|
Human Tornada posted:Aren't most marriages mutually beneficial e.g. I love and want to spend my life with my partner and she feels the same way? Didn't you get the memo? The two consenting adults in question now must front up to a judiciary and explain themselves, apparently.
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 12:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 09:28 |
|
|
Nah you guys are right, these star crossed lovers just found their soulful connection to one another, and there is no possibility that a dude like 50 years older than this woman could have possibly groomed or otherwise manipulated her into believing something that isn’t really true. She’s a CONSENTING ADULT which the only thing that matters in these situations. Historically older men in Hollywood have never brandished their power and authority to get what they want or to present their young beautiful girlfriends as trophies, and they certainly never use them as status symbols to cement their ongoing desirability. It’s just a totally normal and not at all perfect example of the misogynistic culture of Hollywood in which men can and should last forever, perpetually hooking up with the youngest and most attractive woman until their bones literally rot and they can only bang their young starlets via a robotic exo-skeleton (A Sexo-Skeleton, if you will).
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 13:09
|
|
|
Bust Rodd posted:Nah you guys are right, these star crossed lovers just found their soulful connection to one another, and there is no possibility that a dude like 50 years older than this woman could have possibly groomed or otherwise manipulated her into believing something that isn’t really true. She’s a CONSENTING ADULT which the only thing that matters in these situations. Historically older men in Hollywood have never brandished their power and authority to get what they want or to present their young beautiful girlfriends as trophies, and they certainly never use them as status symbols to cement their ongoing desirability. It’s just a totally normal and not at all perfect example of the misogynistic culture of Hollywood in which men can and should last forever, perpetually hooking up with the youngest and most attractive woman until their bones literally rot and they can only bang their young starlets via a robotic exo-skeleton (A Sexo-Skeleton, if you will). Then of course she'll leave him for the sexoskeleton.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 13:15
|
|
|
Vagabundo posted:Didn't you get the memo? The two consenting adults in question now must front up to a judiciary and explain themselves, apparently. Again, this thread is not a court of law.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 13:16
|
|
|
Bust Rodd posted:Nah you guys are right, these star crossed lovers just found their soulful connection to one another, and there is no possibility that a dude like 50 years older than this woman could have possibly groomed or otherwise manipulated her into believing something that isn’t really true. She’s a CONSENTING ADULT which the only thing that matters in these situations. Historically older men in Hollywood have never brandished their power and authority to get what they want or to present their young beautiful girlfriends as trophies, and they certainly never use them as status symbols to cement their ongoing desirability. It’s just a totally normal and not at all perfect example of the misogynistic culture of Hollywood in which men can and should last forever, perpetually hooking up with the youngest and most attractive woman until their bones literally rot and they can only bang their young starlets via a robotic exo-skeleton (A Sexo-Skeleton, if you will). So if I understand your point: It's creepy because he's so old and obviously groomed her and there's a bad power dynamic and blah blah blah It isn't at all that he wants a young wife and she wants to enjoy a few years not having to worry about money at all and this is just mutually beneficial with them both using each other
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 14:08
|
|
|
Len posted:So if I understand your point: Your second example is also creepy.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 14:13
|
|
|
Lumbermouth posted:Your second example is also creepy. Yeah but it makes a lot more sense than he groomed her. My college newspaper was printing articles about how students were using seekingarrangements.com to find a sugar daddy in 2011 so they could afford books and tuition. It's 2019 and she's a PHD student marrying a rich actor seems like a much better way to get rid of student loan debt
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 14:44
|
|
|
Bust Rodd posted:Nah you guys are right, these star crossed lovers just found their soulful connection to one another, and there is no possibility that a dude like 50 years older than this woman could have possibly groomed or otherwise manipulated her into believing something that isn’t really true. She’s a CONSENTING ADULT which the only thing that matters in these situations. Historically older men in Hollywood have never brandished their power and authority to get what they want or to present their young beautiful girlfriends as trophies, and they certainly never use them as status symbols to cement their ongoing desirability. It’s just a totally normal and not at all perfect example of the misogynistic culture of Hollywood in which men can and should last forever, perpetually hooking up with the youngest and most attractive woman until their bones literally rot and they can only bang their young starlets via a robotic exo-skeleton (A Sexo-Skeleton, if you will). You just sound like a nutter now.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 15:02
|
|
LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Again, this thread is not a court of law. No, it's the thread about sexual assault in Hollywood, so either bring some proof of Quaid doing bad or gently caress off with your gossip poo poo
|
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 15:13
|
|
|
I feel like trying to normalize the idea that women are using men as ATMs that they have to sleep with in order to cover their expenses is also a bad thing, but I’m also not accusing Dennis Quaid of anything other than transparently wanting a very young and pretty woman to have sex with and make him seem more enticing and youthful. Whether or not you think one or both of those things is bad is personal and I certainly don’t have any moral high ground to claim.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 15:22
|
|
|
Harvey Weinstein appears at an event for young actors, women who speak out are escorted from the premises: barely any comments here Someone observes that an old guy dating a young woman is creepy: everyone rushes in to shout NO over multiple pages
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 18:42
|
|
|
Bust Rodd posted:I feel like trying to normalize the idea that women are using men as ATMs that they have to sleep with in order to cover their expenses is also a bad thing, but I’m also not accusing Dennis Quaid of anything other than transparently wanting a very young and pretty woman to have sex with and make him seem more enticing and youthful. Whether or not you think one or both of those things is bad is personal and I certainly don’t have any moral high ground to claim. Just baffling that your perception of this actual marriage is "he wants a young and pretty woman to have sex with" Becausr obviously that is the only way he is able to make that happen.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 20:47
|
|
|
Bust Rodd posted:I feel like trying to normalize the idea that women are using men as ATMs that they have to sleep with in order to cover their expenses is also a bad thing, but I’m also not accusing Dennis Quaid of anything other than transparently wanting a very young and pretty woman to have sex with and make him seem more enticing and youthful. Whether or not you think one or both of those things is bad is personal and I certainly don’t have any moral high ground to claim. And yet you were demanding that she be publicly interrogated about the relationship, as if it's anyone else's business. Totally not the kind of thing someone desperate to claim any sort of moral high ground would do.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 21:58
|
|
|
The last few pages are pretty strong evidence we should just stick to sexual assault in this thread.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 22:01
|
|
|
Steve Yun posted:The last few pages are pretty strong evidence we should just stick to sexual assault in this thread. I agree, I think the Quaid thing is weird and creepy and originally would have thought an okay thing to bring up here because it speaks to the general ageist/misogynist culture of Hollywood even if no one in that particular relationship is doing anything untoward. But it definitely isn't worth what just happened.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 22:04
|
|
|
i mean, if i was going to sum up my reaction to it, it's that it does look suspect, but imposing our judgements on a woman (we've all but accused her of being a prostitute) for her choice of relationships with a complete disinterest in any evidence beyond the surface level is not the same thing as empowering the voices of victims of abuse. the only voice being empowered is our own, flaunting the very irrelevance of her voice in the face of our ability to know better than her based on abstract principles. would the suspicions in this thread bear out with evidence? it doesn't matter, because she doesn't matter to anyone in this thread, there is a complete disinterest in anything other than our abstract right to judge her. it is a celebration of our power over her, for her own good. Hodgepodge fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Oct 27, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 22:55
|
|
|
Can we all agree this is a McDonalds and talk about Weinstein
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 22:59
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:Can we all agree this is a McDonalds and talk about Weinstein The new Weinstein Burger seems like a bit of an odd marketing choice on McD's part, come to think about it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 23:03
|
|
|
Hodgepodge posted:i mean, if i was going to sum up my reaction to it, it's that it does look suspect, but imposing our judgements on a woman (we've all but accused her of being a prostitute) for her choice of relationships with a complete disinterest in any evidence beyond the surface level is not the same thing as empowering the voices of victims of abuse. the only voice being empowered is our own, flaunting the very irrelevance of her voice in the face of our ability to know better than her based on abstract principles. lol
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 23:04
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:Can we all agree this is a McDonalds and talk about Weinstein He's bad and the whole situation is a disgusting display of power in the face of not only his victims, but the concept of morality itself. Guillotine. Oh, yeah. Yeah, a small fries with that please.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 23:04
|
|
|
Human Tornada posted:Aren't most marriages mutually beneficial e.g. I love and want to spend my life with my partner and she feels the same way? There's actual footage that TMZ captured years back of Jeff Goldblum asking for random women's phone numbers on the street. He has always been forward and plays it off as charm. This poo poo isn't surprising from him, but Nicole Cliffe is an idiot hack who was editor of the New York Post, so her tweets have no real value and she hasn't followed up with anything. That is why no one gave much of a poo poo. Bust Rodd posted:Nah you guys are right, these star crossed lovers just found their soulful connection to one another, and there is no possibility that a dude like 50 years older than this woman could have possibly groomed or otherwise manipulated her into believing something that isn’t really true. She’s a CONSENTING ADULT which the only thing that matters in these situations. Historically older men in Hollywood have never brandished their power and authority to get what they want or to present their young beautiful girlfriends as trophies, and they certainly never use them as status symbols to cement their ongoing desirability. It’s just a totally normal and not at all perfect example of the misogynistic culture of Hollywood in which men can and should last forever, perpetually hooking up with the youngest and most attractive woman until their bones literally rot and they can only bang their young starlets via a robotic exo-skeleton (A Sexo-Skeleton, if you will). gently caress it. I will say it. He wants to gently caress a young, hot blonde and keeps in good shape for his age. She wants money and can stomach loving him. Talking about grooming in these circumstances makes you sound like you're throwing terms around that you've heard before without knowing what they mean. Who gives a poo poo about this beyond scolds?
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 23:18
|
|
|
Vagabundo posted:And yet you were demanding that she be publicly interrogated about the relationship, as if it's anyone else's business. Totally not the kind of thing someone desperate to claim any sort of moral high ground would do. Since were tabling the Quaid discussion I just want to go on record saying that I never suggested an interrogation or a trial or anything like that, I said : “Nobody speaking up, or calling it out, or I dunno maybe interviewing the new Mrs. Quaid like “how’d you guys meet, what are your interests, what do you have in common?” that sort of stuff.” which I guess was a poorly worded way of saying “Boy I’d sure love to hear her perspective on this”. It’s really crazy how far hearing her side of things would go towards assuaging any fears I have about the nature of their relationship. On one hand it’s none of my business, but on the other hand it felt relevant to lots of conversations we have had in this thread RE misogyny and the intersection of sexism and ageism. But I never advocated for her having to justify her feelings to anyone, I’d just love more information than the clickbait headline of a tweet.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 23:59
|
|
|
we should stomp his balls in fact
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 00:03
|
|
|
We'll start an inquiry to look into any evidence of a quiad pro quo.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 00:12
|
|
|
Ma'am, is this man bothering you?
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 00:14
|
|
|
looks like quaid really started the reactor huh
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 00:22
|
|
|
Judakel posted:gently caress it. I will say it. He wants to gently caress a young, hot blonde and keeps in good shape for his age. She wants money and can stomach loving him. Talking about grooming in these circumstances makes you sound like you're throwing terms around that you've heard before without knowing what they mean. Who gives a poo poo about this beyond scolds? you sound like a healthy well-adjusted individual and so do they
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 00:59
|
|
|
Unoriginal Name posted:you sound like a healthy well-adjusted individual and so do they Like I said: a scold.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 01:01
|
|
|
DC Murderverse posted:i can't believe harvey weinstein can go places without getting spat on or punched or whatever I mean, just watch that video and you can see it happening. Or read this thread. It's full of great examples too. Wendell posted:Right on, Bust Rodd. Steve Yun posted:The last few pages are pretty strong evidence we should just stick to sexual assault in this thread. Alan Smithee posted:Can we all agree this is a McDonalds and talk about Weinstein This happens in every discussion about race, gender, sexual orientation, disability, etc. to the point that those in marginalized groups had to create their own Safe Spaces <gasp> just to loving talk to one-another about their experiences without being gaslit about them.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 01:21
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:This happens in every discussion about race, gender, sexual orientation, disability, etc. to the point that those in marginalized groups had to create their own Safe Spaces <gasp> just to loving talk to one-another about their experiences without being gaslit about them. And every one of those communities hates it when would-be allies outside of their community claim to speak for them while denying them any agency. Using race-based examples: https://medium.com/@TheReclaimed/woke-ing-well-the-difference-between-being-a-savior-and-being-an-ally-250289856d71 posted:These people, who happen to be somehow connected to the oppressing community, seeking out the chance to save those who are oppressed, usually without knowing, understanding, or belonging to that community. In addition, these are the folks who place themselves in the center of the narrative. These are people who somehow seek to dominate those whom they are supposed to be helping. They typically do not ask those whom they are helping anything about their communities, their needs, or even themselves. In this, they render themselves unneeded and unwanted. http://blackyouthproject.com/i-have-no-interest-in-white-allies/ posted:As a system, whiteness acts as an invisible elevator that lifts white voices floors above the Black voices that are most marginalized. This is the most harmful aspect of “white allyship.” In the white supremacist society we inhabit, it has the effect of de-prioritizing and de-centering the Black voices that are most affected in order to champion white voices that are deemed more palpable. This was the case in the #MeToo campaign, where issues that Black women have voiced for years have been met with little acknowledgement, if any, then saw those same movements co-opted by white women and pulled into the mainstream conversation. https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/03/the-white-savior-industrial-complex/254843/ posted:How, for example, could a well-meaning American "help" a place like Uganda today? It begins, I believe, with some humility with regards to the people in those places. It begins with some respect for the agency of the people of Uganda in their own lives. A great deal of work had been done, and continues to be done, by Ugandans to improve their own country, and ignorant comments (I've seen many) about how "we have to save them because they can't save themselves" can't change that fact. http://jxnpulse.com/2017/07/white-saviors-youre-wrong/ posted:You may not see it as a problem, but you are doing more harm than good. Another clue is when white people promise to “give” us a voice instead of helping African Americans use our voices. The job of an ally is to support and amplify the voices of the oppressed, not to decide what is best for them.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 02:43
|
|
|
Hodgepodge posted:The job of an ally is to support and amplify the voices of the oppressed, not to decide what is best for them.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 03:18
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:Which is why I was saying it's bad to shut the discussion down, so you're doing my arguing for me. I'm also a woman, but I don't think you really cared about your "only those who are oppressed can speak on that oppression" rhetoric beyond wanting to win an argument. I'm not really interested in telling people what should be on-topic for the thread, which is why I'm still talking about the subject. It would also be really hypocritical if I were saying that only the oppressed can speak about oppression, since I'm... speaking about oppression. What I am saying is that claiming the right to speak for someone is claiming power for oneself. Whereas in most of these cases, there is a victim who is speaking out, that isn't the case here. Instead, there is someone who has made a decision and our interest is in interrogating her capacity for agency and the legitimacy of her motives. That comes with a lot of baggage, since we seem to feel comfortable suggesting that this woman is literally equivalent to a child, unable to make a very personal decision for herself, or that her motives must be entirely mercenary. I'm not saying that we shouldn't discuss this, I'm saying that the discussion has revealed that we are quite capable of being incredibly patronizing and misogynistic when discussing it. Hodgepodge fucked around with this message at 03:53 on Oct 28, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 03:50
|
|
|
Hodgepodge posted:I'm not really interested in telling people what should be on-topic for the thread, which is why I'm still talking about the subject. Don't answer. I know why.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 03:52
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:Then why in god's name did you quote my post about how we shouldn't shut the discussion down, then argued that point with like six pages of cherry-picked bullshit that had nothing to do with anything we're talking about? Mostly because the discussion so far has been driven by mostly dudes who have only gone beyond the superficial observation that the age gap is suspect to question a woman's capacity for agency and the moral character of her motives. So I think that calling this a safe space for discussion of the topic in danger of being shut down is giving us way, way too much credit. The discussion itself has already been pretty gross. Hodgepodge fucked around with this message at 04:24 on Oct 28, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 04:21
|
|
|
Bust Rodd posted:Since were tabling the Quaid discussion I just want to go on record saying that I never suggested an interrogation or a trial or anything like that, I said : You're right. It is none of your loving business what the nature of their relationship is, and it's not her obligation to "assuage" your fears or your apparent assumption that she's incapable of having any sort of agency in the matter.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 04:49
|
|
|
Gentlemen, I can hear your axes grinding.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 05:27
|
|
|
Just to maybe send this is a better direction: maybe she doesn't have to be a victim for high-profile marriages like this to be a bad thing in the context of Hollywood. Like trying to find info on this, I have found out a great deal about the engagement ring which is evidently older than most of the countries we're posting from. Because the media really wants to tell me about how old that ring is. While there are issues around criticizing the marriage itself, there are really good reasons to criticize glamorizing a marriage with this sort of age disparity. Especially on the basis of the implicit legitimacy conferred by expensive antique jewelry.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 05:41
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:Gentlemen, I can hear your axes grinding. Yes, that must be it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 07:03
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:It's not just money. It's the fact that he's a man, and most men I've met sympathize with the rapist first in every story about rape they've ever heard. LividLiquid posted:Gentlemen, I can hear your axes grinding. gently caress off. This sort of hysterical bullshit, and the smug decision that women in their late twenties shouldn't be allowed agency, don't help anything. You just smear poo poo on the struggles of others to make yourself feel superior. You're not even an ally. You're a moth trying to bathe yourself in someone else's light. For gently caress sake, you're accusing anyone who disagrees with you of supporting rapists. You witless parody of a Tumblr account. You absolute shambles. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 11:34 on Oct 28, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 11:27
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 09:28 |
|
|
I feel like you can make whatever point you’re trying to make without resorting to calling a woman ‘hysterical’ in a thread specifically about sexual assault.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 12:54
|
|