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Son of Sam-I-Am posted:I'm honestly glad you didn't elaborate. It's just tits all the way down.
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May 31, 2019 05:50
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davidspackage posted:It's weird as hell that Generations and First Contact had Data doing emotions finally, and then Insurrection is all "what is playing beep boop" again. Piller hated the emotion chip and hated Data getting emotions; he wanted Data to be eternally emotionless. Son of Sam-I-Am posted:This is a franchise where the queen of a literal hive mind issues verbal commands to the drones. yeah, maybe that has something to do with why people think voyager is one of the less-good trek series
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May 31, 2019 08:01
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Brawnfire posted:That's why I got bay windows on my spaceship. You get a larger viewing angle without compromising atmos.
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May 31, 2019 08:12
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Piller hated the emotion chip and hated Data getting emotions; he wanted Data to be eternally emotionless. How dare characters change. Don’t the audiences understand SYNDICATION?
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May 31, 2019 09:25
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Zesty posted:How dare characters change. Don’t the audiences understand SYNDICATION? To be fair, it was pretty lame to have Data's quixotic dream of becoming more human be resolved through a software update.
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May 31, 2019 09:45
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I finally made it to the end of Voyager. poo poo, I had been warned it wasn't good but the finale failed to meet my very low expectations. We don't even get to see them make it back? Just hail some ships?! Why did they do all this alt future timeline stuff? Why is everyone so willing to throw away the last couple decades? Why is this story mostly about future Janeway? It's pretty amazing that Star Trek survived the Voyager years.
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May 31, 2019 11:08
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marktheando posted:
It's like the economy, you don't see the effects until the president after.
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May 31, 2019 12:50
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Sir Lemming posted:It's like the economy, you don't see the effects until the president after. Wait, so Discovery did well enough for them to green light 20 Star Trek shows because of Enterprise?! 🤔
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May 31, 2019 12:58
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marktheando posted:I finally made it to the end of Voyager. poo poo, I had been warned it wasn't good but the finale failed to meet my very low expectations.
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May 31, 2019 15:08
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Angry Salami posted:To be fair, it was pretty lame to have Data's quixotic dream of becoming more human be resolved through a software update. Not to mention his motivation for this life-altering decision being that he made a faux pas at a party.
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May 31, 2019 15:40
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Angry Salami posted:To be fair, it was pretty lame to have Data's quixotic dream of becoming more human be resolved through a software update. He is a machine, though. Pretty much everything he does is a software update.
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May 31, 2019 16:25
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Except for banging Yar. That was…you know.
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May 31, 2019 16:34
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CPColin posted:Except for banging Yar. That was…you know. ...hardware installation? Plug 'n' play?
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May 31, 2019 16:43
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Data Entry
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May 31, 2019 16:46
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marktheando posted:It's pretty amazing that Star Trek survived the Voyager years. The franchise may have, but only as an empty husk.
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May 31, 2019 17:02
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Sir Lemming posted:Data Entry
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May 31, 2019 17:16
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Do you think Data had to do the USB thing where it wouldn’t fit one way, it wouldn’t fit the other way, and then tried the first way again and it worked for some reason??
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May 31, 2019 17:20
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Sir Lemming posted:Data Entry 
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May 31, 2019 17:25
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Every time I see a bunch of USB sticks plugged into a bank or something I get the irresistible urge to yank them out and start throwing them in the air like a drunken child because of star trek
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May 31, 2019 17:44
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Sir Lemming posted:Data Entry 
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May 31, 2019 17:46
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Well they did spend a long time on spread sheets
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May 31, 2019 18:09
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I'm gonna be honest. As much as everyone talks about the the Maquis thing on Voyager being wasted, DS9 didn't have much more of an idea of what to do with them either. And that's kind of the one legit criticism I'd give to the show. The multiple arcs they start don't really come to a meaningful conclusion outside of the Dominion War arc. The Maquis peter out and get mostly wiped out offscreen. The Klingon War just runs until they decide they want to shift focus back to the Dominion and they're back to being allies again. The show just seems to be stuck in a cycle of not being able to decide what it wants to focus on until the middle of season 5.
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May 31, 2019 18:11
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I don’t think anyone considers the Maquis parts of DS9 to be up that far on the highlights list but something was done with them and it was occasionally an entertaining story or character pieces specific to the Maquis.
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May 31, 2019 18:28
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Kibayasu posted:I don’t think anyone considers the Maquis parts of DS9 to be up that far on the highlights list but something was done with them and it was occasionally an entertaining story or character pieces specific to the Maquis. While I think the quality of the Eddington/Sisko stuff is frequently overblown it's definitely got a good list of Sisko moments and even some decent character development on several ends. The Maquis were only ever a wasted idea if only because DS9 is already rich in terrorism talks via Kira and you can only do so much "I killed people, maaaaaaaan" and "The political ramifications of the declination of morality are faaaaaaart" before it really starts to wear out its welcome. Also they're just very stupid all the way down, to the point of never once making a realistically logical decision. Orv fucked around with this message at 18:34 on May 31, 2019 |
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May 31, 2019 18:32
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I'm only bring up the Maquis not to deflect from one of the valid criticisms of Voyager, but to point out a recurring problem DS9 has, and that's that everything that isn't the Dominion arc kind of peters out without a resolution. Eddington's death does nothing to address the issues that created the Maquis; it's an ending, but not necessarily a resolution.
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May 31, 2019 18:36
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I liked the two parter, the Maquis, focusing strongly on Cal Hudson's uniform. I liked the episode For the Uniform, focusing on the maquis. I will always mix these two up.
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May 31, 2019 18:42
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Honestly I always thought of the Maquis in DS9 mostly being a thing set up for Voyager then about Eddington more than them as a thing.
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May 31, 2019 18:45
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Right. The Maquis story was pretty much forced on DS9 to set up Voyager.
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May 31, 2019 19:33
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Watching Caretaker again, I'm astonished how quickly Chakotay leaps into a Starfleet uniform, with a combadge and everything. Then he forgets about being angry forever at Tom Paris and just ... exists, in the background, until the series ends. What a waste.
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May 31, 2019 20:13
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so I could say that I finally figured out what this god damned cube is doing. Get well Lowtax.
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Regardless of whether it was forced, it was still a part of the world they had to write for. And as I laid out in prior posts, it wasn’t the only plot point that suffered in this manner.
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May 31, 2019 20:16
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Nodosaur posted:And that's kind of the one legit criticism I'd give to the show. Seriously? That's the one legit criticism you have of the show?
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May 31, 2019 20:27
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I meant to say “that’s ONE legit criticism I’d give.” Sometimes my mind ends up putting thoughts in terms I use more often when I write them down.
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May 31, 2019 20:46
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Heh, I hear ya. Ain't no thang.
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May 31, 2019 21:55
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I recently watch Caretaker again just out of curiosity, and there are bunch of things that I liked: - it was fun watching Voyager get to be a real star fleet ship that goes on missions and stuff. - I liked how they introduced some of the other senior officers (all white guys) and actually played it pretty coyly regarding who was going to bite it. - Nelix preparing to get beamed up for the first time got a genuine laugh from me. I didn't like that the ship was totalled after getting to the delta quadrant, but repaired to pristine condition by the time second half started.
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May 31, 2019 22:15
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Nodosaur posted:I'm only bring up the Maquis not to deflect from one of the valid criticisms of Voyager, but to point out a recurring problem DS9 has, and that's that everything that isn't the Dominion arc kind of peters out without a resolution. Eddington's death does nothing to address the issues that created the Maquis; it's an ending, but not necessarily a resolution. From what I read about Ron Moore's depiction of the Maqui, they didn't really have a fully realized vision of what they were. His thing was that the Federation was mad that people left the Federation and it never really jives with what we see. The Maqui are putting lots of lives in danger and its the Federation's job to protect the peace for its people.
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May 31, 2019 22:34
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Nodosaur posted:I'm only bring up the Maquis not to deflect from one of the valid criticisms of Voyager, but to point out a recurring problem DS9 has, and that's that everything that isn't the Dominion arc kind of peters out without a resolution. Eddington's death does nothing to address the issues that created the Maquis; it's an ending, but not necessarily a resolution. It got subsumed by the Dominion War. The Maquis, and the colonists they were trying to protect, are either killed by the Jem'hadar or evacuated out off-screen by Starfleet after Eddington dies, having gotten Sisko to swear to help the survivors before he dies. The issues are also resolved, albeit not happily for the Maquis, because the Dominion clears up the territorial dispute very cleanly. Any former Federation citizens in Cardassian territory are either murdered or escape back to the Federation. After the war, the survivors may well be able to reclaim their old worlds since the Cardassians won't be in any kind of position to make demands of the Feds, but then again they may not want to try and take back worlds devastated by war and may well choose to remain where they resettled after the evacuation. Hard to say, and as far as I know, no one ever wrote a book or comic book about it, much less mentioned it in a movie. But the basic issue of "hey, we don't want to live under Cardassian rule and we don't want to leave" IS resolved. They left or they died.
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May 31, 2019 22:52
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when I say "no resolution", I'm not counting situations where another plot comes in and makes those things go away. That's cleaning house, not finishing a story in a way that gives resolution and meaning to the events.
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May 31, 2019 23:40
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Piller hated the emotion chip and hated Data getting emotions; he wanted Data to be eternally emotionless. Next Gen constantly has moments that hint at the idea that Data is developing emotions and transcending his programming. "The Most Toys" is a really good example of there being really clear rules set about Data only being able to hurt humans in self-dense and then actively trying to murder someone at the end of the episode out of a sense of justice, actively lying about it to Riker about it, and then kind of rubbing it in with a sick burn on the bad guy. The episodes always reset until it's the next time to hint that maybe Data is evolving, but it's hard to walk away with the idea that he's just doomed to no emotions forever.
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Jun 1, 2019 01:37
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I haven't re-watched Voyager in years since it's so painfully bad in places, but I think it's stated (or at least implied) that Chakotay was a Starfleet officer, probably only a year or two before the pilot.
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Jun 1, 2019 03:38
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FuturePastNow posted:I haven't re-watched Voyager in years since it's so painfully bad in places, but I think it's stated (or at least implied) that Chakotay was a Starfleet officer, probably only a year or two before the pilot. He was. He left Starfleet and joined the Maquis after his estranged father was killed by Cardassians. From the transcript of the really bad episode "Tattoo" quote:CHAKOTAY: I wish I could see my father's face right now.
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Jun 1, 2019 03:59
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