|
Steve Yun posted:There’s an amazing moment when a guy pretending to be Buffoon Bruce Lee, a guy pretending to be an imaginary stuntman, a guy who played a stuntman in a previous film and an actual real life stuntwoman all appear on screen and argue with each other. ... and don't forget that a while after that you see a fight scene that the real Bruce Lee choreographed being watched by a woman who is pretending to be the woman in the scene.
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 19:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 18:47 |
|
|
Steve Yun posted:If there’s any One Big Point I get out of this movie, it is that movies are not real, and even movies about real life events are make believe and fantasy. Movies are stories in the same way that people talking about Cliff having murdered his wife are unconfirmed gossip. That's a fairly good taken. Maybe there's also a message that people will get what they want out of a movie, as seen when the cult girl is talking about killing people who taught hem how to kill. My interpretation of the wife killing is that he probably did it under duress and Rick was the only one who supported him afterwards. The act of brotherhood forever earned loyalty and a chance for Cliff towards redemption. He basically becomes Rick's own Kato from that point onward.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 19:50
|
|
|
It just occurred to me that Kato was the character Bruce Lee played on the Green Hornet, and that the stunt job Clint lost by fighting Lee was for Green Hornet, and that I should have recognized this because I just watched the latest seasons of Venture Brothers where The Monarch and 24 pretend to be the Blue Morpho and Kano, Kano being the asian martial arts master employed by the Blue Morpho and later by Jonas Venture. I was so confused by who Kato was supposed to be because I've only ever watched jokes and references to the material they were using. Dang.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 19:59
|
|
|
InfiniteZero posted:... and don't forget that a while after that you see a fight scene that the real Bruce Lee choreographed being watched by a woman who is pretending to be the woman in the scene. Holy poo poo It blew my mind to find out that was Sharon Tate in the movie and not Margot Robbie It’s blowing my mind again to realize how this fits into the theme.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 20:03
|
|
|
The Twitter reaction to the Bruce Lee scene was so virulent that I went into the movie expecting it to be 5 straight minutes of Brad Pitt kicking his rear end. They literally knock each other down one time each and then the fight gets called off. I feel like people were loading up the hot takes about that scene before the movie came out. I definitely saw people preemptively bitching about it when the trailer dropped.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 20:24
|
|
|
Yeah, I mean it probably came off the other way earlier, but I actually don't care if he was supposed to be a buffoon in the movie or not. I do understand why some would be offended. I think Bruce has a huge cult of personality, and that's inflated his stature beyond anything that's reasonable. I think he was a charismatic actor with legit martial arts ability, but how good he truly was will never be determined as there's way too much hearsay and rumor about his life. I grew up loving the guy, but it's a bit ridiculous that people assume he's like the greatest martial artist ever or could beat (insert fighter here)__________ in a fight. That said, I find his inclusion and interpretation in the film interesting. I think the actor did a good job of imitating him, but to me it came off as a bit of a really good parody of his famous lines. Initially, my reaction was, why is this guy making these grand philosophical martial arts statements in the middle of a random episode production? Would he be doing that for every episode and all the time? I'll have to hear what Quentin himself ever says about it, if he ever does.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 20:38
|
|
|
iamsosmrt posted:This movie isn't good. I described in a previous post yesterday my explanations. It's almost like you need to back yourself up because no one else will. QTs fanboys began with Reservoir Dogs and abruptly ended with Jackie Brown. No one has been lapping anything up since.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 21:01
|
|
|
I think we got iamsosmrt turned around since that post, no need to argue with him still
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 21:39
|
|
|
Philthy posted:QTs fanboys began with Reservoir Dogs and abruptly ended with Jackie Brown. No one has been lapping anything up since. This is just patently untrue.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 21:42
|
|
|
Steve Yun posted:I think we got iamsosmrt turned around since that post, no need to argue with him still I mean, it was never my hill to die on. I liked or even loved a lot of things in this movie, but it's like 1 hour too long for my taste and there was a lot of content I really didn't like in that hour.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 21:48
|
|
|
I wonder how much of the movie's runtime is just people driving around. To be fair tho, a big part of living in LA is having to drive everywhere.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 21:52
|
|
|
ruddiger posted:I wonder how much of the movie's runtime is just people driving around. Not enough imo. The whole sequence with Cliff driving home at night through the drive-in is maybe my favorite part of the movie
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 21:58
|
|
|
Blast Fantasto posted:Not enough imo. The whole sequence with Cliff driving home at night through the drive-in is maybe my favorite part of the movie I say this with sincerity, can you explain why? I thought the sequence was filmed really well and was pretty cool in a vacuum. But it was rather long. It may have been, say, 5 minutes but it felt like 10 to me. If it's a difference of taste, I can accept that. For instance, Drive is fairly well liked, and but I had a similar opinion of that movie.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:02
|
|
|
If there was anything to knock the movie for, it was that the cuts needed to be tighter. There was a lot of drawn out shots that didn’t even have the excuse of showing us something nostalgic or interesting. Almost every scene had a few seconds of it
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:11
|
|
|
iamsosmrt posted:I say this with sincerity, can you explain why? Personally I appreciated the driving sequences not just because driving is an integral part of being in LA and because everything was so well staged but importantly as a showcase for whatever music the character was listening to at the time. Underlining a piece of music has always been one of Tarantino's things too so it wasn't really jarring or even surprising.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:13
|
|
|
usually Tarantino picks songs that aren't played out from being in literally every show/movie about the sixties, though
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:15
|
|
|
Blast Fantasto posted:The Twitter reaction to the Bruce Lee scene was so virulent that I went into the movie expecting it to be 5 straight minutes of Brad Pitt kicking his rear end. They literally knock each other down one time each and then the fight gets called off. It's weird people like to forget that Bruce Lee had massive respect for Chuck Norris and there are a bunch of myths that neither ever openly spoke about regarding a spar between them. It doesn't really matter what happened in real life because in the movie everything has a grain of truth and is also blown way the gently caress out of proportion, just like nostalgia for a time long gone.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:16
|
|
|
hawowanlawow posted:usually Tarantino picks songs that aren't played out from being in literally every show/movie about the sixties, though Nah, that would have meant we would have heard Iron Butterfly or Forunate Son or The Doors or something like that. Instead we got Mitch Ryder and Roy Head. Mrs.Robinson did happen though. I'll give you that one.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:17
|
|
|
TrixRabbi posted:I always thought that story weirdly tried to suggest Tarantino making a negligent and bullheaded safety decision on set was really trying to stretch it into a #MeToo scenario. Like, Tarantino 100% hosed up, but it was also clearly a workplace accident and one he's had to personally atone for with her. Maybe if Uma was a man he'd have taken her concerns more seriously, but that's the type of thing that's hard to prove. I just don't know how that story got extrapolated into something explicitly sexist -- and I'm not one to shy away from calling out Hollywood sexism. That was exactly my thoughts during my initial read when it came out, too. "I thought this was about sexual harassment, why are they spending so much time on this?" It wasn't until afterwards and thinking about in context with all the Kill Bill stuff - how often she was choked, spit on, drenched, made filthy and sticky - and how often apparently Tarantino would giddily volunteer to do all this to her himself where it clicked for me what it must have been getting at. Or so I thought? Could very well be that the writer tried to make it out to be something more than it was. I could also see it being true but since Thurman and Tarantino are close and seem to have long since made amends, Thurman tried straddling some line where she refers to the events but not get real blunt to the point where "Uma: QT is a Perv!" makes headlines. I dunno! TrixRabbi posted:I do, however, think it's fair to hold Tarantino accountable for almost certainly being aware to at least some degree of Weinstein's crimes and turning a blind eye, but it's him and basically everyone else who worked with Miramax over the past 20 years as well. Like, I don't buy Robert Rodriguez's story about making Planet Terror as a "gently caress You" to Weinstein when in the end it's still making Weinstein money to do the movie. And there's a whole stock of directors who worked with Weinstein in this period who also had to have been aware but went ahead anyway. That in no way diminishes Tarantino's decision to keep working with him up until the revelations, but it's far from just him. (I realize this is getting off topic, I promise I'll drop the subject). From what I understand there's this largely informal racket of actresses and models more or less escorting that apparently everyone in Hollywood kind of knows exists but don't really talk about much publicly (it's referred to in terms like "yachting"). The existence of such a hustle I'm sure is a systemic sexist problem in itself but I can imagine if you're in the industry and aware that it's A Thing you might see some poo poo and think "Eh, she's got an arrangement going, it's not my business," and not recognize if it's a more overtly abusive situation. Or people are just cowardly, which is always a likelihood. Obviously just rank speculation on my part but it's fun to speculate *shrugs*
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2019 22:42
|
|
|
I wonder if most of the people who are bothered by the pacing have ever seen a movie made before 1980
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 00:05
|
|
|
InfiniteZero posted:Mrs.Robinson did happen though. I'll give you that one. ...and they cut the ignition, i think, right when the classic chorus comes in....which to me was like a "turn this poo poo off" in the greater film making of it all.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 01:03
|
|
|
Vince MechMahon posted:No you're right. But that's the point. He's glorifying that era of TV and doing his idealized, loving version of it. Not how it really was. The person you replied to is definitely being too hard on old TV, as they put it. https://mobile.twitter.com/ZODIAC_MF/status/1156382244669444098 Columbo is better than most of anything on TV today. I'm more familiar with 70s shows than the 60s. People act like all old TV is garbage, far from it. Speaking of, Cliff's trailer interior looked a lot like what I recall the interior of Jim Rockford's trailer looking like.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 01:04
|
|
|
one thing I'll say to defend the Bruce Lee scene: you're seeing it from what appears to be a day dream reminiscence from Cliff's point of view. I'm sure we all look back at some badass moment in our life with rose-tinted glasses that was actually just embarrassing and stupid in actuality.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 02:20
|
|
|
Unmature posted:I wonder if most of the people who are bothered by the pacing have ever seen a movie made before 1980 Especially considering it was one of the best paced movies I’ve seen in a long loving time. Do you know how much I loved watching shots last more than just a few seconds and the movie allowing me to be transported to an entirely different era just through allowing the scene to breathe. It felt so good to just cruise around LA and listen to music. Literally no marvel movie has ever earned their 3 hour run times. I could have watched this movie for another hour easily.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 02:22
|
|
|
The_Rob posted:Especially considering it was one of the best paced movies I’ve seen in a long loving time. Do you know how much I loved watching shots last more than just a few seconds and the movie allowing me to be transported to an entirely different era just through allowing the scene to breathe. It felt so good to just cruise around LA and listen to music. Literally no marvel movie has ever earned their 3 hour run times. I could have watched this movie for another hour easily. It really must be a matter of personal taste. I felt the opposite. I'm also a fan of a lot of classic cinema like the Godfather, Citizen Kane, even Gone with the Wind. I finally invested 4 hours to watch Lawrence of Arabia a few weeks back and while I didn't love everything about it, I didn't mind the pacing. The pacing here just really didn't do it for me. See the thing about the pacing that bothered me in a storytelling sense was the sudden influx of narrative exposition for the final act. Like everything we really needed to know to end the movie was spoonfed in a few moments. Maybe that was done as a reference to some classic Hollywood gag, I don't know, but I wasn't a fan. Like the movie had been at a very deliberate pace for awhile and then BOOM, things started happening in a hurry.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 02:40
|
|
|
theBeaz posted:I think people are just really uncomfortable with the 2 women (who were ready to disembowel 3 innocent people) getting brutally counter-murdered while completely overlooking there was also a man who was mauled by the dog, had his dick bitten off, and then head stomped like a watermelon in the most brutal fashion. Believing this scene has anything to do with #metoo or Weinstein is just... no. So did the dog improv the dick-bite and get a Scooby snack for his good acting instincts afterwards, or do you think the dog emasculating, in the biblical sense, the only male hippy before he gets killed might have had a point and a message behind it. You can enjoy this movie even if you do prefer to watch it through a feminist lens. I did. But I think you're being a little breezy trying to dismiss the gender politics aspect of this movie offhand.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 03:52
|
|
|
WarEternal posted:The person you replied to is definitely being too hard on old TV, as they put it. I thought he was referring to the stuff where we were seeing Rick act. Which is definitely stylized.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 03:57
|
|
|
Unmature posted:I wonder if most of the people who are bothered by the pacing have ever seen a movie made before 1980 This is a disingenous argument, because even within QTs body of work, there is a vast difference in pacing between the Sally Menke edited movies and this one. Inglourious Basterds has 30 minute scenes, but is pretty widely beloved at this point, because the scenes are riveting and full of content, memorable dialogue, reversals, character setups/payoffs Once Upon a Time in Hollywood has none of those things: its shapeless, there are barely even any conversations in it, no real set-pieces except the last 5 minutes. Its allegedly this great buddy movie between Dicaprio and Pitt, and yet they spend most of the movie on their own unrelated tangents and get maybe 15 minutes of screen-time together. On top of that its bizarre structurally, with the Italy trip totally messing up the momentum the movie has built, to where it then has to try to sloppily reset itself in the last 20 minutes. I love the guy as much as anybody but its just not very good.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 03:59
|
|
|
Steve Yun posted:Holy poo poo Idgi, Margot Robbie doesn’t look anything like Sharon Tate. I’m really bemused by people seeing a strong resemblance
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 04:42
|
|
|
DeimosRising posted:Idgi, Margot Robbie doesn’t look anything like Sharon Tate. I’m really bemused by people seeing a strong resemblance I say this with lots of love, but there's a lot of face blind goons.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 04:45
|
|
|
Philthy posted:It's almost like you need to back yourself up because no one else will. QTs fanboys began with Reservoir Dogs and abruptly ended with Jackie Brown. No one has been lapping anything up since. This was before my time so I'm genuinely curious, why would the fanboyism end with a movie that is easily in the top 3 of anything he's done? Saw this movie again and it's just as good the second time, though I do think the editing isn't as tight as his other stuff. I was also too busy paying attention the screen the first time to notice how hilariously on the nose the final use of 60s music was (in a good way). I'm still not entirely sure how I feel about the structure of the last act - it definitely feels a little clumsier on the rewatch. Also neat detail that I missed the first time - the Drafthouse showed some interviews with a stuntman before the movie, and one of the stories he brings is up is the time he paid Charles Manson to repair an actor's dune buggy while they were shooting on Spahn Ranch. Sure enough, there is a dune buggy on the ranch in the movie. Maybe a coincidence I guess, but that's some absurd deep-dive detail if not, and I'm pretty sure it's not. Edit: Also, that Uma Thurman article made me notice it, and maybe I'm overthinking this but: Cliff drives a beat-up version of the same car Uma drives in Kill Bill (a blue Volkswagen Karmann) and there's a shot where he's leaving the driveway to go home that is shot pretty similarly to the scene that resulted in her crash. He even corners too fast and slides a bit. Grizzled Patriarch fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Aug 1, 2019 |
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 05:11
|
|
|
WarEternal posted:The person you replied to is definitely being too hard on old TV, as they put it. Vince MechMahon posted:I thought he was referring to the stuff where we were seeing Rick act. Which is definitely stylized. Yeah, I mostly meant the Lancer pilot scenes (Though I thought the bits we saw of Bounty Law routinely swapped between being honest to the period and QT having a field day.) I saw that ZMF tweet earlier today and was very surprised to find out what was in the film was shot-for-shot with the original show - most notably, that they actually had the sequence of Burt shooting from the truck in motion, and the shot through the shattered windshield. I watched a lot of Nick at Nite as a kid, but typically only 3-camera stuff. I could stand to revisit some classic TV drama. On the subject, however tangentially: I'm honestly glad that Bruce Dern played the role intended for Reynolds. Dern can still "play" old on camera; his scene is a kind of comedic, cathartic button to the Ranch sequence. Yes, shady poo poo is going on, but this old man is seemingly okay with it - young hippie girls are sleeping with him regularly, and he likes the routine they've established. Meanwhile, Reynolds doing a voice role on Archer in 2012 made me uncomfortable. Imagining him as a mostly bed-ridden blind man, in a film shot in 2018...his presence would've palpably changed the tone of the scene.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 06:15
|
|
|
I was hyped as gently caress when Clu Gulager popped up as the shopkeeper in the bookstore, but he had like one line and that was it. That scene should've went on longer. Release the Gulager cut, Tarantino!
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 06:38
|
|
|
DeimosRising posted:Idgi, Margot Robbie doesn’t look anything like Sharon Tate. I’m really bemused by people seeing a strong resemblance What can I say, white people all look the same
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 06:49
|
|
|
DeimosRising posted:Idgi, Margot Robbie doesn’t look anything like Sharon Tate. I’m really bemused by people seeing a strong resemblance Apparently Tate's real sister cried seeing Margot Robbie in person because of their resemblance.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 07:24
|
|
|
Tate and Robbie have drat near identical jawlines and reasonably similar cheekbones I guess but that's really it. It was a good casting choice but I didn't find the resemblance particularly striking.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 08:24
|
|
|
Did anybody read any significance into the part where Sharon Tate asks about the hubbub going on down the way from the Mexican restaurant, and being befuddled to learn it’s a premiere for a porn film? I took it as symbolic of Hollywood moving into a less innocent era, and her being blatantly not prepared for that. But, my own interpretation aside, it definitely seemed too deliberate to not accentuate some kind of point or theme.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 08:42
|
|
|
Speaking of, anyone have any idea what was the porn movie having the premiere? I thought it might have been Deep Throat or Behind The Green Door, but they didn't come out til '72. It might've been Warhol's Blue Movie (AKA, gently caress), but I haven't seen anything to confirm that anywhere. By the way, that specific porn theater has become the New Beverly Cinema, the theater Tarantino co-owns. It was surreal seeing it in the movie while watching the movie there.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 09:37
|
|
Grizzled Patriarch posted:Also neat detail that I missed the first time - the Drafthouse showed some interviews with a stuntman before the movie, and one of the stories he brings is up is the time he paid Charles Manson to repair an actor's dune buggy while they were shooting on Spahn Ranch. Sure enough, there is a dune buggy on the ranch in the movie. Maybe a coincidence I guess, but that's some absurd deep-dive detail if not, and I'm pretty sure it's not. Charlie Manson being obsessed with dune buggies is a small but noted part of his story, so it was almost certainly intentional.
|
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 12:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 18:47 |
|
|
-What did people make of the Gary scene? All that tension and he’s just fine and happy with his situation(other than being blind). Just seemed kind of strange that the Manson girl wasn’t lying at all. -What was up with that painting in Dalton’s driveway? -And lol at Cliff’s perfect fighting reactions when he’s tripping balls.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2019 13:48
|
|
