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don't learn frontend or you'll get a frontend job and have to spend your days working on frontend 
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Oct 18, 2019 23:58
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frontend is a poo poo place to be: it's actually really hard (UI design is a specialist topic and everybody thinks they are much better at it than they actually are) but it's treated as a junior role and compensated accordingly Real Men write microservices
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Oct 18, 2019 23:59
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suspect in one hand and spit in the other
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Oct 19, 2019 00:03
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Ferr posted:LAMP stack + jQuery focused mainly on data integration/pipline and back end reporting my girlfriend’s current and previous jobs were both LAMP backend integrations with “i can sort of read it” levels of js so stuff is definitely out there
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Oct 19, 2019 00:17
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:javascript is javascript and the popular choice changes every year or two I would never hire a LAMP stack dev to do modern day web development. Yes there are other LAMP stack based jobs, but I'm assuming Ferr is just applying for general web dev jobs.
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Oct 19, 2019 00:21
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i had an interview today that i think went well, but drat do i hate whiteboarding the problem was to talk thru an integer stack that had push, pop, and max functions, where max returned the highest integer in the stack, and then optimize it i tend to create a naive solution for things and then optimize, and i suck at whiteboarding the optimization because im chronically bad at thinking academic-technically when under a microscope, and the result is that i always reach the dumbass cs100 solution for something and then get prodded towards a more elegant one. i hate this sideshow routine where i have to demonstrate specific skills that won't have an impact on my day to day
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Oct 19, 2019 01:21
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raminasi posted:my girlfriend’s current and previous jobs were both LAMP backend integrations with “i can sort of read it” levels of js so stuff is definitely out there My work still deploys coldfusion. Although we are pretty close to killing it. And I wouldn't have an issue hiring a LAMP stack dev, I would very much focus on "can learn to read esoteric bullshit written by somebody else" as an immensely useful job skill.
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Oct 19, 2019 01:45
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buttchugging adderall posted:My work still deploys coldfusion. Although we are pretty close to killing it. Place I'm at right now the primary technical part of the interview was "read this code, tell me what's wrong with it" and "read this code, how would you make it better or redesign it" and it let me actually discuss how I do things and I nailed it and now I love working here. More places should do that.
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Oct 19, 2019 02:06
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stuffed crust punk posted:i had an interview today that i think went well, but drat do i hate whiteboarding there are books about this extremely specific topic algorithm design manual http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.471.4772&rep=rep1&type=pdf cracking the coding interview https://www.amazon.com/Cracking-Coding-Interview-Programming-Questions/dp/0984782850 it sucks, but if you are not willing to spend 40-60 hours reviewing basic material maybe you really didn't want that deece 6.5 figgies?
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Oct 19, 2019 02:08
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im enjoying the pairing of posts complaining, in order: * i cant get a job because my skillset is outdated and interviews only want to hire for exactly the skills they will do day-to-day * i cant get a job because interviews want me to demonstrate the bare minimum of skills outside of what i will do day-to-day
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Oct 19, 2019 02:09
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Failed Sega Accessory Ahoy!
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Menacer posted:im enjoying the pairing of posts complaining, in order: do note, it's not the same person issuing both complaints different applicants find different challenges in the interview process and that is ok
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Oct 19, 2019 02:21
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stuffed crust punk posted:i had an interview today that i think went well, but drat do i hate whiteboarding are you jumping straight into coding the naive thing or drawing out how the data would flow in the naive solution and asking (either explicitly or not) for feedback?
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Oct 19, 2019 02:46
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Menacer posted:im enjoying the pairing of posts complaining, in order: both problems can and do exist. to it is a car analogy things, hiring programmers is basically hiring drivers, with some combination of disqualifying candidates because either: * the candidate has been driving ford trucks for the past 10 years, and you have a fleet of mercs * the candidate, applying to be a driver, cannot design an internal combustion engine on a whiteboard the actual day-to-day stuff you should care about is more along the lines of understanding traffic laws, knowing how vehicles handle under adverse weather conditions, and being able to follow road directions, but for some reason these are deemed less important.
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Oct 19, 2019 03:08
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Operating is sysadmins, designing is the program touchers. So there is designing involved in the job, if you make everything document db poo poo or write microservices when you have one person or poo poo the bed other ways, there was a bonafide design fuckup. This is hard to understand because the last campaign of extermination against the operators is underway and it is succeeding. In the nature of design that there is more menial work than important work. Stonebraker and Dean are of the same profession, theoretically, and they're the ones designing engines and poo poo. We are mostly the windshield wiper backup redundant mechanism designers bob dobbs is dead fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Oct 19, 2019 |
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Oct 19, 2019 04:23
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stuffed crust punk posted:i had an interview today that i think went well, but drat do i hate whiteboarding just practice all the kinds of problems out there and it’ll become almost rote. trade time for space or use a well known data structure and that’s the optimization for like 90% of problems you’ll get. optimize in the pseudo code or even better the writing out examples manually stage of working the problem. ctci has a repeatable set of steps for working problems that’s very good. personally I tend to freeze up worse when making changes to whiteboard code with real syntax
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Oct 19, 2019 04:35
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CMYK BLYAT! posted:both problems can and do exist. to it is a car analogy things, hiring programmers is basically hiring drivers, with some combination of disqualifying candidates because either: forgetting the car analogy third complaint of "gently caress you i wont spend a handful of hours doing a driving test FOR FREE pigs!"
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Oct 19, 2019 05:42
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CMYK BLYAT! posted:both problems can and do exist. to it is a car analogy things, hiring programmers is basically hiring drivers, with some combination of disqualifying candidates because either: IME on the interviewer side, 2/5 are someone claiming to have spent 2-4 years in driving school and/or 1+ years professional driving experience (and one time, a PhD in driving and years of teaching driver's ed), but they either fail to be able to whiteboard how to drive to the mailbox 2 blocks away, or they pass the whiteboard but their first month is mostly spent driving on the sidewalk yelling on the radio about admiralty court law
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Oct 19, 2019 07:21
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i did a phone screen with google. they initially reached out based on something that was very niche and right in my wheelhouse based on my corpus of work, so i gave it a shot after the hiring manager spoke w/ me about the project and said i wouldn’t have to worry about toy coding problems from some 23 year old stanford grad. the phone screen was mostly into the weeds on the differences between tls 1.2 and 1.3, network security arcana, and other level 2 network security stuff. there was only one question adjacent to my space, and it was on the risks and limitations of bearer tokens. recruiter said the role had shifted from my speciality to some sort of network role between the time i spoke to the hiring manager and did the phone interview. oh well, not torn up about it, but that seems like an odd thing to do.
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Oct 19, 2019 23:12
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what team were you interviewing for? sounds like maybe mine or one of our sister teams
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Oct 20, 2019 00:06
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:there are books about this extremely specific topic thanks?
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Oct 20, 2019 00:35
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Janitor Prime posted:Maybe for companies stuck maintaining poo poo from the 2000s but this decade has been all about the JS frontends (Angular, React, Vue, Ember, Backbone). If you want to do any web poo poo and you don't have knowledge of any of those then I'd expect what Ferr is running into as the norm. this decade as in the last 4 maybe 5 years, 2009 jquery was very much standard I'm not saying you're wrong but web moves fast reacts only been around since late 2013 and nobody was using it back at initial release
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Oct 20, 2019 00:42
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it comes across a bit like the job ads asking for >5 years of professional react experience mandatory
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Oct 20, 2019 00:53
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Private Speech posted:this decade as in the last 4 maybe 5 years, 2009 jquery was very much standard it may surprise you to know that 2009 was 10 years ago
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Oct 20, 2019 01:03
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Progressive JPEG posted:it may surprise you to know that 2009 was 10 years ago right, but nobody was using react in say 2012 either, seeing as it literally did not exist e: then again I work in embedded so my perspective might be a bit skewed Private Speech fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Oct 20, 2019 |
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Oct 20, 2019 01:45
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over half my job contacts are through agency recruiters. if i tell them (truthfully) that i was using anything other than react or spring boot in my most recent jobs, they will "hold onto my resume" every single time. it's nothing but a keyword matching operation for them. fyi I have tried lying and I did land a job that way, and although I've taken and kept jobs for whch I lacked qualifications in the past, I didn't know how to keep that one.
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Oct 20, 2019 20:04
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Gazpacho posted:over half my job contacts are through agency recruiters. if i tell them (truthfully) that i was using anything other than react or spring boot in my most recent jobs, they will "hold onto my resume" every single time. it's nothing but a keyword matching operation for them. duh? has anyone in this thread ever, ever suggested otherwise? recruiters often don't even look at the skills section of the resume, they will just match based on your previous job title. they literally spend <5s on a resume also agency recruiters are often practically useless. they are bottom feeders trying to salvage dreck (of course you have also repeatedly discussed how you are a garbage candidate and refuse to change your approach, so maybe that is how you have ended up so desperate you talk to bottom feeders)
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Oct 21, 2019 02:50
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i'm not in the habit of looking to internet people to verify firsthand observations, so it doesn't matter whether anyone has said otherwise it wasn't always like this, up until 2009 i could find work without an exact skill match, even through agencies you can put me on ignore if you want
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Oct 21, 2019 03:18
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Gazpacho posted:i'm not in the habit of looking to internet people to verify firsthand observations, so it doesn't matter whether anyone has said otherwise Recruiters have literally zero idea what jQuery is, they are told by the hiring manager "get us candidates with these skills" and that's what they look for. Also agency recruiters have always been wholesale garbage just picking any meat from the bone that they can.
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Oct 21, 2019 04:38
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say what you will about faang hiring, but they don’t really give a poo poo what tech stack you’ve used ‘cause you won’t be using it any more after onboarding they kinda care about languages, but only kinda. I did my interviews in a language that my company does not use in any meaningful way
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Oct 21, 2019 04:47
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Achmed Jones posted:say what you will about faang hiring, but they don’t really give a poo poo what tech stack you’ve used ‘cause you won’t be using it any more after onboarding it's not just faang it's every big company that grows weird internal poo poo over time the earlier they computerized, the more poo poo they have lurking
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Oct 21, 2019 05:03
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some of the weirdest poo poo is in niches you wouldn't expect ikea is the biggest openvms user on the planet, so far as i know every payroll check in america is printed by systems running on os/400 (popular in the 1990s), because the top two vendors both migrated to os/400 in the early 90s every grocery store nationwide has legacy usage of hp-ux because an old-time grocery statistics aggregator was built on hp-ux people expect weird internals and banks and faang but like, there is a lot of old, weird poo poo out there and they gotta hire like everybody else
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Oct 21, 2019 05:07
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buttchugging adderall posted:...I would very much focus on "can learn to read esoteric bullshit written by somebody else" as an immensely useful job skill. Just gonna quote this part right here for emphasis.
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Oct 21, 2019 05:33
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buttchugging adderall posted:My work still deploys coldfusion. Although we are pretty close to killing it. this is what every CF user has said for 10+ years
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Oct 21, 2019 05:41
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I came to learn last week that management will probably tell me to move to an office in another city with a significant CoL increase. this will be without any bump or relocation assistance or anything. seeing as I don't want to live in this other city at all, and there are some glaring danger signs anyway, I'm now on the job hunt again. but since I'm still green I figured I might ask more experienced people here: am I out of line for hoping for anything at all if I'm told to move from one office to another? seems lovely to not offer anything at all and I'm essentially taking a significant pay cut
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Oct 21, 2019 14:45
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If there's a CoL increase, and no predefined salary grids (unions or otherwise), then you should definitely ask for a raise for the move there. Relocation assistance would be the bare minimum. Not because it's well seen or not, but because if you don't, you're essentially saying you're fine taking a wage drop to go live to a place you don't want to move to. They're treating you like a fungible cog in the machine, and this on its own tells a lot. I would personally consider this a "soft-firing" of the kind you've seen in businesses that suddenly go "remote employees have to move or quit."
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Oct 21, 2019 14:48
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Under no circumstances would I personally allow my employer to dictate to me what city I live in unless it was aligned with my own personal goals. You are correct to start a job hunt.
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Oct 21, 2019 15:03
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MononcQc posted:They're treating you like a fungible cog in the machine, and this on its own tells a lot. I would personally consider this a "soft-firing" of the kind you've seen in businesses that suddenly go "remote employees have to move or quit." I'm curious about stories of those soft firings. Like what is the actual case-law / settlements of someone refusing to do so and operating as remote? I assume at some point the company calls it job abandonment, and the person applies for unemployment calling it a dismissal but would love to read about how it actually shakes out.
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Oct 21, 2019 15:24
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Hughlander posted:I'm curious about stories of those soft firings. Like what is the actual case-law / settlements of someone refusing to do so and operating as remote? I assume at some point the company calls it job abandonment, and the person applies for unemployment calling it a dismissal but would love to read about how it actually shakes out. at least in the us there's no regulation around that and the employee would not be eligible for unemployment as far as I know one of my first jobs moved everybody like 40 minutes with traffic south and just said "deal with it" another place the foreign ceo [who had apparently never seen actual bay area traffic] was going to move the whole office from sf to redwood shores [an hour in a car, 2 hours on publc transit] then threw a tantrum when an internal survey said over half the company said they'd quit and rented an extremely lovely office in that is now the zynga building then moved everyone anyway a year later
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Oct 21, 2019 16:41
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Thanks everyone, good to know that I'm not out of line. Now the fun part: to see if I can swing a new job before needing to leave this oneMononcQc posted:They're treating you like a fungible cog in the machine, and this on its own tells a lot. I would personally consider this a "soft-firing" of the kind you've seen in businesses that suddenly go "remote employees have to move or quit." This is the part that sucks the most!!
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Oct 21, 2019 16:58
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Sleng Teng posted:I came to learn last week that management will probably tell me to move to an office in another city with a significant CoL increase. this will be without any bump or relocation assistance or anything. I had this happen to me. I told them to shove it and got a job somewhere else in the same new city that was willing to pay what the local cost of living deserved.
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Oct 21, 2019 19:08
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