awful programming: feature flags and suffering

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Soricidus: Oct 21, 2010; freedom-hating statist shill

ctps: major third-party dependency finally has a version that supports java 9+ so now we're looking at updating our stuff! :toot:

except we still have to support java 8 as well. multi-release jars look like the way to go but every time i look into how to actually produce them i find myself contemplating a career change

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:01

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# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:09

CPColin: Sep 9, 2003; Big ol' smile.

AggressivelyStupid posted:

ctps:
code:
#define MAX1(a, b) (a < b) ? (b) : (a) 
.
.
.
.
#define MAX13(a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i, j, k, l, m, n) (MAX12(a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i, j, k, l, m) < n) ? (l) : MAX12(a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i, j, k, l, m) 
i'm going to track down whoever the gently caress did this and beat them mercilessly with a goddamn sock full of quarters

please raise bail money

Yeah!

It should be MAX2 to MAX14!

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:04

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

Soricidus posted:

ctps: major third-party dependency finally has a version that supports java 9+ so now we're looking at updating our stuff!

except we still have to support java 8 as well. multi-release jars look like the way to go but every time i look into how to actually produce them i find myself contemplating a career change

2 separate poms targeting the same source w/ additional source includes based on version is probably the easiest, laziest way.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:09

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

theoretically you can do it all in a single pom w/ multiple executions but idk that seems like it might confuse people.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:09

AggressivelyStupid: Jan 9, 2012

It actually goes higher, and the last three all return "l" if the abomination is less than the final value,

code:


MAX(..., m) < n ? l : MAX(..., m)
MAX(..., n) < o ? l : MAX(..., n)

finding the max value in something is a solved problem, and this ain't it :psyduck:

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:13

pangstrom: Jan 25, 2003; Wedge Regret

AggressivelyStupid posted:

i'm going to track down whoever the gently caress did this and beat them mercilessly with a goddamn sock full of quarters

please raise bail money

Just so you do this the efficient way, you should beat them with 13 socks. The first has two quarters. The second has one quarter and then another sock with two quarters. The third has one quarter and then a sock with a quarter and inside THAT sock is a sock with two quarters...

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:18

Fiedler: Jun 29, 2002; I, for one, welcome our new mouse overlords.

akadajet posted:

microsoft does this all of the time. visual source safe is my favorite one of these

vss was axed over a decade ago in favor of TFS, which was used internally from its inception

mystes posted:

Isn't "VS for mac" just a rebranded version of Xamarin Studio? It's not really "visual studio" any more than vscode is.

features from vs (like the editor) are being ported to vs for mac. it's getting better.

raminasi posted:

wait are the “vs is good” “vs is ok at best” arguments had between c#/c++ devs? that would make a lot of sense

microsoft gives zero fucks about c++

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:29

gonadic io: Feb 16, 2011; >>=

my team just voted to do away with all rest APIs and databases and replace it all with kafka. we're entirely event based now!

when asked about our need for rest APIs and databases, apparently they're going to be done with ksql views instead now.

internally me and some like minded people are working on a tool so that you define a rest api and a service upstream will translate kafka events into rest calls for you since gently caress that.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:44

mystes: May 31, 2006

gonadic io posted:

my team just voted to do away with all rest APIs and databases and replace it all with kafka. we're entirely event based now!

when asked about our need for rest APIs and databases, apparently they're going to be done with ksql views instead now.

internally me and some like minded people are working on a tool so that you define a rest api and a service upstream will translate kafka events into rest calls for you since gently caress that.

Hmm, I feel like there has to be a joke in there somewhere.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:53

Skyl3lazer: Aug 27, 2007; [Dooting Stealthily]

raminasi posted:

wait are the �vs is good� �vs is ok at best� arguments had between c#/c++ devs? that would make a lot of sense

Oh yeah I do C#

# ? Oct 1, 2018 19:56

Fiedler: Jun 29, 2002; I, for one, welcome our new mouse overlords.

gonadic io posted:

internally me and some like minded people are working on a tool so that you define a rest api and a service upstream will translate kafka events into rest calls for you since gently caress that.

better idea: work on finding a new job

# ? Oct 1, 2018 20:21

Space Whale: Nov 6, 2014

My boss knew about literally hundreds of legacy systems including triggets, bots, scripts, apps - all untracked, not in source control, undocumented. Was also a cool dude. Got me my cool job. Stood up to upper management. Really fought hard for us.

Dude died today.

The bus factor is real.

:rip:

I have no idea how we're gonna figure this pile of lost knowledge out.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 21:13

akadajet: Sep 14, 2003

Fiedler posted:

microsoft gives zero fucks about c++

this is a good thing

# ? Oct 1, 2018 21:19

prisoner of waffles: May 8, 2007; Ah! well a-day! what evil looks
Had I from old and young!
Instead of the cross, the fishmech
About my neck was hung.

Space Whale posted:

My boss knew about literally hundreds of legacy systems including triggets, bots, scripts, apps - all untracked, not in source control, undocumented. Was also a cool dude. Got me my cool job. Stood up to upper management. Really fought hard for us.

Dude died today.

The bus factor is real.

I have no idea how we're gonna figure this pile of lost knowledge out.

woah

sorry for you and your company's loss

(also wth get that poo poo into source control ffs)

# ? Oct 1, 2018 21:23

Lime: Jul 20, 2004

Fiedler posted:

microsoft gives zero fucks about c++

then why are they putting so much work into their compiler?

# ? Oct 1, 2018 21:29

CRIP EATIN BREAD: Jun 24, 2002; Can't post for 6 hours!; Soiled Meat

Space Whale posted:

My boss knew about literally hundreds of legacy systems including triggets, bots, scripts, apps - all untracked, not in source control, undocumented. Was also a cool dude. Got me my cool job. Stood up to upper management. Really fought hard for us.

Dude died today.

The bus factor is real.

I have no idea how we're gonna figure this pile of lost knowledge out.

take all your vacation time right now, start looking for another job, and then give your notice afterwards

# ? Oct 1, 2018 21:33

champagne posting: Apr 5, 2006; YOU ARE A BRAIN
IN A BUNKER

akadajet posted:

this is a good thing

if we�re lucky we might be rid of it in two decades

to be replaced with nothing

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:09

Fiedler: Jun 29, 2002; I, for one, welcome our new mouse overlords.

Lime posted:

then why are they putting so much work into their compiler?

two reasons:
1) a vocal minority of the community gets all pissy about lack of support for new features
2) adding ever-more features to the language actually serves to hastens its demise

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:17

Zlodo: Nov 25, 2006

Fiedler posted:

two reasons:
1) a vocal minority of the community gets all pissy about lack of support for new features
2) adding ever-more features to the language actually serves to hastens its demise

3) there are entire industries with gigantic code bases in c++ and not going to switch off it anytime soon. we're not rewriting the world in rust tomorrow

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:23

prisoner of waffles: May 8, 2007; Ah! well a-day! what evil looks
Had I from old and young!
Instead of the cross, the fishmech
About my neck was hung.

Zlodo posted:

3) there are entire industries with gigantic code bases in c++ and not going to switch off it anytime soon. we're not rewriting the world in rust tomorrow

disagree. as soon as a programming language is not cool, all code written in it vanishes

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:30

gonadic io: Feb 16, 2011; >>=

Fiedler posted:

better idea: work on finding a new job

i'm going to work on the principle that despite it being agreed on in a meeting, nobody is going to do poo poo and i can just ignore it

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:32

JawnV6: Jul 4, 2004; So hot ...

prisoner of waffles posted:

disagree. as soon as a programming language is not cool, all code written in it vanishes

lol can you imagine

the entire field of RE vanishes overnight as desperate companies need to decompile binaries back into something usable

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:34

Fiedler: Jun 29, 2002; I, for one, welcome our new mouse overlords.

Zlodo posted:

3) there are entire industries with gigantic code bases in c++ and not going to switch off it anytime soon. we're not rewriting the world in rust tomorrow

this has no bearing in the decision. microsoft in general is perfectly happy to abandon legacy app development with legacy tools.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 22:54

mystes: May 31, 2006

Fiedler posted:

this has no bearing in the decision. microsoft in general is perfectly happy to abandon legacy app development with legacy tools.

C++/WinRT wouldn't exist if there was a consensus at Microsoft that C++ was obsolete. The Visual Studio people may feel otherwise, but unless Microsoft gives up on UWP completely they aren't going to be able to abandon C++.

# ? Oct 1, 2018 23:02

Zlodo: Nov 25, 2006

Fiedler posted:

this has no bearing in the decision. microsoft in general is perfectly happy to abandon legacy app development with legacy tools.

c++ development is not legacy development

for instance, they want game developers to continue being more comfortable using their tools and api (than for instance things less tied to windows such as vulkan), and they want development on the xbox one to be as cheap and easy as possible so they need to provide good tooling support there as well

# ? Oct 1, 2018 23:02

Fiedler: Jun 29, 2002; I, for one, welcome our new mouse overlords.

mystes posted:

C++/WinRT wouldn't exist if there was a consensus at Microsoft that C++ was obsolete. The Visual Studio people may feel otherwise, but unless Microsoft gives up on UWP completely they aren't going to be able to abandon C++.

c++/winrt was brought to you courtesy of the same bright minds responsible for windows 8.

Zlodo posted:

c++ development is not legacy development

for instance, they want game developers to continue being more comfortable using their tools and api (than for instance things less tied to windows such as vulkan), and they want development on the xbox one to be as cheap and easy as possible so they need to provide good tooling support there as well

games? might care if they started being a significant source of azure revenue, but otherwise...

# ? Oct 1, 2018 23:58

Zlodo: Nov 25, 2006

Fiedler posted:

games? might care if they started being a significant source of azure revenue, but otherwise...

they evidently care enough to pour tons of cash into staying relevant in that space
not that i would mind of the xbox one were to disappear some day, that'd be one less overly lovely platform to deal with

# ? Oct 2, 2018 00:01

Fiedler: Jun 29, 2002; I, for one, welcome our new mouse overlords.

tons of cash? not really, no. i mean, yeah, in absolute terms it's a lot of money but relative to overall revenue and investments elsewhere...

# ? Oct 2, 2018 00:07

Zlodo: Nov 25, 2006

and now for something more relevant to the thread than "c++ is obsolete" fantasies:

why

# ? Oct 2, 2018 00:19

H2Eau: Jun 2, 2010

gonadic io posted:

my team just voted to do away with all rest APIs and databases and replace it all with kafka. we're entirely event based now!

when asked about our need for rest APIs and databases, apparently they're going to be done with ksql views instead now.

internally me and some like minded people are working on a tool so that you define a rest api and a service upstream will translate kafka events into rest calls for you since gently caress that.

hmm yes these sweeping architectural changes will solve everything

# ? Oct 2, 2018 04:05

Corla Plankun: May 8, 2007; improve the lives of everyone

hyperfocusing on ways to make kafka act like sql is the terrible programmer equivalent of vegans who insist on eating tofurkey and soy corndogs

# ? Oct 2, 2018 05:29

eschaton: Mar 7, 2007; Don't you just hate when you wind up in a store with people who are in a socioeconomic class that is pretty obviously about two levels lower than your own?

just put an SQLite database in you Kafka in order to have something you can fetch and then query in your application

_{_{_{you�re welcome}}}

# ? Oct 2, 2018 08:51

gonadic io: Feb 16, 2011; >>=

eschaton posted:

just put an SQLite database in you Kafka in order to have something you can fetch and then query in your application

_{_{_{you�re welcome}}}

Each kafka message contains the updated state of the db file :q:

# ? Oct 2, 2018 09:04

Powerful Two-Hander: Mar 10, 2004; Mods please change my name to "Tooter Skeleton" TIA.

Space Whale posted:

My boss knew about literally hundreds of legacy systems including triggets, bots, scripts, apps - all untracked, not in source control, undocumented. Was also a cool dude. Got me my cool job. Stood up to upper management. Really fought hard for us.

Dude died today.

The bus factor is real.

I have no idea how we're gonna figure this pile of lost knowledge out.

that sucks.

my company just made a bunch of people redundant, in the case of two people representing a total of 50 years experience and knowledge, one was the dev team lead and we have stuff going back maybe 15 years that nobody left knows about.

gj there's so much documentation... hahahaha

# ? Oct 2, 2018 09:22

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

gonadic io posted:

Each kafka message contains the updated state of the db file

# ? Oct 2, 2018 10:12

Workaday Wizard: Oct 23, 2009; by Pragmatica

is the claim that kafka and dbs are isomorphic correct?

# ? Oct 2, 2018 11:14

ynohtna: Feb 16, 2007; backwoods compatible; Illegal Hen

Shinku ABOOKEN posted:

is the claim that kafka and dbs are isometric correct?

from a certain point of view, yes

# ? Oct 2, 2018 11:20

Chalks: Sep 30, 2009

c tp s:

code:

update dba.butt join dba.fart on fart."id" = 1 set butt.date1 = fart.date2;

Table '' not found
SQLCODE=-141, ODBC 3 State="42S02"
Line 1, column 1

Ok sure, cool.

# ? Oct 2, 2018 13:59

Finster Dexter: Oct 20, 2014; Beyond is Finster's mad vision of Earth transformed.

Powerful Two-Hander posted:

that sucks.

my company just made a bunch of people redundant, in the case of two people representing a total of 50 years experience and knowledge, one was the dev team lead and we have stuff going back maybe 15 years that nobody left knows about.

gj there's so much documentation... hahahaha

Oh geez that sucks. Good luck with that. Sounds like a huge mess