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Yardbomb
Jul 11, 2011

What's with the eh... bretonnian dance, sir?

Calaveron posted:

Ham burgers...

De bun.. too dry, de lettuce.. days old at best.

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Antioch
Apr 18, 2003
All the usual complaints about the new World of Warcraft expansion aside, I'm having fun. I don't play enough to burn out, and I only really play with friends so the "community" isn't an issue.

But holy God almighty the Troll voices and dialogue. I love trolls but this is seriously making me reconsider that stance.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Digirat posted:

I haven’t played it myself but by all accounts, starbound

Oh? I tend to not notice anything until well after the fact. I thought Starbound was just a knockoff Terraria that petered out during Development. I wanna hear about the behind the scenes BS.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.

rydiafan posted:

"his dislike of the Metroid Prime games" and "the failure of the Metroid Prime games" are not synonymous.

Crazy shitheads often dislike good things.

I still don't get it. Prime features Samus as a tough, highly competent, driven woman who's horrifyingly deadly and capable and has slight hints that she might be a lesbian.


Though I suppose Japan, so no wonder they backed off hard from that in favor of Other M's take on Samus. Funny how that pretty well killed the franchise.

Len
Jan 21, 2008

Pouches, bandages, shoulderpad, cyber-eye...

Bitchin'!


What the hell did I miss by not find finishing Prime 2 or 3 that Samus is now a lesbian

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.

Len posted:

What the hell did I miss by not find finishing Prime 2 or 3 that Samus is now a lesbian

You didn't miss anything, but she is unusually close to the female bounty hunter in 3 and is much more affected by her death than by the deaths of the others.

I chose to interpret that as Samus having had feelings for her, but I freely admit it's nothing more than an ambiguous hint that they were close.


Like any Nintendo game would actually have a canon queer character, much less a franchise protagonist. Japan is one of the most conservative countries on Earth that isn't a theocracy, and Nintendo is dedicated to the inoffensive mass market.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Len posted:

What the hell did I miss by not find finishing Prime 2 or 3 that Samus is now a lesbian

I'm missing that one too. It might be her interactions with Gandrayda, the female shapeshifting bounty hunter from Prime 3, but I think Gandrayda's just a flirt.

Cythereal posted:

I still don't get it. Prime features Samus as a tough, highly competent, driven woman who's horrifyingly deadly and capable and has slight hints that she might be a lesbian.


Though I suppose Japan, so no wonder they backed off hard from that in favor of Other M's take on Samus. Funny how that pretty well killed the franchise.

And again, it was mostly Sakamoto, the original creator of Metroid. Metroid was never big in Japan, and most of the time that doesn't seem to bother Nintendo, but it might've been the reason they specifically had a Japanese-designed, written and developed Metroid after the Primes at all. And there's nothing wrong with that on its face; I remember a lot of hype when it was announced and all we had to go on was 'the Ninja Gaiden developers are making a Metroid'.

It was really just Sakamoto that hosed it up. And the writing was on the wall for that for literally years beforehand: the famous 'Ridley gives Samus PTSD' scene was taken almost verbatim from a Super Metroid tie-in manga he wrote. Well, the parts that weren't borrowed from Smash Bros. Brawl, at least.

Len
Jan 21, 2008

Pouches, bandages, shoulderpad, cyber-eye...

Bitchin'!


I just went and watched all three death scenes and the lady hunter has Samus getting to watch her, the other two she'd already murdered once, and herself die. Pretty sure that would shake anyone up.

Im too lazy to find any cutscenes where the hunters interact in non-violent ways though. I should really replay those games someday but then I'd have to use a wiimote again and hard pass.

Yardbomb
Jul 11, 2011

What's with the eh... bretonnian dance, sir?

Cythereal posted:

Though I suppose Japan, so no wonder they backed off hard from that in favor of Other M's take on Samus.

Don't do this weird thing, other than places like famitsu giving the usual :thunk: ratings japan wasn't particularly hot on the game either.



Other M is obvious, A rank is Metroid Prime 3, C is (Wii port) Metroid Prime 2 and the B is (Wii port) Metroid Prime.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.

Yardbomb posted:

Don't do this weird thing, other than places like famitsu giving the usual :thunk: ratings japan wasn't particularly hot on the game either.



Other M is obvious, A rank is Metroid Prime 3, C is (Wii port) Metroid Prime 2 and the B is (Wii port) Metroid Prime.

That's not what I meant.

I meant that Other M to me feels like a very... Japanese take on Samus. Physically smaller and less imposing than normal to the point that her arm cannon is about half its normal size, she's obsessed with being a mother, she mentally turns into a little girl anytime she encounters her archenemy, and she's very meek, demure, and submissive to everyone (all men) she meets.

Barudak
May 7, 2007

It was designed, in large part, in an effort to make Metroid appeal to Japanese audiences because the games did terrible there and very well in the west. Its an explicit thing they talked about during development. Then Other M came out and tanked in Japan, tanked in America, and still did better in the US than Japan and Nintendo finally sort of maybe got the hint now that theyre making Metroid Prime 4

rydiafan
Mar 17, 2009


Cythereal posted:

I still don't get it. Prime features Samus as a tough, highly competent, driven woman

And that's what he didn't like. He wanted a pathetic, weak girl who obeyed what a man told her to do, apparently.

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




Hey, just because the discussion has now tilted to games with potential that got smothered in their sleep, I just want to say that Dragon Quest 11 is fantastic and the music is the only problem I have with it besides the costumes.

Safeword
Jun 1, 2018

by R. Dieovich
I wish I was more invested in the Spiderman lore, because I can't take any villains particularly seriously, or get invested in with them like I could the arkham antagonists.

Even putting aside several games of development, the likes of Taskmaster and Mister Negative can't compare with Riddler and Scarecrow.

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011

Safeword posted:

I wish I was more invested in the Spiderman lore, because I can't take any villains particularly seriously, or get invested in with them like I could the arkham antagonists.

Even putting aside several games of development, the likes of Taskmaster and Mister Negative can't compare with Riddler and Scarecrow.

Who's being Mister Negative now. :rolleyes:

Somfin
Oct 25, 2010

In my🦚 experience🛠️ the big things🌑 don't teach you anything🤷‍♀️.

Nap Ghost

RareAcumen posted:

Hey, just because the discussion has now tilted to games with potential that got smothered in their sleep, I just want to say that Dragon Quest 11 is fantastic and the music is the only problem I have with it besides the costumes.

I love when you can feel the good game peeking through the cracks of a bad one. And these days if you're lucky the good one can actually show up! Gungeon is good now

Safeword
Jun 1, 2018

by R. Dieovich

MiddleOne posted:

Who's being Mister Negative now. :rolleyes:

You've certainly taken me to Task.

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


Safeword posted:

I wish I was more invested in the Spiderman lore, because I can't take any villains particularly seriously, or get invested in with them like I could the arkham antagonists.

Even putting aside several games of development, the likes of Taskmaster and Mister Negative can't compare with Riddler and Scarecrow.

Spiderman villains always come off like they really don't want to win, as if they're only bad guys because they love being bad and if Spiderman wins (which is always) it's just oopsie-daisies.

bewilderment
Nov 22, 2007
man what



exquisite tea posted:

Spiderman villains always come off like they really don't want to win, as if they're only bad guys because they love being bad and if Spiderman wins (which is always) it's just oopsie-daisies.

Depends on the guy. Like, Shocker is in the game and taken out early because he canonically is just a punch-clock villain who just thinks robbing banks is the easiest way to make money (especially since once he became a felon it got a lot harder to get ar real job).
Though there's also self-parodies like THE WALL

Attestant
Oct 23, 2012

Don't judge me.
I like Spider-Man the best when it embraces the slightly silly and hammy enemies, and just has fun with the whole thing. I don't need to find the Rhino threatening, I just wanna hear funny banter between him and Spider-man, while basically playing cops and robbers. :shobon:

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011

bewilderment posted:

Depends on the guy. Like, Shocker is in the game and taken out early because he canonically is just a punch-clock villain who just thinks robbing banks is the easiest way to make money (especially since once he became a felon it got a lot harder to get ar real job).
Though there's also self-parodies like THE WALL


Hey I saw the Dark Souls video, THE WALL is terrifying.

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


The greatest tragedy here is that Spiderman is a Mets fan.

Vic
Nov 26, 2009

malae fidei cum XI_XXVI_MMIX
Note he went to a game in costume. Spider-Man is a Mets fan, while Peter Parker is a Yankees fan.

ilmucche
Mar 16, 2016

What did you say the strategy was?
Green goblin is a cackling madman who throws pumpkin (spiced, I hope) bombs at people while rocketing around on his flying skateboard. Pretty sure he isn't too serious.

Wasn't there a villain that was just water? From the 90s show I seem to remember him trying to body slam spiderman, missing and splashing himself everywhere so he couldn't reconstitute. Spidey says he'll come back one day, after he evaporates and reforms in the clouds lol

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

Cleretic posted:

It was really just Sakamoto that hosed it up.

Didn't he also mandate the dumbass control scheme.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."
I thought he wanted a worse one and the one that was released was a compromise.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

John Murdoch posted:

Didn't he also mandate the dumbass control scheme.

Yes. Team Ninja suggested using the nunchuck, Sakamoto said no. Given what we know now, this might've possibly been because the Prime series used that control scheme.

What they did manage to get Sakamoto to back down on, for the record: he wanted it to be on-rails. Unclear what exactly that means, whether he wanted a rail shooter or maybe something like Killer7, but either way that shows a critical misunderstanding of the game series he himself invented.

Samuringa
Mar 27, 2017

Best advice I was ever given?

"Ticker, you'll be a lot happier once you stop caring about the opinions of a culture that is beneath you."

I learned my worth, learned the places and people that matter.

Opened my eyes.

Safeword posted:

I wish I was more invested in the Spiderman lore, because I can't take any villains particularly seriously, or get invested in with them like I could the arkham antagonists.

Even putting aside several games of development, the likes of Taskmaster and Mister Negative can't compare with Riddler and Scarecrow.

I love Taskmaster because he knows full well he is a gun for hire and doesn't want none of this "Take over the world" poo poo, he does his job, get his pay and fucks off.

Don't know how he is portrayed in the game though.

Calaveron
Aug 7, 2006
:negative:

Samuringa posted:

I love Taskmaster because he knows full well he is a gun for hire and doesn't want none of this "Take over the world" poo poo, he does his job, get his pay and fucks off.

Don't know how he is portrayed in the game though.

Tries to do his job, can’t because Spidey’s too good, and fucks off

CordlessPen
Jan 8, 2004

I told you so...
I don't like a trend that I think I'm noticing where games, mostly loot-based games, will indicate damage in DPS rather than some kind of attack rating or hit point. I get that they're trying to be helpful and not make it seem like faster weapons are poo poo, but knowing the base damage is so much more useful than having the DPS calculated for you that I really wonder why they bother. Like, a slow but powerful weapon could have the same DPS as a faster one, but the fact that the first attack would kill in one hit makes a world of difference. It's also not clear what formula they use when calculating DPS as it varies in every game.

I think the most annoying place I've seen it is in Dead Cells, because not only is it not helpful for the usual reasons, the weapons show a second, higher number that indicates the damage a weapon does on a critical hit. Thing is, criticals aren't random, they're actually pretty easy to control (a bunch of them is just "every Xth hit is a crit", sometimes it's hits against a wall, timed hits, etc.), so the game tells you the DPS of just regular attacks and the DPS of just critical attacks, but it means squat in actual use because it doesn't take into account how often criticals happen.

It's not the worst thing in the world, but if the game gave me a base number for damage and criticals, I could work the rest after just a bit of use, but because it tells me the DPS of each kind of hit, I have to "undo" that formula and guesstimate how much damage a weapon would actually do considering that every third hit is a guaranteed critical.

Safeword
Jun 1, 2018

by R. Dieovich

Samuringa posted:

I love Taskmaster because he knows full well he is a gun for hire and doesn't want none of this "Take over the world" poo poo, he does his job, get his pay and fucks off.

Related, but I really enjoyed The Old Republic's Bounty Hunter story for this reason - you could maintain professional standards of "do the job you're paid to do (and so god almighty help you if you've lied to me about the mission) then split", without it being portrayed in a cackling villain type of way. If the funds were still there, sure you'd help out whatever side wanted you, but once the money dries up...

Attestant posted:

I like Spider-Man the best when it embraces the slightly silly and hammy enemies, and just has fun with the whole thing. I don't need to find the Rhino threatening, I just wanna hear funny banter between him and Spider-man, while basically playing cops and robbers. :shobon:

Yeah, I think my main issue is that other Spidey quips the main plot feels pretty dry so far. Other than Mister Negative and Shocker I haven't been fighting anyone too flamboyant; even then the former is righteously evil, and the latter is portrayed as frightened and coerced so the humour normally attached to him isn't there.

Maybe this is just a result of me being better attached to Batman because I don't have any real experience with his comic counterpart. To me he's a product of the film and gaming industry, not comics, so I didn't go into Arkham with any preconceptions.

Schubalts
Nov 26, 2007

People say bigger is better.

But for the first time in my life, I think I've gone too far.

Samuringa posted:

I love Taskmaster because he knows full well he is a gun for hire and doesn't want none of this "Take over the world" poo poo, he does his job, get his pay and fucks off.

Don't know how he is portrayed in the game though.

The best Taskmaster is still
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgJtlYb6c0M

Barudak
May 7, 2007

Livelock is not a very good game, let no one accuse it otherwise. The achievements for it, however, are pretty easy so I was grinding out the last one which was to kill [x] of enemies of every enemy type in the game. For a game that requires three playthroughs to get everything else, why was that last?

One enemy needs to be killed 25 times but only appears in one level, at the very end, and there are 3 of them. Even getting the 9 kills for beating the game three times, you still need to run through that level another 6 times and even speed running its about 6 minutes to finish, and if you arent it could be well over 10 minutes a run.

Der Kyhe
Jun 25, 2008

Cleretic posted:


Most of the games that got famously stuck in development hell for years were this, too, usually stemming from a key developer getting too ambitious and/or fickle and eventually having to face reality; Duke Nukem Forever, Daikatana and Final Fantasy XV all had to deal with that.

And of course, if executive meddling counts, there's a whole slew of others.

Asset-wise Duke Nukem Forever was a trilogy, which managed to publish only one game. And that after the bankruptcy asset sales.

If they had curb-stomped that sack of potatoes that was the owner and lead designer of the 3Drealms, they would have had one game to rival the original Half-life, second one to rival the Unreal 2 and third one to go against Doom 3.

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

What about that game where the baseballman bankrupted Rhode Island

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

Samuringa posted:

I love Taskmaster because he knows full well he is a gun for hire and doesn't want none of this "Take over the world" poo poo, he does his job, get his pay and fucks off.

Don't know how he is portrayed in the game though.

I am having no luck finding it, but there was an issue of a comic book I read recently where some villain, I think Zemo, was bragging to Misty Knight (iirc) about how he was going to win anyway despite the defeat he had plainly suffered because he had left Taskmaster with instructions to blow up some nukes. At which point Misty simply calls Task up and puts him on the monitor, where he explains that he was now being paid more to not follow through with the plan.

Safeword
Jun 1, 2018

by R. Dieovich
There was a neat villain in that Marvel Diablo RPG that, upon being offered infinite cosmic power, promptly shat himself and ran to the Avengers about who was offering them this power - this guy was just a thief with ghost powers thank you, and was very happy with a status quo that let him make money so easily.

Safeword
Jun 1, 2018

by R. Dieovich
I retract my complaint about the villains. Act 3 in Spiderman goes absolutely mental.

Attestant
Oct 23, 2012

Don't judge me.

Safeword posted:

I retract my complaint about the villains. Act 3 in Spiderman goes absolutely mental.

I was trying real hard not to say anything. :allears:

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Samuringa
Mar 27, 2017

Best advice I was ever given?

"Ticker, you'll be a lot happier once you stop caring about the opinions of a culture that is beneath you."

I learned my worth, learned the places and people that matter.

Opened my eyes.

marshmallow creep posted:

I am having no luck finding it, but there was an issue of a comic book I read recently where some villain, I think Zemo, was bragging to Misty Knight (iirc) about how he was going to win anyway despite the defeat he had plainly suffered because he had left Taskmaster with instructions to blow up some nukes. At which point Misty simply calls Task up and puts him on the monitor, where he explains that he was now being paid more to not follow through with the plan.

He got bad days too



There's also this one bit during Siege - the event where Norman Osborn decides to take down Asgard - where he is freaking the gently caress out because just the idea of it is completely above his pay grade and, as a lower level mook, he knows he'll be the first one to get vaporized.

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