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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Lol I left Gary Indiana out for a reason Gary Indiana Gary Indiana Gary Indiana let me say it once again
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Aug 12, 2019 15:16
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:buy your Allen Edmonds while you can because as a company they are beyond hosed wisconsin and michigan are probably not the best ideas based on what their state governments have been doing to local infrastructure chicago has a reasonable amount of tech, as do the twin cities though the latter is mainly medical and retail stuff, not shiny startups
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Aug 12, 2019 15:19
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I thought it was called Jerry Indiana.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:20
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Lol I left Gary Indiana out for a reason https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNM5g2ARGyY
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Aug 12, 2019 17:30
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feedmegin posted:It really isn't. Check out the last couple of pages of the Oldie Programmers thread in the CoC. genuinely didn’t realize it was how!! he’s a treasure 
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Aug 12, 2019 17:34
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I’ve never heard of this how!! person other than his current insanity. what’s the story?
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Aug 12, 2019 18:33
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Achmed Jones posted:I’ve never heard of this how!! person other than his current insanity. what’s the story? his current insanity pretty much is the story they ask for help or feedback then refute it in (often fallacious) argument when it's given i'm convinced they're just having a stymie-style larf
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Aug 12, 2019 19:01
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hobbesmaster posted:everywhere east of the dry line is like that ah yeah that makes sense - I just don't have much experience with climate outside the Midwest other than summer in Seattle and winter in NY
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Aug 12, 2019 20:03
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The place I did my node.js tech interview with this morning just called me saying they want to move forward with some references. I assume after that they will be proceeding with an offer. The recruiter said to think of a salary range and let her know with the referneces. Any advice? This seems to be moving really fast
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Aug 12, 2019 20:53
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barkbell posted:The place I did my node.js tech interview with this morning just called me saying they want to move forward with some references. I assume after that they will be proceeding with an offer. The recruiter said to think of a salary range and let her know with the referneces. Any advice? This seems to be moving really fast references typically come last, when you have pretty much everything ironed out, including price, and it's down to you and another finalist or something giving up your references early will just tire them out / piss them off
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Aug 12, 2019 20:56
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Wait what. They called me asking for references and also to give them a range since I said I hadn't considered one quite yet.
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Aug 12, 2019 21:24
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barkbell posted:Wait what. They called me asking for references and also to give them a range since I said I hadn't considered one quite yet. Tire out the references, that is, I think Seems to me there's no point in giving references unless an offer is on the table--and them asking for your range is a last ditch effort to get you to speak up first. If it were me and I were feeling confident/unanxious (ha!), I'd email something back about accepting industry standard rates, or whatever the language would be--there's examples in this thread--and ignore the request for references until you are definitely offered or offer-immediately-pending
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Aug 12, 2019 21:33
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The recruiter said this is the last step of the process. No more interviews. I should probably e-mail back asking for a discussion of benefits.
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Aug 12, 2019 21:35
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barkbell posted:The recruiter said this is the last step of the process. No more interviews. I should probably e-mail back asking for a discussion of benefits. You're in a great position. Hold steady and whatever you do, do not give them a number.
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Aug 12, 2019 21:41
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It seems that the "never give a number" advice isn't 100% ironclad, but drat near, yes
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Aug 12, 2019 21:42
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I was very lucky in the job I just accepted. They asked me for a number, I decided "we're at the end of this process, let's put my number out there" and they came back the next week with an extra 15k on top because the CEO decided to stop asking for a number and make salaries data-driven to eliminate unconscious biases when hiring women. I'm just sitting there thinking "poo poo I was expecting them to negotiate me down"
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Aug 12, 2019 22:04
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gettin laid off at the end of september, whooo. havent had to look for a job in close to 10 years. linkedin still the goto for that? got my first job though craigslist so idk
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Aug 12, 2019 22:39
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pathetic little tramp posted:I was very lucky in the job I just accepted. They asked me for a number, I decided "we're at the end of this process, let's put my number out there" and they came back the next week with an extra 15k on top because the CEO decided to stop asking for a number and make salaries data-driven to eliminate unconscious biases when hiring women. This is the reason you don't give a number. Chances are very high that the range is higher than 15k more and you could have asked for more.
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Aug 12, 2019 22:44
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Achmed Jones posted:I’ve never heard of this how!! person other than his current insanity. what’s the story? how!!'s first post was a long winded tale about showing up at a new job as a junior dev, looking at the code base for a couple hours, and coming back to declare that the only possible path forward was a ground-up rewrite. the question was "how do i make them see my obvious brilliance?" up next in the oldie thread, on the current re-reg, how!! came in with this glorious post describing a 3 hour workday where his 'boss' would write tickets, he would close them out in ~15 minutes each, until the boss got bored. the question wasn't "how do i keep myself sharp in this weak sauce environment", it was "how can i get these hours at my next place". warnings about the tech atrophy went unheeded. now, 7 years into a programming career, how!! swooped into the oldie thread to whinge about "oversaturation," which he then goes on to define as "a company refusing to hire talent for any reason outside of sheer technical competency" and makes clear that he is unwilling to whiteboard, take-home, or even wag the dog on basic behavioral questions how!! is a 1-year-10-times developer and a bottomless pit into which any and all advice can be aimed without consequence. dunk on him at your leisure, don't pretend that it's for anyone but the peanut gallery
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Aug 12, 2019 22:56
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JawnV6 posted:how!!'s first post was a long winded tale about showing up at a new job as a junior dev, looking at the code base for a couple hours, and coming back to declare that the only possible path forward was a ground-up rewrite. the question was "how do i make them see my obvious brilliance?" 
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Aug 12, 2019 22:59
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How!! is the programmer we all secretly aspire to be
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Aug 13, 2019 00:34
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I'm doing well, thanks
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Aug 13, 2019 00:36
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the smarter versions of how!! go into product management or sales after a while or I guess the more personable ones
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Aug 13, 2019 01:09
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JawnV6 posted:how!!'s first post was a long winded tale about showing up at a new job as a junior dev, looking at the code base for a couple hours, and coming back to declare that the only possible path forward was a ground-up rewrite. the question was "how do i make them see my obvious brilliance?" Don't forget the original... nbv4 Which led to this thing of beauty... That Turkey Story posted:I work as a programmer coding software for an automatic sewing machine that runs entirely on cow manure to be used primarily by wives of cattle farmers (not even kidding). Despite how it sounds, we somehow have a steady stream of consumers and the software itself is surprisingly complicated -- the machine manages all different kinds of needles and threads, switching between them via a simple interface and it alerts the user when spools are running low, etc. It's not exactly the most fun work I've done, but it's unique and it pays well. Hughlander fucked around with this message at 01:40 on Aug 13, 2019 |
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Aug 13, 2019 01:37
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Hughlander posted:Don't forget the original... nbv4 are you uckngi kidding me no way
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Aug 13, 2019 01:48
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And so JawnV6 discovers his ancestry of Jaw needle classes, revisions one through five
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Aug 13, 2019 02:16
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That Turkey Story's gigantic brain is wasted on programming
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Aug 13, 2019 02:20
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Ciaphas posted:It seems that the "never give a number" advice isn't 100% ironclad, but drat near, yes The problem is that recruiters are told by their managers to not say a number first too. This creates a situation where it's "you say a number first, no you say a number first, no you say a number first, no you say a number first..." Somebody has to say a drat number first, even though neither side wants to. Who ends up actually saying a number first depends on market conditions. If it's easier for a programmer to find another recruiter, then the programmer will force the recruiter to say a number first. If it's easier for the recruiter to find another programmer, then the recruiter will force the programmer to say a number first. Just because you want the upper hand, doesn't mean you are going to have it...
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Aug 13, 2019 03:08
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School of How posted:The problem is that recruiters are told by their managers to not say a number first too. This creates a situation where it's "you say a number first, no you say a number first, no you say a number first, no you say a number first..." Somebody has to say a drat number first, even though neither side wants to. Who ends up actually saying a number first depends on market conditions. If it's easier for a programmer to find another recruiter, then the programmer will force the recruiter to say a number first. If it's easier for the recruiter to find another programmer, then the recruiter will force the programmer to say a number first. Just because you want the upper hand, doesn't mean you are going to have it... Thanks for the incisive analysis on how negotiations have worked since time immemorial.
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Aug 13, 2019 03:31
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Not a Children posted:You're in a great position. Hold steady and whatever you do, do not give them a number. if you are pressed to give them a number, shoot extremely high since you are post interview, if you are way out of the ballpark, they will just tell you and come back with another number. you really can't aim too high
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Aug 13, 2019 03:44
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Hughlander posted:Don't forget the original... nbv4 my god I'm speechless
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Aug 13, 2019 04:10
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Hughlander posted:Don't forget the original... nbv4 seriously large lomarf
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Aug 13, 2019 13:16
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Not a Children posted:You're in a great position. Hold steady and whatever you do, do not give them a number. I just replied with my references and didn't mention anything about a range. If I do receive an offer what's the proper way to reply? Do I ask for a week to consider since I have two more tech interviews this week? Do I mention that I have more interviews? Do I ask what benefits are negotiable? I'm real new to this.
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Aug 13, 2019 13:38
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barkbell posted:I just replied with my references and didn't mention anything about a range. Honesty is the best policy here. Say you're very excited about their offer and that you'll get back to them once you wrap up a few more interviews you're doing with other companies. If possible give them a timeline on when that will be and if you can't assure them that you'll be asking the other companies to accelerate the process. In response to this they may say that they need an answer asap and if you don't respond within 48 hours or whatever then the offer will be rescinded. This is a bluff. Call it. If they genuinely are able to get another candidate hired that quickly then it's probably an extremely low-end position that you didn't want anyways. That or they're closing the door because they don't want employees who know how to negotiate and guess what- you didn't want to work for them anyways. PIZZA.BAT fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Aug 13, 2019 |
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Aug 13, 2019 13:44
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Third interview went well last week. Round-robin, one-on-one with various members of the team. Turns out a former co-worker of mine was roommates with their project manager so got to close that loop pretty hard. HR asked for references and a number which I deferred on the latter per the gospel here. See what they come back with. give me the figggggggies
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Aug 13, 2019 13:58
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Rex-Goliath posted:In response to this they may say that they need an answer asap and if you don't respond within 48 hours or whatever then the offer will be rescinded. This is a bluff. Call it. this being said, asking for more than like a week of consideration time starts to push you into dickhead territory and you may get bounced for that
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Aug 13, 2019 14:02
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oh yeah absolutely. that's why you're upfront about it. granted they definitely will push you to hurry up the process and will probably ask for firm deadlines. you won't have to give them anything right away but you'll need to turn around and ask the other companies for firm timelines because you're starting to get offers. it will suck a bit juggling all of it but it will be extremely beneficial for your negotiating position!
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Aug 13, 2019 14:16
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Yeah that's the lovely part of applying for jobs. I straight up had to contact one place and say "uh hey i just got an offer from MegaCorp so what's your timeline? I don't want to rush you, but I have to get back to them relatively soon."
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Aug 13, 2019 15:42
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Hughlander posted:Don't forget the original... nbv4 this has always been one of my favorite SA posts ever
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Aug 13, 2019 18:56
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Hughlander posted:Don't forget the original... nbv4 Are nbv4 and how!! seriously the same person?
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Aug 13, 2019 21:19
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