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Basebf555 posted:Did Kvit! ever watch The House That Jack Built? I want to hear their thoughts. Watched half of it but then had to go to bed because of exams in the morning. I'm going to finish it tonight and I'll be sure to post my thoughts, I'm interested in hearing yours as well!
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Dec 20, 2018 16:35
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Kvlt! posted:Watched half of it but then had to go to bed because of exams in the morning. I'm going to finish it tonight and I'll be sure to post my thoughts, I'm interested in hearing yours as well! I found it to be a very disturbing but ultimately hollow experience, which I think was at least partially the point. Dillon plays the whole emptiness thing really well(probably the most impressive version of that I can think of since Henry), and so examining that character is what the whole movie is about, but in the end that emptiness wasn't able to carry a 2+ hour film in my opinion. Unlike Henry, you don't get to follow any supporting characters long enough to get to know them or care about them. We can discuss specific scenes in more detail I guess once you've finished it, but I know Hollismason really was just not impressed on any level so I'm just interested to hear other opinions.
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Dec 20, 2018 17:06
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Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:15
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. Lord of Illusions.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:23
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Does End of Days count?
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Dec 20, 2018 18:23
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. Not sure how you feel about it but The Void sort of fits in there.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:28
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I'd say The Exorcist III fits that description.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:29
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. It's a group of police, but there's Baskin as well which is a fun ride.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:35
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. The First Power with Lou DIamond Phillips is really underrated. The Denzel Washington movie Fallen is another one, and borrows heavily from The First Power. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PD7SDGKg_g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC-ykURLzSg
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Dec 20, 2018 18:35
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Fallen is so freaking good.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:40
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Denzel doing the "Tiiiiiime is on my side. Yes it is" is one of the best gently caress yous without actually saying gently caress you in any movie.
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Dec 20, 2018 18:59
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. I wouldn’t call either of them great but Cast a Deadly Spell and The Resurrected are fun neonoir horror
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Dec 20, 2018 19:00
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I love that genre of supernatural detective. I would also say The Resurrected from the 90s is good as well.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:00
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Oh yeah, I'm a sucker for occult/monster noir. Even the blah ones like Dylan Dog: Dead of Night tickle my fancy.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:06
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Reporter rather than detective, but Kino released The Night Stalker recently.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:06
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Stink Billyums posted:Reporter rather than detective, but Kino released The Night Stalker recently. Do you mean The Night Flier, because that movie is really loving good. Edit: Apparently no it's a different movie? Is Night Flier a remake? Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Dec 20, 2018 |
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Dec 20, 2018 19:08
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If we're doing reporters then muthafuckin' Candyman. Not so much a reporter as a student, but it has the same feel.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:11
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There are actually a fuckton of detective stories in supernatural horror. For ones where the protagonist is conducting an investigation, but not a detective: Cigarette Burns and The Ninth Gate*. I second the recommend for Lord of Illusions. *Roman Polanski is a pedophile
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Dec 20, 2018 19:13
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Basebf555 posted:Do you mean The Night Flier, because that movie is really loving good. Oh man the night stalker and the resultant series are all time classics of horror television. Kolchak friggen owns. Not at all related to the night flier
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Dec 20, 2018 19:14
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Tolkien minority posted:I wouldn’t call either of them great but Cast a Deadly Spell and The Resurrected are fun neonoir horror Cast a Deadly Spell is great! The only thing is that it's not a detective stumbling onto the supernatural, but an alt history movie where it posits the question "what if magic and the supernatural were real and matter of fact and existed in 1940s Hollywood?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMte4btEG5M They made a sequel called Witch Hunt which is just as good, but they recast Fred Ward with Dennis Hopper. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVcYIJ0StHk Basebf555 posted:Do you mean The Night Flier, because that movie is really loving good. Night Flier's a Stephen King adaptation. Night Stalker and Night Strangler are the two Kolchak movies.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:15
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Tolkien minority posted:Oh man the night stalker and the resultant series are all time classics of horror television. Kolchak friggen owns. Not at all related to the night flier Yea when the name Night Stalker came up I didn't immediately connect it to Kolchak for some reason. But I wasn't sure if they were related because Night Flier also has an investigative reporter tracking a killer that he suspects is actually a vampire.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:16
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alf_pogs posted:the logical inconsistencies and broken narrative of The Shining is why it's great, i think. I'm curious about the logical inconsistencies, the broken narrative is obvious. I didn't find much too inconsistent save for the 2 Gradys, which I still don't get. There's 2 right? It's not the same dude or am I tripping? Choco1980 posted:It's a pretty proven fact that The Shining was deliberately made contradictory. The sets themselves are deliberately impossible geometrically if you examine them for instance. There's windows that should be interior walls, doors to nowhere, the maze legitimately changes shape, etc etc. I heard about this but never noticed it in the films, is there a video or something with examples?
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Dec 20, 2018 19:32
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s.i.r.e. posted:I'm curious about the logical inconsistencies, the broken narrative is obvious. I didn't find much too inconsistent save for the 2 Gradys, which I still don't get. There's 2 right? It's not the same dude or am I tripping? What scenes are you talking about? As far as I know Grady is only played by the one actor.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:39
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. Definitely check out Cast a Deadly Spell if you haven't yet. No one's said the original Wicker Man, which should count.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:42
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It is the greatest horror film of all time, but it's not supernatural horror.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:43
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Halloween Jack posted:It is the greatest horror film of all time, but it's not supernatural horror. Eh, I think there's room to argue. It's certainly a mystery, and it's supernatural in that the island is full of pagans committing human sacrifice because of their religious beliefs. To the believers, it is supernatural, but it's not supernatural to an outsider or non-believer. Cast a Deadly Spell wouldn't count either, since the entire world is supernatural. But it's more fun to count it.
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Dec 20, 2018 19:46
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Halloween Jack posted:It is the greatest horror film of all time, but it's not supernatural horror. Hey if you believe in the Old Gods it is. Christ had his chance and he blew it!
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Dec 20, 2018 19:46
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Killing me won't bring back your loving honey!
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Dec 20, 2018 19:52
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ruddiger posted:Night Flier's a Stephen King adaptation. Night Stalker and Night Strangler are the two Kolchak movies. King wrote at great length about Kolchak in Danse Macabre, though. There's no way The Night Flier wasn't influenced by it. I've never seen Cast A Deadly Spell, but I have seen Witch Hunt and it's hilarious. It is of course a riff on the McCarthy hearings, looking for literal witches instead of Communists. A major plot point is William Shakespeare being brought into the present day to work as a script doctor.
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Dec 20, 2018 20:05
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Basebf555 posted:What scenes are you talking about? As far as I know Grady is only played by the one actor. One Grady is the dude Ulman tells Jack about when he's offering him the job, the one that chopped up his family who's never seen (Charles Grady), the other is the one that Jack meets in the bathroom (Delbert Grady). Or are they supposed to be the same person?
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Dec 20, 2018 20:07
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s.i.r.e. posted:One Grady is the dude Ulman tells Jack about when he's offering him the job, the one that chopped up his family who's never seen (Charles Grady), the other is the one that Jack meets in the bathroom (Delbert Grady). Or are they supposed to be the same person? Possibly. There's been a certain amount of discussion on the subject, a lot of it revolving around the photo from 1921 and the fact that both Gradys killed their wife and daughters.
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Dec 20, 2018 20:12
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I keep meaning to see Cast a Deadly Spell. I think it's still on HBO.
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Dec 20, 2018 20:13
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s.i.r.e. posted:One Grady is the dude Ulman tells Jack about when he's offering him the job, the one that chopped up his family who's never seen (Charles Grady), the other is the one that Jack meets in the bathroom (Delbert Grady). Or are they supposed to be the same person? Ah, yea sorry I thought you meant physically two different actors playing the same role(which confused me because I think Grady only physically appears in the bathroom scene). Anyway yea I don't have a real explanation for that, I believe in the book he's just Delbert Grady. I guess the most likely explanation is that the Overlook has basically erased his memory and he somehow ended up taking on a different name.
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Dec 20, 2018 20:21
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The Two Gradys and Other Doubles, from Wikipedia (from Gordon Dahlquist of The Kubrick FAQ)
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Dec 20, 2018 20:28
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Samuel Clemens posted:Aside from Angel Heart, are there any great horror films about a detective/police officer who goes to investigate a mystery and finds something supernatural? I guess In the Mouth of Madness sort of works in the same vein. While they're not all noir films and some have more/less pervasive supernatural stuff than others we kinda sorta dubbed this type of flick "noir horror" in the last thread and I made a list based on what folks suggested that I fortunately saved. Note that not all of these are necessarily great (and some like Cataclysm are brainmeltingly bad). For this list we did include things where magic and supernatural stuff are already a known thing, but not movies where NOTHING supernatural happens so that does leave out some movies like Seven that are certainly horror films that involve an investigation. Maybe "occult noir" is better? 9th Gate 1,000 Eyes of Dr. Mabuse Angel Heart Apostle Blood Cult Cast a Deadly Spell Cataclysm Constantine Dark (1979) Dead and Buried Dr. Mabuse: The Gambler Dylan Dog: Dead of Night Fallen Jacob's Ladder Lord of Illusions Lost Highway Nick Knight Night Flier Night Stalker Night Strangler Resurrected Return of Dr. Mabuse Split Second Testament of Dr. Mabuse Wicked City (live action, stay far away from the anime) Note that "Night Stalker" and "Night Strangler" are the two Kolchak movies from before the TV series, they're both cool IMO. IIRC they're generally not listed with Kolchak in the title if you're looking. Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Dec 20, 2018 |
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Dec 20, 2018 20:48
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I guess I never realized that reincarnation was such a common reading of what happens to Jack and Grady in The Shining. That always seemed a bit to simplistic to me. I always saw it more as like the hotel itself not abiding by the normal rules of time and that a person's essence could be somehow absorbed into it so that from their point of view they've "always been there".
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Dec 20, 2018 20:54
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It's not exactly a detective, but I think Night of the Demon/Curse of the Demon would qualify.
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Dec 20, 2018 21:01
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Basebf555 posted:I always saw it more as like the hotel itself not abiding by the normal rules of time and that a person's essence could be somehow absorbed into it so that from their point of view they've "always been there". That reading is also listed in the wikipedia, under the 1921 photograph section. It's a new idea to me, but I really like it, and it works more for the story than reincarnation.
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Dec 20, 2018 21:06
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My thoughts on The House That Jack Built. Personally, I loved it. I think it's the best horror movie of the year, possibly the best movie of the year (tied with At Eternity's Gate) and by far Von Trier's greatest work. I'm just going to spoiler everything: I loved the parallel between Dante and Jack: with Jack acting as a reverse Dante who is guided by Virgil deep into hell rather than through hell and up into heaven. I think others are right that the movie is ultimately about hollow-ness. I think Jack is a character who always felt hollow and tries to get some satisfaction from depravity, but is just as unsatisfied by his acts as a serial killer as he is by his normal life. He is a man who can't connect with the world whether he is building a house or murdering people, but makes up this idea of his murdering as an "art form" to justify his existence. If he can't connect to the real world, maybe he can connect to the antithesis of everything the real world thinks of as good. I think the deeper he gets into the murdering, and starts to become less and less careful about getting caught, he realizes that his actions as a killer are just as hollow as his actions as an architect: he gains absolutely nothing from them. His idea of "Mr. Sophistication" being this artist whose work nobody understands and is beyond the comprehension of normal artists, or what normal artists consider good and just, is him desperately trying to validate that he has SOMETHING in the world which fills up his hollowness, when the truth is he has nothing at all. He's completely empty. Even when he builds his house completely out of corpses, the perfect material according to him, he is completely unsatisfied. It is only when he reaches Elysium that he realizes he was wrong about his work, that Virgil was right about him and his emptiness: that's why he tries to go directly to God at the end but fails, it is a desperate attempt to validate his work, but he fails because his work is ultimately like Jack himself: empty, meaningless, depraved, and useless. What I really found interesting is how at the end Virgil says to Jack that he isn't supposed to go to the lowest circle of hell, but one higher up (presumably the seventh circle of hell, for punishing those who commit violence) but at the end Jack falls into the lowest point of hell: reserved for those who commit treachery. I couldn't quite gleam who exactly Jack betrayed, I'd love to hear other people's thoughts on it. I also think that Jack is supposed to represent Von Trier himself: you see how Von Trier directly adresses his Nazi comments and previous works. It wouldn't surprise me at all if this is his final film. I loved how the movie had a lot of pitch-black humor and weird shifts in tone. The use of Bowie's "fame" was really perfect and bizarre. Matt Dillon played the emptiest character I have ever seen: there was absolutely nothing behind those eyes. It was the perfect choice for the role and one of Dillon's best performances. As with most movies, I think the violence is over-hyped. The most disturbing part of the movie is by far the footage of real-life violence and atrocities, other than that it is nothing one wouldn't expect from Von Trier (though to be fair, I saw the rated R cut, not the unrated edition). Overall, fantastic movie. I'm really interested in everyone else's thoughts on it.
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Dec 20, 2018 22:20
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Kvlt! posted:spoilers I haven't seen it yet, but I'm gonna try and get to it soon so I can contribute to the convo. In reading about it, it seems to be the most polarizing film of the year, except for maybe Vox Lux.
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Dec 20, 2018 22:24
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