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catfry posted:I'm convinced the music theme of Ludwig the holy blade is a classical piece, and not a Bloodborne original score, but everyone else online seems to think it's original. Does anyone have any idea what I could be thinking of instead? I'm by no means a classic music expert but the piece that Ludwig's theme reminds me the most of is Dies Irae, from Giuseppe Verdi's Requiem.
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Aug 2, 2018 16:58
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 You know what they say, brain in, brain out!
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Aug 7, 2018 23:43
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Honestly, seeing one video of the first section of this DLC was enough to turn me off to ever playing it (long before yours; I don't remember if it was Lotus Gramayre's LP or someone else's at this point, but it's kind of moot). It's obvious FromSoft gave up on the "fair" part of "tough but fair" long ago.
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Aug 8, 2018 00:12
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I agree that they definitely went overboard. I think they tried to compromise between NG and NG+ difficulties because they knew a lot of people would be playing it then, since it's accessible very early on and a lot of the audience likely had a completed game save. In NG+ the difficulty is a lot more homogenized, scaled more around the difficulty of the main game. But it's still just absolutely brutal in enemy damage vs the damage you deal to them which is a bummer. edit: Even so, it's absolutely worth playing just to soak in the atmosphere and the sense of mystery and dread. It's hard, too hard, and for most of the wrong reasons, but definitely bearable. CJacobs fucked around with this message at 00:32 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 00:29
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CJacobs posted:edit: Even so, it's absolutely worth playing just to soak in the atmosphere and the sense of mystery and dread. It's hard, too hard, and for most of the wrong reasons, but definitely bearable. I disagree. But then, that's what Let's Plays are for. I say this as someone who clawed his way through 90% of DS3's DLC, and utterly gave up on it in the final hour. No amount of mysterious and dreadful atmosphere is worth that bullshit.
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Aug 8, 2018 01:14
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The first dlc for dark souls 3 was good but I agree the the second one was just pure bullshit. Edit: As in the number of times that your only option was to just book it and hope for the best was extremely frustrating. Hunt11 fucked around with this message at 01:40 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 01:38
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Hunt11 posted:The first dlc for dark souls 3 was good but I agree the the second one was just pure bullshit. It's bad game design that the Souls series gets a weird pass for that the only reasons to kill enemies are to collect experience and static items, but as soon as you've had your fill of xp and/or don't care about items, you're best off to just run. I suspect that's why they fill DLC with so many unique weapons, so no matter what xp level you are, you won't blitz through your first time.
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Aug 8, 2018 02:54
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You should fight the enemies because it's fun!
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Aug 8, 2018 05:33
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Speaking of the Souls games, this area is reminding me a lot of the Duke's Archives - and the mad patients remind me a bit of the bloathead enemies in Artorias of the Abyss.
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Aug 8, 2018 05:36
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Yeah the Research Hall really does seem like "Duke's Archives, By Tim Burton" in some ways doesn't it lol
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Aug 8, 2018 05:40
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It's interesting you were implying the patients were real people trapped in the nightmare. I had interpreted it very differently. What if they're just constructs like the very scenery? Not real people but creations of those trapped inside, like the 2 grand cathedrals.
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Aug 8, 2018 06:03
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Not necessarily the patients, for reasons we'll see in the next episode it's a little bit impossible for them to be real people and still be alive in their condition even by Bloodborne's standards. The few church folks still hanging around, though, I'd say they're likely real people stuck in a twisted representation of the hell they created for the patients in the real world.
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Aug 8, 2018 06:27
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CJacobs posted:Yeah the Research Hall really does seem like "Duke's Archives, By Tim Burton" in some ways doesn't it lol I definitely agree with what you said about FromSoft's use of verticality in their games. I can't even imagine the effort that went into designing the research area's gimmick.
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Aug 8, 2018 07:52
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Definitely anything that acts or is shaped like a Hunter is a real person trapped in this nightmare, and I think anyone you directly talk to is one, but the enemies are largely not yeah. This does mean that the Research Hall sidequest is a real person of course, and I have a theory for why she's here based on how I think the Nightmare Functions, which I'll explain once the DLC is over. Also, fun fact, the enemies in the Research Hall are indeed blind, not deaf though, and they have awareness around them. This does mean you can sneak up on them pretty easily by walking around until you kick a bottle or activate one of them and then their screaming aggros the lot of them. I disagree that the research hall is attempting to make Blood Saints, but what they're trying for is spoilery at this point in time. Honestly the DLC is a lot easier to discuss after you do everything in the main game because it's a lot of backstory/information about how certain things went down historically. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 09:09 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 08:51
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The two hunters at the altar are just especially infuriating given that the Old Hunters are such better implementations of the same basic concept. Instead, they have maxed stats and are just generally bullshit. I'm not sure if blood saints are the only sources of healing blood. I mean I always assumed the blood vial pickups that you got were literally just drawing blood from the infused people of Yharnam. Blood already explicitly has supernatural potency in Bloodborne, anyways. Maybe the Blood Saints are for special magic blood? Jetrauben fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 09:04
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Nah, Adella's blood (and an item we will receive in the next episode) explains what Blood Saints are pretty explicitly.quote:Blood taken from Adella, nun of the Healing Church. Restores an amount of HP, then continues to gradually restore HP for a short time. Blood Saints are created by the healing church as living farms for pure healing blood that hasn't been infected with the plague. It's probably not the only source of healing blood they have (which I did not say), but it's not purestrain old blood which by comparison practically guarantees infection and beasthood. If I had to guess I'd say that they likely exist as a way for the healing church to 'convert' old blood into healing blood. Lord_Magmar posted:I disagree that the research hall is attempting to make Blood Saints, but what they're trying for is spoilery at this point in time. Honestly the DLC is a lot easier to discuss after you do everything in the main game because it's a lot of backstory/information about how certain things went down historically. edit: After rethinking it yeah you're right, the goal of the Research Hall here is something else that's very tangible, but the blood saint thing is definitely important as we will see. I misspoke a little in saying that it is their main goal, when really it's more like the means to an end. I'll make sure to rectify my statements from this episode in the next one. CJacobs fucked around with this message at 10:00 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 09:38
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Oh yeah the blood saints absolutely matter, I mentioned the side quest for a reason, but not as the end point or even a particularly common means, just because they're proof you can purify the blood. I also don't think their blood is particularly clean of infection or anything, just because of the true nature of the blood, but it is more potent and pure and powerful absolutely. But as I said a lot of my opinions on what's actually going on in this game are based on later information/bosses so I can't really discuss it properly here. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 14:14 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 14:08
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bony tony posted:Hang on, the lyrics aren't just AAAAAAAAAAAAAA? There's a fun spin on choral music for a climactic fight scene in the new(ish) Deadpool movie. There are minor spoilers in the lyrics, if you care about that sort of thing in a silly comic book movie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0pt-hONuSA
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Aug 8, 2018 16:11
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Lord_Magmar posted:Oh yeah the blood saints absolutely matter, I mentioned the side quest for a reason, but not as the end point or even a particularly common means, just because they're proof you can purify the blood. I also don't think their blood is particularly clean of infection or anything, just because of the true nature of the blood, but it is more potent and pure and powerful absolutely. But being a blood saint invites other, very dire problems. You trade the beast plague for another problem.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:34
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CJacobs posted:
The church hunter in white isn't really saying a different prayer than Amelia, she's just skipping the first part ("Let us pray, let us wish... to partake in communion... Let us partake in communion... and feast upon the old blood. Our thirst for blood satiates us, soothes our fears. Seek the old blood..."), instead starting each loop from "...But beware the frailty of men"
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Aug 8, 2018 23:24
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Psychepath posted:It's bad game design that the Souls series gets a weird pass for that the only reasons to kill enemies are to collect experience and static items, but as soon as you've had your fill of xp and/or don't care about items, you're best off to just run. I suspect that's why they fill DLC with so many unique weapons, so no matter what xp level you are, you won't blitz through your first time. I think that's by design. Your first time through an area, you don't know where you're going, where items and enemies are, or which areas are safe, so the best thing to do is carefully advance, explore, and dispatch anything that attacks you. Once you know where you're going, whether it's because you died in a later area, or are on a new game +, you can save yourself time by running past everything. Edit: And thinking back to how many attempts some of the tougher bosses in this series can require, fighting everything between the bonfire/lantern and fog door every time would be very tedious. ponzicar fucked around with this message at 07:27 on Aug 11, 2018 |
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Aug 11, 2018 07:20
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ponzicar posted:I think that's by design. Your first time through an area, you don't know where you're going, where items and enemies are, or which areas are safe, so the best thing to do is carefully advance, explore, and dispatch anything that attacks you. Once you know where you're going, whether it's because you died in a later area, or are on a new game +, you can save yourself time by running past everything. I killed everything from the lamp on EVERY TIME I died my first run-through up until around Cainhurst. I also farmed actual blood vials the first half the game before I realized I could buy them...
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Aug 11, 2018 16:00
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 Everyone stumbles at some point. But whether you are able to fall down seven times and stand up seven times, or only stand up six, there's one thing for sure: You're probably better off just being yourself rather than becoming a disembodied head in a grocery bag.
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Sep 4, 2018 22:37
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Yeah that music is awesome. But I have to raise my hand and admit Living Failures killed me once or twice. Though in NG+ I just beastbloodpellet spammed them at their spawn points.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:10
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There's a reason the first thing I do in the video upon entering the fight is collect my bloodstain lol. They are not to be underestimated.
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Sep 5, 2018 00:29
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Man, just look at those massed, incredibly hard-hitting enemies swinging right through each other to hit you, while not damaging each other... It's a well-worn criticism at this point, but in games that focus so much on positioning in combat, it's pretty glaring. If From Software makes another Souls-like game, it's one of the big things I hope they fix. Alongside actually releasing it on PC this time. (Sony  )
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Sep 5, 2018 00:53
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So hey, we now know basically what the research hall was trying, and failing based on this boss, to do. Produce the Blue Man Groups newest power performers.
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Sep 5, 2018 02:25
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gently caress the headbutts as they can get you when you are already on the ground.
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Sep 5, 2018 02:38
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I will say this boss is really easy if you load up on visceral attack based runes, there’s some quirky programming where the game assumes you visceral all 4 living failures every time you visceral 1 of them. Causing you to fully heal with any healing on visceral rune, and gain 8-16 bullets with the bullet return rune. It helps they have giant parry windows on every melee attack, and giant backstab windows on every magic attack. Also there can only be 4 at a time, and the other reason visceral are so good is each Failure has an invisible health bar which viscerals will tend to kill in one go with plenty of extra damage, which increases the damage the boss fight as a whole takes significantly because whilst the individual failures die in a specific amount of damage any additional damage on the killing blow is still taken from the overall health bar. Lastly the meteors only come from one direction so you can always hide behind the Lumenflower Tree in the middle and never be hit by the meteor barrage. Next time once the side quest for the Brain Fluid Lady is done I’ll probably give my interpretation of what’s up with the research hall, and why I think the Living Failures Failed compared to the Celestial Emissary. But having rewatched the Orphanage episode to the.end I think part of it is my interpreted timeline is different to yours CJacobs. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 03:08 on Sep 5, 2018 |
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Sep 5, 2018 02:58
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I think they wrote that music purely with the meteor attack in mind because it is such a neat effect and "Whaaaaaat is going on now" moment.
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Sep 5, 2018 05:51
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I love that the Living Failures, pale imitations of the Celestial Emissary, are better than the actual real Celestial Emissary at making contact with the stars and cosmos.
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Sep 5, 2018 06:12
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As much as the Living Failures are obviously big Emissaries, they also remind me a hell of a lot of the Yetis/Giant Lost Child from the Nightmare. Mainly their big blobby head. Also, the moment when they first summon meteorites and the sky turns into a starscape is an incredible mind gently caress. Megillah Gorilla fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Sep 5, 2018 |
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Sep 5, 2018 08:11
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CJacobs posted:I love that the Living Failures, pale imitations of the Celestial Emissary, are better than the actual real Celestial Emissary at making contact with the stars and cosmos. They're better at casting magic, actually making contact with the Great Ones, not so much I imagine. Also, like their melted head suggests they're really goddamn stupid when they fight, no elegance or thought just swinging and slow magic. Also, unlike the Emissary when they call the cosmic magic, which the Emissary can do just not the ridiculous meteor storm, it requires a lot more concentration and stops them from doing anything else. The Emissary in his third phase can just spawn lasers above his head and then keep wailing on you. I'm also pretty sure they came first, but that gets into timeline stuff. Also agreeing with everyone that the Meteor Attack is really good, I honestly love all the bosses in the DLC for similar reasons as Ludwig and The Living Failures, they use music extremely well imo. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 09:22 on Sep 5, 2018 |
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Sep 5, 2018 08:57
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Kibayasu posted:I think they wrote that music purely with the meteor attack in mind because it is such a neat effect and "Whaaaaaat is going on now" moment.
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Sep 5, 2018 09:07
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Shei-kun posted:"Okay, I've got their pattern down. I can do this. Wait, what are they doing? Where did the skybox g-oh no." Yeah, that moment was loving cool and no mistake 
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Sep 5, 2018 11:46
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Megillah Gorilla posted:As much as the Living Failures are obviously big Emissaries, they also remind me a hell of a lot of the Yetis/Giant Lost Child from the Nightmare. Mainly their big blobby head. I can kinda see it from a silhouette standpont, but designwise and context-wise they're very different. The Giant Lost Children are part of the Dreamlands, specifically the Pthumerian city of Loran, and seem to be almost domesticated by the Loran Silverbeasts (their wrists are wrapped in ropes, signifying that they have been bound, and they have massive scars on their backs from the Silverbeasts' claws).
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Sep 5, 2018 15:42
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Given that we are in the nightmare and things are more unreal than usual, is it possible the living failures were never able to contact the cosmos in the real world, and it is only here in this place that they can be as potent as they might have been meant to be?
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Sep 5, 2018 19:56
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It is possible! Although that begs the question that I asked before rotating the stairs, which is just how much of the Nightmare is actually real and how much of it is fabricated cthulu nonsense. It's more of a philosophical question I guess because there's really no way to know outside of the few things we have seen (and will see) that are concrete, established real people and places. Maybe the Living Failures weren't actually alive at all in the real world. And if the research hall patients are real, surely they didn't end up as rolling sacked heads and headless bodies stumbling around- the real world of Yharnam has some pretty fantastical mutants running around, but with the real creatures you never really have to ask "how is this thing even alive?"
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Sep 5, 2018 20:07
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Megillah Gorilla posted:As much as the Living Failures are obviously big Emissaries, they also remind me a hell of a lot of the Yetis/Giant Lost Child from the Nightmare. Mainly their big blobby head. They always reminded me of these dudes from Metal Slug 3:  visually and thematically
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Sep 5, 2018 21:25
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Personally, I'm leaning towards the thought that the Living Failures never existed, or at least in the form that you fought them in. Assuming that the Hunter's Nightmare is just that and nothing more, which is to say an everlasting mental punishment for Hunters who sinned (at least until you stick a sword in them, RIP Ludwig), then this asylum might be the torment of this Lady Maria, with the patients and Living Failures being nightmarish representations of what she might have had to witness and be complicit with in the real world. For example, we know the Church was trying to turn people into Kin, and the Living Failures might be what she feared would happen as a result- misshapen abominations capable of calling the stars themselves to fall on you. What is most interesting to me is that the patients in her mind (assuming this IS a personalized hell of her own making) hold Maria in high esteem, either begging her for mercy they seemed to have reasonably expected, or even being a little playful with her (cf: that blob who thinks she's a robin). This seems to imply that Maria might have been actually been nice to the patients even by our standards, and not 'nice by the standards of the Church'. And while she might not have done anything to really ease their suffering (she wouldn't be here otherwise), she might have done her part to care for them, which is why she'd be tormented with the patients' begging voices, asking for little bits of comfort here and there, but as incapable of actually easing their suffering in the Nightmare as she was incapable (or unwilling to do) in life.
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Sep 6, 2018 02:16
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