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Play
Apr 25, 2006

Strong stroll for a mangy stray

Some of these are actually a bit ambiguous, they don't have enough information to be sure who's to blame. I mean, it's not like awful children who only want money are all that uncommon.

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trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos

Is this so there's no concrete evidence of what anyone says, and the parent can then rewrite how the discussion went in their head based on how they felt about it?

Learning to read between the lines on these is a trip.
[/quote]
The thing the parents say on the forum is that if they put anything in print their children will purposely twist their words. If something is in writing

it can't be denied or explained away. And it might be the former paralegal in me, but any time someone refuses to put something about money in writing, they're up to something.

Play posted:

Some of these are actually a bit ambiguous, they don't have enough information to be sure who's to blame. I mean, it's not like awful children who only want money are all that uncommon.
Here's how I interpreted them:

quote:

Unfortunately for me I’ve surrounded myself with good people as my friends and so I am destined to continually hear all their wonderful stories and plans for family time. I put on a happy face but it’s getting harder and harder to pretend I am loved when I am not. I’ve been waiting for that walk and talk for months now with my daughter and she has gone back to just not replying to texts or invitations. She says all the right things like I’ll call next week to set a time then just doesn’t. My son has disappointed me by saying,” you’ve sabotaged all your relationships Mom”.
She's really bitter that other people get to have good relationships with their children, and her son telling her that she's sabotaged all her relationships should be a giveaway that she is the problem but- no insight. Instead his saying that is a "disappointment" to her. His not being nice to her makes him the problem.

quote:

I sent the ED age 40 w/new baby an email earlier today, asking if she would consider family counseling sessions in order that we could put what’s happened in the past behind us.

I received a rapid response to my email and essentially here’s her reply:

“get help for your hate and anger issues…I have a great life…go away forever ”

I replied: ” I have been evaluated 2X by 2 psychologists and told by both that I have PTSD . Perhaps you are the one who needs counseling. You have spread lies about me, mocked my homelessness, never called when I was very sick 2X in hospital, never ever invited me ever to any home you have lived in, humiliated me, and withheld the birth of the baby. and then you tell me I have issues.” I ended it with ” goodbye daughter.
This person has PTSD, which is linked to anger issues, and won't consider the possibility that she actually does have issues that push people away and tries to use it as a way to be a victim. The way she said it too was sort of funny. "I don't have anger issues! I have PTSD, therefore I can't possibly be the problem! How dare you!"

quote:

story of woman who abandoned her babies
The mother in the story tried to give her children better lives (she was leaving them on doorsteps, not throwing them into dumpsters) and was sincerely sorry. I think it was also a fictional television show/movie and the poster was still jealous.

This poo poo really is a trip.

new boot goofin
Jul 23, 2007

like school in july

quote:

The mother in the story tried to give her children better lives (she was leaving them on doorsteps, not throwing them into dumpsters) and was sincerely sorry. I think it was also a fictional television show/movie and the poster was still jealous.

This poo poo really is a trip.

oh poo poo, right?? The longer I read that post the more it became apparent that this wasn't like a news story or something, this woman was getting all lovely over like, a Lifetime movie. these people are definitely not living in reality.

Bruce Boxlicker
Jul 26, 2004



Fun Shoe
My recently estranged mother sent a birthday card and a present to our middle son today for his birthday. We sent the card back a few days ago and it came right back. I left a note saying not to call, text, show up or send mail as it is not welcome. Her husband started calling our phones telling us we need to fix this via voicemail. Flying monkeys indeed. My wife and I sent her a text saying none of it was welcome and that we already cut ties. We warned her that this was the second time and we will be filing a restraining order the next. She didn't apologize. Didn't try to fix anything. She just told us we were going to have to file it because she wasn't going to stop. I blew up at her and told her she's a deadbeat narcissist and alcoholic that has done quite enough damage. This really was the right choice. She has no respect for boundaries and everyone is just a pawn that has to do what she says. She got cut off because of this lack of respect and now the extinction burst is getting underway. I can't wait to explain to the judge why this is happening. She's a public school teacher and it's going to be sad when she goes to jail over this and gets the can but seriously I have no idea how they've let her around children this long.

I'm really glad this thread is here.

13Pandora13
Nov 5, 2008

I've got tiiits that swingle dangle dingle




Bruce Boxlicker posted:

My recently estranged mother sent a birthday card and a present to our middle son today for his birthday. We sent the card back a few days ago and it came right back. I left a note saying not to call, text, show up or send mail as it is not welcome. Her husband started calling our phones telling us we need to fix this via voicemail. Flying monkeys indeed. My wife and I sent her a text saying none of it was welcome and that we already cut ties. We warned her that this was the second time and we will be filing a restraining order the next. She didn't apologize. Didn't try to fix anything. She just told us we were going to have to file it because she wasn't going to stop. I blew up at her and told her she's a deadbeat narcissist and alcoholic that has done quite enough damage. This really was the right choice. She has no respect for boundaries and everyone is just a pawn that has to do what she says. She got cut off because of this lack of respect and now the extinction burst is getting underway. I can't wait to explain to the judge why this is happening. She's a public school teacher and it's going to be sad when she goes to jail over this and gets the can but seriously I have no idea how they've let her around children this long.

I'm really glad this thread is here.

Good job standing firm on this. You're doing what's best for your family and it seems like it's empowering your wife as well.

trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos

Bruce Boxlicker posted:

My recently estranged mother sent a birthday card and a present to our middle son today for his birthday. We sent the card back a few days ago and it came right back. I left a note saying not to call, text, show up or send mail as it is not welcome. Her husband started calling our phones telling us we need to fix this via voicemail. Flying monkeys indeed. My wife and I sent her a text saying none of it was welcome and that we already cut ties. We warned her that this was the second time and we will be filing a restraining order the next. She didn't apologize. Didn't try to fix anything. She just told us we were going to have to file it because she wasn't going to stop. I blew up at her and told her she's a deadbeat narcissist and alcoholic that has done quite enough damage. This really was the right choice. She has no respect for boundaries and everyone is just a pawn that has to do what she says. She got cut off because of this lack of respect and now the extinction burst is getting underway. I can't wait to explain to the judge why this is happening. She's a public school teacher and it's going to be sad when she goes to jail over this and gets the can but seriously I have no idea how they've let her around children this long.

I'm really glad this thread is here.

Oh, man, I'm sorry. If you haven't looked at DWIL Nation I'm gonna suggest it again. They have some good stuff in the Stickied thread at the top of the page.

quote:

Q: What are the signs of the DWIL apocolypse?
A:

7 signs of the DWIL apocalypse (by Cece3):

1. Nice messages (i.e. hoovering)
2. Angry messages
3. FMs
4. Unannounced visits
5. CPS WellCare checks
6. Accusations of PPD/other mental illness
7. Fake illness/hospitalization

Pre-apocalypse (BSC shows nuclear capabilities):

1. Lawn Tantrum
2. GP rights

Apocalypse (BSC goes full nuclear):

1. "Unintentional" harm to poster/family
They also advise people to keep a "gently caress you file" of their kids' checkups, any communication with teachers, etc., as well as documentation of their harassment, and be sure to have the house clean and healthy food in the kitchen in case of a CPS visit.

teen witch
Oct 9, 2012
Holy poo poo, Lawn Tantrums is a beautiful BEAUTIFUL phrase.

Pigsfeet on Rye
Oct 22, 2008

I'm meat on the hoof

teen witch posted:

Holy poo poo, Lawn Tantrums is a beautiful BEAUTIFUL phrase.

Please change my name to Major Lawn Tantrum

Uncle Enzo
Apr 28, 2008

I always wanted to be a Wizard
What are DWIL and FMs? I don't think those have been explained in the thread so far.

KitConstantine
Jan 11, 2013

Uncle Enzo posted:

What are DWIL and FMs? I don't think those have been explained in the thread so far.

DWIL is a sub-board on a forum generally for mothers/women who are expecting. It stands for Dealing With In Laws and seems to be the original version of boards like r/justnomil and is the originator of a lot of the lingo like DH (Dear Husband) and FM (flying monkey).

FM is often interchangable with 'minion'. Some are people that are enlisted to contact the estranged offspring, generally to try to get them back in line with the demands of the mother/father. They are usually people who are currently emeshed (terminology used frequently is 'in the fog') and are reacting poorly to someone throwing the toxicity of the current situation into relief. Sometimes they are people on the outside who are on the receiving end of a sob story from the estranged person and are 'just trying to help'.

Bruce Boxlicker
Jul 26, 2004



Fun Shoe

trickybiscuits posted:

Oh, man, I'm sorry. If you haven't looked at DWIL Nation I'm gonna suggest it again. They have some good stuff in the Stickied thread at the top of the page.

They also advise people to keep a "gently caress you file" of their kids' checkups, any communication with teachers, etc., as well as documentation of their harassment, and be sure to have the house clean and healthy food in the kitchen in case of a CPS visit.

I have been on there since you suggested it, I just feel more comfortable sharing here with goons. I appreciate it. We are going to the courthouse to file a stalking order today. It's free and only requires you explain to a judge why it's happening. Thankfully our state is pretty protective of those seeking these types of orders. It's past time we were just done with this poo poo.

Bruce Boxlicker fucked around with this message at 18:22 on Oct 4, 2019

normal-ass vampire
Feb 14, 2011

trickybiscuits posted:


The mother in the story tried to give her children better lives (she was leaving them on doorsteps, not throwing them into dumpsters) and was sincerely sorry. I think it was also a fictional television show/movie and the poster was still jealous.

This poo poo really is a trip.
Regardless of whether or not it's fiction, I just love that she can't grasp that there's a massive difference between this scenario and "was a constant negative presence in my children's lives and made them miserable". Like, yes, you were there, all right. You've cleared the lowest possible bar and still hosed up.

it dont matter
Aug 29, 2008

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/oct/07/i-was-an-intruder-what-its-like-to-be-your-parents-least-favourite-child

quote:

Growing up in an outwardly happy family – her mother was a midwife, her father a doctor – it was only later that Sara understood the hidden dynamic: “I found out when I was 11 that I was illegitimate,” she says. “My mother was pregnant – and had been deserted – when she met the medical student she went on to marry. In their minds, I wasn’t a ‘doctor’s daughter’ like my sisters: I was just some random man’s offspring.”

quote:

“When I started school at five, I was left alone. And I mean alone: Mum was proud of telling people that she could stay at work until late because I came home, cooked my supper and often put myself to bed.”

When her sisters came along, they had very different childhoods: “They were never left alone. They were favoured emotionally and financially. My sister was bought a record player for her ninth birthday, for example, and I got nothing. Later, they both got driving lessons. Not me.”

Goddamn, her parents were shitheads.

trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos

Bruce Boxlicker posted:

I have been on there since you suggested it, I just feel more comfortable sharing here with goons. I appreciate it. We are going to the courthouse to file a stalking order today. It's free and only requires you explain to a judge why it's happening. Thankfully our state is pretty protective of those seeking these types of orders. It's past time we were just done with this poo poo.
Good for you, I hope it goes well.

quote:

On one hand, I like who I am…honest, true, caring and decent…on the other hand I hate myself for who I am, which is gullable and sensitive and foolish…
today is my birthday, and while I made a vow to myself to simply enjoy the day, I can’t help being human and having expectations and hopes…needless to say, my son didn’t text me…several others did and my brother dropped off a beautiful plant for my flower garden which made my day…my sister, who I consider myself closest to, and who I text on a daily basis didn’t bother to text me until 4pm, saying something lame like she tried to text earlier but for some reason her phone wouldn’t send emojis…give me a break…so why not simply text happy birthday!! I was just kind of like oh, lol.
but see the clincher is, she will be irritated with me for my sarcasm for her negligence…
it’s a prime example of how I am sick and tired of having to suck up the b.s. from other people and being damned when I slightly stand up for myself! its wrong and there is no reason she couldn’t shoot out a text in the morning…
peoples insensitivity makes me want to be more of a loner…
this feels like a purposely calculated slam.

this may sound foolish, but I’m just sick and tired of being hurt


quote:

Christmas was always my big holiday. I made cookies, spent several months buying gifts ( each yr my husband would say I bought too much, I’d tell him next year I’d cut back but never did), days wrapping, decorated the house, trimmed the tree, sent cards, planned the meal and cooked for days. My husband’s birthday is 3 days before Christmas, so we also gathered the Sunday before Christmas to celebrate it.

On Christmas Eve, at exactly 7pm each year, we would eat a meal so big the buffet filled my entire counter space. Afterwards, while Christmas music played, we’d sit in a circle in the living room, taking turns opening gifts, which took close to 2 hours.

quote:

About a month ago, I met with my ES. Since he was still wanting to meet with me, I assumed we were onto repairing our mother/son bond. However, in our conversation, there was so much he alluded to and said that just didn’t sit well with me. Instead of confronting him in the restaurant where we were meeting (didn’t want that confrontation in public), I called him on the phone. He became very angry. Said I had plenty of time to tell him these things at the restaurant or even outside. I didn’t want to make a scene anywhere really. He sent a text requesting a conversation to discuss some issues. I went into a full fledged panic and had to call my sister to talk me off the ledge (don’t ask why cause I seriously do not know why had so much fear) then he called later that day and set MY boundaries, more like sequestered. I can’t talk about him, or his wife to any one. I can’t send text messages or emails other than I love you texts to him, Not allowed to discuss anything about his wife’s lack of respect on social media (whether I or anyone else have been offended or not). Not allowed to gossip (I’m assuming anything positive or negative) about anyone outside of him or his wife to him (I asked him to define gossip, he couldn’t) AND I’m not allowed bring up anything in the past or anything pertinent that may cause him and his wife to have a disagreement (I don’t talk to her. I credit her for all this ridiculousness). See . . . I’m sequestered. Anyhoo, been actually playing this game of nonsense for almost 2 months now. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

quote:

Hi friends! I am back! It has been a rough road, but we rode it through. My husband had his heart procedure and came out okay. We chose not to tell either ED, only our son who was a rock of strength. Husband told the EDs after he came home. Boy were they pissed!! They said such awful things to their Dad that he ended up in the ER with an uncontrollable nose bleed., Same scenario they did to him a year ago when he had sepsis. I was so mad that I almost lost it!! Part of me was glad he sees them for what they are, and part of me is so sad that now he won’t see our GGs. But we will go on. Happy that we have each other. Happy that we can see past the clouds.

Grimdude
Sep 25, 2006

It was a shame how he carried on
These people and not replying to texts quick enough for their liking.

Going through a whole thing with my mom and she pulled this poo poo. She texted (along with several others) on my birthday last week and I had the gall to not reply fast enough and boy howdy did I hear it in a voicemail the very next day. And this isn't new with her. I'm constantly reminded when I haven't called back or messaged fast enough.

I told her like a month ago I've been feeling depressed (which my paternal grandpa battled with) and that I needed time before meeting up. This was right after she threw a fit because I canceled dinner plans (that she told me about that day, not asked). I told her she's stressful for me and I needed to just figure poo poo out on my end.

She actually used the line "I guess I thought I raised you better" in the voicemail and it made me go from "oh God I feel so guilty maybe I'm wrong, maybe this voicemail will be nice and make me regretful" to "haha wow okay then."

Seriously, my stomach was in knots all day anticipating hearing that message. What a relief.

ohnobugs
Feb 22, 2003


Grimdude posted:

These people and not replying to texts quick enough for their liking.

Going through a whole thing with my mom and she pulled this poo poo. She texted (along with several others) on my birthday last week and I had the gall to not reply fast enough and boy howdy did I hear it in a voicemail the very next day. And this isn't new with her. I'm constantly reminded when I haven't called back or messaged fast enough.

I told her like a month ago I've been feeling depressed (which my paternal grandpa battled with) and that I needed time before meeting up. This was right after she threw a fit because I canceled dinner plans (that she told me about that day, not asked). I told her she's stressful for me and I needed to just figure poo poo out on my end.

She actually used the line "I guess I thought I raised you better" in the voicemail and it made me go from "oh God I feel so guilty maybe I'm wrong, maybe this voicemail will be nice and make me regretful" to "haha wow okay then."

Seriously, my stomach was in knots all day anticipating hearing that message. What a relief.

How dare you answer when it's convenient to you and not according to her own predetermined schedule. She can't effectively control your time when you do that. It's like every interaction with a person like this they are trying to extract something from you.

These people also have no concept of how their own behavior makes people not want to talk to them or interact with them.

trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos
It makes no sense that people think this is a personal slight against them! One woman a while back said that she has gotten the relationship with her estranged family that she wanted and part of that was that when she texted them they responded right away. But these people are unbelievably sensitive to rejection and seem unable to understand that they are not the center of other people's worlds.

I read this today on another website:

quote:

My mother was deeply, very deeply, offended that both her children decided to live with their partners before getting married. Living in sin. She was wallowing in how she must have raised us so very wrong that we thought that was okay.

I sat with her one evening, because I was in town, while she had this meltdown. And pointed out to her that she was 1) completely wrong, and 2) deeply offensive in that belief.

She had raised children into adults who knew their own minds and their own hearts and were not afraid to act on their own initiative. We were doing what was right for ourselves and our partners. We were acting smartly and responsibly in our own lives. Telling me that I was "living in sin" and making her sad by acting on my own adult will? gently caress her.

She saw it as a direct attack on her own life choices, her own decisions, that we were doing something completely different. She thought we were doing what we were doing to consciously and deliberately throw her choices back in her face.

I asked her if she though that she had raised a child who as an adult would be that deliberately cruel, or were her expectations out of line with reality? She was offended that I was living my life, and offended that I had found a partner who agreed with my choices. She was hurt that I wasn't following her unwritten rules. I pointed out that her expectations and her feelings about her expectations were entirely on HER, not on me, and she could either realign her thinking to join me in reality, or be marginalized as I continued to live my life as I chose.

Her upbringing was dysfunctional. Her father was an astoundingly controlling narcissist and deeply misogynistic. The carry-over from that to the rest of her life has been huge. But SHE was capable of raising smart, independent, kind children and not spilling too much of that dysfunction.

She changed. It was hard decades of slow work, mostly beginning when I was about 10 and she would've been about my age now (48ish). It accelerated when I was about 16 and started really calling her out on her poo poo and refused to play her games any longer. It's continued after that talk 20 years ago and as she has seen how I parent, how I've raised my daughter, and the person that daughter is becoming. And as she has had to rework and reevaluate her relationship with her husband/my father, since my brother and I have been out of the house for longer than we lived with them. They've been married for 55 years now. But I only think they started talking to each other, and really listening to each other, after the nest had been empty for about 10 years.

My mother truly is not a narc. But the FLEAs from her father? drat those things were huge.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
I'm reminded of how it's important if your kids are friends with a kid who has a clearly dysfunctional home life to invite them over when you can and show them a different family to teach them what a healthy (or at least less dysfunctional) relationship can look like, that their own experience at home is not their only option. A lot of people just haven't seen what a healthy and equitable relationship looks like, and care more about ticking the right boxes than actually talking to people.

trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos

THOT PATROL posted:


quote:

I am so sorry. I do know a little of what you are going through. It is a living nightmare not knowing where she is or if she is safe. I went through a similar situation with my ED at cutoff #1 when she ran off at 16 with her boyfriend who was 18 and was here illegally with his family from Mexico and was always badmouthing America and talking about leaving this “horrible country”.

My ED took off with him one day, out of the blue, right after we spent over $1,000 remodeling her bedroom, with no argument or anything to trigger it. We had Police looking for her and she was on the national database for missing and endangered children. We put posters up all over our state. I was so worried that he took her to Mexico and that she was being used as a sex slave there.

Anyway, after nearly a year of this living nightmare, she finally decided to make contact with me and wanted to come back home. She had been safe, living with his family in another state that whole time.

Had to quote this one because they HAD to mention the money they put into redecorating the room. $1,000! What an ungrateful child! They spent money on her! The ability to miss the point is amazing.

purple death ray
Jul 28, 2007

me omw 2 steal ur girl

"my daughter's boyfriend was Hispanic so I assumed he had sold her into sex slavery in Mexico" lmao fox news has so much to answer for

SulfurMonoxideCute
Feb 9, 2008

I was under direct orders not to die
🐵❌💀

Ghost Leviathan posted:

I'm reminded of how it's important if your kids are friends with a kid who has a clearly dysfunctional home life to invite them over when you can and show them a different family to teach them what a healthy (or at least less dysfunctional) relationship can look like, that their own experience at home is not their only option. A lot of people just haven't seen what a healthy and equitable relationship looks like, and care more about ticking the right boxes than actually talking to people.

It really is. My in-laws are amazing and I've been happier with them than I ever have with my own. I was so screwed up as a kid and had such a hard time maintaining friendships, especially growing up in a small town as a non-binary person. I moved to the city at 16, met some other kids from ruined homes, started to really open up, then met my now husband, and his family blew my mind. I completely latched on to them, probably to an unhealthy degree, and a combination of events led to me leaving home at 17 and going to their place instead. They took me in as one of their own and referred to me as "one of the kids" along with all their kids right away.

Mushika
Dec 22, 2010

I'm conflicted as to whether to post this or not but over the course of this thread, I think it has been asked of people with positive parental experiences how it went down or what was different about it or how to be a good parent. I don't know the answer to any of this. I have a great relationship with my parents. I'm taking a break from packing right now to post this because I'm driving them halfway across the country to be a part of my brother's wife's retirement ceremony. It's going to be a good trip. I don't get to spend nearly as much time with them as I would like, though that may change now that I'm unemployed. We're bringing guitars for my father, my brother and I to play when we have a spare moment and art materials (weaving, sewing, some metalworking) for my mother, sister-in-law and I to share over coffee and while we cook. My sister-in-law, from the little she has told us, had a terrible family upbringing and has no contact with her parents. I'm not sure about the details because I never wanted to push her to talk about it and she didn't seem terribly forthcoming about it. What I do know is that she has adopted my parents as her own with a fervor that is sometimes startling. Her love for my parents over the years has made me appreciate the relationship I have with them so much more.

I really don't want to sound as if I'm lauding myself or my relationship with my parents. I'm lucky as loving hell. I landed in this family, I didn't choose to be here. My sister-in-law, however, did. I don't know what her circumstances were. Maybe one day she'll tell me more about it. Maybe not. I know she loves my brother and he loves her, and that we are a family and we all love each other and support each other. We're all broke and barely making ends meet and I don't know how she and my brother are going to make it with the poo poo retirement that they're going to get, but we're all going to make it happen for all of us somehow.

I don't even know where I'm going with this. Maybe I should have just taken this to E/N. Sorry. Just thought I'd throw a positive parental experience in there.

SulfurMonoxideCute
Feb 9, 2008

I was under direct orders not to die
🐵❌💀

I think it's a good place. I have an incredible and positive relationship with my in-laws, I've gotten to experience both sides.

Also this came across my feed this morning. Extremely typical attitude and language.

SulfurMonoxideCute fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Oct 10, 2019

Relentless
Sep 22, 2007

It's a perfect day for some mayhem!


Mushika posted:

I'm conflicted as to whether to post this or not but over the course of this thread, I think it has been asked of people with positive parental experiences how it went down or what was different about it or how to be a good parent. I don't know the answer to any of this. I have a great relationship with my parents. I'm taking a break from packing right now to post this because I'm driving them halfway across the country to be a part of my brother's wife's retirement ceremony. It's going to be a good trip. I don't get to spend nearly as much time with them as I would like, though that may change now that I'm unemployed. We're bringing guitars for my father, my brother and I to play when we have a spare moment and art materials (weaving, sewing, some metalworking) for my mother, sister-in-law and I to share over coffee and while we cook. My sister-in-law, from the little she has told us, had a terrible family upbringing and has no contact with her parents. I'm not sure about the details because I never wanted to push her to talk about it and she didn't seem terribly forthcoming about it. What I do know is that she has adopted my parents as her own with a fervor that is sometimes startling. Her love for my parents over the years has made me appreciate the relationship I have with them so much more.

I really don't want to sound as if I'm lauding myself or my relationship with my parents. I'm lucky as loving hell. I landed in this family, I didn't choose to be here. My sister-in-law, however, did. I don't know what her circumstances were. Maybe one day she'll tell me more about it. Maybe not. I know she loves my brother and he loves her, and that we are a family and we all love each other and support each other. We're all broke and barely making ends meet and I don't know how she and my brother are going to make it with the poo poo retirement that they're going to get, but we're all going to make it happen for all of us somehow.

I don't even know where I'm going with this. Maybe I should have just taken this to E/N. Sorry. Just thought I'd throw a positive parental experience in there.

It's a nice contrast to see the positive side of people finding a family when their blood relatives aren't capable.

Reading this thread, I keep thinking of my friend Phil. One summer in high school I was mostly living with my dad, as his place was closer to my summer job. One night I ended up crashing at my mom's house pretty late. Woke up the next morning... my mom is making waffles for Phil. Apparently he got into a fist fight with his step-dad, my mom heard about it from a friend of a friend, and he just lived in her guest bedroom for the better part of a month.

Whatever problems and issues I might have with my mom, a lack of caring and empathy has never been a problem. It's been almost 20 years since that happened, and just last week I heard my mom is renting the grandmother apartment above the garage to another person in need. This gal is friends with one of my cousins, moved back home from Alaska to take help care of her ailing mother with whom she's previously been estranged. A couple fights with her mom, and an Adult Protective Services call because she wouldn't let her mother take 2-4 Vicodin per hour... and she's estranged from her mother again, and my mom is taking in another stray.

Sherry Bahm
Jul 30, 2003

filled with dolphins

Relentless posted:

It's a nice contrast to see the positive side of people finding a family when their blood relatives aren't capable.

Finding surrogates to fill those parental roles went a long way towards helping me come to terms with having lovely biological parents. I might not have a relationship with my biological mother or father anymore, but I have people who have become mothers and fathers to me. People that I call and talk to and spend time with, people that I reach out to when in times of need, and when I have something to celebrate. I have people who want to be an active part of my life, and that's been a million times more validating than blood ever was.

And it's how cool and understanding and supportive these surrogates have been that drives home the point of how toxic the biological batch was. These are also the people who helped me unlearn a lot of the bs I had inevitably picked up from growing up with the biological parents in the first place. Because you don't realize just how screwed up you are until you finally step out of that kind of environment and get called out on it. In spite of everything I consider myself really lucky to have had people and places to land in when it all went to poo poo for me with the biological parents; and these people have become my family in ways that the biological ones never were, or could be.

Splash Attack
Mar 23, 2008

Yeahhh!
I am GHOS!!
Haaaaaa Ha Ha Ha!!




Ghost Leviathan posted:

I'm reminded of how it's important if your kids are friends with a kid who has a clearly dysfunctional home life to invite them over when you can and show them a different family to teach them what a healthy (or at least less dysfunctional) relationship can look like, that their own experience at home is not their only option. A lot of people just haven't seen what a healthy and equitable relationship looks like, and care more about ticking the right boxes than actually talking to people.

i honestly didn't realize that my family life was actually not normal at all until i got older. i remember a few years back i was getting a ride from my dad's cousin for a family gathering because i live closer to her than my family now, and when i got there she and her husband were snapping at each other because their kid wasn't ready to leave yet (she was still a toddler) so we ended up running a little late. i remember feeling this huge feeling of anxiety and dread because when that happens with my parents, my dad fumes during the entire car trip and starts laying into everyone around him about every single perceived slight we did to him or fault we had, so i was preparing for that to be the awkward bystander for this to play out.

imagine my surprise when before they got into the car, they made up, kissed, and then just a very pleasant conversation on the way there. it honestly was a huge shock for me because i'd never thought that there was any other way to handle it beforehand.

Mushika posted:

I'm conflicted as to whether to post this or not but over the course of this thread, I think it has been asked of people with positive parental experiences how it went down or what was different about it or how to be a good parent. I don't know the answer to any of this. I have a great relationship with my parents. I'm taking a break from packing right now to post this because I'm driving them halfway across the country to be a part of my brother's wife's retirement ceremony. It's going to be a good trip. I don't get to spend nearly as much time with them as I would like, though that may change now that I'm unemployed. We're bringing guitars for my father, my brother and I to play when we have a spare moment and art materials (weaving, sewing, some metalworking) for my mother, sister-in-law and I to share over coffee and while we cook. My sister-in-law, from the little she has told us, had a terrible family upbringing and has no contact with her parents. I'm not sure about the details because I never wanted to push her to talk about it and she didn't seem terribly forthcoming about it. What I do know is that she has adopted my parents as her own with a fervor that is sometimes startling. Her love for my parents over the years has made me appreciate the relationship I have with them so much more.

I really don't want to sound as if I'm lauding myself or my relationship with my parents. I'm lucky as loving hell. I landed in this family, I didn't choose to be here. My sister-in-law, however, did. I don't know what her circumstances were. Maybe one day she'll tell me more about it. Maybe not. I know she loves my brother and he loves her, and that we are a family and we all love each other and support each other. We're all broke and barely making ends meet and I don't know how she and my brother are going to make it with the poo poo retirement that they're going to get, but we're all going to make it happen for all of us somehow.

I don't even know where I'm going with this. Maybe I should have just taken this to E/N. Sorry. Just thought I'd throw a positive parental experience in there.

no, don't be. i have a friend who has a very good relationship with his father and brother, and every sunday he'd go spend time with them, drinking and having a good time because of how close knit they are. he confessed to me that he honestly feels bad talking about it because he knows so many people in our social circle don't have good relationships with parents, including me, but i told him hearing about how he has a good time just knocking back beers with his dad honestly does make me happy. it makes me a little sad that i can't do the same with my own parents, but at least i know that a healthy family dynamic is possible and not something that you just find in fiction.

Dirt Road Junglist
Oct 8, 2010

We will be cruel
And through our cruelty
They will know who we are

Relentless posted:

It's a nice contrast to see the positive side of people finding a family when their blood relatives aren't capable.

Reading this thread, I keep thinking of my friend Phil. One summer in high school I was mostly living with my dad, as his place was closer to my summer job. One night I ended up crashing at my mom's house pretty late. Woke up the next morning... my mom is making waffles for Phil. Apparently he got into a fist fight with his step-dad, my mom heard about it from a friend of a friend, and he just lived in her guest bedroom for the better part of a month.

Whatever problems and issues I might have with my mom, a lack of caring and empathy has never been a problem. It's been almost 20 years since that happened, and just last week I heard my mom is renting the grandmother apartment above the garage to another person in need. This gal is friends with one of my cousins, moved back home from Alaska to take help care of her ailing mother with whom she's previously been estranged. A couple fights with her mom, and an Adult Protective Services call because she wouldn't let her mother take 2-4 Vicodin per hour... and she's estranged from her mother again, and my mom is taking in another stray.

Your mom bailed me out of jail, let me pay her back in installments, loaned me clothes for court, and put in a good word with the judge for me (because of course your mom knows everyone in that county). I pretty much lived in her house that winter when I was unemployed, because she and your step-dad were gone all the time, and it meant not having to be sad in my parents' basement.

Boywhiz88
Sep 11, 2005

floating 26" off da ground. BURR!

Dirt Road Junglist posted:

Your mom bailed me out of jail, let me pay her back in installments, loaned me clothes for court, and put in a good word with the judge for me (because of course your mom knows everyone in that county). I pretty much lived in her house that winter when I was unemployed, because she and your step-dad were gone all the time, and it meant not having to be sad in my parents' basement.

I thought this was leading up to “and I hosed her” because it’s SomethingAwful. But that’s so sweet and nice. I’m so glad people can look out for one another like this.

trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos

Picnic Princess posted:

I think it's a good place. I have an incredible and positive relationship with my in-laws, I've gotten to experience both sides.

Also this came across my feed this morning. Extremely typical attitude and language.


Once on this forum I read the line "If you do something good and something bad, the two don't cancel each other out like some kind of video game. You're a person who's done a good thing and done a bad thing."

My parents were pretty great and I'm close with my father and brother, and was close with my mom before she died.They were just supportive, talked with us honestly, didn't put us down, trusted us to do the right thing, and took us along when they did stuff- they were really active in mental health advocacy and went to a lot of meetings. I like hanging out with my dad, with or without his girlfriend (who is also good people), just watching movies or getting dinner, and we can talk about silly things or serious things or whatever. I've never thought about why they were good parents. They just did everyday things and were kind and good at listening. They also had some mental health problems but still did a good job raising two kids.


eta just want to add this before I forget

quote:

I am a very Social person who gravitate to people who needs a friend because I’m all about inclusion. I love to make people smile , laugh and be happy. We retired, moved to a brand new subdivision where the first occupants who met 6 other great couple and since met and made a lot and to include friends and neighbours. But there was a small group totalling 12 of us that were closer . We were the originals who met at our house for our first annual Christmas party, The 12 of us would have our Annual small get togethers, summer barbecues, Christmas small gathering, boating . We were always the regular ones to plan and show up to everything. . . I love to Entertain and we’ve filled our house to the maximum to include everyone in the neighbour hood for our Christmas pot Luck party. Our house being the larger model could accmodate more people so it seemed our home was the centre for different occasions All these occasions were planned with the help of the original group. . We started up all these neighbour events together. But it was at my house this couple made great friendships with others. . Monthly Euchre where 8 couples could play comfortably in one room. We’ve organized monthly bowling, waster toss tournaments in our back yard. Just so people could meet and have fun. We’ve been invited back to most . I really took to a couple who more or less stayed to themselves all but for women’s yoga. I will call the couple Smith, Just before Christmas Mrs Smith was diagnosed with cancer. I knew of a mutual friend who went to yoga with mrs Smith. So New Years Eve I called the mutual friend and suggested that we would meet up at Mrs smiths house with goodies and ring in the new year with the smiths who had no family or friends at this point to visit. Even though there was this cancer thing hanging over her head, mrs Smith and husband had a great time. This evening made for a great friendship amongst the six of us. We celebrate each other’s birthday at a restaurant, went b once to a festival once . We never lived in each other’s pockets but would meet up occasionally for a long walk together. A car ride in the afternoon. Coffee twice at a coffee shop. . It appeared our friendship was noticed by the lady from our original group who helped me coridnatec the neighbourhoods events from the start who went to Mrs Smith as she lived next door and commented on what she called our little “click”. We had going with the six of us. We never looked at our friendship has a “click” because it was an occasional friendship. Not friendships where you regularly hung out

There’s only one couple who knows about our estrangement with our daughter . This estrangements that left me even more sensitive, more easily hurt than ever I was in my lifetime . So I don’t know if I’m over reacting and this is where I need a totally fair and looking at every view point. Since I formed this friendship I’ve noticed that myself and husband didn’t get invited to a garden party hosted by the friend who had invited everyone else in our original group and included a few more . Mrs Smith and now mr Smith both now suffering cancer wasnt invited , and they live next door with no fence to separate so they could see everyone having a great time while they just looked on. amrs Smith would cut their grass , do favours when asked for them while they were away. Water their piants. But not to invite them? The six of us weren’t invited . I was so incredibly hurt. Every function I hosted all 12 of this group were always invited to our home. They were the mainstays. The foundation., these 12 people. During the week I happened to be outside in my front when my two women neighbours who were among the 12 mainstays , all dressed up , stopped and chatted . I asked in all innocence going shopping ladies? They immediately became uncomfortable and said a few were getting together for lunch. I made a little remark saying ” my invitation must have got lost in the mail”. They both said it wasn’t them who made the invited list. And it was just a small gathering. As if that was ok. It was me who put all these people together in the first place. I Laughed and told them to have a good time. I was completely devastated this time. I felt unwanted, helpless, ostrasized , rejected , angry , how could they be so thoughtless, ? The friend who planned this acts like nothings amiss. Nothing’s wrong. I have never mentioned a word to her anyone on how I feel . I never mentioned to anyone that I even knew about the garden party, I thought in my senior years I wouldn’t be dealing with this drama . This was just teenage stuff . I have no idea why this is happening. Is it because I cancelled the bowling Has too many people were bailing out last minute leaving me embarrassed to having to cancel 4 lanes of bowling that was reserved for 2. Weeks leaving a financial loss for this small business? Everyone said they understood my position and why I took it, They treated me no differently. That’s the only upset ! Or am I overreacting to think because I’ve included all of them to everything I’ve hosted , for the exception of Mr and mrs smiths Birthday dinner along with the other couple should they be obligated to include me in their smaller events. Am I being unfair? Am I not doing the same thing with the birthday party dinner? Because there’s a once a month large dinner group that includes everyone, my rational was no one would be interested in joining us 6. We would have to celebrate all 34 people Birthday , which would end up going out to eat multiple times a month. It woukd get out of hand. It would appear were only invited to the once a month large dinner group which includes everyone but excluded from all events from the original 12 group. Please put my mind at rest by looking at my story from everyone’s point of view to be fair. I don’t feel comfortable addressing my feelings to them. After all it’s up to them who they want to hang out with, is it unreasonable of me think just maybe my neighbour should suggest to the person whoes doing the inviting maybe suggest why are you leaving out. easy Street? That’s what I would do, I can’t take on anymore pain of rejection and betrayal. And is this what it’s all about?

That's 1,800 words to say that people in her social group, which she owns, are meeting up without her.

trickybiscuits fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Oct 11, 2019

trickybiscuits
Jan 13, 2008

yospos
let's keep this depressing thread going

quote:

I’ve not been posting much over the past year. Mostly because I’ve not had much good to share. I should be able to contribute but haven’t felt like I could.

This past year has been more of the same misery. I try to keep my head up and a smile on my face, but I’m so very tired. I feel that I’m the one reaching out to my adult children and their spouses yet I don’t feel like any one of them care. If I don’t call them they don’t call me. If I don’t suggest fun things to do together they don’t. If I don’t call and ask if I can come over I don’t get invited.

They never ask me how I’m doing or if I need anything.

I’ve been on my own my whole life and am pretty self-sufficient but it would be nice to know someone cares.

It’s the little simple things that add up.

My son and daughter-in-law had a baby in August, premature and is doing well. Although I call, offer to help, ask to come see the baby. It’s as if I’m a casual acquaintance. I’ve just learned from Facebook that birth announcements were sent out to friends and family yet I’ve not received one. Maybe a small thing to some but important to me.

Perhaps it’s gotten lost in the mail? I want my son about it but don’t want to beg. What would you do? I’ve thought about posting a note in Facebook saying that I’d like one too would that make me look foolish to their Facebook friends?

I’m so tired of the little things. They add up. I don’t think I’ll make it thru my upcoming birthday and holidays. My heart is broken.

Translation: I might literally die because my son won't prioritize my emotions over his wife and premature newborn baby.

quote:

My “breaking point” was when my nicer ED sent around a mass email (sent to many people at once with a hidden BCC) in which she told everyone the entire names of her newborn twins. I had been asking what their names were going to be and only told their first names. Because she named them after the other grandmother and a great grandmother due to what I believe was her dad’s parental alienation efforts. I believe she didn’t bother to talk to me ahead of time because my feeling don’t matter, or she lacks the empathy and compassion for others to tell me the truth in advance. It is her choice to name her kids whatever but I felt lied to, lies by omission. And what I came around to was that I had to let go of wanting more or different with these adult kids of mine. I had to stop seeing myself as only having value if they valued me. The change I sought was within myself and my perspective I finally realized.

Translation: I knew the children's names in advance, but not their WHOLE names, and my daughter named her children after people one the other side of her family for the sole purpose of hurting me and for no other reason.

quote:

My husband met with my oldest ED on Monday. He payed it out sstraight to her. He spoke and she listened. He told her we are changing our Wills and both ED’s will get zero. He said if you start treating us with respect and stop calling your mother toxic and mentally ill and start acting like grown women then we would give it awhile before we go to our lawyer to change it. He said it’s disgraceful how they have been acting over these 3 years. He told them they have to stop with their BS and grow up. The entire time she didn’t open her mouth. I’m sure she is going over everything with her aunt and sister. He was put in 15 minutes. So it’s been 5 days and no word. I believe we won’t hear anything or we will hear their rules. At this point I don’t care either way. I’m over it.
Exactly one week later:

quote:

Hello, I know I’m ranting a little but it’s my own fault. Husband met with ED and never heard a word back. It’s been a week and nothing. I knew this would happen and that’s why I wasn’t eager to do anything. They are probably discussing this with my snake sisterinlaw or best friend who helps them run the show. Now my husband said he shouldn’t have waisted his 15 minutes of time talking to her. I hate the waiting. I do believe she will answer with nastiness and being the same as over 3 years ago. I would like to get an answer and put it to rest. The waiting aggravates me. I knew this would happen because I know their behaviors very well. They are the same inhumans and havent changed. I’m really pissed. Sorry for the rant
Translation: my husband tried to use an inheritance to influence out daughter. It didn't work.

Both from the same poster:

quote:

I’m going to admit it right off the bat…I don’t want my daughter living with me.

My daughter has always been difficult and demanding. She was overly attached to me, had no boundaries, and was glued to me 24/7. As a teen she started to act out, but it got to the point where she was stealing money, lying about even insignificant things, and for some reason thought this was ok. I warned her that she needed to stop. Took her to many therapists and psychiatrists trying to get help. She rejected them all. Our family could not deal with her anymore and told her she must live with her Dad, who lived alone and could dedicate more time. (She had an older sister and younger brother) To make a long story short, she did the same thing to him. And one night she sneaked out and came home drunk and with drugs and a weapon. He told her she must hand over her phone and let him search her purse before he would allow her in the home. She said no and called the police. Crazy as it sounds, the police supported HER and took her into custody and put her into a temporary foster home. They called me to take her and I refused as she had been violent in the past towards me and her younger brother. So, they tried to prosecute both my exhusband and I for neglect, which they soon found out is a crock of crap. Their case was unfounded of course and I begged them for help as none of us could afford the mental heath services that she needed. At that time, we were in more than $30,000 of medical debt thanks to all the help we tried to get. Anyway, she was a nothing but problems for them too. They put her in a boarding type school for kids with issues. At age 18 they still wouldn’t release her from custody so she ran away to CA and has been living and working there for almost 2 years now.

Even across the country she creates problems. There is constant drama with her jobs, roommates, housing, employers, boyfriends, the list goes on. She creates havoc and drama wherever she goes. She will call me sometimes as many as 10 times a day. I ask her not to as I’m WORKING and that just makes her call more. Any sort of request to stop just makes her do it more. She always needs money for rent, food, medical care, transportation, the list goes on. She lost her passport. She lost her birth certificate, ID, SS card, multiple times. We’ve tried to convince her to go live with her Dad for awhile, to save money, and then go out once she can better support herself but she refuses. I’ve offered to help her go to college but she refuses. Bottom line is that she wants to behave like an rear end in a top hat to everyone and for us to foot the bill while she rides her skateboard, drinks, and does drugs. I told her I’m done sending money. Yes, she does work full time, but in CA that’s just not enough.

SO now, instead of moving to her Dads house, she wants to move back into my home. I told her no, that I don’t think her step-Dad would allow it. Because that is the truth. Yes, I put the blame on him rather than taking it on myself because she doesn’t even talk to him unless he answers the phone and then only tries to get money or to vent her long list of problems. She only wants to come here because she can boss me around and guilt me into giving her money. My husband and I are both professionals and we can’t have drugs, drinking, and the police involved in our lives. Not to mention the fact that we have a teenaged son who is in HS that is still in the home. (He is the best kid you could ever ask for thankfully)

So now, I’m the most horrible person in the world. (as she’s told me all my life) She says things like “What sort of Mother kicks her child when she’s down?” or things like “If I had a kid I could never turn my back on them like you’ve done to me”. When she was a kid I did everything for her. I put her in private religious school, had her in activities, sent her to fun camps, and spent all my time with her to the detriment of my other children. She always demanded ALL of my attention and she got it.

quote:

I agree so much that our society is in shambles. But I think a lot of it is due to the ‘acceptance of evil”. I sought out a large number of therapists and psychiatrists for my daughter. And the last one (provided by the state) blamed all of my daughters problems on “birth trauma” because there were forceps involved in her delivery. I kid you not. My daughter took money because of birth trauma, not because she wanted to buy alcohol. My daughter cheated in school because of birth trauma, not because she didn’t do her homework, and my daughter carried a knife, and sold prescriptions drugs because of forceps, not because she was trying to make money to buy a plane ticket to California.

Nothing was her fault, nothing was my fault, no one could ever be held accountable or responsible for their behaviors because of birth trauma. And apparently the prisons are full of birth trauma victims and we should feel sorry for them, accept them, and support them.

I was actually court ordered to sit and listen to this. I smiled and thanked her. She said “You don’t believe a word of this do you?” and I said “nope”. Then it was written into a report that went to the judge that I was polite, compliant, but did not believe in their philosophy and would continue to fail at parenting my child.



quote:

It is interesting what you say about PTSD. I definitely already had some abandonment issues before the estrangement with my daughter. My parents divorced when I was 4; I had been very attached to my father, who became a weekend dad and remarried (a good thing– I loved my stepmother, who was very warm and caring). My mother had mental health issues and struggled being a single mom. My sister and I didn’t get along well at all when we were growing up. So, this makes a lot of sense. I have also “lost” childhood friends along the way.

I believe I became too emotionally dependent on my daughter, was hoping she would be my “best friend” and that wasn’t what she wanted. So, yeah, I see your point about how past trauma can have a lot to do with how a person experiences an estrangement later in life.

I am very undecided re therapy. My kids and I saw therapists when they were young and having problems, and I had some very negative experiences– felt I was being judged and blamed, and I wasn’t willing to put myself thru that. I saw my own psychiatrist for a short while, who prescribed meds, but our talking time was very limited. I definitely lean more towards self-help stuff.

Translation: I refuse to treat my PTSD and abandonment issues and became emotionally dependent on my daughter, which made it hard for me when she cut me out of her life.

eta: quote from the Idiots on Social Media thread

Puppy Time posted:

It comes from "I need there to be an acceptable reason that I suffered as a child, because if I agree that my parents did lovely things, that will mess up the nice balance of coping mechanisms I have."

Particularly if you still have a relationship with those parents, because then you have to find a new way to deal with "I love this person, who loves and supports me,* but also they hosed me up in major ways."

Extra points if you ALSO have children you've "disciplined" with that way, so you get the EXTRA fun of "In the process of trying to be a good parent, I have irrevocably hosed my offspring up, and I can't take that back."

It's really uncomfortable to face all that poo poo head on, to say nothing of the fact that they probably have extra emotional/mental issues on top of all that compounding the issue, because brains are total bullshit.


*Presumably, at least most of the time

trickybiscuits fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Oct 14, 2019

ikanreed
Sep 25, 2009

I honestly I have no idea who cannibal[SIC] is and I do not know why I should know.

syq dude, just syq!
The weird thing to me isn't that they acted that way in the first place, but that they can sit down to write these posts and not realize they're assholes.

PetraCore
Jul 20, 2017

👁️🔥👁️👁️👁️BE NOT👄AFRAID👁️👁️👁️🔥👁️

Wait, is the birth trauma thing saying the daughter has brain damage causing impulse control issues bc of forceps being used on her soft newborn skull?

Like I completely believe there's mental illness going on there that mom ignored bc it was inconvenient, but I didn't realize that was a thing.

ikanreed
Sep 25, 2009

I honestly I have no idea who cannibal[SIC] is and I do not know why I should know.

syq dude, just syq!

PetraCore posted:

Wait, is the birth trauma thing saying the daughter has brain damage causing impulse control issues bc of forceps being used on her soft newborn skull?

Like I completely believe there's mental illness going on there that mom ignored bc it was inconvenient, but I didn't realize that was a thing.

It's not really. Infant skulls are naturally deformed during the birthing process because humans are stupid shaped for birth and big headed, but it returns to normal shape after 1 to 3 days.

Newborns look like coneheads

PetraCore
Jul 20, 2017

👁️🔥👁️👁️👁️BE NOT👄AFRAID👁️👁️👁️🔥👁️

ikanreed posted:

It's not really. Infant skulls are naturally deformed during the birthing process because humans are stupid shaped for birth and big headed, but it returns to normal shape after 1 to 3 days.

Newborns look like coneheads
So I'm guessing the court was trying to explain to her that her daughter was... special needs? And mom just ignored it?

ikanreed
Sep 25, 2009

I honestly I have no idea who cannibal[SIC] is and I do not know why I should know.

syq dude, just syq!

PetraCore posted:

So I'm guessing the court was trying to explain to her that her daughter was... special needs? And mom just ignored it?

Probably, and the forceceps thing is one of those stories narcissistic people tell to say how every negative outcome they experience is someone else's fault. Even if no one is at fault, they love blaming people for screwing up their life.

ohnobugs
Feb 22, 2003


PetraCore posted:

Wait, is the birth trauma thing saying the daughter has brain damage causing impulse control issues bc of forceps being used on her soft newborn skull?

Like I completely believe there's mental illness going on there that mom ignored bc it was inconvenient, but I didn't realize that was a thing.

That's a lovely therapist. Every time therapy gets around to talking about mom's abusive behavior, or the daughter starts showing independence or improved function, I suspect mom is cutting out on that therapist and goes looking for a new one.

Not sure why she owes $30,000. I'd like to see a breakdown of that. She could have refused to pay her bills because she wasn't told what she wanted to hear. She may be on the hook for her daughter's court-ordered hospitalization or care. That number could also just be unrelated credit card debt or completely made up. Who knows?

My dad had our family switch therapists a few times when we were kids, usually when we got to talking about what he and my stepmother were doing. Off-topic, but my hoarder stepmother is a disability scammer and claims to have every kind of illness ever. She also claims to have brain damage from birth for the same reason. According to her, in the olden days doctors used heavy metal forceps and went in like Wolverine to pull out babies. It's bullshit, but it's also difficult to prove it didn't happen. There are a few legitimate cases of that kind of damage happening to boomers during birth, but it's blown way out of proportion. I'm imagining this mother demanding an explanation for what's wrong with her daughter that doesn't involve her being an abusive bitch, and this poor therapist is just racking their brain for something to tell her.

ohnobugs fucked around with this message at 22:14 on Oct 14, 2019

RoboRodent
Sep 19, 2012

I mean, brain damage during birth is a thing. One of my cousins falls into that category, though I think the explanation for her case was a lack of oxygen. Damage the wrong part of the brain and you do have issues with understanding consequences, which can lead to these sorts of disciplinary problems. Same reason you see a lot of people with FASD get into trouble with the law. The part of the brain that connects "I want this thing so I'll just take it" to "but if I steal and cheat ill get in trouble" is just straight up not working properly. These are learnable skills, but it's harder for them. They need support and love and consistency.

So this woman has been sat down and had it explained to her that her daughter is brain damaged and could use some extra support and love in order to get her life sorted out, but that interferes with her ability to blame her daughter for everything, so it must be a lie.

Facebook Aunt
Oct 4, 2008

wiggle wiggle




RoboRodent posted:

So this woman has been sat down and had it explained to her that her daughter is brain damaged and could use some extra support and love in order to get her life sorted out, but that interferes with her ability to blame her daughter for everything, so it must be a lie.

Yeah, that seemed weird to me. Here you have an excuse on a silver platter for why your kid being a gently caress up isn't in any way your fault. You'd think most of the estranged parents would love that. But for this lady that isn't enough, it must be the child's fault.

ohnobugs
Feb 22, 2003


That stuff just ruins the game of golden child/scapegoat they've got going on with the daughter and son. Also, effort.

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PetraCore
Jul 20, 2017

👁️🔥👁️👁️👁️BE NOT👄AFRAID👁️👁️👁️🔥👁️

RoboRodent posted:

I mean, brain damage during birth is a thing. One of my cousins falls into that category, though I think the explanation for her case was a lack of oxygen. Damage the wrong part of the brain and you do have issues with understanding consequences, which can lead to these sorts of disciplinary problems. Same reason you see a lot of people with FASD get into trouble with the law. The part of the brain that connects "I want this thing so I'll just take it" to "but if I steal and cheat ill get in trouble" is just straight up not working properly. These are learnable skills, but it's harder for them. They need support and love and consistency.

So this woman has been sat down and had it explained to her that her daughter is brain damaged and could use some extra support and love in order to get her life sorted out, but that interferes with her ability to blame her daughter for everything, so it must be a lie.
Right, obviously this lady isn't a reliable narrator but 'the court mandated that I have this explained to me in small words with diagrams, then they were informed I wouldn't follow through with what my daughter needed' makes me think the daughter actually is special needs (in the literal sense of needing extra care and support due to a disorder or condition) but mom refuses to believe it.

Also note how mad she is at her underage daughter calling the cops when neither of her parents would let her live with them, and how shocked she is that the cops, gasp, sided with her daughter.

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