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Man I hope Jon gets at least early onset Alzheimer's soon or something to show that his resurrection wasn't just a freebie "nah just kidding he aint actually dead" writing decision btw I thought the episode was dope while watching it despite stupid moments, but ultimately disappointing in the context of the whole show. Not surprised that it went like this but it's still better than most shows. In some ways it's reminiscent to me of a lot of Nolan movies where every rewatch or every time i think about specific scenes, they seem dumber in retrospect.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:32
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NK died for the same reasons Ned and Red Viper and Robb did, trying to stick to his 'code' when he really shoulda been more practical Ned's code was honor, NK's code was "looking cool in slow motion"
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Apr 29, 2019 17:32
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Vintersorg posted:Arya most likely jumped from this tower above all the nonsense on the ground. She used the same shadowstep ability when she snuck up on Jon in the godswood. Jon was all like "how did you sneak ooop on meh?!" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPJ399yxdJU Was in roughly the same location.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:32
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Thom and the Heads posted:And she probably landed with a sick roll and looked super badass That's our Arya!
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Apr 29, 2019 17:32
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Zaphod42 posted:With Jon the zombies were being rezzed as he approached. There was that scene earlier where Arya crowd surfed over the top of a bunch of zombies that were clogging up a stairwell like it was no big deal. Lol, for all we know she ran like a cartoon across the tops of the zombies heads while they were all staring at Bran/NK haha
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Apr 29, 2019 17:33
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KidDynamite posted:So like gently caress the story arguments. Did anyone else with an OLED TV have this episode and any dark scenes in general look like complete poo poo? I was watching via HBO Go and the first 20-30 minutes were so bad. I need to find some 4k Yeah right here dude. The episode looked like dogshit and we tried loving around with the tv settings but then realized hbo go had some gnarly compression. So bad.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:35
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teagone posted:She used the same shadowstep ability when she snuck up on Jon in the godswood. Jon was all like "how did you sneak ooop on meh?!" I would be fine with the idea that wights are useless without active direction from the NK, but it feels like the Walkers should have had a bit more agency there. It also feels a bit different between being able to basically walk up on Jon, as opposed to the super jump that she pulls off. Does she just jump from a stand-still beyond the entire force with him? If she jumps from a tower or a branch, it is a pretty weak foreshadow, since she doesn't actually do the same thing she did with Jon.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:35
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I'm running a death pool at work where you predict who's alive or dead by the end of the season, with a bonus column predicting if they become a white walker or not. I'm not grading the WW column yet because I suppose there could still be some swerve where that kind of thing is still possible, but that might just be me hoping.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:35
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Zaphod42 posted:Lol, go away with this arrogance. We understood it people just think it was cheesy. Its not about being bad at watching, get off your high horse. quote:"This had to happen because otherwise what would we do, so that means its fine even if its nonsensical" is some really really weird non-logic. You can't justify an action purely because "we wouldn't know what to do otherwise". That doesn't make it make sense. We know we have Cersei still sitting on the Iron Throne, so we knew they had to win, and win while still being in a condition to fight her. The only way the second major story arc can be completed is if this first one ends in a certain fashion. The cavalry being thrown away was for practical storytelling because the Dothraki have no part to play in the war against the army of the dead. Before Melissandre showed up and lit their swords on fire, they weren't even equipped to kill anything. Keeping them around at all was stupid and dumb, they should have probably been deployed to ward off any attack from the south by the Golden Company. Having the Dothraki simply ferry away people on their horses is no less cheesy or dumb than sending them on a suicide charge. Where would they go? Unless they were planning to evacuate people off Westeros altogether, there was no escape. quote:Also you say "you guys are bad at watching TV for thinking this episode has issues!" followed by "oh but the episode totally had issues, the ending wasn't satisfying, the writer doesn't know what to do so it was... okay"
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Apr 29, 2019 17:37
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teagone posted:She used the same shadowstep ability when she snuck up on Jon in the godswood. Jon was all like "how did you sneak ooop on meh?!" Yeah but Jon is just one dude and he was just chilling in the woods not expecting a surprise. NK had like 50,000 undead zombies standing guard for him, doing nothing but looking around for enemies to stab. Arya was scared of like 5 dudes in the library but somehow now sneaking past 50,000 is no biggie? Dr_0ctag0n posted:There was that scene earlier where Arya crowd surfed over the top of a bunch of zombies that were clogging up a stairwell like it was no big deal. Lol, for all we know she ran like a cartoon across the tops of the zombies heads while they were all staring at Bran/NK haha That's basically what I'm picturing yeah lol
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Apr 29, 2019 17:37
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Madurai posted:Brienne, Jaime, and Pod all had full suits of armor, and the average Joes didn't. Just this episode Beric and Jorah got stabbed repeatedly through their armour with rusty old knives. Theon got ran straight through with a broken off wooden stick. I wouldn't mind if they showed them getting shanked in the gaps (it'd be no less dramatic right?), but they get stabbed straight though their cuirass every time. Don't get me wrong, this isn't a fault unique to Game of Thrones, and it's not like it affects the story really; but it is a pretty grating detail once you start looking for it.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:39
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gtkor posted:I would be fine with the idea that wights are useless without active direction from the NK, but it feels like the Walkers should have had a bit more agency there. It also feels a bit different between being able to basically walk up on Jon, as opposed to the super jump that she pulls off. Does she just jump from a stand-still beyond the entire force with him? If she jumps from a tower or a branch, it is a pretty weak foreshadow, since she doesn't actually do the same thing she did with Jon. Arya put more ability points into Shadowstep that upgraded it to level 3, unlocking new ability traits for Shadowstep that increased run speed, silenced footsteps, and travel distance.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:40
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Arya's shift from murdering the undead by the truckload on the walls to getting scared in the library was pretty jarring. It woulda worked better if the library scene had been framed around her trying to find something all sneaky-like (did she lose her dragonglass weapons or something?), it was just confusing as to why she was there and why she was suddenly scared and also made it sorta weird when she shifted back into badass mode after talking to Melisandre. Also Melisandre chilling in that room was pretty funny.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:40
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TyrantWD posted:We know we have Cersei still sitting on the Iron Throne, so we knew they had to win, and win while still being in a condition to fight her. The only way the second major story arc can be completed is if this first one ends in a certain fashion. The cavalry being thrown away was for practical storytelling because the Dothraki have no part to play in the war against the army of the dead. Before Melissandre showed up and lit their swords on fire, they weren't even equipped to kill anything. Keeping them around at all was stupid and dumb, they should have probably been deployed to ward off any attack from the south by the Golden Company. Having the Dothraki simply ferry away people on their horses is no less cheesy or dumb than sending them on a suicide charge. Where would they go? Unless they were planning to evacuate people off Westeros altogether, there was no escape. This is all really weird reverse logic. Post hoc ergo propter hoc or something. "the plot needs this to happen, so it makes sense that this happens. The plot then only works if this happens, so that happens." That's not how the world works or how reality works. That's like, the very definition of contrived writing, dude. And no, we don't know they had to win. None of this is "known". Its made up fiction, so if you aren't a hack writer you can do whatever you want. Some people's creativity just died at age 8 or something and can only think in cliches.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:42
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wyoak posted:Arya's shift from murdering the undead by the truckload on the walls to getting scared in the library was pretty jarring. It woulda worked better if the library scene had been framed around her trying to find something all sneaky-like, it was just confusing as to why she was there and why she was suddenly scared and also made it sorta weird when she shifted back into badass mode after talking to Melisandre. Also Melisandre chilling in that room was pretty funny. She should have cut off the face of a wight to become a wight and pulled off a stealth mission in the godswood under disguise. I realized she can't cut the face off a White Walker since they explode into ice when you hit them with dragonglass/valyrian steel.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:42
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WampaLord posted:The show is called Game of Thrones Yeah and the word game implies that the struggle for the throne is less serious than something that isn't a game (such as, I don't know, the survival of the human race). Imagine that.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:42
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whalestory posted:Man I hope Jon gets at least early onset Alzheimer's soon or something to show that his resurrection wasn't just a freebie "nah just kidding he aint actually dead" writing decision In the books it's mentioned by Dondarrion that you lose a bit of yourself each time you die or if you stay dead too long before being ressed - Cat Stark was dead for days iirc and gets ressed as a heartless vengeance-obsessed revenant of her former self. It seemed to me that the surviving Starks were all turning kinda evil with Jon about to be ressed and possibly being a bit like Cat, Arya becoming a ruthless assassin, Sansa turning into Cercei 2.0, Rickon going to live on Cannibal Island, and Bran turning into a creepy tree wizard and doing poo poo like warging into Hodor. Doesn't look like the show's going with that at all though, we didn't get Lady Stoneheart and Jon seems his old self for sure.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:42
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I had a good night's sleep and after thinking about it for a while Arya killing the Night King was still real good I liked it.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:43
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I missed what Melisandre told Arya about the blue eyes, anyone want to provide a recap?
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Apr 29, 2019 17:43
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TyrantWD posted:Agreeing that there are issues is not the same as people going "wtf, its impossible that Arya could have done anything she did. Arya is probably the most skilled fighter in Westeros at this point, and her succeeding with a sneak attack is just as plausible a method as any. On top of that, it was inside Winterfell. Surely she would know how to get around that place better than anyone. Her getting the drop on the Night King there made complete sense to me. So did Theon charging at him. Jon charging at him like an idiot with all the corpses around him made less sense, but then again Jon is an idiot so it still made sense
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Apr 29, 2019 17:44
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TyrantWD posted:Arya is probably the most skilled fighter in Westeros at this point This is an exceptionally dumb comment, and well represents how the show has been dumbed-down the last few seasons. There should be no such thing as "best fighter ever in the world". Best fighter at WHAT? Best fighter in armor? Best fighter with a spear? Best fighter with a sword against unarmored foes? Best fighter in 1-on-1 duels, or best fighter in big line warfare combats? Robert was a great fighter. Loras was a great fighter. Arya is a good fighter. Barriston Selmy. Jaime Lannister. Arthur Dayne. Oberyn Martell. The Mountain. etc. There's no one "best at everything" among those names. Each excels at some things, and has weaknesses at others. That's how the world works. Its complicated. Nobody is the best ever at everything forever always. You master one thing, and that's good in some situations and bad in others. That's realistic. That's human. Maybe in a fight, The Mountain beats Oberyn, but Arya could somehow beat The Mountain, but then maybe Oberyn could beat Arya. The idea that just one of them is the absolute best always is itself simplistic. But this isn't complex writing with human characters anymore, its superheroes.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:45
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Push El Burrito posted:I had a good night's sleep and after thinking about it for a while Arya killing the Night King was still real good I liked it.  It was pretty great. I think if anyone deserved it, it was Arya. The foreshadowing for it was good too. It was a bit sudden but I'm not sure how else they could have resolved it without a last moment save. There wasn't gonna be some epic showdown between Jon and NK. That's just not how GoT does things.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:46
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Macaluso posted:On top of that, it was inside Winterfell. Surely she would know how to get around that place better than anyone. Her getting the drop on the Night King there made complete sense to me. At least one theme the show has been consistent with is Jon Snow’s supremely poor judgment. It even got him killed.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:46
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Macaluso posted:On top of that, it was inside Winterfell. Surely she would know how to get around that place better than anyone. Her getting the drop on the Night King there made complete sense to me. I thought Jon was trying to get to him before he could make the corpses come back, so that at least made sense to me.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:46
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wyoak posted:Arya's shift from murdering the undead by the truckload on the walls to getting scared in the library was pretty jarring. It woulda worked better if the library scene had been framed around her trying to find something all sneaky-like (did she lose her dragonglass weapons or something?), it was just confusing as to why she was there and why she was suddenly scared and also made it sorta weird when she shifted back into badass mode after talking to Melisandre. Also Melisandre chilling in that room was pretty funny. She was doing well then got overwhelmed and her face slammed into a wall - she was shook and snapped out of her murderous spree. The Red Lady had to get her amped again!
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Apr 29, 2019 17:47
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Zaphod42 posted:This is all really weird reverse logic. Post hoc ergo propter hoc or something. "the plot needs this to happen, so it makes sense that this happens. The plot then only works if this happens, so that happens." That's not how the world works or how reality works. That's like, the very definition of contrived writing, dude. Undead army was dumb and uninteresting so ending it was fine. Probably woulda been better to do it last season. And the real hack ending would be "LOL none of this mattered the world ended everyone is dead," it's basically one step away from "it was all a dream" Also I'm not discounting the possibility that it's all a dream
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Apr 29, 2019 17:47
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Zaphod42 posted:This is an exceptionally dumb comment, and well represents how the show has been dumbed-down the last few seasons. We're gonna need a bigger 
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Apr 29, 2019 17:47
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tooterfish posted:The only armour that works reliably in this universe is the plot kind, the rest might as well be cardboard. The guys not wearing it are the smart ones, since it obviously just weighs you down for no reason. Yeah, this happens way too often. The people filming scenes just don't even realize what armor is, its just clothing to them. It'd be so easy to have the zombies shank Beric in the neck or bite him, but instead they just stab him right through his jack-of-plate like its made of butter. Armor in this show is exceptionally worthless, except for cool points, but cool points do grant plot armor sometimes.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:47
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Zaphod42 posted:This is an exceptionally dumb comment You're an exceptionally bad poster
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Apr 29, 2019 17:47
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Zaphod42 posted:This is an exceptionally dumb comment, and well represents how the show has been dumbed-down the last few seasons. this is all true but it's also a good explanation of why Arya taking out the NK is fine Arya has been trained as a magic assassin, out of everyone at Winterfell she's easily the most suited to surprise killing a single dude
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Apr 29, 2019 17:48
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wyoak posted:GRRM/HBO setup up two major conflicts over the entire run of the story with entirely different stakes (it's the core problem of the entire story), and the show can only end once so only one of the conflicts has the be the final one. Most people seem to be more interested in the politiking so HBO made a choice and went with it. Thinking of White Walkers vs Politics as an either-or is a stupid trap that the dipshit showrunners walked right into but the way to avoid it was to have them come south of the wall two years ago and march across the continent and see how the politics change and different houses react to the introduction of an existential threat
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Apr 29, 2019 17:49
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Solaris 2.0 posted:I thought for sure that was the ending we were going to get because RR Martin himself has stated that the White Walkers were an analogy for a divided humanity failing to unite to fight environmental destruction/ Climate Change. the nameless masses will being sacrificed to stop it while the wealthiest elites hire mercenaries to protect them?
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Apr 29, 2019 17:49
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wyoak posted:GRRM/HBO setup up two major conflicts over the entire run of the story with entirely different stakes (it's the core problem of the entire story), and the show can only end once so only one of the conflicts has the be the final one. Most people seem to be more interested in the politiking so HBO made a choice and went with it. You being able to imagine an equally dumb and or contrived scenario doesn't make that any less contrived or dumb. Yes, that would be bad too. But they could do... anything else? Like any of the things people keep suggesting? But yeah, ignore all that.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:50
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Dr_0ctag0n posted:There was that scene earlier where Arya crowd surfed over the top of a bunch of zombies that were clogging up a stairwell like it was no big deal. Lol, for all we know she ran like a cartoon across the tops of the zombies heads while they were all staring at Bran/NK haha The dude in the Foley stage who got to make the empty coconut sound whenever she stepped on their heads has the best job on set.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:51
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wyoak posted:And the real hack ending would be "LOL none of this mattered the world ended everyone is dead," it's basically one step away from "it was all a dream" That would not have been a hack ending, it is literally the most logical consequence of all the poo poo we’ve seen and all these garbage backstabbing humans failing to work together against an overwhelming foe. It’s the opposite of nothing mattering — everything mattered and, step by step, brought them to an entirely predictable failure
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Apr 29, 2019 17:51
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i can't believe someone asked "what's plot armor" in a show where robb's wife and arya sustain identical injuries but arya somehow runs away, swims through poo poo, and then fights a perfectly healthy trained assassin and comes out on top.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:52
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Zaphod42 posted:What if the whole army of the undead just stayed in the distance and the NK just torched Bran with his dragon? Or what if he just ignored the keep and surrounded the godswood with his army and took Bran? Anyway, is there any reason to think Bran's crow warging was anything more than just keeping track of the NK or was something else going on there?
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Apr 29, 2019 17:52
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wyoak posted:And the real hack ending would be "LOL none of this mattered the world ended everyone is dead," it's basically one step away from "it was all a dream" i would take either of those endings over the lovely generic rear end TV ending this series seems to be headed towards
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Apr 29, 2019 17:53
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just another posted:What if Ned didn't go south? What if the Children of the Forest never created the wights in the first place? Really makes you think. it's fanservice: we begged to see bran's murder we should've been more clear
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Apr 29, 2019 17:53
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Everything was dumb even though it looked really cool. But my brain is caught in a feedback loop of just how terrible and nonsensical and unsatisfying it was that Arya of all people killed the Night King. What's the point of the rest of the show then? Just send Arya off to assassinate all your enemies and sit back and reap the rewards. To do anything else is just garbage idiocy.
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Apr 29, 2019 17:53
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