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Blotto_Otter posted:I mean, this post alone is a larger library of games than the two (2) game library currently announced by Google... Oh don't worry, we will probably see a third one when Stevia Beta launches 2019.
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Mar 19, 2019 22:31
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im the controller designer guy who replaced "start" and "select" with two different forms of the hamburger menu icon i played a demo of onLive years ago. i played one of the batman arkham games and it worked ok for that. i could notice the lag but it was playable over average comcast internet and wifi
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Mar 19, 2019 22:34
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pixaal posted:Everyone saying they don't like not owning a game fine, but think about how much you'd save if you didn't need a gaming computer? A $500 computer will work just as well as a $2,500 gaming computer. 160ms of input lag is too much for a loving paradox map game. "Coding games with this in mind" shaking my drat head. making this work would require a complete and all-encompassing infrastructure project the USA hasn't done since the Rural Electrification Act--and to be clear i 100% support that!--and the politicians in the regions it'd have to be done in most desperately would be the most vocal opponents to it. When the prerequisites for your tech idea are "revolution against an electoral plurality and some of the largest monopolies in the entire country" you might wanna revisit the ol' white board
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Mar 19, 2019 22:35
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*NEW HOT GAME releases. Being a human with a job, try to log into Stadia after work, but servers are SLAMMED. Next day log in, but major choppiness. Google announces "they are looking into it". Finally get playing a week later, google confirms their servers were DDOSed and recommend we change our password on every account we owned. Payment information also stolen, probably.*
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Mar 19, 2019 22:45
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Meanwhile in the Android world... https://www.reddit.com/r/androiddev/comments/b2ztr0/google_terminated_our_startups_developer_account/
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Mar 19, 2019 22:52
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IN PRINCIPLE i actually really like the concept a central processing hub through which 4k+ visual data is streamed with low-latency to clients with modest devices of a broadly universal spec instead of a hodgepodge of Gaming Rigs. Except for the facts that --it doesn't really work --the tech to make it work is a ways off --it will take Actual capital-c Communism in the usa to create that infrastructure in a remotely equitable fashion --it would require a complete (and needed, IMO) refiguration of how people have aligned themselves with the internet in general and games/media in particular --it would be such a tempting target for hacking you may as well make the poo poo free so nobody had financial info on it (see the above two) --gently caress it make access and modification of media on there open-source why doncha now that all the above poo poo has happened Aside from that, yeah. I kind of think Goons are maybe drinking the haterade a little, on this one.
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Mar 19, 2019 23:11
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Tweet was deleted. What'd it say?
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Mar 19, 2019 23:11
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I really hope this is shity and doesn't work because if it's good enough that the mass market doesn't care it's basically an across the board reduction in responsiveness and image quality forever vs what we could have had with dedicated hardware. I guess it's probably inevitable that that happens at some point but hopefully it's not anytime soon
joe football fucked around with this message at 23:21 on Mar 19, 2019 |
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Mar 19, 2019 23:15
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This is a great idea when paired with a game that works for it. RPGs, Puzzle games, Turn base strategy or even MMORPGS would work with this input lag. I can see myself playing like Civ 7 on this. Why the gently caress they are putting games that are highly dependent on having almost no input lag is beyond me.
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Mar 19, 2019 23:20
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 Hmm maybe 166ms isn’t so bad...
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Mar 19, 2019 23:21
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The idea behind the tech and the concept on paper is really cool. If it worked, it would be cool. I live in the UK, and it's trivial to get sub-20 ping to any major datacenter here from anywhere in the country. But if Digital Foundry can test it under what you can only presume would be absolute ideal conditions when invited by Google themselves, and it still has 100+ ms input delay, it's just a complete non-starter for me. Of course, I bet there are millions of people playing with that much or more input lag on their PS4 because they don't know about game mode or whatever, so the mass-market appeal has the potential to be huge if they can: a) get it to perform consistently b) get devs onboard c) price it keenly d) release their own cool exclusives None of that seems beyond the realms of possibility considering Google's means, so it could be a success. Just not for someone like me.
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Mar 19, 2019 23:22
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I'm still trying to wrap my head around how Google plans on approaching this from the business side of things. Selling games a la carte doesn't seem desirable, because charging just once up front for something that is going to incur expenses indefinitely (by way of chewing up server time) is a no-no. So it has to be via subscription, right? But the only sustainable way to make a subscription service into a viable product is to have a lot of content to offer, and I'm guessing that the company that just hired the first-ever head of its new development studio... **checks notes** two weeks ago... does not exactly have a ton of content in the pipeline. I assume Google is cutting big fat checks to get Ubi and Bethesda to bring their games over, but that doesn't seem sustainable in the long run. Did the announcement make any mention of if/how they were going to try to entice developers to come to their platform? I know they promised a bunch of features for developers, but did they say word one about the business case for why you should develop for Stadia?
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Mar 19, 2019 23:23
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Steve Yun posted:
This depends on how they're calculating it / people have been throwing around that AC:Odyssey has 100ms built into it already
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Mar 19, 2019 23:27
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Just to dispel some myths here - the issue with low-latency loss-sensitive applications in a real world environment are being overstated. The issue with last-mile infrastructure, while a real issue, when it manifests does NOT generally manifest as an increase in network latency but rather imposes a bandwidth limitation and in some extremely severe cases, link reliability (packet loss). In practice what this means is that as long as that infrastructure is good enough to cope with whatever the packet rate of the streams is AND it's not severely degraded trash (talking <12mbps sync speeds) you will have a consistent experience regardless of the underlying infrastructure - you do NOT need fibre to the node to be able to support real time streaming applications. Here in Australia, where our last-mile infrastructure is extremely poor, we can still use real time applications because they fit into these parameters outside of edge cases. In addition, wireless infrastructure in the home introduces it's own set of reliability issues and any test done on a streaming service over wireless is dumb out of the gate.
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Mar 19, 2019 23:30
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Dre2Dee2 posted:*NEW HOT GAME releases. Being a human with a job, try to log into Stadia after work, but servers are SLAMMED. Next day log in, but major choppiness. Google announces "they are looking into it". Finally get playing a week later, google confirms their servers were DDOSed and recommend we change our password on every account we owned. Payment information also stolen, probably.* God, I hadn't even stopped to consider DDOSing w/r/t this thing.
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Mar 19, 2019 23:39
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We have a console for people with data caps that can't handle 20GB per hour of playtime, it's called the Xbox 360
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Mar 19, 2019 23:48
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Lol this stupid streambox poo poo is going to bomb so hard.
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Mar 20, 2019 00:07
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Steve Yun posted:
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Mar 20, 2019 00:09
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Does the Xbox’s controller use WiFi even when it’s plugged in?
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Mar 20, 2019 00:26
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They're bluetooth aren't they?
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Mar 20, 2019 00:35
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Steve Yun posted:Does the Xbox’s controller use WiFi even when it’s plugged in? Yea, I think they do.
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Mar 20, 2019 00:40
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Bardeh posted:They're bluetooth aren't they? It is and it isn't. It's needlessly complicated of course.
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Mar 20, 2019 01:06
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Steve Yun posted:Does the Xbox’s controller use WiFi even when it’s plugged in? I don't know about when it's hooked to the xbone, but on PC it only uses the USB connection if that is plugged in. Otherwise xbone controllers can use their own wifi flavor or bluetooth, if you have one of the bluetooth models. I would expect the controllers to talk over USB when plugged in to the xbone, as IIRC there have been problems with the wireless 360 controllers at crowded events.
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Mar 20, 2019 01:14
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Tormented posted:This is a great idea when paired with a game that works for it. This is how I feel as well. Same as when Valve was pushing the Steam Link. If Steam Link couldn't do it over an Ethernet LAN I really don't see them delivering on their claim of 1080p 60fps. Much less 8k at any frame rate. I would love to be wrong though. Just last night I was wishing I could play Factorio on my tablet
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Mar 20, 2019 01:29
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the issue is that to support a reasonably low latency experience will require a mammoth investment in server infrastructure spanning the entire earth. While it's technically possible I highly doubt the streaming application work on commodity infrastructure (i.e generic cloud servers) so this may be hundreds of millions of dollars and take years. The only way I can see it happening is if the tech turns out to be useful for other stuff beyond just gaming. I have a feeling the GPU resources may be getting poached from one of Googles other platforms and they are seeing it as a way to add return on an existing investment.
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Mar 20, 2019 03:33
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My guess is that by "releasing in 2019" they mean "releasing in select cities in 2019" so that they can control the narrative of the latency being good, before rolling it out nationwide in 2020
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Mar 20, 2019 03:50
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The 7th Guest posted:My guess is that by "releasing in 2019" they mean "releasing in select cities in 2019" so that they can control the narrative of the latency being good, before
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Mar 20, 2019 03:58
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Danakir posted:Tweet was deleted. What'd it say? quote:I am hearing that Google seriously wants FGC tournaments to be run on the Stadia, and boy where do I *begin* with this poo poo... first off, nobody is going to use wireless controllers/fightsticks. That's a *complete* non-starter in a tournament setting with hundreds of players.
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Mar 20, 2019 03:58
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This might as well be non-news for any Australian because I’m willing to  that this service is going to launch, struggle and quietly get shuttered before it ever ends up launching here.
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Mar 20, 2019 04:07
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LMFAO! Playing on PC alone makes FGC tournaments go on fire. This poo poo will be a nuclear explosion.
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Mar 20, 2019 05:20
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Molestationary Store posted:Lol this stupid streambox poo poo is going to bomb so hard. New thread title plz
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Mar 20, 2019 07:04
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Bardeh posted:The idea behind the tech and the concept on paper is really cool. If it worked, it would be cool. I live in the UK, and it's trivial to get sub-20 ping to any major datacenter here from anywhere in the country. But if Digital Foundry can test it under what you can only presume would be absolute ideal conditions when invited by Google themselves, and it still has 100+ ms input delay, it's just a complete non-starter for me. Of course, I bet there are millions of people playing with that much or more input lag on their PS4 because they don't know about game mode or whatever, so the mass-market appeal has the potential to be huge if they can: The internet is dogshit in large parts of rural UK though
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Mar 20, 2019 10:13
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I'm incredibly sceptical about this entire thing, and while it opens up some interesting possibilities it is quite horrifying for people who want to tinker with games, get rid of vsync, motion blur, etc. Not to mention the entire ownership thing. 160 msec input lag according to DF also suggests there's something seriously wrong with the pipeline how Google is delivering the content. Be it with encoding/decoding speed or whatever. Even with the supposed 60 msec built-in input delay factored in. That being said for example Tekken 7 runs with a static input lag of around 100 msec because the game works on a delay based netcode. So packets get sent instantly and in theory with a reliable sub 100 msec latency you could have an experience similar to offline (in reality often not the case). I'm mentioning this because the idea that a loving turn based strategy game won't work with 160ms delay is laughable. I could see a fighting game work with some sort of dynamic delay that factors in latency and pushes in footage as soon as possible and synchronizes the "game" clock across both clients. Is it ideal? No. Probably error-prone. But in ideal conditions probably surprisingly workable if the game is built for it from the ground up. I'm definitely not advocating for cloud based FGs (jfc) but I feel people are exaggerating input lag... And honestly Google's current solution doesn't seem to be pushing footage nearly as quickly as it's theoretically possible. That being said minimizing input lag in twitch based games is ideal and feels good and I hope this won't actually become the norm. Also someone correct me if I'm wrong but one added wrinkle this entire solution has is the decoding speed of the video stream. As far as I understand CPU-driven h264/5 video decoding isn't sub 1 ms, so GPU/hardware driven video decoding specifically engineered for low latency may be ideal. And I can't see loving Chromecast being the low latency solution. It doesn't mean the solution has to be expensive, though.
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Mar 20, 2019 10:33
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limaCAT posted:The same Microsoft that killed off Lionhead, gave Halo to 343 and got us Kinect Sports, Halo MCC and Sea of Thieves? That Microsoft? If you want cloud gaming to work, it is probably helpful to have experience with 1) clouds and 2) gaming. Google has one of those. MS has both.
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Mar 20, 2019 12:18
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Also like I understand the scepticism but the massive doom and gloom is a little hard to reconcile with the fact that Sony have been doing this for four years at this point. Sure it hasn't set the world on fire but on the other hand they've stuck with it so the service obviously works well enough to have some people using it. Not to mention that as I said, some European ISPs even offer this as a service to customers. If you are a Telecom Italia customer you can do game streaming right now, today. The game selection isn't world-class or anything but one of the games you can stream is Arkham City, which strikes me as a good choice because the combat system is pretty generous so even a fair amount of lag is probably easy to get used to. The idea demonstrably works well enough that several companies have products you can buy at the moment. Here is a Reddit thread I randomly found in which a bunch of people compare notes on PSNow, with some people saying it works well and they enjoy using it and others saying it doesn't and the lag sucks: https://www.reddit.com/r/PS4/comments/82gdxd/how_many_people_have_tried_playstation_now/ Can Google do better than these guys? Maybe, idk, but it seems premature to talk about how it can never possibly work in any way because ~physics~ Zephro fucked around with this message at 12:34 on Mar 20, 2019 |
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Mar 20, 2019 12:28
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I can't even stream PS4 from downstairs without it being unplayable, so I can't wait to see how this goes down.
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Mar 20, 2019 12:41
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Zephro posted:Also like Game companies really want this to be a thing because its gives them a ton of control over when people can play their game, and what exactly they do with it. Also, it will let them have a subscription model.
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Mar 20, 2019 12:54
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Zephro posted:Sure it hasn't set the world on fire but on the other hand they've stuck with it so the service obviously works well enough to have some people using it. I think this is a likely description of where game streaming is going to be in a few years, but this also describes many of the products or services that Google has abandoned over the last several years. Google's history of walking away from viable projects because they got bored or because the numbers weren't sexy enough is definitely factoring into my skepticism. I think Microsoft's eventual streaming offering will have more staying power, because they clearly have a plan to build a big gaming library to support a subscription-based service, whereas I have no idea what Google's short- or long-term business plan is. Single-game sales don't make sense, and they're years and years away from having the content to support a subscription service.
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Mar 20, 2019 12:54
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This system, according to the DF guy, would remove the bandwidth restrictions keeping multiplayer games capped at around 100 people with minimally interactive environments. We could see a return to UO style MMOs with thousands or tens of thousands of people playing in the same shards, which would be so cool and worth 166ms of input latency. Look forward to star citizen rebooting again as a stadia-exclusive.
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Mar 20, 2019 12:59
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Zephro posted:Also like Hey they've stuck with it because they also sell a physical console with physical games. They can keep doing PSnow with no draw backs because it's not their main thing. No way in hell the PS5 would be streaming only. I've tried every streaming service from on live to psnow and the Xbox to PC. It looks like rear end. It looks like I'm playing a YouTube video and feels like I'm playing drunk.
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Mar 20, 2019 13:10
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