[SPAM] FW: RE: The logs could do with a courtesy flush

The Something Awful Forums > Archives > Comedy Goldmine > The Goodmine > [SPAM] FW: RE: The logs could do with a courtesy flush

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Neddy Seagoon: Oct 12, 2012; "Hi Everybody!"

Entropic posted:

You know the most terrifying thing about that? Someone probably deliberately put that cut in the cable jacket for drainage because it was the only way they were permitted to solve the problem.

Redoing the cabling or fixing the leak would cause an outage and affect production!! :argh:

# ? Jul 13, 2019 16:17

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# ? Apr 27, 2024 09:54

ellspurs: Sep 12, 2007; Kappa :o

Nth Doctor posted:

That's really loving weird. In the same era, I started my degree and the main high level languages we used were Java and C. Even with that there was a certain dated feel to the courses.

Also all of the department's lab computers were Linux / Unix.

In the early 2000s the instructor's choice of programming language for our IB Computer Science course was... Pascal.

We had to run it off a floppy disc, and we lost six months of teaching when the teacher went off sick and they couldn't find anyone else who knew how to teach it.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 16:26

Weedle: May 31, 2006

ellspurs posted:

In the early 2000s the instructor's choice of programming language for our IB Computer Science course was... Pascal.

We had to run it off a floppy disc, and we lost six months of teaching when the teacher went off sick and they couldn't find anyone else who knew how to teach it.

Lol I was turning in my Pascal code on a floppy disk in a manila envelope in 2007. That teacher was eventually fired for getting his dick out in a computer lab.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 16:43

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

Wizard of the Deep posted:

I agree and disagree with that. I think administration can be standardized like accounting. Comparing it to a trade like plumbing would mean we figured out "don't poo poo in the same river you drink from" 40 years ago, and today we're dealing with how bad lead actually is and PEX pipes.

I mean... yeah?

# ? Jul 13, 2019 19:34

The Iron Rose: May 12, 2012; Cat Army

ellspurs posted:

In the early 2000s the instructor's choice of programming language for our IB Computer Science course was... Pascal.

We had to run it off a floppy disc, and we lost six months of teaching when the teacher went off sick and they couldn't find anyone else who knew how to teach it.

2009, first year of high school we learned Pascal. That was the one and only computer or tech course I ever took.

No floppy disk though.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 19:46

The Fool: Oct 16, 2003

In 1998 my AP CS class consisted of our teacher handing out copies of the K&R book and then leaving us in the lab unsupervised.

So of course we did nothing but Duke3d LAN games.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 20:04

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

You can say what you want about its suitability for modern computing tasks, at least Pascal had "this should be easy to use to teach basic programming concepts (of the late 60s/70s)" as part of its original design goals. And it does a pretty good job at that, een though that pure structured programming design is no longer in style and hasn't been in a while.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 20:04

Nemo2342: Nov 26, 2007; Have A Day; Nap Ghost

The Fool posted:

In 1998 my AP CS class consisted of our teacher handing out copies of the K&R book and then leaving us in the lab unsupervised.

So of course we did nothing but Duke3d LAN games.

That was my AP CS as well, though our computers were ancient so we mostly played Scorched Earth instead, or helped the non AP people with their Turbo Pascal stuff.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 22:05

spankmeister: Jun 15, 2008

ellspurs posted:

In the early 2000s the instructor's choice of programming language for our IB Computer Science course was... Pascal.

We had to run it off a floppy disc, and we lost six months of teaching when the teacher went off sick and they couldn't find anyone else who knew how to teach it.

Ah, yes I remember using Turbo Pascal for DOS.

Later we "upgraded" to Delphi.

# ? Jul 13, 2019 22:25

Jorath: Jul 9, 2001

The Iron Rose posted:

2009, first year of high school we learned Pascal. That was the one and only computer or tech course I ever took.

No floppy disk though.

drat. I took my first high school programming course in 1989 in pascal. I assumed that the educational world had moved to %100 Java in the 90's, and then to something like ruby or .Net.

# ? Jul 14, 2019 05:42

Agrikk: Oct 17, 2003; Take care with that! We have not fully ascertained its function, and the ticking is accelerating.

Turtle supremacy.

DRAW 90
TURN 90
DRAW 90
TURN 90
DRAW 90
TURN 90
DRAW 90

# ? Jul 14, 2019 15:05

Data Graham: Dec 28, 2009; 📈📊🍪😋

Look, a box turtle

# ? Jul 14, 2019 15:12

Sywert of Thieves: Nov 7, 2005; The pirate code is really more of a guideline, than actual rules.

Agrikk posted:

Turtle supremacy.

DRAW 90
TURN 90
DRAW 90
TURN 90
DRAW 90
TURN 90
DRAW 90

poo poo, this actually brings back memories. 😊

# ? Jul 14, 2019 15:52

wolrah: May 8, 2006; what?

Merijn posted:

poo poo, this actually brings back memories. 😊

Literally the earliest memory I have of elementary school computer class is running Logo on an Apple IIe with two 5.25" floppy drives. It took me about two minutes to get in trouble for not following along with the lesson after I decided to tell it "RIGHT 999999999" which of course meant my turtle was too busy turning clockwise a few million times for me to do what the teacher was telling us to do.

I could definitely see that as being two important lessons preparing me for my eventual career.

1. The computer will do whatever it's been told to do, even if it's stupid or harmful.
2. If you give the computer a lot of things to do (or tell it to do one thing a lot of times) and that list doesn't occasionally either implicitly or explicitly include "check for user input" it's not going to listen to you until it's done, even if you want it to stop.

# ? Jul 14, 2019 16:39

BlankSystemDaemon: Mar 13, 2009

wolrah posted:

1. The computer will do whatever it's been told to do, even if it's stupid or harmful.
2. If you give the computer a lot of things to do (or tell it to do one thing a lot of times) and that list doesn't occasionally either implicitly or explicitly include "check for user input" it's not going to listen to you until it's done, even if you want it to stop.

Man, I remember these times.
Thank gently caress we have preemptive kernels in modern OS'.

# ? Jul 14, 2019 16:43

22 Eargesplitten: Oct 10, 2010

wolrah posted:

Literally the earliest memory I have of elementary school computer class is running Logo on an Apple IIe with two 5.25" floppy drives. It took me about two minutes to get in trouble for not following along with the lesson after I decided to tell it "RIGHT 999999999" which of course meant my turtle was too busy turning clockwise a few million times for me to do what the teacher was telling us to do.

I could definitely see that as being two important lessons preparing me for my eventual career.

1. The computer will do whatever it's been told to do, even if it's stupid or harmful.
2. If you give the computer a lot of things to do (or tell it to do one thing a lot of times) and that list doesn't occasionally either implicitly or explicitly include "check for user input" it's not going to listen to you until it's done, even if you want it to stop.

We did LEGO Logo in a summer camp around 2001-2002 and the first thing we did was set up a fan, then were given the commands for telling it to cycle speed and stop cycling speed. After a few go-rounds of that the teacher pointed out how everyone�s fan was going at a different speed because the command hadn�t said to change by a specific amount so it stopped at a different speed depending on the exact moment we told it to hold steady. That was basically lesson 1. Computers are dumb, they will do exactly what you tell them to, even if that�s not what you meant.

In college in �09 it was C++, then at another school in �11 it was Java. Then I know at least MIT was using Python at that same point. Seems all over the place what the preferred language for s school is.

# ? Jul 14, 2019 16:49

Neddy Seagoon: Oct 12, 2012; "Hi Everybody!"

22 Eargesplitten posted:

We did LEGO Logo in a summer camp around 2001-2002 and the first thing we did was set up a fan, then were given the commands for telling it to cycle speed and stop cycling speed. After a few go-rounds of that the teacher pointed out how everyone�s fan was going at a different speed because the command hadn�t said to change by a specific amount so it stopped at a different speed depending on the exact moment we told it to hold steady. That was basically lesson 1. Computers are dumb, they will do exactly what you tell them to, even if that�s not what you meant.

I've occasionally helped friends with how to do specific things in programs like Blender and Unity, and my general response to "it seems hard/very complex to do this One Simple Thing (that they now understand how to do)" is generally something like "congratulations, you understand just how powerful [the software] can be".

# ? Jul 14, 2019 17:08

wolrah: May 8, 2006; what?

D. Ebdrup posted:

Man, I remember these times.
Thank gently caress we have preemptive kernels in modern OS'.

One of the high schools I went to was an Apple school. They had a few OS X systems in testing but the main systems accessible to students were running Mac OS 9 and had Netscape Communicator as the browser. I'm fairly certain everyone in that school could find the reset button on a first-gen iMac entirely by muscle memory after having to use that combination when doing research.

# ? Jul 14, 2019 17:22

nielsm: Jun 1, 2009

I remember once in school having a day where we got to work with some LEGO Dacta computer-controlled stuff, I think as part of some physics teaching about gear ratios and such. I noticed the system seemed to be fully programmable but didn't quite understand the language used. Thinking back, I think it was some Lisp-dialect. I wish they would have taught me something about it rather than just "don't touch that"

# ? Jul 14, 2019 17:50

BlankSystemDaemon: Mar 13, 2009

wolrah posted:

One of the high schools I went to was an Apple school. They had a few OS X systems in testing but the main systems accessible to students were running Mac OS 9 and had Netscape Communicator as the browser. I'm fairly certain everyone in that school could find the reset button on a first-gen iMac entirely by muscle memory after having to use that combination when doing research.

Heh, this made me look for the document describing the multitasking that was in Mac OS 9, but which wasn't ever really noticed because then OS 10 happened and that was 1) Mach from CMU 2) some FreeBSD 7 bits (scheduling/process model, VFS, netstack, POSIX compatibility) and 3) a whole bunch of userland code plus some drivers - with the 3rd part contributing by far the most in terms of size.

And just prior to that, I'd stumbled across one of my favorite stories from back in the days on the impossibility of not being able to send email more than 500 miles.

nielsm posted:

I remember once in school having a day where we got to work with some LEGO Dacta computer-controlled stuff, I think as part of some physics teaching about gear ratios and such. I noticed the system seemed to be fully programmable but didn't quite understand the language used. Thinking back, I think it was some Lisp-dialect. I wish they would have taught me something about it rather than just "don't touch that"

I'm pretty sure MindStorm descends directly from the LEGO 9 V spec which was the foundation for the train-sets I used to play with (and which are still in the boxes in my parents' attic), so it seems entirely probable that NXPLisp (the programming language used in MindStorm) is descended from Logo on LEGO Dacta.

BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Jul 14, 2019

# ? Jul 14, 2019 23:02

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

Mindstorms can be flashed to run on Java too, and it's pretty fun to watch your robot fail as threading goes wrong.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 00:52

Sywert of Thieves: Nov 7, 2005; The pirate code is really more of a guideline, than actual rules.

22 Eargesplitten posted:

Computers are dumb, they will do exactly what you tell them to, even if that�s not what you meant.

This is the essence of programming, or even working with computers in general.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 07:54

22 Eargesplitten: Oct 10, 2010

Yeah, it was definitely the right first lesson for an elementary/middle school programming class.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 13:22

Sefal: Nov 8, 2011; Fun Shoe

My linux lessons in school consisted of creating directories via the terminal and then deleting those directories.
The windows specific lessons became good when we had to study for the Microsoft Technology Associate exams. Pretty basic stuff, but it was miles ahead of the regular lessons.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 14:26

The Macaroni: Dec 20, 2002; ...it does nothing.

wolrah posted:

Literally the earliest memory I have of elementary school computer class is running Logo on an Apple IIe with two 5.25" floppy drives. It took me about two minutes to get in trouble for not following along with the lesson after I decided to tell it "RIGHT 999999999" which of course meant my turtle was too busy turning clockwise a few million times for me to do what the teacher was telling us to do.

Pressing Ctrl-C didn't cancel the process?

# ? Jul 15, 2019 16:26

Sirotan: Oct 17, 2006; Sirotan is a seal.

My high school offered several computer skills classes including:

-Learning about token ring networking, in 1999
-Touch typing, on keyboards with a bunch of keys missing (they were all stored in a giant garbage can in a closet) while the teacher held a piece of paper over your hands
-An entire semester long class to go through some dumb MS Office tutorials (I got an award at the end of the year for being the best student in this class, lmao)

# ? Jul 15, 2019 16:44

Eikre: May 2, 2009

The Macaroni posted:

Pressing Ctrl-C didn't cancel the process?

Why would an eight-year-old seated at baby's first command line know an interrupt keystroke?

# ? Jul 15, 2019 17:36

Renegret: May 26, 2007; THANK YOU FOR CALLING HELP DOG, INC.

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Eikre posted:

Why would an eight-year-old seated at baby's first command line know an interrupt keystroke?

And before anyone says it

No I wouldn't expect the teacher who just read the lesson plan on a book the night before to know either.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 17:54

Ham Equity: Apr 16, 2013; i hosted a great goon meet and all i got was this lousy avatar; Grimey Drawer

wolrah posted:

1. The computer will do whatever it's been told to do, even if it's stupid or harmful.
2. If you give the computer a lot of things to do (or tell it to do one thing a lot of times) and that list doesn't occasionally either implicitly or explicitly include "check for user input" it's not going to listen to you until it's done, even if you want it to stop.

If I could choose one simple technical concept to drill into the minds of all management, it would be GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out).

Not sure how common that acronym is these days, it's been around since at least the 80s, and is just as (almost certainly way more) applicable today as it was back then.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 17:56

Kurieg: Jul 19, 2012; RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20

Thanatosian posted:

If I could choose one simple technical concept to drill into the minds of all management, it would be GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out).

Not sure how common that acronym is these days, it's been around since at least the 80s, and is just as (almost certainly way more) applicable today as it was back then.

For the most part, yeah. But I think you can blame a lot of companies for not doing basic input scrubbing.

That said, I've been able to deflect/delay a few tickets for minor bugs because they only arise when the user was being actively malicious and the "fix" would drastically impact performance for everyone else. In that case the bugfix was "fire that end user".

# ? Jul 15, 2019 18:10

BlankSystemDaemon: Mar 13, 2009

Thanatosian posted:

If I could choose one simple technical concept to drill into the minds of all management, it would be GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out).

Not sure how common that acronym is these days, it's been around since at least the 80s, and is just as (almost certainly way more) applicable today as it was back then.

It's more applicable now, since society is proving that it works outside of computers too. :eng99:

# ? Jul 15, 2019 18:15

stevewm: May 10, 2005

Sirotan posted:

My high school offered several computer skills classes including:

-Learning about token ring networking, in 1999
-Touch typing, on keyboards with a bunch of keys missing (they were all stored in a giant garbage can in a closet) while the teacher held a piece of paper over your hands
-An entire semester long class to go through some dumb MS Office tutorials (I got an award at the end of the year for being the best student in this class, lmao)

Around the same time... Mine offered typing, "Office Basics" which was just a class dedicated to learning word/excel, and programming (using Visual C++). The programming class stupidly had a prerequisite of having completed Advanced Placement Math, when the programming they did in said class didn't involve anything outside putting some buttons on a form and performing basic logic.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 18:25

OneTruePecos: Oct 24, 2010

Thanatosian posted:

If I could choose one simple technical concept to drill into the minds of all management, it would be GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out).

Not sure how common that acronym is these days, it's been around since at least the 80s, and is just as (almost certainly way more) applicable today as it was back then.

Cue the Babbage quote about being asked if the machine will still give the right results if you give it the wrong values to start on. I'm sure you could find some quote from Socrates or Aristotle about the definition of a process being something with an end state that depends on the beginning state if you went looking.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 18:32

wolrah: May 8, 2006; what?

The Macaroni posted:

Pressing Ctrl-C didn't cancel the process?

I'm not 100% sure what I tried, but this was 1992 and my family had an IBM PC that I played games on so I was familiar with a few Ctrl combos at that point. I don't think I was aware of Ctrl+Apple+Reset at that point or if that even worked on pre-Mac hardware.

I did apparently misremember what exactly I did though, I fired up an Apple IIe emulator running Apple Logo and it only allows up to six digits, while performing a "RIGHT 999999" in a fraction of a second even with the CPU speed set to "realistic" so either the AppleWin emulator is way off the mark or I have something wrong. All I can recall for sure is I got it stuck in a loop that I'm pretty sure wasn't infinite but was going to take a long time to complete on that hardware.

Looking at the Apple Logo manual on Archive it seems like flow control was pretty early in the book, so maybe I just read ahead and started playing with loops before the class was supposed to get there. I'm not sure. The end result was the same, I got yelled at for not following along (a common theme in my schooling when the class was going way too slow).

Eikre posted:

Why would an eight-year-old seated at baby's first command line know an interrupt keystroke?

I was actually six at the time (first grade) and I did know my way around MS-DOS enough to install and play my games, so keyboard shortcuts were not unfamiliar. Not sure if I knew Ctrl-C by then though, I feel like that was something I learned a year or two later when I started writing my own batch files.

I was not a normal kid.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 20:06

The Macaroni: Dec 20, 2002; ...it does nothing.

Eikre posted:

Why would an eight-year-old seated at baby's first command line know an interrupt keystroke?

The old Apple II welcome tutorial program taught Ctrl-C. (Which looking back, was pretty amazing.) Plus the teacher actually taught us that keystroke, since we were all jackasses in class doing things like:

10 PRINT "TIM IS A PENIS HEAD": REPEAT 1000
20 GOTO 10

# ? Jul 15, 2019 20:19

TITTIEKISSER69: Mar 19, 2005; SAVE THE BEES
PLANT MORE TREES
CLEAN THE SEAS
KISS TITTIESS

Sounds like GOB's Program

# ? Jul 15, 2019 20:47

Renegret: May 26, 2007; THANK YOU FOR CALLING HELP DOG, INC.

YOUR POSITION IN THE QUEUE IS *pbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbt*

Cat Army Sworn Enemy

I got in trouble for using CSS in an HTML class in college before we officially learned it.

I was too lazy to rewrite all the formatting for every assignment so I kept reusing the same file. I kept using it anyway.

# ? Jul 15, 2019 22:43

Panthrax: Jul 12, 2001; I'm gonna hit you until candy comes out.

First semester of college in 1998 I took I think a programming 101 class that was based on C++. All assignments and tests were done by hand on paper, except for the one or two weeks when we got to go to the computer lab and play around with Borland C++ to see how programming actually worked! Surprisingly, I hated that class!

# ? Jul 15, 2019 22:58

Sheep: Jul 24, 2003

Panthrax posted:

First semester of college in 1998 I took I think a programming 101 class that was based on C++. All assignments and tests were done by hand on paper, except for the one or two weeks when we got to go to the computer lab and play around with Borland C++ to see how programming actually worked! Surprisingly, I hated that class!

This was my C/C++ class in 2014 too. Every test was pen and paper, including the final.

# ? Jul 16, 2019 00:07

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# ? Apr 27, 2024 09:54

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

wolrah posted:

writing my own batch files.

When I was unemployed around the recession I did a government sponsored "computer repair" course that was ECDL and CompTIA A+ with some vague extra exams later on. When we got to batch files people in the class couldn't understand how they were dangerous, so I wrote this "badidea.bat" script to show them:

code:

echo lol
start cmd /k badidea.bat

Sadly not everyone heeded my instruction to save all their work before running it.

Sheep posted:

This was my C/C++ class in 2014 too. Every test was pen and paper, including the final.

"Program on paper, you fail if it doesn't compile!" is why I dropped out of the course I started in 2003. poo poo never changes.

# ? Jul 16, 2019 03:02

The Something Awful Forums > Archives > Comedy Goldmine > The Goodmine > [SPAM] FW: RE: The logs could do with a courtesy flush

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