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Lobok posted:Wasn't he saying this while pretending to be Lark? It's how someone like Lark would phrase it. I specifically remember a scene with Hunt and Hunley using that phrasing that was why I was wondering if it was the IMF just referring to the CIA that way.
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Jul 31, 2018 19:25
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Lobok posted:Any thoughts on the significance of Homer's Odyssey at the beginning of Fallout? I remember some of the big plot beats of the Odyssey but most don't seem to match anything in the movie, unless Rogue Nation and Fallout are included as one and the underwater sequence in RN is Charybdis. By the end of Fallout it seemed like maybe it was just a reference to Hunt going on all these adventures and ending up back with his wife. I don't think the Odyssey had much impact on the movie so not sure why it was there. Max as a siren? Can't think of anything for lotus eaters. Henry Cavil is the cyclops after he gets his face burned off. The wife stuff was entirely different though because he didn't go back with her and she went off with a suitor.
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Jul 31, 2018 19:41
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Pretty much all the MI stuff in 4+ was in MI2, it's really the prototypical MI movie where the pieces start coming together and Ethan becomes fully superhuman. MI and MI3 are kind of the odd men out. I still love 1 because it feels the most like a LeCarre-esque spy thriller and the CIA heist is still goddamned great. It really only goes off the rails with the helicopter in the train tunnel. 3 is only memorable to me because of PSH, the Vatican scene, and the lipreading scene. PSH really carries it.
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Jul 31, 2018 19:42
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I like both MI and MI3 as well, I'm just saying they don't really fit the franchise template. I think they actually work just fine as fun Tom Cruise movies (yes, that is a genre)
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Jul 31, 2018 20:12
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:I like both MI and MI3 as well, I'm just saying they don't really fit the franchise template. I think they actually work just fine as fun Tom Cruise movies (yes, that is a genre) MI 1 has Ethan as a master thief and con artist type character but not a incredible fighter. Ethan gets knocked out by an old man even. You get the acrobatic stuff though which sets up the franchise. MI 3 feels more like a direct sequel to MI 1 but Ethan has upgraded fighting ability. MI 2 is just straight up unkillable machine and competent at all things ,which leads closer to his 4+ character. However, I did like that they had him have to figure out how to fly a heliocopter in fallout. Raccooon fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Jul 31, 2018 |
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Jul 31, 2018 20:24
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Raccooon posted:I don't think the Odyssey had much impact on the movie so not sure why it was there. This wasn't like some passing name on the spine of a book on a bookshelf in the background. Homer's Odyssey was very deliberatley chosen and placed front and centre for the audience at the beginning of the movie so it seems like it should have some meaning. About Julia, yeah he didn't end up back with her but that was the only thing I could think of in terms of the overall plot of both stories. Agreed about Cyclops, though I didn't think so initially because the injury wasn't quite bad enough to make me think of him as one-eyed. Various articles say this about the reference to the Odyssey: Slant magazine quote:“No man aforetime was more blessed, nor shall ever be hereafter” is how Odysseus, the wandering protagonist of that ancient Greek epic, describes Achilles, confined to the underworld after his fateful demise by arrow on the Trojan battlefield. Fallout follows through on at least the first part of Odysseus’s sentiment, missing no opportunity to prop up Cruise’s indomitable earthly ego while his character runs, jumps, falls, fist-fights, sky-dives, and clambers up rope and cliff in service of…what exactly? An-Nahar quote:All of the elements present in his life are obstacles for Ethan, much like Homer had his share of monsters to overcome. And then this FilmSchoolRejects article that mentions both of the above quote:I like this analysis except for the Julia part. Maybe Ilsa is the Sirens, but regardless Julia is definitely Penelope, the wife of Odysseus who thinks her man is lost at sea forever and who is currently being pursued by potential replacements. Hunt may not be trying to find his way home to Julia, but that is where he lands in the last act of Fallout, and she not only has a suitor but a new beau.
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Jul 31, 2018 20:29
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Yeah I wondered about it to because it is big lettering right in the center frame. But, those quotes feel like a stretch. Maybe they had an idea to make it like the Odyssey but abandoned and never took out the book reference. Like, the Erica Sloan thing doesn't even fit at all with Hunt being Odysseus. Or is he supposed to be like Achilles from that first quote, but doesn't have a tragic death? Raccooon fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Jul 31, 2018 |
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Jul 31, 2018 20:36
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There was one shot in the film that felt mythological, probably helped by the fact I was watching in IMAX, and it's when Hunt looks out of the back of the plane into the storm below. I thought at the time that he was either going into the underworld or he was descending down into the mortal world as a god.Raccooon posted:Yeah I wondered about it to because it is big lettering right in the center frame. The first quote is saying that Hunt is Achilles, not Odysseus. Which isn't an obvious leap. If it were the Illiad, ok maybe.
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Jul 31, 2018 20:46
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The Odyssey is the story of a man trying to get home after a war. Ethan and Ilsa spend the entire movie trying to "go home" go home meaning being accepted back into the arms of their respective countries and intelligence agencies after going to war with Solomon Lane. Whether each character represents a specific monster is another issue, but the basic story connection is pretty easy to make.
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Jul 31, 2018 21:57
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One thing I haven't seen mentioned about the stunts is the way it changes how things are shot. It's one thing to marvel at the meta-story of this actor risking his life but beyond that it actually changes the movie, too. So many times in a car chase we get shots from the pavement, shots of wheels and bodies of cars, fast cuts, blurred pans, distant shots, and a whole bunch of other techniques for hiding who's behind the wheel. But when Cruise was on the motorcycle for real tearing through Paris we got several long, clear, wide shots of him and the traffic and his surroundings. You get a better sense of the speed and geography and characters' relation to one another.
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Jul 31, 2018 22:13
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Tom Cruise alone in the helicopter was extremely entertaining, Cruise literally being alone in there is part of the reason why.
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Jul 31, 2018 22:16
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LesterGroans posted:Tom Cruise alone in the helicopter was extremely entertaining, Cruise literally being alone in there is part of the reason why. For a second I thought both this and the HALO jump had some CGI trickery because no way would this ever happen, even in this series.
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Jul 31, 2018 22:24
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MeatwadIsGod posted:For a second I thought both this and the HALO jump had some CGI trickery because no way would this ever happen, even in this series. Wait were both of those shots real?
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Jul 31, 2018 22:25
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Credit to Cruise for going the extra mile to make it worthwhile everyone putting their all into it.
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Jul 31, 2018 22:26
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Raccooon posted:Wait were both of those shots real? Yeah. I wasn't convinced until I watched the behind-the-scenes mini-documentaries on YouTube. It's crazy.
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Jul 31, 2018 22:27
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MeatwadIsGod posted:Yeah. I wasn't convinced until I watched the behind-the-scenes mini-documentaries on YouTube. It's crazy. Holy poo poo this movie is even crazier than I thought
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Jul 31, 2018 22:29
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I would have hated to be the insurance underwriter for Fallout. "Wait, you want Cruise to do what?"
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Aug 1, 2018 00:19
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Raccooon posted:It’s definitely in 3’s score but I haven’t thought about it. It may not be in 4 or 5 It's definitely in Rogue Nation, albeit with a Moroccan twist as they make their way to Ilsa's villa, along with a brief snippet in London later on.
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Aug 1, 2018 01:12
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Timby posted:I would have hated to be the insurance underwriter for Fallout. Remember though that in this conversation the underwriter is talking to Cruise. Ok not really, but it's fun to imagine Cruise as like a one man movie production team.
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Aug 1, 2018 01:24
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Cruise and Jackie Chan have never done anything together, right?
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Aug 1, 2018 01:46
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I'm surprised he hasn't done anything with Donnie Yen, unless he has and I'm just blanking on it.
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Aug 1, 2018 01:57
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SleepCousinDeath posted:I'm surprised he hasn't done anything with Donnie Yen, unless he has and I'm just blanking on it. Well they've both mostly stayed in their own countries. Yen never really had a phase in his career like Jackie Chan did where he fully committed to Hollywood and Cruise hasn't done much outside of the U.S. that I can think of.
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Aug 1, 2018 02:01
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Was it just me or did anyone else think the cgi in Fallout's action scenes was pretty shoddy in places? I know they were only onscreen for fractions of a second but there were a few bits that just looked a bit out of place. mostly the cgi added cars during the bike chase and the helicopters crashing at the end in the snow had this weird grainy filter laid over the top. And the bike chase when Ethan gets knocked off the bike over the bonnet of the car looked weirdly wooden too. It looked absolutely stunning though, the shots at the end in the air were real nice looking. I enjoyed it, it certainly didn't feel its length like some other films but wasn't as blown away as others. I didn't read into any hype and I haven't watched any MI since the mediocre John Woo one.
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Aug 1, 2018 19:43
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It sounds like you enjoyed Fallout though overall, so definitely at least checkout the previous two, Rogue Nation and Ghost Protocol. Rogue Nation is the one that establishes the villain from Fallout but they're both very much worth watching.
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Aug 1, 2018 19:53
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I think my favorite M:I stunt is in Rogue Nation, right after Cruise/Hunt has been drowned and resuscitated, and he tries to do a Dukes Of Hazard slide over the hood of the car, and he ends up going nose-first off the car. Just a little moment of not being Superman.
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Aug 1, 2018 20:29
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I haven't seen Fallout yet, but I don't think anything will top Cruise running out of line on the skyscraper, and the MI theme kicking in as he sprints off in the opposite direction and then springs off the side of the building in the (almost) perfect arc. Such an amazing moment of "what the hell is he up to?" turning to "oooooooh poo poo!" in a split second.
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Aug 1, 2018 20:32
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I appreciate Cruise doing that and making things fallible and imprecise. It adds to humor or to the effect that what they are doing is not easy poo poo. They’re selling.
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Aug 1, 2018 20:32
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Basebf555 posted:I haven't seen Fallout yet, but I don't think anything will top Cruise running out of line on the skyscraper, and the MI theme kicking in as he sprints off in the opposite direction and then springs off the side of the building in the (almost) perfect arc. Such an amazing moment of "what the hell is he up to?" turning to "oooooooh poo poo!" in a split second. That's Rogue Nation, right? I just saw Fallout (it was great! maybe cut 15 minutes tho. and I'm tired of monologuing villains) and I haven't seen the previous two in a while so I was gonna fire those babies up.
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Aug 2, 2018 02:50
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Al Cu Ad Solte posted:That's Rogue Nation, right? I just saw Fallout (it was great! maybe cut 15 minutes tho. and I'm tired of monologuing villains) and I haven't seen the previous two in a while so I was gonna fire those babies up. this 'un https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoYXzLSnHVE&t=532s
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Aug 2, 2018 04:40
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My favorite part about this is how he completely eats poo poo on the top of the window coming in. I think a less competently made movie would have just had him thread the needle for maximum cool factor, but by fudging the landing, they get a little extra bit of tension of with everyone trying to drag him back in. The franchise really does a good job of maximizing each set piece as much as possible before moving onto the next. Tart Kitty fucked around with this message at 05:02 on Aug 2, 2018 |
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Aug 2, 2018 04:58
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I got back from MI6 this morning, loving hell. While, yeah, there is some dodgy CGI, there's so much that's impressively real that it more than balances out. I mean, there's an extended take gunfight that's nothing but a dream sequence I also like that, like the best Jackie Chan, the action scenes told a story. They all have arcs and characters who make decisions and move around, affecting and reacting to their environments It's a nice change from 'everyone hold still and fight on this flat, featureless surface, we'll get back to the plot in a second'
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Aug 2, 2018 06:06
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Saw MI:6 last night, loved it. The only action scene I would say isn't that great is the gunfight in the tunnels after Cavill's villainy is revealed. It felt incomprehensible, unlike all the other scenes. Probably because of the darkness, but I literally couldn't tell where everyone was in relation to each other. But all other action in the movie ruled. I really loved how exasperated Cavill was getting as the film went on. He was so frustrated that Ethan just won't give up and die.
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Aug 2, 2018 08:05
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I really love the Mission Impossible movies, and watched them all in the last few weeks in anticipation of Fallout, which was maybe a mistake. As incredible and well-put-together it is as an action movie (I'd need to see it again, but I think the Paris sequence has usurped Ronin as my favourite car chase), there just wasn't enough Mission Impossible in it for my tastes. All I wanted was at least one heist with the team all working at it from different angles and having to improvise on the fly - the Vatican stuff in 3 is still probably the best they've done on that front - and the closest we got was Hunt smashes van into river, Benji retrieves Lane and puts him on a boat, Hunt drives away from police and bad guys. Hardly chess master stuff. The series has always had pretty crap villains - Phillip Seymour Hoffman being the grand exception - but I quite liked in Rogue Nation the idea that if Ethan Hunt is always three steps ahead of everyone else, Solomon Lane is three steps ahead of him. I thought his transformation into bug-eyed doomsday jihadist was really jarring. I'd probably be more forgiving if it wasn't a direct sequel, which invites comparison to what's gone before. Remember how in Rogue Nation the team worked together to manipulate Lane into a trap through his exasperated hubris? In this one Ilsa punched him a bunch  In short: too much Impossible, not enough Mission. Matinee fucked around with this message at 13:13 on Aug 2, 2018 |
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Aug 2, 2018 10:01
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garycoleisgod posted:Saw MI:6 last night, loved it. The only action scene I would say isn't that great is the gunfight in the tunnels after Cavill's villainy is revealed. It felt incomprehensible, unlike all the other scenes. Probably because of the darkness, but I literally couldn't tell where everyone was in relation to each other. But all other action in the movie ruled. Yeah that bit was weak, the others were running around all over whilst Ethan just stood in one spot for 5 minutes. Or it seemed like it. Poorly shot, that scene.
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Aug 2, 2018 15:14
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That scene seemed like intentional chaos. Three groups fighting in a dark environment where enemies were all surrounding each other and nobody fully had a handle on what was going on.
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Aug 2, 2018 15:37
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Lobok posted:That scene seemed like intentional chaos. Three groups fighting in a dark environment where enemies were all surrounding each other and nobody fully had a handle on what was going on. That scene was the weakest part of the movie for me because as has been said it's a little jumbled and in terms of plot there's no good reason for Angela Bassett's character to take over the operation using CIA assets when she knows or at least has good reason to believe that her top asset is a double agent. Especially not by cutting the loving power when the IMF has their guns trained on a highly dangerous terrorist. It seriously plays like she's one of the Apostles it's so stupid.
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Aug 2, 2018 16:20
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I'm halfway through the 3 hour Empire Magazine podcast with Christopher McQuarrie and it's really fascinating to hear the insight that went into Fallout. I've just got to a point where he said that the dark tunnels shootout was basically worked out on the morning of filming in two hours. It's making me appreciate a lot more of the movie, but also how this shoot sounded so insanely seat-of-the-pants it's basically pure luck that it turned out so good. A bit like an IMF mission, basically. A recommended listen - Mcquarrie talks in unfiltered detail and he's great to listen to.
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Aug 2, 2018 19:31
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Matinee posted:I'm halfway through the 3 hour Empire Magazine podcast with Christopher McQuarrie and it's really fascinating to hear the insight that went into Fallout. I've just got to a point where he said that the dark tunnels shootout was basically worked out on the morning of filming in two hours. McQuarrie is cool. He directed the massively underrated 'Way of the Gun' back in 2000, wrote some stuff, but more or less vanished, and now has become Tom Cruise's go to director.
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Aug 3, 2018 00:30
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McQuarrie's first major credit was writing The Usual Suspects. He won an Oscar for it.
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Aug 3, 2018 00:36
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I listened to a podcast episode about lovely Tarantino ripoffs, and there seemed to be a consensus that Way of the Gun was a diamond in the rough.
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Aug 3, 2018 00:36
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