying.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?
Jurassic world could finance dig teams to collect enough dna to get a full genetic profile without frog DNA but they wanted theme park attractions.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

business hammocks posted:

They should include a scene with Laura Dern or Sam Neill complaining that the bottom fell out of paleontology and they have to be adjuncts at 65 because of Jurassic Park, even though real dinosaurs are totally different and worth studying.

i mean its true. at some point they would start selling baby micro raptors and poo poo as pets. id get one. i mean the herping breeding community is already full of hosed up breeding ideas and plans. this wouldnt be any different.

TheMaestroso
Nov 4, 2014

I must know your secrets.
Dinosaurs are birds, not reptiles.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

TheMaestroso posted:

Dinosaurs are birds, not reptiles.

Theropods are birds.

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

"Hi Everybody!"

Arcsquad12 posted:

Jurassic world could finance dig teams to collect enough dna to get a full genetic profile without frog DNA but they wanted theme park attractions.

Pretty sure they even say at some point in the film they specifically engineered "classic" Dinosaurs on purpose because they'd sell better.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Neddy Seagoon posted:

Pretty sure they even say at some point in the film they specifically engineered "classic" Dinosaurs on purpose because they'd sell better.

Yeah, because feathered dinosaurs look dumb as hell.

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

business hammocks posted:

They should include a scene with Laura Dern or Sam Neill complaining that the bottom fell out of paleontology and they have to be adjuncts at 65 because of Jurassic Park, even though real dinosaurs are totally different and worth studying.

lol

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

achillesforever6 posted:


Then again maybe Jurassic Park just wasn't meant to be a franchise and should have just stayed one perfect film (as much as I love The Lost World it basically is Spielberg making a high budget B-movie)

Yeah, it really wasn't. Here's a challenge, try to come up with any possible storyline for a Jurassic Park movie that isn't either utterly hokey schlock or just retreading what happens in the first movie.

It's not possible, everything that they could do with the concept was already done with the first movie before you start getting into 'T-Rex attacks LA!' or 'Genetically altered monster-dino auction with a little clone girl(?!?)'.

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Yeah, because feathered dinosaurs look dumb as hell.

Wrong, refer to my avatar.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."
Retell the first movie from the point of view of the raptors.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?
Make a movie about trying to safely move dinosaurs to a mainland attraction and have Ian Malcolm mock it the whole time.

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Linear Zoetrope
Nov 28, 2011

A hero must cook

khwarezm posted:

Yeah, it really wasn't. Here's a challenge, try to come up with any possible storyline for a Jurassic Park movie that isn't either utterly hokey schlock or just retreading what happens in the first movie.

It's not possible, everything that they could do with the concept was already done with the first movie before you start getting into 'T-Rex attacks LA!' or 'Genetically altered monster-dino auction with a little clone girl(?!?)'.

Jurassic Park except it's Free Willie with a shitton of dinosaurs.

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