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Jedit posted:Away and throw shite at yourself. The weakest actor in the original group was Lauren Socha, who ironically turned out to be playing herself. The other four were all at least good, and if you're saying Iwan "Ramsay loving Bolton" Rheon can't act then you need your head seeing to. Sorry, I didn't really like any of them except the guy who left first. I think the show became less dour after those characters were all gone too.
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Dec 7, 2018 12:16
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Servoret posted:Sorry, I didn't really like any of them except the guy who left first. I think the show became less dour after those characters were all gone too. Not going to argue against your opinion, but I felt that a lot of them were pretty good actors throughout. It jumped the shark when they ran out of ideas and said 'hey, let's just swap powers for no reason' Jedit posted:The
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Dec 7, 2018 12:22
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I enjoyed Rudy as a character just because when Curtis thought he might be pregnant and he heard about it his first response was a genuinely delighted "Congratulations, mate! Here, our Curtis is pregnant!" which was adorable.
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Dec 7, 2018 13:24
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Servoret posted:I thought the last couple of seasons of Misfits after that got better and better. With all the original series regulars gone, they started hiring people who could act. The final group had fun interactions with each other. 
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Dec 7, 2018 14:59
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There was a problem with a lot of shows around the mid to late 00s I think trying to follow the coattails of  that got so caught up in their mysteries and myth arcs it became increasingly obvious they were not the slightest bit interested in any kind of resolution to anything at all. Way back with X-Files tried to string people along with the idea that there might be answers to half of those mysteries and tended to end with a wet fart and/or copious retcons.
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Dec 7, 2018 15:29
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Ghost Leviathan posted:There was a problem with a lot of shows around the mid to late 00s I think trying to follow the coattails of The X-Files gets brought up a lot, and the fact is, there was no mytharc until they needed to write Gillian Anderson out temporarily because she got knocked up. It worked for a while, but there never was any plan, so it eventually got too convoluted.
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Dec 7, 2018 15:32
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Iron Crowned posted:The X-Files gets brought up a lot, and the fact is, there was no mytharc until they needed to write Gillian Anderson out temporarily because she got knocked up. It worked for a while, but there never was any plan, so it eventually got too convoluted. Season 1 set up some things that appeared in season 2, like deep throat mentioning that there was a town where people were being dosed with alien goo through contaminated beef, but that’s about it.
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Dec 7, 2018 15:36
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The story I heard was Chris Carter never expected X-Files to be renewed, so there never was any great plan to resolve all the stuff they'd hinted at. Then the show got massively successful, and they spent the next few years desperately trying to make it all mean something. Probably would have been better if the show had ended with the first season, then got brought back a few years later. Basically, I want Alien Nation to have been the massive success and X-Files to be the show that got a cult following resulting in a few TV movies to wrap things up.
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Dec 7, 2018 16:45
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Everyone forgets about Brisco Country Jr. It had an arc, and wrapped it up in one season, and was planning to do something different for season 2 before it was cancelled.
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Dec 7, 2018 16:48
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Antifa Turkeesian posted:Season 1 set up some things that appeared in season 2, like deep throat mentioning that there was a town where people were being dosed with alien goo through contaminated beef, but that’s about it. X-Files was really meant to be a monster of the week kind of show. There wasn't supposed to be much continuity other than Mulder believing a lot of things that looked crazy and Scully being more skeptical and suspicious. Of course Mulder was usually right but Scully was supposed to try to discredit him as a total weirdo. Some of the long term arc writing pretty obviously just occasionally grabbed random poo poo from the early stuff and made a story out of it. Sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't. The Cigarette Smoking Man was actually just a background character who was just supposed to stand in the corner and smoke basically but they suddenly decided he was in with this shadowy group that wanted to get rid of Mulder because he was getting to close to the truth. Mulder also believed his sister was kidnapped by aliens but mostly that was portrayed as "guy is weird, believes crazy things." Then later they decided that it was ultimately true and look, here's his adult sister! Actually no gently caress you it was just a super clone lol. It was weird because some of the things Mulder believed were very clearly supposed to be false but then later on started randomly becoming true.
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Dec 7, 2018 16:53
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Sunswipe posted:The story I heard was Chris Carter never expected X-Files to be renewed, so there never was any great plan to resolve all the stuff they'd hinted at. Then the show got massively successful, and they spent the next few years desperately trying to make it all mean something. Probably would have been better if the show had ended with the first season, then got brought back a few years later. Davros1 posted:Everyone forgets about Brisco Country Jr. It had an arc, and wrapped it up in one season, and was planning to do something different for season 2 before it was cancelled. Both shows were on the cancellation bubble, and the X-Files barely squeaked into a renewal. I was pretty heartbroken at the time when Brisco County Jr. got cancelled. ToxicSlurpee posted:X-Files was really meant to be a monster of the week kind of show. There wasn't supposed to be much continuity other than Mulder believing a lot of things that looked crazy and Scully being more skeptical and suspicious. Of course Mulder was usually right but Scully was supposed to try to discredit him as a total weirdo. I think one of the more glaring examples of this to me was that somehow Mulder's dad was super important to all of it. I mean in what world does it make sense that somehow some conspiracy weirdo like Fox Mulder had gone 30+ years and never had a clue, or even an alien knickknack from the 60's.
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Dec 7, 2018 17:18
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Davros1 posted:Everyone forgets about Brisco Country Jr. Sho 'Nuff
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Dec 7, 2018 17:29
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Every episode of the X-Files: Scully: looks like this person was stabbed to death Mulder: actually there was an x file from 20 years ago where a spectral Bigfoot was sighted on a horse stabbing people with the biblical Lance of Longinus, I bet it was that again Scully: you're full of poo poo -40 MINUTES LATER- Mulder: look, there's a spectral Bigfoot on a horse stabbing people with the biblical Lance of Longinus, too bad the government erased all the pictures we took Scully:*in someone's office* the case remains....unsolved The end! Created by Chris Carter I made this!
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Dec 7, 2018 18:18
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Iron Crowned posted:Both shows were on the cancellation bubble, and the X-Files barely squeaked into a renewal. I was pretty heartbroken at the time when Brisco County Jr. got cancelled. I dunno, that kinda makes it funny. Shoulda done more where Mulder's wrong because what's going on is even weirder.
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Dec 7, 2018 18:20
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uvar posted:I remember liking a show called Threshold, which got cancelled (midway through shooting the season finale, just in time to avoid ending on a cliffhanger) because nobody cared. The Wikipedia page mentions that they had a three year arc planned with a new title for the show each year - Threshold/Foothold/Stranglehold - which seem like terrible names for a TV show out of context and a great way to confuse viewers if they'd ever gotten that far. I watched that in a marathon on I think it was syfy at that point. It was pretty good honestly. Basic premise was that aliens were using some sort of sound to change brain waves and convert people to their side. It was all part of some plan to take over Earth. But some people were caught up in some sort of Thing, and now have different brain waves. They can't be affected by the sound, but need to hide in a bunker (I think the aliens can track the brainwaves?). Threshold is the name of the contingency plan some gov't person put together just in case of aliens, as unlikely as it was. And I think she also has the brainwave thing because of coincidence maybe? And you could tell they knew they were being canceled, because the last episode was something where, irrc, the main character's son from the future somehow contacts them and tells them they're totally gonna win in the end and defeat all the aliens. Also Brent Spiner was in it I think. I might see if I can track it down to watch with my fiance. So, just read the wikipedia article. I was pretty close in general. It wasn't the main character's future son, it was the baby born to one of the infected during the episode, telepathically communicating with the main character and appearing as an older child. Had Peter Dinklage and Charles Dutton as main characters as well as Brent Spiner. purple death ray posted:Every episode of the X-Files: Yeah, I couldn't understand the point. I was expecting a show where things are often a grey area, and the skeptic and believer could both be right, with at least some amount of supernatural/alien/whatever being accepted over time as real by Scully, but Muller still being way out there and wrong sometimes. So when I actually got around to watching it after it was on a couple of seasons, I was really confused. I couldn't understand why Scully was still a skeptic after seeing blatant poo poo over and over again. Or why everyone always treated Muller like he was crazy, even though it seemed he was always right. Also, was there a reason that they were allowed to investigate this shadowy secret gov't organization? If the gov't knows aliens are real and trying to hide it, would they even have a supernatural investigation branch of the FBI that isn't made up of people who know about the aliens? What would the point be? They're going to be almost useless to the cabal when investigating things actually having to do with the aliens due to their lack of knowledge. Even if there's other poo poo that the branch is needed to keep tabs on, you're putting them in a unique position to be able to uncover the cabal itself. Wouldn't you just have a supernatural branch, and people who investigate different cases based on what they're cleared for? Like, field agents are need to know as well as at least enough knowledge to know which department to kick a case to. Detectives have at least some clearance for their specific cases (aliens, ghosts, ball lightning, whatever). Department heads have more info about their own cases, as well as about the other departments' cases. Then have a director who has high clearance on everything and reports to the different shadowy gov't cabals that are apparently needed to handle this poo poo. As opposed to setting up an agency that actively works against you. And either way, when Muller and Scully start sticking their noses into things they shouldn't, why wouldn't you just set up an accident on the way to a crime scene? Hell, you're a shadowy group of old white politicians who run a secret gov't program to stop a covert alien invasion. Just loving have someone walk into their houses and shoot them in their beds. Boom, problem solved.
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Dec 7, 2018 19:18
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X-Files should've ended with Mulder and Scully walking into an alien base on Earth only to find the shiba inu from Silent Hill 2's secret ending.
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Dec 7, 2018 19:49
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Servoret posted:The final group had fun interactions with each other. You have the palate of a swineherd https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anKnOnxRsyA
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Dec 7, 2018 19:57
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Araenna posted:And either way, when Muller and Scully start sticking their noses into things they shouldn't, why wouldn't you just set up an accident on the way to a crime scene? Hell, you're a shadowy group of old white politicians who run a secret gov't program to stop a covert alien invasion. Just loving have someone walk into their houses and shoot them in their beds. Boom, problem solved.
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Dec 7, 2018 20:59
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Araenna posted:I watched that in a marathon on I think it was syfy at that point. It was pretty good honestly. Basic premise was that aliens were using some sort of sound to change brain waves and convert people to their side. It was all part of some plan to take over Earth. But some people were caught up in some sort of Thing, and now have different brain waves. They can't be affected by the sound, but need to hide in a bunker (I think the aliens can track the brainwaves?). Threshold is the name of the contingency plan some gov't person put together just in case of aliens, as unlikely as it was. And I think she also has the brainwave thing because of coincidence maybe? And you could tell they knew they were being canceled, because the last episode was something where, irrc, the main character's son from the future somehow contacts them and tells them they're totally gonna win in the end and defeat all the aliens. Also Brent Spiner was in it I think. I might see if I can track it down to watch with my fiance. They mostly arrest bigfoot and weird crime mutants, so they probably feel like it’s worth the hassle to have someone oppressing the vampire druglords and pimp werewolves.
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Dec 7, 2018 22:29
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Despite all this I still loving love the xfiles
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Dec 7, 2018 22:32
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purple death ray posted:Despite all this I still loving love the xfiles Yeah its good episodes are absurdly good. The first movie was pretty good too.
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Dec 7, 2018 22:53
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X-Files is a mess of a show, but I still love it, and Jose Chung's "From Outerspace" might just be the single finest hour of television, let alone the X-Files. It encapsulates everything the show was about and how quixotic and dumb mulder's quest is because everything he's searching for is so far beyond anyone's understanding. It happened in season 3 and just undercuts the rest of the series basically. The only episode that comes close is Mulder and Scully meet the Weremonster from season the season ten comeback, and it's essentially a story about how pointless the return of the X-files is. Unfortunately has some gross transphobia in it. ^second movie wasn't bad either. Solid 2 parter territory which was refreshing after the last couple of seasons Ambitious Spider has a new favorite as of 23:30 on Dec 7, 2018 |
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Dec 7, 2018 23:26
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Ambitious Spider posted:
Isn’t that Morgan’s one from season 11? There weremonster one is about how modernity is horrible and pointless.
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Dec 7, 2018 23:34
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The best X-Files episodes are the goofier ones, but they only work so well because they're playing against the serious stuff.
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Dec 8, 2018 11:08
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LIVE AMMO ROLEPLAY posted:The best X-Files episodes are the goofier ones, but they only work so well because they're playing against the serious stuff. Doctor Who is similar; its best episodes are when it goes off-the-wall, high concept and being unafraid of looking silly, but those episodes only work if they're few and far between. I'd say that's because you can't be off-the-wall in every way, all the time, you lean on certain tools to make that work. When the guy that was really good at those sorts of episodes took over as showrunner for Who, that started showing, because suddenly what worked for one or two episodes a season was going on all the time, it quickly wore out its welcome. Doctor Who aging badly, as an aside, is a whole different thing. The first few seasons of the revival alone are like mainlining the mid-00s in all the best and worst ways at the same time.
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Dec 8, 2018 11:34
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LIVE AMMO ROLEPLAY posted:The best X-Files episodes are the goofier ones, but they only work so well because they're playing against the serious stuff. The Cops episode is just superb.
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Dec 8, 2018 11:39
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Shoulda done more where Mulder's wrong because what's going on is even weirder. One of my favourite episodes was the Satanic panic one. When they got the case you could see Scully bracing herself for "here we go against with his bullshit, sigh" only for Mulder to go, "Nope, Satanic abuse never happened, it was all false memories" and actually explaining how people in the real world got things so wrong. Naturally, when they arrived, it was actually Satan loving with people.
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Dec 8, 2018 12:53
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Speaking of X-Files, Millennium was actually really good, but (a) the first episode was... not so good, which I could see turning people off the series and (b) the story arc, which did feel organic and planned, was (b1) threaded through "monster of the week" episodes and (b2) came to its natural conclusion at the end of season 2, because they didn't think they were going to get a season 3. Oops. Like, honestly, I would maybe recommend impatient viewers to read a precis of season 1, and then watch season 2 in its entirety. Lance Henriksen and Terry O'Quinn are great, oh and also for you X-Files nerds, the Jose Chung story arc continues here, in a blackly funny episode. It's weird to think of Millennium as a period piece now, but if you're going in with fresh eyes, that might be the best lens.
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Dec 8, 2018 13:07
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Season one of Millennium is basically Criminal Minds, with a hint of something supernatural happening in the background (and coming to the front in one or two episodes). Season two is more of a mid-2000s overarching supernatural mystery show. Like, in season one, you don't actually know what the Millennium Group is even supposed to be, but then in season two it becomes "fundamentalist Christian apocalypse cult comprised entirely of former FBI agents". The second season is definitely a big improvement on season one in terms of storytelling, but I think season one is perfectly fine for what it is and in any event season two put me off a bit because when I watched it I was just bored by anything that used Christian eschatology as its theme (it would be interesting to see a show which uses the end times stories from other cultures or religions; I don't know how Muslims or Buddhists believe the world will end, for instance, so it might be interesting to use that as the basis for a programme). Season three is also there. The X-Files episode that tried to conclude the series was pretty poor.
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Dec 8, 2018 14:15
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That is actually really fair. And yeah, I wish it had ended better.
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Dec 8, 2018 15:26
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Re: Threshold I rewatched it last year and it was pretty cool, even if the alien signal sometimes veered too deep into bulshit plotanium not!magic. But I remember the first episode where the team first assembles. They go through who is who, what insane means of maintaining secrecy they're going through (like having their windows actually being screens playing normal accounting office stuff for everyone who'd try to peek from the outside) and then someone finally asks "Soo, what are we supposed to do here anyway?" and everybody just looks at each other uncomfortably. That last part may be paraphrased, but only slightly.
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Dec 8, 2018 15:53
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RedSnapper posted:Re: Threshold A weird thing I read about Threshold is that the showrunners planned for each season to have a different name. S1 was Threshold, S2 would have been Foothold and S3 Stranglehold. Because that wouldn't have confused people at all.
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Dec 8, 2018 16:10
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Threshold the title was used by the same writer who did that Star Trek Voyager episode where going above the speed of light turns you into a salamander. Even by Voyager standards that episode was poo poo.
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Dec 8, 2018 16:42
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Araenna posted:I couldn't understand why Scully was still a skeptic after seeing blatant poo poo over and over again. Or why everyone always treated Muller like he was crazy, even though it seemed he was always right. Mulder had the opposite problem; he instantly leapt to the craziest explanation every time, whether there was evidence or not. The fact that he's in a TV show where the mundane explanation would be boring meant he was usually right, but it also made him easily manipulated and prone to running off to follow every insane lead when Scully wasn't around to keep him in check. And then of course there were the episodes where their positions were reversed, like the one where Brad Dourif claims to be psychically communicating with Scully's dead father, showing that Scully has a believer side and Mulder can be skeptical. I think overall it was a lot more interesting dynamic than the caricature version that it's often portrayed as.
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Dec 8, 2018 17:24
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Threshold the title was used by the same writer who did that Star Trek Voyager episode where going above the speed of light turns you into a salamander. Even by Voyager standards that episode was poo poo. It wasn't long after that that the bug things from fluid space that the Borg couldn't assimilate showed up. That was also the time I quit watching Voyager. Holy crap did that show go off the rails.
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Dec 8, 2018 17:27
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When was Voyager on the rails?
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Dec 8, 2018 17:28
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Nm
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Dec 8, 2018 17:30
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Lord Hydronium posted:I know this was always a common criticism/joke about the show, but it makes sense to me (the Scully part especially) because proof of one weird thing doesn't mean every weird thing exists. Just because last week you discovered a giant humanoid flukeworm doesn't prove aliens or Bigfoot are real. Scully's attitude was to go into every case assuming there was a rational explanation until proven otherwise. To her credit, after about Season 2 she's fully onboard with something weird going on with the alien plot, she just believed it was a government conspiracy rather than proof extraterrestrial life exists. And if I recall the later seasons correctly, she even ends up coming around on that as the evidence mounts. A weird quirk of the series that nobody really talks about is Mulder’s contempt for religious poo poo like miracles or just benign or helpful supernatural things. In the one where Scully’s in a coma after being abducted, her b-story is of some nurse convincing her to live and then at the end when Mulder’s telling her about how he beat up smoking man and poo poo that day, she says she looked up the nurse that helped her and found out she died years ago, and the Mulder rolls his eyes and says that’s stupid. And then Scully yells at him for believing in monster poo poo all the time but not letting her just have a ghost that helps people. Him fundamentally being a pessimist who will indulge any lunatic thing as long as it confirms his worst suspicions about humanity and the universe but who won’t tolerate a benevolent god or any belief that comforts people is one of his more interesting traits. Like for him it just doesn’t make sense that there could be ghosts that just help people, but every time there’s a ghost seemingly tormented by its earthly crimes or out for revenge, that just fits his understanding of how things are.
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Dec 8, 2018 17:40
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Pastry of the Year posted:Speaking of X-Files, Millennium was actually really good And being network TV, it was on every commercial break for every show, 24/7.
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Dec 8, 2018 17:47
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Threshold the title was used by the same writer who did that Star Trek Voyager episode where going above the speed of light turns you into a salamander. Even by Voyager standards that episode was poo poo. That's literally one of the only episodes of Voyager I like because it's loving weird.
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Dec 8, 2018 18:06
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