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Jerk McJerkface posted:
It's a complete destruction of carry Io. Those 5 levels are enormous.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:07
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mikeraskol posted:It's a complete destruction of carry Io. Those 5 levels are enormous.  Look at how often OG were pushed back to basically their highground waiting for IO to come online, then wait 5 levels and remember you aren't on OG.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:10
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Ravus posted:
With that gold talent do we see the emergence of Midas IO? He doesn't even have hands.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:17
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Low-key I really do think the bigger nerf is that you just can't get the armor talent anymore. Delaying makes carry Wisp weaker but you still would eventually hit that timing; now, you actually have to build something like a Shiva's or a Lotus or something. Now you actually need to build items to solve problems. Although tbh +90 gpm is actually really good for a level 10 talent and might actually break support Io. Actually yeah, support Wisp is probably the best hero in DotA right now because you're guaranteed to get level 10 really fast for a support and now you're going to have really good timings on getting a mek and a spirit vessel and so on.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:26
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Sampatrick posted:Delaying makes carry Wisp weaker but you still would eventually hit that timing; A part of timing is literally the time that it comes online. Delaying it means it doesn't come out at the same time during the game, which results in the 75 spirit damage being significantly less effective. So I really don't think you can say that you will still eventually hit that timing - it's completely dead. mikeraskol fucked around with this message at 19:32 on Sep 6, 2019 |
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Sep 6, 2019 19:29
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mikeraskol posted:A part of timing is literally the time that it comes online. Delaying it means it doesn't come out at the same time during the game, which results in the 75 spirit damage being significantly less effective. You realize that OG also won with carry wisp in the late game, right? Aghs still offers a massive amount of damage. That's not why this is a huge nerf to carry wisp. They also took fights with aghs before level 15. The nerf is making it so you actually need to itemize defensively. You're no longer unkillable based on nothing but levels. shades of blue fucked around with this message at 19:36 on Sep 6, 2019 |
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Sep 6, 2019 19:34
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Its a huge nerf to 'lets afk jungle Io from minute 5 to 20 then walk down mid and essentially win the game at minute 21', which is what OG did in most games I saw.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:39
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OG always did that when they got aghs, not when they hit level 15. The nerf is -15 armor and not having a slow at level 10.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:40
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Sampatrick posted:You realize that OG also won with carry wisp in the late game, right? Aghs still offers a massive amount of damage. That's not why this is a huge nerf to carry wisp. They also took fights with aghs before level 15. The nerf is making it so you actually need to itemize defensively. You're no longer unkillable based on nothing but levels. This is a ludicrous point to be honest, but you do you. Their entire strategy was built around the level 15/agh's power spike being completely overpowered for the point that you can it in the game, but sure, because they won one game late against NiP you're totally right here.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:42
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mikeraskol posted:This is a ludicrous point to be honest, but you do you. Their entire strategy was built around the level 15/agh's power spike being completely overpowered for the point that you can it in the game, but sure, because they won one game late against NiP you're totally right here. the game where ana supposedly told them at the end of the draft he wanted to do it so they didn't have a good draft to go with it
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Sep 6, 2019 19:48
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mikeraskol posted:This is a ludicrous point to be honest, but you do you. Their entire strategy was built around the level 15/agh's power spike being completely overpowered for the point that you can it in the game, but sure, because they won one game late against NiP you're totally right here. They went and took fights as soon as Ana got aghs what are you talking about. They never waited for level 15 because level 15 isn't what let you fight. You could fight as long as you had spirit slow and aghs. Aghs give you so much damage; level 15 made you stronger, but it was still a more damaging radiance that applies a slow before you got there. The problem is now you're going to have aghs and then not be able to fight because you no longer have spirit slow and then you'll hit level 20 and have to take the armor talent or else you just get blown up because overcharge is no longer sufficient as a defensive ability. The strength of Io wasn't that you hit this one power spike at 15 and became absolutely unbeatable, the strength was that you hit a power spike with aghs and then another one with level 15 and then another one with heart and the level 20 talent. It was never one singular power spike, it was a series of power spikes that made Io stronger and stronger so that it didn't matter that you went super late, Io would still get stronger and stronger because the talents you have are the best in the game.
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Sep 6, 2019 19:52
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I think you're both wrong here and right. You're significantly downplaying the "engine" of what made Io carry good. The level 20 transition is what was used to close out (some) games, but that's not what won them. OG used the insane level 15 spike, when no other hero on the map comes even remotely close to touching Io's combination of damage and survivability, to completely take control of the game. Essentially minutes 20-26 turned into a walk over, which turned into map control which either outright won the game right there or made for an easy transition into finalizing the game. And that all happens because of that insane midgame timing, not because of the level 20 armor talent. The level 15 talent and aghs pairing was the engine and its gone. The prime example of this is the last game of the tournament. mikeraskol fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Sep 6, 2019 |
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Sep 6, 2019 20:00
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I don't disagree with any of that, I just think the nerf to survivability and slow timing is a bigger problem than the damage nerf. On the other hand, support wisp is going to be banned every game for the next month or two now. Having a level 10 gpm talent on wisp of all heroes is absolutely busted.
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Sep 6, 2019 20:07
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It's a smaller patch than I expected tbh.
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Sep 6, 2019 20:10
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goatface posted:It's a smaller patch than I expected tbh. Yeah. They didn't even nerf Vacuum.
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Sep 6, 2019 20:47
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There's usually been a post-TI patch that knocks a lot of the meta heroes down a peg and then it's October-November for the next big version change. Curious if the neutral bounty nerf is going to bring Radiance heroes back in line with those that build BF or Maelstrom or just want to get kills. The NS Void buff seems... pretty aggressive. It gives him a way to secure last hits on ranged creeps from level 1, and makes him much more dangerous from minutes 10 to 15, and it's also a buff to his aghs. Maybe the awkwardness of playing around Dark Ascension is still gonna trip him up but his win rate was already pretty high in pubs. Night terror may be back boys. I wonder if Solar Crest and Medallion got a big enough nerf as well. -1/-2 armor and 100 extra gold is certainly a nerf, but it's still an item that costs 4k that's been performing like an item that costs 5k.
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Sep 6, 2019 21:59
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I'm not sure if that Tree Volley nerf is enough, honestly.
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Sep 6, 2019 22:30
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Medallion didn't actually get nerfed but the Solar Crest nerf is at least something. Now you probably just build something else before upgrading Medallion.
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Sep 6, 2019 22:39
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MVP throwing their hat back into the ring with a total of 0 players on their roster atm. I haven't been on Twitter to see what's been announced, if anything, but the way it was positioned makes it sounds like Forev is going to a new Korean org. Probably an LCK org like someone mentioned when I said T1 a few pages back (meaning tier 1 not SK Tele) ESL wants to host their Major in the States and will need an extension, which Valve hasn't given them. Sounds like they're considering dropping it completely. I know Epicenter got the greenlight months ago so they've probably hit a brick wall with Valve.
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Sep 6, 2019 22:56
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96 spacejam posted:MVP throwing their hat back into the ring with a total of 0 players on their roster atm. I haven't been on Twitter to see what's been announced, if anything, but the way it was positioned makes it sounds like Forev is going to a new Korean org. Probably an LCK org like someone mentioned when I said T1 a few pages back (meaning tier 1 not SK Tele) Forev already signed with T1, which is the rebranded SKT LoL team.
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Sep 6, 2019 23:02
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Yea my bad, I just asked for clarification after I posted that and got the update and came back to edit.
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Sep 6, 2019 23:08
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Ya'll get pretty superlative with your hot nerf takes. Half the carry IO strat is his lvl 25 aug, which is hilarious with certain combos. Naix is still dumb and boring. Dumb and boring.
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Sep 6, 2019 23:12
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Edit: Not worth it.
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Sep 6, 2019 23:16
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Half of what makes arc warden good is that you hit level 25 and can one shot Roshan with spark wraith
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Sep 6, 2019 23:18
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JollyPubJerk posted:Ya'll get pretty superlative with your hot nerf takes. Half the carry IO strat is his lvl 25 aug, which is hilarious with certain combos.
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Sep 7, 2019 00:07
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Rumor is that tnc is splitting up between actual tnc and GeekFam. Dubu and March are allegedly involved in those teams. Apparently QO is still on his Oracle stack. No one has anything about the T1 stack. I don't think it's very likely it'll end up as a Korean stack at this point.
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Sep 7, 2019 02:26
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Please do not reply to JPJ, he adds enough garbage without help. Imo the biggest io Nerf is the armor. For both positions, a huge part of Ios strength comes from making a(nother) core near immortal. Core Io made that even stronger by being immortal itself. The timing for the slow/additional damage may have been changed, but it still leaves io as a core that only needs one damage item, which is what was so busted about it.
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Sep 7, 2019 02:35
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Team Aster: 1 sccc 2 chyuan 3 xxs 4 boboka 5 fade
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Sep 8, 2019 14:39
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Sampatrick posted:Rumor is that tnc is splitting up between actual tnc and GeekFam. Dubu and March are allegedly involved in those teams. Apparently QO is still on his Oracle stack. No one has anything about the T1 stack. I don't think it's very likely it'll end up as a Korean stack at this point. https://twitter.com/TeamOracleAU/status/1169914051641540608
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Sep 9, 2019 01:44
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Serenity dropped their entire roster on the team registration page and added shaker
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Sep 9, 2019 21:40
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Read that as Secret and lol'd
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Sep 9, 2019 22:26
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EG is taking a long time to announce their new lineup of 1 Mason 2 CCnC 3 Sumail 4 Cr1t 5 Yawar
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Sep 10, 2019 18:06
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Zurreco posted:EG is taking a long time to announce their new lineup of Don't tease me.
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Sep 10, 2019 18:15
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Lmao Alchemist got so destroyed it made it to a peruvian newspaper:
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Sep 10, 2019 18:59
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turboraton posted:Lmao Alchemist got so destroyed it made it to a peruvian newspaper: that rules
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Sep 10, 2019 19:11
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That’s actually so good so no one picks it. Also io carry is still good. Just get a midas.
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Sep 10, 2019 20:09
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http://www.dota2.com/procircuit Qualifier #1: Sep 30-Oct 5  Midas Mode 2
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Sep 11, 2019 01:09
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Is that the Major qualifier or the minor quals?
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Sep 11, 2019 01:28
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Zurreco posted:Is that the Major qualifier or the minor quals? quote:
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Sep 11, 2019 01:39
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Sir Sadim is destroying Midas mode before it begins
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Sep 11, 2019 01:43
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