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people needing their entertainment to say some message they already agree with broadly is way more annoying that like Jaws not having some deep message
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Sep 25, 2019 21:18
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CharlestheHammer posted:people needing their entertainment to say some message they already agree with broadly is way more annoying that like Jaws not having some deep message
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Sep 25, 2019 21:31
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I watched The Princess & The Frog on Netflix recently because I'd never seen it before and it's really some poo poo. Doing a story set in New Orleans during the 1930s while subsuming all hints of racial animus is peak Disney whitewashing. The closest it gets to acknowledging the historical reality is when the realtors tell Tiana that she lost the bid on the lot for her dream restaurant because of her "background." You could assume that's because she's black, but narratively it reads that she's poor. If you're going to ignore all the racial politics of the South in the 20s while trying to tell a story about black people, then the only way to do it is if there aren't any whites. That's before we even get to the blatant class war. Doctor Facilier is only a bad guy because he resents rich people and wants to be rich himself. Same for Prince Naveen's fat English butler, who resents being treated like a slave his whole life and wants to turn the tables. Meanwhile Big Daddy, the white land baron of New Orleans is one of the good guys. Also, in my brain I knew I should hate Big Daddy for being a capitalist, but I had to like him because he was voiced by John Goodman. A dirty trick, imo. On top of all of that it uncritically reconstructs the domestic ideology of pre-2000s Disney films. Tiana's dream of honoring her dead WW1 vet father by realizing his restaurant is treated as delusional. What she really needs is a loving relationship with a good man. So it's real convenient that in the end she gets to have both based on the mere technicality that when she frog marries Naveen she legally becomes a princess. So the movie undermines the ambitions of its own protagonist and its central theme at the same time by insisting you should be able to have both - even if you didn't really want it before. What a loving mess. Still some of the music is good, and it's visually one of the most interesting Disney movies. I wouldn't recommend showing it to your kids or a niece/nephew unless you're willing to contextualize it for them at some point. It's just some dumb Disney bullshit. This was supposed to be Disney's send up for black girls and it still managed to be one of the most problematic films they've ever made, circa 2009.
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Sep 25, 2019 21:38
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the most amazing thing about the mcu to me is how polarized people get over these films i enjoy them as a long time comicbook fan but i recognize they are basically garbage pushed out for mass consumption. i'm not going to defend the artistic merit of these dumb movies but if you expect something deeper than popcorn action flicks you're probably the biggest idiot in this conversation. if you enjoy the big dumb superhero stuff go see them otherwise don't, you are missing anything important that's for loving sure i guess it's hard to avoid talking about them a little since they are so ubiquitous but i feel their success has more to do with hollywood being creatively bankrupt outside of well executed slop (or poorly executed, looking at you michael bay and transformers) plus a increasingly key foreign market that frankly doesn't want anything else from us at least the conversation to be having is why there exists such a vacuum that mcu has grown to fill it almost entirely
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Sep 25, 2019 21:39
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It's way easier to adapt a pre-existing popular property than to try and come up with something original yourself. I mean that in the purely commercial, profit-driven sense. It's not as if there's a dearth of creativity in Hollywood from writers or directors, it's just that Hollywood capitalists are so risk-averse they aren't willing to bet on anything that isn't already a franchise. Comic books have literally decades of material that can be mined, and tens of millions of people around the world who are primed to want to see it.
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Sep 25, 2019 21:47
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though the problem is they are kind of ashamed of comic books so they change them to make them more “serious”. Which is lame because Thanos killing people to impress a girl is way less dumb then where we ended up. People are fine with weird silly poo poo
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Sep 25, 2019 21:49
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get that OUT of my face posted:this article is a better negative review of Avengers: Endgame than Sam Kriss's blathering Wait isn't Jacobite some fash adjacent anti-Jacobin?
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Sep 25, 2019 22:00
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KomradeX posted:Wait isn't Jacobite some fash adjacent anti-Jacobin? Yes it is, lmao. Jacobite apparently has better film criticism than noted Something Awful poster Sam Kriss.
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Sep 25, 2019 22:05
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that review using the term "capeshit" over and over set of some alarm bells in my head
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Sep 25, 2019 22:06
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iirc "capeshit" is an alt right pejorative for superhero movies, because they're all produced by Jews of course
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Sep 25, 2019 22:08
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:iirc "capeshit" is an alt right pejorative for superhero movies, because they're all produced by Jews of course So where does the good part of their film criticism come in?
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Sep 25, 2019 22:13
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I'm pretty sure it's because superheros wear capes
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Sep 25, 2019 22:13
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KomradeX posted:So where does the good part of their film criticism come in? I dunno I didn't read it lol
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Sep 25, 2019 22:14
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:iirc "capeshit" is an alt right pejorative for superhero movies, because they're all produced by Jews of course it's a /co/ term for superhero comics, shows, movies etc., not every single thing 4chan does is antisemitic or racist
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Sep 25, 2019 22:16
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I’m actually pretty sure that’s not true
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Sep 25, 2019 22:16
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barfing up 4chan buzzwords in my "magazine of philosophy, cultural analysis, and politics."
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Sep 25, 2019 22:26
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CharlestheHammer posted:I’m actually pretty sure that’s not true yeah they're also sexist and homophobic
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Sep 25, 2019 22:37
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:I watched The Princess & The Frog on Netflix recently because I'd never seen it before and it's really some poo poo. Doing a story set in New Orleans during the 1930s while subsuming all hints of racial animus is peak Disney whitewashing. The closest it gets to acknowledging the historical reality is when the realtors tell Tiana that she lost the bid on the lot for her dream restaurant because of her "background." You could assume that's because she's black, but narratively it reads that she's poor. If you're going to ignore all the racial politics of the South in the 20s while trying to tell a story about black people, then the only way to do it is if there aren't any whites. I was always curious about this movie but was never gonna watch it thank you for this. lmao at making a fictional benevolent monarchy in 1930s New Orleans
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Sep 25, 2019 22:50
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:It's way easier to adapt a pre-existing popular property than to try and come up with something original yourself. I mean that in the purely commercial, profit-driven sense. It's not as if there's a dearth of creativity in Hollywood from writers or directors, it's just that Hollywood capitalists are so risk-averse they aren't willing to bet on anything that isn't already a franchise. Comic books have literally decades of material that can be mined, and tens of millions of people around the world who are primed to want to see it. a lot of the better stuff coming out now and really since forever has always been low budget for this reason. then to be honest why would someone make a 150mil dollar film on something that isn't guaranteed to get asses in seats. it's simply an obscene amount for most productions and it's not surprising so many big budget films have failed to deliver probably the biggest legit problem is the slow death of any film going experience that isn't mcu or transformers but because movie theaters have priced themselves out of films with a limited audience for the most part. luckily there are services still picking these things up so unless going to a theater to see cohen bro movies and similar directors stuff is a must just watch it at home on netflix or whatever. a theatrical release of buster scruggs would have been cool idk if there was a limited one but im just glad the movie was made and i saw it
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Sep 25, 2019 22:55
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an actual dog posted:I was always curious about this movie but was never gonna watch it thank you for this. lmao at making a fictional benevolent monarchy in 1930s New Orleans The plot is that Prince Naveen is coming to New Orleans to marry a rich woman. His family cut him off for being a playboy, and they'll only recognize his rights if he marries into a rich family. Why he'd go to New Orleans to marry some common bourgeois child instead of actual royalty is never dwelled on. Also, you'd think from looking at stills that Prince Naveen is maybe light skinned or mixed race, but really he's Italian.
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Sep 25, 2019 22:59
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Gonna make the incredibly LF argument that hand-drawn animation is more ideologically pure than CGI since it does not intend for any kind of realism the way digital does and therefore does not create a substitute reality of which to escape and not engage with capitalism in. Nah, not really, but CGI is so rigid and I'm so pissed that it's become the de facto choice of animation in the West. It's a big reason I like anime even though most of it is the same formula over and over with very little surprise to it or just outright dumb fetish poo poo. But drat does it move better in motion if it has enough budget than the latest Pixar crap.
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Sep 25, 2019 23:08
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Probably Magic posted:Gonna make the incredibly LF argument that hand-drawn animation is more ideologically pure than CGI since it does not intend for any kind of realism the way digital does and therefore does not create a substitute reality of which to escape and not engage with capitalism in. Nah, not really, but CGI is so rigid and I'm so pissed that it's become the de facto choice of animation in the West. It's a big reason I like anime even though most of it is the same formula over and over with very little surprise to it or just outright dumb fetish poo poo. But drat does it move better in motion if it has enough budget than the latest Pixar crap. I'm not sure what's worse the low budget CGI cartoons, or those cheap flash looking cartoons from the mid 2000s. Though I think the CGI worked for Clone Wars, Rebels and Resistance
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Sep 25, 2019 23:35
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i am p hype for el camino, the trailers are good af
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Sep 25, 2019 23:55
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CharlestheHammer posted:people needing their entertainment to say some message they already agree with broadly is way more annoying that like Jaws not having some deep message not everything needs a deeper message than say being an interesting character study or trying to craft a well told story not everyone with something entertaining to present has a meaningful analysis of the greater world necessarily also peter benchley regretted writing jaws because he felt it hurt shark conservation efforts by terrifying men like donald trump into despising them, it was nothing more than a spielberg directed b monster movie that did gangbusters in the box office Percelus has issued a correction as of 00:07 on Sep 26, 2019 |
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Sep 25, 2019 23:59
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Probably Magic posted:Gonna make the incredibly LF argument that hand-drawn animation is more ideologically pure than CGI since it does not intend for any kind of realism the way digital does and therefore does not create a substitute reality of which to escape and not engage with capitalism in. Nah, not really, but CGI is so rigid and I'm so pissed that it's become the de facto choice of animation in the West. It's a big reason I like anime even though most of it is the same formula over and over with very little surprise to it or just outright dumb fetish poo poo. But drat does it move better in motion if it has enough budget than the latest Pixar crap. Princess and the Frog gets blamed for 2D animation falling out of popularity because it flopped, but it flopped because it's a fatally flawed movie. The pacing of it is all wrong too. You're moving on to new vignettes or plot beats at a breakneck pace, and music numbers happen with so much frequency it feels more like a musical than a proper movie. I mean a musical is fine, but something has to actually happen that the viewer can dwell on.
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Sep 26, 2019 00:38
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Yes it is, lmao. Jacobite apparently has better film criticism than noted Something Awful poster Sam Kriss. national review has better film criticism than most mainstream publications because their writers have mastered the dark art of discussing plot without just doing plot summaries it really is unnerving how bad most professional film critics are when it comes to that half the comments on any given variety review are just yelling at the reviewer for including spoilers for no reason
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Sep 26, 2019 02:56
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Some Guy TT posted:national review has better film criticism than most mainstream publications because their writers have mastered the dark art of discussing plot without just doing plot summaries weirdly their print critic is ross douthat, but their online stuff is just hilarious hot takes
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Sep 26, 2019 03:49
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I branched off into David Talbot's "Brothers: The Hidden History of the Kennedy Years" after the Epstein thread got me to read Talbot's history of Allen Dulles (which is incredibly dark and infuriating). One of the accounts in the book was of the painter William Walton traveling to Leningrad and Moscow in the week after JFK's assassination to continue an outreach project to Russian artists, but also to engage in back-channel talks with Soviet diplomats. What stood out to me in this story is that Walton supposedly was confronted time and time again of the Soviets fearing that JFK's assassination was part of a take-over of the US by "a reactionary clique", and/or that the people behind the assassination were "nationalist hardliners". It struck me because those kinds of phrases, especially the latter one, are the kinds of things that media/fiction usually attributes to what happens in the USSR/post-Soviet Russia, usually as a set-up to some kind of armed conflict. And further, when you get to more pop/mainstream accounts of Presidential administrations, there's always this looming spectre of "America's enemies might strike at her in-between Presidents, when the new team hasn't been brought up to speed yet", when Soviet accounts of Walton's visit instead had them waiting with bated breath for what LBJ might do instead, fearing that he'd be more aggressive towards them and that this would be the end of detente. Maybe it is all just projection from the right.
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Sep 26, 2019 11:32
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gradenko_2000 posted:And further, when you get to more pop/mainstream accounts of Presidential administrations, there's always this looming spectre of "America's enemies might strike at her in-between Presidents, when the new team hasn't been brought up to speed yet" i do not recall having seen this trope very often but i was born near the end of the cold war so obviously there wouldnt have been any reason for me to the closest example i can think of is an episode in the nineties outer limits series where first contact happens right after the new guys sworn in theres a great line in there about how the aliens must have planned this at a time they wouldnt be ready and then someone else says they can crush us like ants why the hell would they bother waiting until the ants arent ready the russians end up deciding to attack the aliens even though its obviously a terrible idea and the new president goes along with it too because hes a centrist idiot
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Sep 26, 2019 13:11
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gradenko_2000 posted:And further, when you get to more pop/mainstream accounts of Presidential administrations, there's always this looming spectre of "America's enemies might strike at her in-between Presidents, when the new team hasn't been brought up to speed yet", when Soviet accounts of Walton's visit instead had them waiting with bated breath for what LBJ might do instead, fearing that he'd be more aggressive towards them and that this would be the end of detente. This is also a very common idea around presidential assassination attempts. Here's the authoritative source on all things history talking about the immediate aftermath of the assassination attempt on Reagan: Wikipedia posted:Within five minutes of the shooting, members of the Cabinet began gathering in the White House Situation Room.[52] Haig, Defense Secretary Caspar Weinberger and Allen discussed various issues, including the location of the nuclear football, the apparent presence of more than the usual number of Soviet submarines unusually close off the Atlantic coast, a possible Soviet invasion of Poland against the Solidarity movement, and the presidential line of succession. Although normally no tape recorders are allowed in the Situation Room these meetings were recorded with the participants' knowledge by Allen, and the five hours of tapes have since been made public.[49][53][54][50] Within five minutes, the cabinet were talking about how it might be the prelude to a Soviet attack or a Soviet nuclear strike or a Soviet invasion of Poland. Americans up to and including their elites really earnestly believed their own propaganda about the bloodthirsty Soviets looking for any excuse to destroy America just because. Even while, as your source and many others point out, the Soviets were much more often just terrified of America losing its collective mind one day and wiping them off the planet out of sheer bloody-minded hatred of communism.
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Sep 26, 2019 13:26
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KomradeX posted:Wait isn't Jacobite some fash adjacent anti-Jacobin? get that OUT of my face has issued a correction as of 13:59 on Sep 26, 2019 |
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Sep 26, 2019 13:56
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this poo poo isnt going to go away is it https://mobile.twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1177195190202916864
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Sep 26, 2019 14:13
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KomradeX posted:Wait isn't Jacobite some fash adjacent anti-Jacobin? its loving nuts lol. seems to be where all the nick land-style racists with philosophy degrees have ended up
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Sep 26, 2019 14:15
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Farm Frenzy posted:this poo poo isnt going to go away is it yeah this guy throwing around far left like an epithet isnt exactly getting my hopes up that this movie gives a poo poo about class consciousness even though the reviews are acting like the joaquin phoenix joker is supposed to be some kind of relatable everyman
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Sep 26, 2019 14:28
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lol the clown protesters have "eat the rich" signs. they're going to cast anti-capitalists as terrorists y'all
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Sep 26, 2019 14:50
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Serf posted:lol the clown protesters have "eat the rich" signs. they're going to cast anti-capitalists as terrorists y'all
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Sep 26, 2019 14:59
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:I watched The Princess & The Frog on Netflix recently because I'd never seen it before and it's really some poo poo. Doing a story set in New Orleans during the 1930s while subsuming all hints of racial animus is peak Disney whitewashing. The closest it gets to acknowledging the historical reality is when the realtors tell Tiana that she lost the bid on the lot for her dream restaurant because of her "background." You could assume that's because she's black, but narratively it reads that she's poor. If you're going to ignore all the racial politics of the South in the 20s while trying to tell a story about black people, then the only way to do it is if there aren't any whites. I did like that the bankers still didn't want to give her the place at the end (cuz they are racist, she's royalty at this point); they had to be threatened with violence by alligator in order to enter into a fair deal.
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Sep 26, 2019 15:01
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get that OUT of my face posted:didn't they do the same thing with Dark Knight Rises nah Bane does use vaguely populism rhetoric include being against the law which made trials not a thing. the movie then just quietly forgets about this
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Sep 26, 2019 15:02
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CharlestheHammer posted:nah Bane does use vaguely populism rhetoric include being against the law which made trials not a thing. All the inmates who've been liberated just turn Gotham upside down by implementing their own kangaroo court mockery to persecute their own oppressors. This is supposed to be considered a bad thing, even though the movie clearly establishes the conflation of both forms of "justice" because they were being wrongfully detained to start with. It's only unacceptable now because "justice" is embodied by bad guys and they're persecuting respectable bourgeois. It's the exact same kind of unreconstructed reactionary sentiment adapted from A Tale of Two Cities. Revolutionary justice is only unacceptable because it's aesthetically offensive.
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Sep 26, 2019 15:10
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get that OUT of my face posted:didn't they do the same thing with Dark Knight Rises lmao yeah it demonizes occupy wall street because nolan felt an uncomfortable tingling in his bank account when he saw that there's a moment when the proletarian catwoman is walking around town looking distressed as rich people are dragged outside and beaten and their stuff is looted. she says to her friend, who is loving this "this used to be somebody's house" (inside a rich townhouse) and her friend goes "now its everyone's house" and catwoman, who has made a career out of stealing from rich people, looks horrified they even said that bane's coat was designed to look like an "eastern european revolutionary's coat"
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Sep 26, 2019 15:28
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