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I knew about the 17 year old and figured a 14 year old would make bigger splashes
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Oct 5, 2019 18:55
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There at least eight different women complaining about Franco being a criminal sex pest at this point.
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Oct 5, 2019 20:22
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Catfishenfuego posted:Hey I know you really really hate women and queer people but maybe do some googling before posting glib responses to easily sourced stories about a serial sex monster that preyed on my friends. Fixed link https://time.com/5099415/violet-paley-james-franco-allegations/
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Oct 5, 2019 20:32
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Charlie Rose Faces New Harassment Allegations From Makeup Artist https://www.thecut.com/2019/09/charlie-rose-hit-with-new-harassment-allegation.html Stormy Daniels to Get $450,000 Settlement After Arrest at Columbus Strip Club https://news.yahoo.com/stormy-daniels-450-000-settlement-124328983.html LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Was Franco the one filming sex scenes for spurious reasons. Yea, it was scandalous stuff but seems like it got overshadowed because Franco might be seen as salvageable compared to the infamous guys with dozens (or hundreds) of victims. Flashback: 3 James Franco Accusers Share Allegations About Actor: 'I'm Terrified for My Career' https://www.insideedition.com/3-james-franco-accusers-share-allegations-about-actor-im-terrified-my-career-40027 James Franco Is 'a Mess' and 'Hasn't Slept for Days' https://people.com/movies/james-franco-is-a-mess-and-hasnt-slept-for-days-after-accusations-says-source/ Louis C.K. is still swimming in some kind of purgatory too. His comedy and his movie I Love You, Daddy are acceptable in some places but not others. Some gave the film four stars and others want it vanquished.
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Oct 5, 2019 21:56
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I wonder how much better off Louis C.K. would be now if his first film back didn't have a synopsis that read like a defense of Woody Allen. Skimming the plot, I know it's more complicated, but it wasn't a good look.
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Oct 6, 2019 02:53
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ImpAtom posted:Nah. You really cannot accept that your point was garbage? He has always made the same types of jokes. Where have you been? Don't tell me what I meant. If you want to rant against profane material, do it. Snowman_McK posted:maybe he should have finished the jokes before he performed them. I think that's how performing things is usually supposed to work. That's not how joke writing works. You have to, you know, perform them and fine tune them. That's how performing things usually works. Judakel fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Oct 6, 2019 |
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Oct 6, 2019 03:04
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Judakel posted:You really cannot accept that your point was garbage? He has always made the same types of jokes. Where have you been? Don't tell me what I meant. If you want to rant against profane material, do it. I like how you shifted from "transphobic and attacking the victims of school shootings" to "profane" and tried to treat them as the same thing. You keep trying to shift the goalposts.
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Oct 6, 2019 03:36
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ImpAtom posted:I like how you shifted from "transphobic and attacking the victims of school shootings" to "profane" and tried to treat them as the same thing. How is that a shift?
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Oct 6, 2019 03:38
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the former is bad, the latter isn't
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Oct 6, 2019 03:58
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Krankenstyle posted:the former is bad, the latter isn't Why would the profane be ok? It is an attack on things considered sacred - or in a more loose sense: off-limits.
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Oct 6, 2019 04:09
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Profane is a big umbrella You have profane comedy going after sacred cows that deserve to be attacked. Subservience to the state, society’s obsession with censoring curse words. Going after powerful people and structures that deserve to be criticized. George Carlin’s sort of thing. Then you have profane comedy that goes after marginalized segments of society. Eddie Murphy spending his 80’s making fun of gays for getting AIDS and making fun of asian stereotypes. Attacking people who are at a disadvantage in our society and are vulnerable to being harassed or even killed. Andrew Dice Clay sort of stuff.
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Oct 6, 2019 04:38
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Steve Yun posted:Profane is a big umbrella You can draw the line at where you feel un/comfortable. Not sure how persuasive of an argument that will be, but you can. The Day The Laughter Died is one of the funniest comedy albums of all time, by the way.
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Oct 6, 2019 04:46
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Stand up comedy isn't funny enough to spend so much time defending.
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Oct 6, 2019 05:08
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Stand up comedy isn't funny enough to spend so much time defending. Sexual Assaults and the Ethics of Standup
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Oct 6, 2019 11:04
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Stand up comedy isn't funny enough to spend so much time defending. You take that back, there’s been as many as four good stand up comedians
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Oct 6, 2019 14:53
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Judakel posted:That's not how joke writing works. You have to, you know, perform them and fine tune them. That's how performing things usually works. Go to an open mic then. That's what they're for. Also, buying that it's just about tuning the joke, and that it's not because he's now teling jokes exclusively from the perspective of an absolute rear end in a top hat is some gullible poo poo.
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Oct 7, 2019 04:05
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Snowman_McK posted:Go to an open mic then. That's what they're for. No, comics have to make a living, too. Even as they develop their jokes. Open mics are for open mic-ers. No one is being gullible here except you; you fundamentally misunderstood my points: he has always been this and picking at the quality of the joke telling when it is not a finished product is desperate. You'd never dare say you simply object to the nature of the material and don't want to hear it. Judakel fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Oct 7, 2019 |
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Oct 7, 2019 04:47
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CK doesn't "have to make a living": 1. he is a millionaire 2. if he wants more, he can get a regular job. He has muffler shop experience, don't me?
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Oct 7, 2019 06:11
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Louis CK didn't have any of these restrictions on his shows before he was outed as a sex pest.
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Oct 7, 2019 06:15
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Judakel posted:No, comics have to make a living, too. Even as they develop their jokes. It's weird, this part suggests you don't know we're talking about Louis CK (estimated net worth 16 million) quote:he has always been this and picking at the quality of the joke telling when it is not a finished product is desperate. but this part suggests that you are specifically talking about him. quote:You'd never dare say you simply object to the nature of the material and don't want to hear it. whereas this suggests that you're actually in a completely different conversation with someone else. I mean, I haven't heard it, and i'm fine with that, and it seems Louis doesn't want me to hear it either. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 06:27 on Oct 7, 2019 |
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Oct 7, 2019 06:24
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Like, before his public outing as a creep he had hilarious sets where he talked about slavery, the holocaust and used the n word a bunch, and there were no bans on bringing in pen and paper when he was workshopping those jokes.
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Oct 7, 2019 06:31
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Skwirl posted:Like, before his public outing as a creep he had hilarious sets where he talked about slavery, the holocaust and used the n word a bunch, and there were no bans on bringing in pen and paper when he was workshopping those jokes. This is purely anecdotal, but a lot of my friends got into him through a ten minute set of him doing 'edgy' material, much of which never appeared in any other shows. In fact, I'm not sure any of it did.
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Oct 7, 2019 06:54
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MorgaineDax posted:I also have no idea what the story is behind the women who had to date Franco to protect 14 years olds is about, and I remember reading the trying to meet up with a 17 year old story, the oral sex acting school story, and the car blow job story. How much Franco sex pest knowledge do we gotta have before being allowed to ask for more details? As one of the plebs that asked for details about one of Franco’s apparent crimes, I can only humbly apologise for not having an encyclopaedic knowledge of the details of his life, especially when it comes to the seedier escapades.
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Oct 7, 2019 07:56
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Krankenstyle posted:CK doesn't "have to make a living": Not anymore. Snowman_McK posted:It's weird, this part suggests you don't know we're talking about Louis CK (estimated net worth 16 million) He lost a lot of money. Stop being a smartass. You only have the latter part down. Skwirl posted:Louis CK didn't have any of these restrictions on his shows before he was outed as a sex pest. He also didn't have vultures fishing for a story back then.
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Oct 7, 2019 09:42
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Judakel posted:
I don't have a good definition for what a proper apology should have been after being publicly outed for sexual harassment and honestly, probably assault, but what ever it is he sure as gently caress didn't do it. And he can live off royalties for the rest of his life and his children will be fine (we don't even know their last name). You're arguing he needs a safe space to tell jokes when he was denying people a safe space to even exist. Air Skwirl fucked around with this message at 09:56 on Oct 7, 2019 |
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Oct 7, 2019 09:53
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Skwirl posted:I don't have a good definition for what a proper apology should have been after being publicly outed for sexual harassment and honestly, probably assault, but what ever it is he sure as gently caress didn't do it. And he can live off royalties for the rest of his life and his children will be fine (we don't even know their last name). How cute. You're using the safe space analogy. Regarding his apology: that moment has passed and apparently he is simply not interested in talking about it at length. I wish he were, because I am very curious. Some of his friends have hinted at it being not as it was portrayed. Regardless, he is getting exactly what any comedian with the same juice would demand they get. Sitting here complaining that he is getting that space because you want to poo poo on unfinished material to feel better about what he did is not going to change that. Judakel fucked around with this message at 10:15 on Oct 7, 2019 |
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Oct 7, 2019 10:12
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Since this is still going, apparently, I love the idea that since Louis' material is always evolving on tour and never finished, even when he's doing a series of heavily marketed shows, that we can never criticize it or the base concepts behind it. Louis on his deathbed will utter the final version of his act, and only then can we say "not great, I guess/I liked his earlier stuff." Nobody steal this concept before I get my spec script in to the Twilight Zone.Skwirl posted:I don't have a good definition for what a proper apology should have been after being publicly outed for sexual harassment and honestly, probably assault, but what ever it is he sure as gently caress didn't do it. I've always wondered how we'd handle someone coming back into the fold. So far, most sex pests have either tried to ghost and come back or just double down, so "gently caress off" has worked just fine as a general strategy. I don't know that we've seen much in the way of genuine self-reflection, apology and comeback. I guess Dan Harmon would count (not sure what the general consensus is), but that case didn't seem to get as much press to start with, I don't think.
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Oct 8, 2019 00:36
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Judakel posted:He lost a lot of money. No, he lost a lot of potential earnings. I mean, what even is your point? You forgot to say.
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Oct 8, 2019 01:46
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The difference between $20000 and $20 million is a lot bigger than the difference between $20m and $40m. CK will be fine, he won't starve. Unless he's an idiot. Money is very good at growing itself, the trick is having some to start with.
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Oct 8, 2019 02:23
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I'd be interested in a real count on how much he lost. He's down for a half year or year of touring and some of the better venues are cut off, but I don't know how much cash is really in stand-up, compared to TV and movies. His movie basically got canned, but it wasn't exactly going to be a blockbuster. Missing his shot at high art hurts, but I don't think it's a given that I Love You, Daddy would be an award winner. I thought it hurt Horace and Pete, but it looks like I hosed up the date. He held onto some of his executive producer spots which I think still counts for some small piece of the action, even if he was practically cut off from production. He lost some money but I imagine that if he can stabilize his tailspin for a minute with an alright set of shows Netflix will hand him a briefcase full of cash, if he wants it, and that seems to be where the big money is right now. It brings up the problem we've seen with other offenders. Even if they're successfully "canceled" they still get to go home to their swimming pool of gold or maybe even get as many smaller side projects as they want the second no one is looking.
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Oct 8, 2019 02:34
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i'd be willing to bet you all the money that Louis CK lost that he still didn't lose as large a portion of his future earnings as all of the women he whipped it out in front of, who then had to deal with his gross-rear end manager loving with their career, the societal pressure of not being believed by your peers/co-workers, and the malaise and depression that comes with both of those things anyone concerned with poor louie's money can suck my rear end in a top hat
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Oct 8, 2019 02:49
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The article I found covering Dan Harmon's apology pointed out the additional insidious damage that the harassment also made Megan Ganz lose all faith in her writing ability for years since she assumed that she was just hired because he wanted to have sex with her. The damage runs so deep with this stuff.
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Oct 8, 2019 03:36
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The craziest thing about the inane "but the material is unfinished!" defence is that it ignores that people like CK still assume what they're saying has the potential to be funny. He's not saying random words in different orders and scientifically analysing how much people did or didn't laugh. He's saying hosed up poo poo because he assumes the laughs will outweigh the complaints (and sadly do in the audiences he is seeking to impress). He knows the greater world (i.e. people who know better than to go see him) would object to his act and he is hiding it from their criticism. Any "working out" at this stage in his career / the touring cycle is deciding if he should move this bit before this bit, or emphasis that word here in order to get a bigger laugh. He 100% knows if what he says is problematic and doesn't give a poo poo. I say this as someone who used to really like his work before these allegations came out. He's a total hack now. And it's not because people are more sensitive to the topics he's dealing with or judging him more harshly. It's because he used to at least attempt to paint himself and his bad views in a negative light or to humanise the topics he was talking about (not always, some of his material was always wrongheaded), but now that he has (rightly) fallen out of favour with more left leaning audiences he is only interested in targeting material towards right wing / chud types. I don't know if he has become more bitter / unfunny because of the last few years, or was always posturing (most likely, given that he was trying so hard to hide being a creep), but I have no interest in hearing what he has to say on stage or how he makes money in the future. Anyone who is deeply concerned with "how will he provide for himself/his family" or is willing to give him stage time when they can't vouch for the safety of other performers or staff has completely misplaced their empathy in this situation.
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Oct 8, 2019 04:04
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StandardFireworks posted:The craziest thing about the inane "but the material is unfinished!" defence is that it ignores that people like CK still assume what they're saying has the potential to be funny. He's not saying random words in different orders and scientifically analysing how much people did or didn't laugh. He's saying hosed up poo poo because he assumes the laughs will outweigh the complaints (and sadly do in the audiences he is seeking to impress). He knows the greater world (i.e. people who know better than to go see him) would object to his act and he is hiding it from their criticism. Any "working out" at this stage in his career / the touring cycle is deciding if he should move this bit before this bit, or emphasis that word here in order to get a bigger laugh. He 100% knows if what he says is problematic and doesn't give a poo poo. His material has definitely changed. The structure of his usual act was some terrible impulse or thought he'd had, but then criticised by a more reasoned voice. The implication was that the latter was the real him. It seems, in retrospect, that it was very much the construct and the lovely impulse was the real him. Also, yeah, people workshopping jokes can still be funny, as literally any open mic will show. There was on in particular i went to in Melbourne, and there were four or five people there, in a pub's basement where i though 'gently caress, you're done, your voice and style as a comedian is complete, you just need your break.'
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Oct 8, 2019 04:10
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Judakel posted:How cute. You're using the safe space analogy. Regarding his apology: that moment has passed and apparently he is simply not interested in talking about it at length. I wish he were, because I am very curious. Some of his friends have hinted at it being not as it was portrayed. Regardless, he is getting exactly what any comedian with the same juice would demand they get. Sitting here complaining that he is getting that space because you want to poo poo on unfinished material to feel better about what he did is not going to change that. You're really pissed off at even inconveniencing him in any way. So honestly, do you think he did anything wrong at all, or just something so insignificant that even critical scruitiny of his demands on his audiences is an unjust and unwarranted consequence?
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Oct 8, 2019 06:23
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Snowman_McK posted:No, he lost a lot of potential earnings. So he lost on practically guaranteed money plus money he used to self-finance projects. I've said it multiple times. Hodgepodge posted:You're really pissed off at even inconveniencing him in any way. Beating off in front of people is pretty hosed up. Complaining about his demands is dumb.
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Oct 8, 2019 08:23
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He used his power to crush women who tried to call him out and doesn't seem apologetic so gently caress him. Eat the rich.
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Oct 8, 2019 08:46
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Parakeet vs. Phone posted:
Mike Tyson I guess? DC Murderverse posted:i'd be willing to bet you all the money that Louis CK lost that he still didn't lose as large a portion of his future earnings as all of the women he whipped it out in front of, who then had to deal with his gross-rear end manager loving with their career, the societal pressure of not being believed by your peers/co-workers, and the malaise and depression that comes with both of those things LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:He used his power to crush women who tried to call him out and doesn't seem apologetic so gently caress him. Yeah like that's the real thing. Louis should be in prison for at least several years and most of his and his accomplices wealth divvied between his victims. Anything less is too little.
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Oct 8, 2019 08:59
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Yeah, that's a big thing too: all the accomplices around these sex offenders who also never deal with any consequences.
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Oct 8, 2019 09:07
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Judakel posted:So he lost on practically guaranteed money plus money he used to self-finance projects. so he didn't lose anything. It's not practically guaranteed if it' predicated on people being willing to watch him.
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Oct 8, 2019 09:15
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