|
anilEhilated posted:The parts of TtH not related to the Andii and Coral blow, though. That blows too. Just a bunch of guys wallowing in their self pity.
|
#
?
Oct 26, 2019 20:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 10:11 |
|
|
Toll the Hounds definitely improves on a re-read. If only because you know to skip all the Harllo sections.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2019 20:07
|
|
|
I liked the Harllo story - I found it pretty touching, albeit in a mostly depressing Eriksonesque way (though the happy-ish pay-off with Stonny at the end gave me wonderful warm feels). On the contrary I found the Tiste Andii bits only OK - the whole Dying God thing felt like a weird red herring, even in a series which generally makes a strength out such things. It was satisfying to see some comeuppance for Clip the Douche, though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 10:59
|
|
|
The Harllo bit kinda bug me. When he gets abducted it seems like he's been gone a couple of days at most, but when we cut to him it seems like he's been in the mines a long time.
Alhazred fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Oct 28, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 12:31
|
|
|
Alhazred posted:The Harllo bit kinda bug me. When gets abducted it seems like he's been gone a couple of days at most, but when we cut to him ut seems like he's been in the mines a long time.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 14:24
|
|
|
TtH also has Karsa being weirdly friendly to everybody during the Ultimate Showdown of Ultimate Destiny, which is wonderful. He gives pep-talks!
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 14:36
|
|
|
I mean does it even make sense for Harllo to be five years old in the first place?
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 14:49
|
|
|
It does not. Also doesn't make sense for Fiddler to be younger in the GotM prologue than the MoI flashback. Or for Grubb and Fiddler to age like ten years over the course of the Bonehunters various campaigns while everyone else stays about the same, and Sinn maybe loses a few years. Or Karsa's kids to be teenagers. Or for Deadsmell to have been born during the conquest of Quon Tali during the founding of the Empire. Or for Tattersail to be a teenager while she's shacked up with Mock, when she should be about a century old. Or for the Seguleh second to have been "missing" for millennia. But Kellanved's Reach implies that the Empire is only like 30 years old, so we're pretty clearly not meant to give a gently caress about precise chronologies.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 15:17
|
|
|
The emotional payoff of the Harllo subplot was one of the best in the entire series for me, right up there with "I lost her!" and Beak
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 15:22
|
|
|
Harlo had me up to tears. Had to close the book, say drat and think on a lot of stuff.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 15:35
|
|
|
Hanavat letting Rutt hold her baby is always my put the book away for a bit moment.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2019 19:04
|
|
|
Oh Snapple! posted:Hanavat letting Rutt hold her baby is always my put the book away for a bit moment. The snake storyline is really grueling, but has several really excellent payoffs, this one in particular.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2019 18:58
|
|
|
Strom Cuzewon posted:But Kellanved's Reach implies that the Empire is only like 30 years old, so we're pretty clearly not meant to give a gently caress about precise chronologies. I suppose you could argue that (TCG spoilers) if Kaminsod is the narrator for the series, that he's as unreliable a narrator as Krupp or Gallan and just ignore Esselmont's books.
|
|
#
?
Oct 30, 2019 00:03
|
|
|
It’s stated somewhere (or maybe I imagined it idk) that the start date of the empire is Kellenved’s birth date (birth of an emperor/empire kind of thing).
|
|
#
?
Oct 30, 2019 15:04
|
|
|
I'm about 3/4 through Bonehunters. Is there any fan-art depicting the Trolbarahl that anyone can link? Having a hard time picturing it, he gives only sparse descriptions of it. I think Kalam may have been describing it as "lizard cats" when it was getting chased by the hounds, unless I missed something. Nothing on the spoiler free fan art section of the Malazan wiki (it's risky to look at those anyway). I just don't want to google anything of course.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 22:29
|
|
|
i choose to believe the trohlbarahl is the same thingy as the pack
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 01:02
|
|
|
Finished Reaper's Gale this morning. Really enjoyed it, I found it consistently engaging, with the slight exception of the Awl/Redmask story which I feel like didn't quite land for me. I just don't think I felt the Awl as a people as well as I did when, say, the Edur culture/society was first introduced. I also found myself getting many of the various Letherii politicos confused early on - like Karos and Rautos, Tanal and Triban. A lot of really emotionally charged scenes Trull, Toc, Beak ;_; One thing I found myself thinking about afterwards was something one of the Bonehunters had a line about. Whether Adjunct Tavore was a military genius or not. If she should be historically considered alongside Dujek, Coltaine etc. And I was thinking about it, and in a lot of ways I think she is the embodiment of Cold Iron, especially in respect to Malazan military doctrine. She is always listening to those around her. She is calculated and unemotional on the surface, but inspires incredible loyalty. We know from earlier books that she was a very serious student of Malazan military history and strategy, so I don't think the success of using the marines to invade Lethera was a fluke. Its commented on several times that that is what Kellanved established them for, and Tavore knew that the Bonehunters had been hardened by Y'Ghatan, and knew she had some extremely competent sergeants in Fiddler, Hellian, etc. At the end of the day she is still very young, with now two campaigns under her belt, so no she may not be a Dassem or Nok... yet, but just give it a little more time and I bet she'll be mentioned alongside all those old guard commanders.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 11:47
|
|
|
Hocus Pocus posted:
Tavore invaded a country she didn't know for a reason she got wrong. This lead to things like the troops attacking two retired demons who lived peacefully on a farm. The reason she was successful was not her own but that the Edur didn't have the ability or interest to keep the Lether empire together.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 13:44
|
|
|
I love how Hellian is listed in Hocus Pocus's post as a "competent" sergeant, and how even though she is barely ever not utterly piss drunk, hardly ever seems to know exactly where she is or what's going on, or even is able to distinguish between her two corporals or ascertain that there actually are two, that is still an accurate description of her.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2019 00:41
|
|
|
OneSizeFitsAll posted:I love how Hellian is listed in Hocus Pocus's post as a "competent" sergeant, and how even though she is barely ever not utterly piss drunk, hardly ever seems to know exactly where she is or what's going on, or even is able to distinguish between her two corporals or ascertain that there actually are two, that is still an accurate description of her. Conquering an empire one tavern at a time, baaabyyyyyy When every I finished a Malazan book I read one or two other books as a palate cleanser, just because they're such a time commitment. But hearing that Toll the Hounds is a bit different in style, and more divisive, actually makes me want to start it straight away. Hocus Pocus fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Nov 3, 2019 |
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2019 01:14
|
|
|
OneSizeFitsAll posted:I love how Hellian is listed in Hocus Pocus's post as a "competent" sergeant, and how even though she is barely ever not utterly piss drunk, hardly ever seems to know exactly where she is or what's going on, or even is able to distinguish between her two corporals or ascertain that there actually are two, that is still an accurate description of her. Hellian was the one who figured out how to get the people of Lether on the malazans' side. She also seems competent because her squad have to fight that much harder because they're lead by a drunken idiot.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2019 09:41
|
|
|
OneSizeFitsAll posted:I love how Hellian is listed in Hocus Pocus's post as a "competent" sergeant, and how even though she is barely ever not utterly piss drunk, hardly ever seems to know exactly where she is or what's going on, or even is able to distinguish between her two corporals or ascertain that there actually are two, that is still an accurate description of her. She also [Bonehunters spoilers] managed to track down and That's probably Eriksson having a bit of fun with the whole 'luck of the drunk' thing - since I doubt Oponn would favour two people in the same army - but you could make a case that she's a bit like Fiddler. Well, not an adept, but a little sensitive to magic-y stuff.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2019 10:44
|
|
|
I drive a BBW posted:It’s stated somewhere (or maybe I imagined it idk) that the start date of the empire is Kellenved’s birth date (birth of an emperor/empire kind of thing). one of the things ive seen mentioned is that while this is true, they do start the empire dating from Kellenved's bday - he is also lying about his birthday. As is evident from the prequel books, he pretends to be an old guy, but is really in his 20s-30s before the empire starts. so basically, see all of the above people mentioning that timelines arent meant to be be super strict.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 20:49
|
|
|
Just starting The Crippled God. Home stretch, baby! Loved Dust of Dreams. Some wonderful (and also some horrific) stuff in there.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 22:28
|
|
|
I just read these and I have no idea what happened.
|
|
#
?
Dec 2, 2019 19:08
|
|
|
Sokani posted:I just read these and I have no idea what happened. I'm on my 4th or 5th re-read and I think I finally understand everything that's going on.
|
|
#
?
Dec 2, 2019 19:39
|
|
|
I think I've done them all 3x and people still post connections in here that blow my mind
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2019 11:05
|
|
|
Had a thought the other day that the dragons that Fiddler's group see flying around in the Azath House are a bit of an anomaly, given what we learn about Eleint and Starvald Demelain being sealed later in the books.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2019 22:27
|
|
|
 oh steve
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2019 02:36
|
|
|
That isnt
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2019 20:38
|
|
|
Just finished Dust of Dreams and....the part with Hetan is just loving vile. First of all it's extremely gratuitous (Hetan isn't just raped, she's crippled, raped by two dozen men and turned into the tribe's sex slave). What makes it even worse is that it follows the pattern of Midnight Tides, a woman is raped so the male characters can get upset about it and swear revenge while the rape victim just wanders off and die without any agency. Steven Erikson tries to justify it with making it about patriarchy but that just feels wildly out of place, this is a book about armies of velociraptors and undead cro magnon men, not the Handmaid's Tale. It's an absolute low point of the entire series.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2019 17:46
|
|
|
Alhazred posted:Just finished Dust of Dreams and....the part with Hetan is just loving vile. First of all it's extremely gratuitous (Hetan isn't just raped, she's crippled, raped by two dozen men and turned into the tribe's sex slave). What makes it even worse is that it follows the pattern of Midnight Tides, a woman is raped so the male characters can get upset about it and swear revenge while the rape victim just wanders off and die without any agency. Steven Erikson tries to justify it with making it about patriarchy but that just feels wildly out of place, this is a book about armies of velociraptors and undead cro magnon men, not the Handmaid's Tale. It's an absolute low point of the entire series. Yes, that is a subplot about which people tend to have very strong feelings.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2019 22:09
|
|
|
Alhazred posted:Just finished Dust of Dreams and....the part with Hetan is just loving vile. First of all it's extremely gratuitous (Hetan isn't just raped, she's crippled, raped by two dozen men and turned into the tribe's sex slave). What makes it even worse is that it follows the pattern of Midnight Tides, a woman is raped so the male characters can get upset about it and swear revenge while the rape victim just wanders off and die without any agency. Steven Erikson tries to justify it with making it about patriarchy but that just feels wildly out of place, this is a book about armies of velociraptors and undead cro magnon men, not the Handmaid's Tale. It's an absolute low point of the entire series. That's not really how Erikson justifies that scene; his commentary can be found here: https://www.tor.com/2014/03/26/mala...#comment-427360 ...but yeah, I tend to skip the hell over that part on a reread and think it could have been not included without losing anything.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2019 22:28
|
|
|
ulmont posted:That's not really how Erikson justifies that scene; his commentary can be found here: https://www.tor.com/2014/03/26/mala...#comment-427360 That justifaction only makes it worse. If you're trying day something about the horrors of torture or subvert the noble savage myth then maybe not wrote something that seems like its taken from Cannibal Holocaust. Alhazred fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Dec 12, 2019 |
|
#
?
Dec 12, 2019 12:48
|
|
|
An off-screen [anything] wouldn't be as appalling as actually reading it happen is. I mean, this is a series that - prior to the hobbling - has scenes where Duiker sees the aftermath of a Whirlwind uprising (babies on spits and women strangled with their own intestines); Karsa lopping off that slaver(forgot his name)'s arms and legs; the Tenescowri and what happens to the Prince Jelarkan of Capustan... All awful things, all arguably as bad or worse than what happens to Hetan, but the first and third happen off-screen, while the second happens to someone who's simply a massive oval office. I dunno, I get what Eriksson was trying to do. I don't like it, but I'm not supposed to.
|
|
#
?
Dec 12, 2019 20:01
|
|
|
I loathed reading it the first time. I skipped it the second time. I read Erikson's explanation for it a while back, but that doesn't make it any different for me--I'm still never going to read that section again.
|
|
#
?
Dec 12, 2019 20:04
|
|
|
I can't fault his reasons for it, but I don't think it landed. Especially with how it wraps up. God I hate having to be an apologist for how rapey fantasy is.
|
|
#
?
Dec 12, 2019 22:51
|
|
|
kingturnip posted:An off-screen [anything] wouldn't be as appalling as actually reading it happen is. Same. That scene was so intense, the part where she looks up and sees her old 'friends' still gives me the chills.
|
|
#
?
Dec 13, 2019 00:29
|
|
|
Similarly is Stonnys rape. I get the intention - that trauma can lead you to shut people out, that accepting help and compassion can feel like weakness - but I don't think the narrative supports it. Especially as in MoI her rape is mostly a motivation for Gruntle, and it takes 5 more books before we see her take on it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 13, 2019 00:39
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 10:11 |
|
|
Strom Cuzewon posted:Similarly is Stonnys rape. I get the intention - that trauma can lead you to shut people out, that accepting help and compassion can feel like weakness - but I don't think the narrative supports it. Especially as in MoI her rape is mostly a motivation for Gruntle, and it takes 5 more books before we see her take on it. But we don't really see her take on it. In Toll the Hounds it's mainly the male characters who talk about Stonny and even then they mostly talk about how she shouldn't be so sad and be a better mother.
|
|
#
?
Dec 13, 2019 08:01
|
|