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Sapozhnik posted:The end-user story for installing these old OSes makes the dev story for embdev board bringup almost look easy by comparison. Just LOL if you use SPL. I too like making factory flashing harder for no reason! Also I love device trees. I really do not miss making board files from scratch with global structs having to be filled in.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:17
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yeah device trees are very ftw although i do wish the docs were easier to find / more up-to-date i really should get back into embdev, it's fun. there's way fewer jobs out there than there are for fart app bullshit though
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Nov 14, 2018 17:25
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Sapozhnik posted:yeah device trees are very ftw although I do wish the docs were easier to find / more up-to-date Yeah, that's why I have moved on to DevOps + Embedded. Once I learned Jenkins/TeamCity, K8s, Docker, and AWS I jumped quite a few figgies in salary. Combine that with Embedded on the side (I do board bringup as a 1099 for a few clients) and you can make a good chunk of change. Edit* " I do wish the docs were easier to find / more up-to-date" is the mantra of the entire kernel lol. Best to just stare at existing Device Tree files as examples.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:31
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Sapozhnik posted:The end-user story for installing these old OSes makes the dev story for embdev board bringup almost look easy by comparison. thing is, at least in HP’s case, that’s basically the story there too except the partition table type is different; I installed HP-UX 9.1 by booting and updating off CD unfortunately NetBSD doesn’t generate an LIF partition table for its hp300 ISO, and neither its installer nor its booter have had the necessary work done to get the data they need off an ISO-9660 filesystem yet (though support is in libsa) so network booting shenanigans are what’s needed
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Nov 14, 2018 19:15
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eschaton posted:I’m not even doing that, I’m just going direct from the 10Base-T MAU on the 9000 to a Thunderbolt to Gigabit adapter successfully loading fx or sash and then failing to move data over nfs was always the symptom of Ethernet suckage on SGIs with lance Ethernet similar issues with suns using hme — boot firmware can load mini root, but the os kernel shits itself until plugged into a hub I wouldn’t rule out Ethernet problems just yet
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Nov 15, 2018 06:30
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tbh I don’t really know if lance/tulip/hme actually sucked that bad, or if modern 10/100/1000 cards just have sloppy support for 10 mbps half duplex with csma/cd. all i know is that plugging old systems into a hub makes the problem go away
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Nov 15, 2018 06:34
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successfully loaded over NFS! I had my Thunderbolt Ethernet adapter set to 10.0.1.1 and had also set the NetBSD VM to 10.0.1.1, which worked OK for obtaining the bootstrap and for bootp, but not for RPC/NFS I switched the VM to 10.0.1.2 and I was able to actually load a kernel, though I didn’t actually get to the kernel banner so there’s still more to adapt; it’s possible I just needed to wait longer, but if so it was sure taking its time, or maybe I need to make more device files or something my next step is to try to boot the miniroot instead of a moderately complete diskless installation, since all I really want to do is put files on disk to boot from instead and the miniroot plus the CD should let me do that
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Nov 15, 2018 10:31
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eschaton posted:successfully loaded over NFS! I hope you do a writeup for computer archaeology purposes, figuring out the needs of old systems is a bit of a detective story. I've had similar woes with old sun rack servers and nbsd has it right, they always seem to need a hub/switch to operate sanely.
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Nov 15, 2018 16:18
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I’ll see about doing a write up doing a ./MAKEDEV all in the exported root’s /dev didn’t help and I still haven’t been able to boot past the bit that says what the start address is I wonder however if perhaps NetBSD isn’t just assuming that HP-9000/300 series systems should use a serial console, I’ll bring a serial adapter in tomorrow to see about that (this is a thing I fiddle with at work while building, running automated tests, etc.) I might also try to get NetBSD working in an emulated 9000/380 in MAME meanwhile, my 9000/332 doesn’t seem to work at all, it looked in good shape and has the FPU and 8MB RAM installed, but upon applying power all I get are all 8 status LEDs lit indicating it hasn’t even hit the boot ROM; other folks have suggested checking the PSU to ensure it’s providing all expected voltages, as evidently that’s a common failure mode for them also I have to wonder how NetBSD will feel in 8MB on a 16MHz 68030…
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Nov 16, 2018 05:22
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definitely looks like I’ll need to use a serial console for the moment, I have A1659 (CRX) graphics and there doesn’t seem to be a driver for that as I look at various bits of information online there’s an sti(4) driver that should be able to do basic text I/O, but it doesn’t seem like it’s actually being used for the console
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Nov 16, 2018 09:12
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i set up a new unix a few days ago, and for fun i tried to compile in the console kernel screensavers, but they switched over the console to the new vt() and the old cool screensavers no longer work  . they had this one called rain that was really nice
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Nov 16, 2018 09:27
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michael is up in arms about intels performance in the upcoming linux 4.20
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Nov 16, 2018 23:55
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larabel is an amd fanboy and nobody is happy about regressions connected to resolving horrible security bugs
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Nov 17, 2018 00:46
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turns out it did in fact just need a serial console! with that in place, it turns out I’m booting from NFS just fine theoretically NetBSD should allow sti(4) to handle console either as text or as a frame buffer via wscons, the messages at startup show its finding out everything necessary, but for some reason it’s not happening the next step is to blast the mini root to the right partition on the disk, boot from that, and install from the ISO
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Nov 17, 2018 01:07
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eschaton posted:turns out it did in fact just need a serial console! with that in place, it turns out I’m booting from NFS just fine 
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Nov 17, 2018 04:34
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Nov 17, 2018 04:39
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got partway through the installer and hit a bug, it saw the CD-ROM drive as/dev/cd0 but wouldn’t mount the CD as /dev/cd0a, so I had to run through it again, suspend it, mount the disc manually in /tmp, and continue by pointing the installer to the archives as if they were on the local filesystem I confirmed it was putting the files in place, too, though I had to shut down to head home (I’m not going to leave that old PSU running) before starting the install, I also managed to put the customer booter in place with installboot(8) and everything seemed to work I should do a build of NetBSD-current for hp300 and see if I can debug console support for my A1659 so I can bring up X
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Nov 17, 2018 05:03
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eschaton posted:I should do a build of NetBSD-current for hp300 and see if I can debug console support for my A1659 so I can bring up X i can't imagine the modern Xorg will be pleasant in 16 mb of ram not to mention, using the dumb framebuffer driver will be agonizingly slow
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Nov 18, 2018 03:05
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oh, I’m not doing this on the 9000/332 (which has its maximum of 8MB), I’d be doing this on the 425t which has 128MB in it also X works just fine in HP-UX 9.10 so it should work just as well on NetBSD
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Nov 19, 2018 11:29
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eschaton posted:also X works just fine in HP-UX 9.10 so it should work just as well on NetBSD X in HP-UX is accelerated X in netbsd will (probably) be a dumb framebuffer
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Nov 19, 2018 18:40
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:X in HP-UX is accelerated dsyp
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Nov 19, 2018 20:51
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unaccelerated X (or X with only block-move-and-replace, since it looks like that may be all the A1659/CRX/Elk supports) on an 8-bit framebuffer on a 25MHz 68040 won’t be that bad not like I’m going to run GNOME or KDE and unaccelerated DPS on a similarly spec’d NeXT is just fine, I’d expect X to be faster
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Nov 19, 2018 21:04
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seems like displaylink displays will finally get usable in wayland too https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=GNOME-3.32-Cogl-Mutter-DL-Opt
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Nov 20, 2018 09:33
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someone claims to have HP-UX working, with graphics, on the HP 9000/300 series emulation in MAME that surprises me given how broken and touchy said emulation seems to be, hopefully it’s just a matter of fixes going into master that didn’t make it to 0.203, or a matter of configuration they say they’re going to start working on support for the HP-Apollo 9000/400 series soon, too, which is pretty exciting
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Nov 21, 2018 04:29
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eschaton posted:someone claims to have HP-UX working, with graphics, on the HP 9000/300 series emulation in MAME yeah this poo poo makes me want to dig up my old tapes idk if i have a qic drive that still works
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Nov 21, 2018 04:35
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the belts have likely turned to goo both inside the drives and in the tapes what do you have? just old backups, or old system tapes? because if you have old system tapes I know people who can image them and will desperately want to, for preservation
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Nov 21, 2018 15:22
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it's literally a box in my mom's basement, unles she threw that poo poo out. there is definitely an hp-ux boot tape of some kind in there; idk what else i was a weird kid
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Nov 24, 2018 21:02
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love to deal with computer
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Nov 26, 2018 03:52
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eww, gross, virtualbox
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Nov 26, 2018 03:59
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Found why it wasn't working when I tried installing vbox 5.1 instead of 5.2. 5.1's message for that same error tells you to install kernel-core-devel, which isnt the right name for the package but at least it was more helpful than just "install headers"
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Nov 26, 2018 04:18
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brand engager posted:love to deal with computer virtualbox is for when you want to get nothing done for a week
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Nov 26, 2018 04:31
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Normally I don't condone self-abuse but if you really must use virtualbox then at least use dkms to build its kernel drivers, ye gods man
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Nov 26, 2018 04:32
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It's for a class, so I'm stuck using it
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Nov 26, 2018 04:38
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run the windows version of it inside kvm
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Nov 26, 2018 04:40
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about to do an "cyber op"
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Nov 26, 2018 04:47
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Oracle made the MacOS version extra pretty, or something,
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Nov 26, 2018 05:01
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MrMoo posted:Oracle made the MacOS version extra pretty, or something, LG webOS?
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Nov 26, 2018 05:28
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brand engager posted:It's for a class, so I'm stuck using it in that case get the pre-built packages from rpmfusion
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Nov 26, 2018 05:39
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brand engager posted:It's for a class, so I'm stuck using it get vmware player and use that instead. at worst you have to convert the vdi or vhd or whatever to vmware's format
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Nov 26, 2018 06:02
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Why does it even matter which vm thing I'm using? This isn't some long-term setup where extra janitoring to have the Correct Yospos Tooling can pay off in any way. Finals are the first week of december, and the whole thing is getting torn down.
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Nov 26, 2018 06:11
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