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trucutru posted:Nah, they mention SSOCS (Server Side Object Container Streaming) frequently, as is their current to-go excuse to why they cannot add new poo poo. Hav posted:And before, it was Network Bind Culling. Before that, it was Serialized Variables. I'm trying to explain what these cool things do for the noobs in this thread: -Save on sending/calculating totally useless poo poo. (Which may have been ok in small single player maps, but isn't cool with a galaxy) -That's it. All the new technology that has never been done before basically means that no one has done it in Cryengine before. Because it would be stupid to do it in Cryengine. Each one boils down to "hey maybe we shouldn't send all the data about everything to everyone". What a revolution in gaming, I'm glad Chris is there.
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Sep 9, 2019 14:46
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Dogeh posted:It should be with you in two weeks. Sir, I think you meant... 90 days top !
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Sep 9, 2019 14:53
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Taxx
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Sep 9, 2019 14:54
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Peak players for SoaT in 2019 is 233.
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Sep 9, 2019 14:56
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For today's LOLs, some selected quotes from 2013... https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/14892/concern-game-complexity-detail-vs-alpha-release-nov-2014 quote:All in all, I'm not too worried. Even if they have to push the target dates back a couple of months I know that they will provide the game to us in spectacular fashion. Not too far from the thruth. They have indeed provided us a "game" in spectacular fashion, but I'm not sure this is what this commando had in mind when he wrote that... quote:I feel extremely confident that CR and his teams will be able to finish on time. And even if they went a little over, I would not have any problems or be worried. They are highly experienced game makers, so I think they have fairly good grasp on what kind of time will and would be spent on the different facets of SC. Can’t wait! I wonder if this commando is still bursting with extreme confidence in Chris today.. quote:i think they said they r going to hire a total of 74 people by the time this game launches so i dnt have any worries They've had 500+ people in the past few years and the game is still nowhere to be seen. Are you starting to be worried, commando ? quote:Also as stated in previous threads with concerns to the deadline and how much work they are doing, they ARENT building the game from the ground up. They arent making a game engine from scratch and most of the assets and components are already in place ... but of course the scope expanded, so suddenly the game engine, the assets and the components are not in place anymore, right ? quote:cause CR will be releasing portions of the game as they go along the development hangerbay,alpha ,beta i dont mind if the game is delayed for a few months Bwahahahaha. Imagine being that guy that doesn't mind if the game is delayed FOR A FEW MONTHS. quote:Remember this Isn't a normal studio, if you get payed to do a job why hurry? That's why it takes so long, but this team is passionate and driven and work because they love the game. This commando is right, this isn't a normal studio. They're in no hurry, I think that's spot on. They like sitting on their arse collecting a fat paycheck all while working on sandworms.. .err... I meant fixing elevators... sorry, I didn't mean any harm.
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Sep 9, 2019 15:03
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Baxta posted:I actually think CIGs description of serialized variables at the time was something to do with parsing the variables to xml. cryengine apparently does everything with xml that is horrific and bloated even by xml standards. probably just about works if multiplayer is just a deathmatch on a simple map with a low number of players but completely useless for an mmo. instead of working this out and developing proper solutions in 2013 cig just roll with it until the game breaks and then make a big song and dance if they eventually fix it years later.
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Sep 9, 2019 15:04
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tooterfish posted:That's not a unity feature, it's a C# one. Serialisation isn't a game development concept, it's a basic bitch programming one. Seriously. Even to the extent that __get and __set are inbuilts for most object-oriented programming languages, which in turn completely inspired the game frameworks through shared concepts in basic programming. Accurate car analogy too. Danknificent posted:SSOCS is great and all, but I'm not holding my breath for really smooth performance until CNN, ESPN, and LMNOP are implemented. Not until the ItemsXP V2.0 update, and that's going to mean refactoring the ships again. 2025.
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Sep 9, 2019 15:06
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RabbitWizard posted:I'm trying to explain what these cool things do for the noobs in this thread: The fun thing was how much of a big deal they made about atomically updating game objects. Or even switching to 64-bit addressing space. My bag has always been about the unintended consequences they're introducing to the engine, which they're also having to extend, and that they've managed to piss off the developers of the engine to the extent that they had to jump ship to a free version. Classic Chris. The networking stuff is pretty much hilarious, mainly because latency is a factor in any design they will try, and they've been collecting real money based on their ability to either solve a problem that the financial computing bods have in a gaming context, or change the speed of light.
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Sep 9, 2019 15:12
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Nyast posted:For today's LOLs, some selected quotes from 2013.... Back to a time when You where not to mention Sandi was Chris wife. Such honest times.
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Sep 9, 2019 15:12
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Kosumo posted:Back to a time when You where not to mention Sandi was Chris wife. So they had a stranglehold on that information?
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Sep 9, 2019 15:32
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Zazz Razzamatazz posted:So they had a stranglehold on that information? 
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Sep 9, 2019 15:42
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I wonder why they decided to remove hover mode. https://i.imgur.com/z3TaSJB.mp4
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Sep 9, 2019 15:48
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trucutru posted:I wonder why they decided to remove hover mode. Landng sucessfl
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Sep 9, 2019 15:58
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Reinventing basic industry stuff nobody else bothers to make any fuss about, plus burning through a ton of money to deliver underwhelming and poorly finished goods that are designed to look nice from the outside despite production being rotten? CIG isn't Chevrolet in this analogy. They're Tesla.
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Sep 9, 2019 16:00
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stinch posted:cryengine apparently does everything with xml that is horrific and bloated even by xml standards. Yeah, their "serialized variables" are not really just serialized variables, but their solution to a very SC-specific problem: When a new ship is spawned by a server a normal space game sends a message to the clients saying "Spawn a ship of type X". SC instead would spawn the ship on the server and then send all the thousands of components if is made of to every client as XML messages for the clients to reconstruct (I think it was something like 50 MB per small ship) which caused big hiccups. Their serialized variables refers to doing stuff the regular way (Spawn a ship of type X client) and then sending some unique info about that ship (what color it is, who does it belong to, what weapons does it have) to the client, that info are the serialized variables they are talking about.
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Sep 9, 2019 16:09
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Anticheese posted:Reinventing basic industry stuff nobody else bothers to make any fuss about, plus burning through a ton of money to deliver underwhelming and poorly finished goods that are designed to look nice from the outside despite production being rotten? You are right. The ships have panel gaps big enough to clip through. Still love my concept jpeg though.
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Sep 9, 2019 16:14
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C-Bangin' it 
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trucutru posted:I wonder why they decided to remove hover mode. In the thread that was posted in, they can't even agree if hover mode is actually being removed or not: https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/d1iq12/ive_never_felt_so_helpless_curse_you_hover_mode/ezmxxba/ CIG's great communication at work!
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Sep 9, 2019 16:16
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Kosumo posted:Back to a time when You where not to mention Sandi was Chris wife. Now that was a ticklish situation
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Sep 9, 2019 16:17
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Sep 9, 2019 16:23
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Just noticed this post - if it was real, the 890 would be less luxury party boat and more "death trap by stairs":
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Sep 9, 2019 16:23
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Rotten Red Rod posted:CIG's great communication at work! The most transparent development ever.
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Sep 9, 2019 16:26
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Rotten Red Rod posted:Just noticed this post - if it was real, the 890 would be less luxury party boat and more "death trap by stairs": I liked this response: quote:Sounds like somebody can't afford an 890j... Filthy pleb.
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Sep 9, 2019 16:34
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Posting in this new Scam Citizen thread for posterity. I'll be here when the trial starts. ETA?
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Sep 9, 2019 16:35
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Zazz Razzamatazz posted:Before that it was regular old Object Container Streaming that was going to save the game right? The way I remember it (which could be wrong, because this odyssey of incompetence has had so many ludicrous twists and turns over the years), they kept taking up OCS as the holy grail that would make SC work. Then before a big sale they announced that OCS was complete, and stalwart citizens joyfully emptied their wallets. Once the patch hit and performance was still dogshit, however, CI Somebody please correct any of my misrememberings.
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Sep 9, 2019 16:35
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So if SQ42 beta is due out next year, that means they probably have the AI locked down, right? https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/d1raex/stop_you_are_violating_the_law_look_out_hes_got_a/ Seems fine to me!
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Sep 9, 2019 16:40
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Bayonnefrog posted:Posting in this new Scam Citizen thread for posterity. I'll be here when the trial starts. ETA? 2 weeks
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Sep 9, 2019 16:55
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Wise Learned Man posted:The way I remember it (which could be wrong, because this odyssey of incompetence has had so many ludicrous twists and turns over the years), they kept taking up OCS as the holy grail that would make SC work. Then before a big sale they announced that OCS was complete, and stalwart citizens joyfully emptied their wallets. Once the patch hit and performance was still dogshit, however, CI Your rememberings are correct
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Sep 9, 2019 16:57
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Wise Learned Man posted:The way I remember it (which could be wrong, because this odyssey of incompetence has had so many ludicrous twists and turns over the years), they kept taking up OCS as the holy grail that would make SC work. Then before a big sale they announced that OCS was complete, and stalwart citizens joyfully emptied their wallets. Once the patch hit and performance was still dogshit, however, CI I recall the same.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:01
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The specific technical details don't really matter because it's all bullshit designed to misdirect or obfuscate how much of a disaster this project is. Even if on some level it makes sense (like not sending a 50mb XML file to all clients simultaneously) the fact that this at all a problem which needs solving mid-stream is tantamount to proclaiming your enormous incompetence. "Why, we here at Crobber Motors recognize the need to have wheels on your vehicles, because the dragging friction of your undercarriage scraping the ground creates too much wear on your vehicle. That's why coming in Q1 *spokesperson steps into a chariot which explodes when the door closes*
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Sep 9, 2019 17:09
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https://twitter.com/RobertsSpaceInd/status/1168997159682879488
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Sep 9, 2019 17:12
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trucutru posted:Yeah, their "serialized variables" are not really just serialized variables, but their solution to a very SC-specific problem: When a new ship is spawned by a server a normal space game sends a message to the clients saying "Spawn a ship of type X". SC instead would spawn the ship on the server and then send all the thousands of components if is made of to every client as XML messages for the clients to reconstruct (I think it was something like 50 MB per small ship) which caused big hiccups. for the non-coder people, think of this as a zaurg-like minimum payment on their technical debt edit: kw0134 posted:The specific technical details don't really matter because it's all bullshit designed to misdirect or obfuscate how much of a disaster this project is. absolutely true but it's also very funny how they keep inventing buzzwords to describe stuff that nobody else would even mention, let alone consider an achievement "how do we fit our bigly 'verse into a level on the server?" is a question that nobody else would ever ask, because without an answer they wouldn't start! Klyith fucked around with this message at 17:20 on Sep 9, 2019 |
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Sep 9, 2019 17:12
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kw0134 posted:The specific technical details don't really matter because it's all bullshit designed to misdirect or obfuscate how much of a disaster this project is. Even if on some level it makes sense (like not sending a 50mb XML file to all clients simultaneously) the fact that this at all a problem which needs solving mid-stream is tantamount to proclaiming your enormous incompetence. "Why, we here at Crobber Motors recognize the nWeeed to have wheels on your vehicles, because the dragging friction of your undercarriage scraping the ground creates too much wear on your vehicle. That's why coming in Q1 Well, yes, but it has been funny watching them reinvent the wheel, calling it something like Pneumatic Rotational Cylinder, and having all the citizens cream their pants over the possibilities PRC will bring. What? All assets cannot fit in memory and you need to stream them? CSOCS! What? Servers have the same issue? SSOCS! What do you mean its better to send each client a ship's movement vector instead of having each one compute it using the thrusters' state? Ship physics v2! Maybe people shouldn't have to re-download the whole game when we change a line on the .ini file. Delta Patcher! What if we had more than one commando face? DNA-based character customization! And so on.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:18
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I mean, the original Crash Bandicoot had great streaming (it was actually way ahead of its time), and it had to deal with a slow-rear end CD drive. But you never saw "With CLIENT SIDE OBJECT CONTAINER STREAMING!!! OMGGGGG!!" on the box. The results spoke for themselves. SC is the opposite. Hugely bombastic names, substandard results.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:25
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Bayonnefrog posted:Posting in this new Scam Citizen thread for posterity. I'll be here when the trial starts. ETA? Not currently known, but the only blocks to trial were motion to bound and as m'colleague Albie Quirky pointed out they handed over a cheque on August 19th. They've been urged to make all attempts to settle, but Crytek seems vested in taking this in front of ordinary Americans. Agony Aunt posted:I recall the same. Ditto. Klyith posted:absolutely true but it's also very funny how they keep inventing buzzwords to describe stuff that nobody else would even mention, let alone consider an achievement They've been working on various variants of 'Object Container Streaming' for upwards of three years now. Three years. That's around 21 gallons of Scrum master tears.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:31
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Zazz Razzamatazz posted:The way I read it, and I could be wrong, was that normally developers will make a game with a bunch of ideas and throw them together into an alpha. Then to get to beta they trim down what doesn't work, or what isn't balanced, or makes sense for the game they're trying to make. But since SC has had a playable alpha, and because they're selling ships based on gameplay loops they don't have- they can't really do that "trim down" phase... Yes, using Anthem as an example (a poor example but it's the one that I have the most insight on) you can see what could have gone (more) wrong if they had done what SC is doing. At EA your games have to make it through several 'gates' in order to continue not being shut down or being cut significantly. Near-ish the beginning of Anthem's development they had to demo to some higher-ups so they wanted to come up with a 'killer feature' to build some internal hype. They came up with the whole flying thing to demo to Patrick Söderlund which he apparently loved. Later on they came up with the overheating concept to limit flight times. Imagine they had come up with the flying thing in an open alpha and started selling different flight packs and all kinds of other crap. Later on they realize the flying doesn't work and they want to cut it down with the overheating thing? Too bad, already sold a ton of stuff based on unlimited flying. CIG is 100% locked in to delivering everything they have ever sold as a feature. I love it.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:31
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CIG could do the ethical and right thing and offer refunds. But Chris Roberts is a conman more than anything.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:35
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Fidelitious posted:Yes, using Anthem as an example (a poor example but it's the one that I have the most insight on) you can see what could have gone (more) wrong if they had done what SC is doing. I wouldn't say 100 %. You can see they start dropping the oldest stuff in favour of the new stuff - old backers are gone and/or dead and the rest is outvoted and silenced by newer backers - which will be outvoted in a year or two by even newer backers.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:45
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I said come in! posted:CIG could do the ethical and right thing and offer refunds. But Chris Roberts is a conman more than anything. Hah, like they have the money for refunds. Also although Crobberts is acting as a con-man at this point, I think he's also duped himself. SC is his dream more then anybodies and it's his last hope to show everyone what a talented game designer and movie director he is. So he's going to ride this ship all the way to the bottom thinking that it will start floating again at any moment. In a way I'm reminded of L. Ron Hubbard, founder of the Scientology. The man had to of known that his cult's beliefs were all bullshit, he'd dreamed it up after all. But towards the end of his life he lost sight of that; he spent his last days getting audited in a attempt to rid himself of the space ghosts causing his illnesses.
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Sep 9, 2019 17:51
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Sanya Juutilainen posted:I wouldn't say 100 %. You can see they start dropping the oldest stuff in favour of the new stuff - old backers are gone and/or dead and the rest is outvoted and silenced by newer backers - which will be outvoted in a year or two by even newer backers. Yeah, this. There's a lot of older stuff like land claims, science ships, news ships, etc. that simply cannot happen. I'd be willing to bet the reaction from the current crop of kool-aid drinkers would be pretty muted if they cut all that stuff. Most of them already are happy to melt down their older ships to buy new stuff anyway. That said I'm not actually saying the game will ever actually be finished, just that I doubt this will be the reason it won't. They're more than happy to keep making new stuff and let the old stuff rot. Rotten Red Rod fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Sep 9, 2019 |
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Sep 9, 2019 17:53
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Fidelitious posted:Yes, using Anthem as an example (a poor example but it's the one that I have the most insight on) you can see what could have gone (more) wrong if they had done what SC is doing. It really isn't much of an impediment to them since they can just quietly forget about features until not enough people care about them.
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Sep 9, 2019 18:01
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