Star Wars: a cool dude in a black cloak and helmet and his name is Star Wars

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Cinema Discusso > Star Wars: a cool dude in a black cloak and helmet and his name is Star Wars

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CaptainApathyUK: Sep 6, 2010

galagazombie posted:

What do you mean by "planned"? In TFA she was obviously planned to have a special origin but J.J. has his dumb mystery box and gave her a mysterious origin without actually thinking one up. After all that's the next guys problem. Then RJ decides he won't pick up Abrams mess and pretends the setup isn't there. And now J.J is back and has to go back to the "Plan" even if the plan was to have some other hack come up with an actual origin.

Yeah that's totally fair. I guess what I actually mean is that I far prefer the idea that her parents were nobody, and it feels like a step back to retcon that. Not everybody has to be related to OT characters.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 10:14

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# ? Apr 23, 2024 13:43

Captain Splendid: Jan 7, 2009; Qu'en pense Caffarelli?

The thing with twists like that is that it doesn't matter what it is because I already know that it was thought up after the fact and any foreshadowing I'm seeing is my own projection.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 10:17

Milkfred E. Moore: Aug 27, 2006; 'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'

Just prior to the global release, Kathy screened The Force Awakens for George. He didn�t hide his disappointment. �There�s nothing new,� he said. In each of the films in the original trilogy, it was important to him to present new worlds, new stories, new characters, and new technologies. In this one, he said, �There weren�t enough visual or technical leaps forward.� He wasn�t wrong, but he also wasn�t appreciating the pressure we were under to give ardent fans a film that felt quintessentially Star Wars. We�d intentionally created a world that was visually and tonally connected to the earlier films, to not stray too far from what people loved and expected, and George was criticizing us for the very thing we were trying to do. Looking back with the perspective of several years and a few more Star Wars films, I believe J.J. achieved the near-impossible, creating a perfect bridge between what had been and what was to come.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 10:50

Captain Jesus: Feb 26, 2009; What's wrong with you? You don't even have your beer goggles on!!

Based on the plot leaks it seems that the movie is not gonna be 3 hours. It's gonna be endless.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 11:33

CharlestonJew: Jul 7, 2011; Illegal Hen

Captain Jesus posted:

Based on the plot leaks it seems that the movie is not gonna be 3 hours. It's gonna be endless.

Star Wars: Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker: Act I

# ? Sep 24, 2019 13:20

Brother Entropy: Dec 27, 2009

Milkfred E. Moore posted:

He wasn’t wrong, but he also wasn’t appreciating the pressure we were under to give ardent fans a film that felt quintessentially Star Wars.

lol, imagine saying this about the guy who made the prequels

no human being on earth would understand that pressure more than lucas

# ? Sep 24, 2019 13:45

Fitzy Fitz: May 14, 2005

George Lucas wanted the sequels to be about microscopic force creatures. No one should be listening to him.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 14:31

High Lord Elbow: Jun 21, 2013; "You can sit next to Elvira."

Fitzy Fitz posted:

George Lucas wanted the sequels to be about microscopic force creatures. No one should be listening to him.

After the junk Disney has tried to push on us, I think I�d rather see the germs.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 14:34

Fitzy Fitz: May 14, 2005

george lucas, not bitter: "If I�d held onto the company I could have done it, and then it would have been done. Of course, a lot of the fans would have hated it, just like they did Phantom Menace and everything, but at least the whole story from beginning to end would be told."

# ? Sep 24, 2019 14:40

Boxman: Sep 27, 2004; Big fan of

Disney would have given us microscopic force creatures but Chapek saw Osmosis Jones and knew it could not be improved upon

# ? Sep 24, 2019 14:45

FlamingLiberal: Jan 18, 2009; Would you like to play a game?

Kathleen Kennedy- �oh really? Endgame got 3 hours? Well we get five�

# ? Sep 24, 2019 14:49

feedmyleg: Dec 25, 2004

Fitzy Fitz posted:

george lucas, not bitter: "If I�d held onto the company I could have done it, and then it would have been done. Of course, a lot of the fans would have hated it, just like they did Phantom Menace and everything, but at least the whole story from beginning to end would be told."

I mean, come on:

Bob Iger's new book posted:

Early on, Kathy [Kennedy] brought J.J. [Abrams] and Michael Arndt up to Northern California to meet with George at his ranch and talk about their ideas for the film. George immediately got upset as they began to describe the plot and it dawned on him that we weren�t using one of the stories he submitted during the negotiations.

...

The truth was, Kathy, J.J., Alan [Horn, Disney�s film chief], and I had discussed the direction in which the saga should go, and we all agreed that it wasn�t what George had outlined. George knew we weren�t contractually bound to anything, but he thought that our buying the story treatments was a tacit promise that we�d follow them, and he was disappointed that his story was being discarded.

...

Just prior to the global release, Kathy screened The Force Awakens for George. He didn�t hide his disappointment. �There�s nothing new,� he said. In each of the films in the original trilogy, it was important to him to present new worlds, new stories, new characters, and new technologies. In this one, he said, �There weren�t enough visual or technical leaps forward.� He wasn�t wrong, but he also wasn�t appreciating the pressure we were under to give ardent fans a film that felt quintessentially Star Wars. We�d intentionally created a world that was visually and tonally connected to the earlier films, to not stray too far from what people loved and expected, and George was criticizing us for the very thing we were trying to do. Looking back with the perspective of several years and a few more Star Wars films, I believe J.J. achieved the near-impossible, creating a perfect bridge between what had been and what was to come.

...

�The issue was ultimately, they looked at the stories and they said, �We want to make something for the fans.� People don�t actually realize it�s actually a soap opera and it�s all about family problems � it�s not about spaceships. So they decided they didn�t want to use those stories, they decided they were going to do their own thing so I decided, �Fine.�

...

They weren�t that keen to have me involved anyway. But at the same time, I said if I get in there I�m just going to cause trouble. Because they�re not going to do what I want them to do. And I don�t have the control to do that anymore. All I would do is muck everything up. So I said, �Okay, I will go my way, and I�ll let them go their way.'�

That's literally Iger saying that they made empty movies intentionally because it's what the fans wanted.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 15:14

teagone: Jun 10, 2003; That was pretty intense, huh?

I wonder what George had in mind for the ST.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 15:21

McCloud: Oct 27, 2005

feedmyleg posted:

I mean, come on:

That's literally Iger saying that they made empty movies intentionally because it's what the fans wanted.

"fans wanted nostalgia to jerk them off to completion while wearing Leias gold bikini, and boy howdy did we give them exactly what they wanted!"

# ? Sep 24, 2019 15:32

Small Strange Bird: Sep 22, 2006; Merci, chaton!

"It's for the fans!"

[Fat Riker wanders into the holodeck]

# ? Sep 24, 2019 16:06

sponges: Sep 15, 2011

Lucas comes across as naive in that excerpt.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 16:14

High Lord Elbow: Jun 21, 2013; "You can sit next to Elvira."

FlamingLiberal posted:

Kathleen Kennedy- �oh really? Endgame got 3 hours? Well we get five�

Come back to me when your best Star Wars movie is better than the worst Marvel movie and we�ll talk, Kathy.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 16:32

Fitzy Fitz: May 14, 2005

sponges posted:

Lucas comes across as naive in that excerpt.

He's very in love with the weird story that he wants to tell and seems to fundamentally not understand why other people don't like it

# ? Sep 24, 2019 16:39

Neo Rasa: Mar 8, 2007; Everyone should play DUKE games.

teagone posted:

I wonder what George had in mind for the ST.

IIRC there's an interview with Lucas or/and Gary Kurtz or one of the other Star Wars producers from around when the prequels were coming out where they talk about it a bit. But IIRC it was something along the lines of that Dark Empire comic from the 90s.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 16:41

SuperMechagodzilla: Jun 9, 2007; NEWT REBORN

Fitzy Fitz posted:

George Lucas wanted the sequels to be about microscopic force creatures. No one should be listening to him.

Lucas� sequels were going to be about what�s been causing all these mutations. Like, why do people have psychic powers in the first place?

Of course we have the midichlorians as a basic mechanism, but where did they come from? It seems like Lucas was going to reveal that midichlorians did not evolve naturally, but were engineered by an ancient species that had transcended its concrete physical form and spread itself across the galaxy as a �grey goo� sort of deal.

So these �Whills� have been subtly manipulating events - and that automatically raises questions of, like, what are their intentions? Are they evil?

# ? Sep 24, 2019 17:17

Kart Barfunkel: Nov 10, 2009

It sounds awesome and super pulpy and I�m sad we�ll never get to see it.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 17:21

General Dog: Apr 26, 2008; Everybody's working for the weekend

The Whills wield disproportionate control in finance and The Media

# ? Sep 24, 2019 17:22

Fitzy Fitz: May 14, 2005

SuperMechagodzilla posted:

Lucas� sequels were going to be about what�s been causing all these mutations. Like, why do people have psychic powers in the first place?

Of course we have the midichlorians as a basic mechanism, but where did they come from? It seems like Lucas was going to reveal that midichlorians did not evolve naturally, but were engineered by an ancient species that had transcended its concrete physical form and spread itself across the galaxy as a �grey goo� sort of deal.

So these �Whills� have been subtly manipulating events - and that automatically raises questions of, like, what are their intentions? Are they evil?

see I thought he was describing more of a Fraggle Rock scenario

# ? Sep 24, 2019 17:30

YaketySass: Jan 15, 2019; Blind Idiot Dog

The Wiles Of The Whills

# ? Sep 24, 2019 17:45

Hodgepodge: Jan 29, 2006; Can't post for 247 days!

SuperMechagodzilla posted:

Lucas� sequels were going to be about what�s been causing all these mutations. Like, why do people have psychic powers in the first place?

Of course we have the midichlorians as a basic mechanism, but where did they come from? It seems like Lucas was going to reveal that midichlorians did not evolve naturally, but were engineered by an ancient species that had transcended its concrete physical form and spread itself across the galaxy as a �grey goo� sort of deal.

So these �Whills� have been subtly manipulating events - and that automatically raises questions of, like, what are their intentions? Are they evil?

The lesson is that if you're going to abandon materialism, go all in. Show us the microverse controlled by ancient aliens!

# ? Sep 24, 2019 18:58

Vinylshadow: Mar 20, 2017

I'm totally down for Osmosis Jones With A Lightsaber Fighting Sith Cells

# ? Sep 24, 2019 19:06

ALLAN LASSUS: May 11, 2007; apul.prof./ass.prof.

Lucas's weird-rear end plans would have made either a completely horrible or a loving awesome sequel trilogy but either way it would have been more interesting to watch than the bland mess of rehashing and fanservice that JJ & friends cooked up

# ? Sep 24, 2019 19:27

High Lord Elbow: Jun 21, 2013; "You can sit next to Elvira."

YaketySass posted:

The Wiles Of The Whills

And eventually our heroes discover that the Whilla must be destroyed to save the galaxy, leading to Episode VIII:

Good Whill Hunting

# ? Sep 24, 2019 19:45

FlamingLiberal: Jan 18, 2009; Would you like to play a game?

It�s good to know that Lucas looked at how poorly people responded to the whole �midichlorians� thing in Episode I and said �yup, let�s give them more of that�

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:00

TheOmegaWalrus: Feb 3, 2007; by Hand Knit

FlamingLiberal posted:

It�s good to know that Lucas looked at how poorly people responded to the whole �midichlorians� thing in Episode I and said �yup, let�s give them more of that�

I never, ever thought I'd be typing this- but given the choice between more of the prequels and more of the Disney schlock... I gotta go with more of the prequels.

They had a few hard notes, but overall brought back much of the fantastical, childlike wonder that the original trilogy dripped with.

The Disney films are basically and brazenly produced by a profit-seeking algorithm.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:25

porfiria: Dec 10, 2008; by Modern Video Games

The thing about the sequels as currently constituted is that they are almost perfectly uninteresting, which is the worst thing art can be; there's no way Lucas's movies would be that.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:28

Fitzy Fitz: May 14, 2005

The bones of the prequels were fine, but they needed a Marcia Lucas to make the finished product coherent

The sequels are just completely lacking in any sort of artistic vision. I give George credit for at least having that in spades

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:42

Vinylshadow: Mar 20, 2017

"How can Star Wars make money?"

"Brilliant."

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:43

feedmyleg: Dec 25, 2004

Lucas was fine with challenging his audience and subverting their expectations. Disney is not. I want films that set out to be interesting and challenging over ones that set out to be fluff, regardless of ultimate quality. I don't care how good the fluff is or how bad the challenging films are.

The fact that George Lucas always gave the bird to fans (outside of some Boba Fett fanservice, I guess) is admirable.

feedmyleg fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Sep 24, 2019

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:44

Everyone: Sep 6, 2019; by sebmojo

TheOmegaWalrus posted:

I never, ever thought I'd be typing this- but given the choice between more of the prequels and more of the Disney schlock... I gotta go with more of the prequels.

They had a few hard notes, but overall brought back much of the fantastical, childlike wonder that the original trilogy dripped with.

The Disney films are basically and brazenly produced by a profit-seeking algorithm.

The Force Awakens was barely reheated leftovers, but I really liked The Last Jedi. Luke being bitter cranky. Kylo Ren seeking a connection with Rey out of loneliness from killing or driving away everyone who loved him. The rakishly charming hacker recruited by Finn and Rose turning out to very much not have a heart of gold. Poe "going rogue" to hit the First Order turning out to be a mistake that destroyed most of the Resistance. The idea that the Force was awakening in all sorts of people instead of being confined to the Magic Space Jesus bloodline of the Skywalkers. Snoke narrating his own murder.

# ? Sep 24, 2019 20:46