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Delthalaz posted:I think I would have been much more satisfied with the season if they had told us what the deal actually is with the drat planet. It's just as mysterious now as it was in the first episode. Instead, we end with asteroids hurtling toward earth from the B-plot. Whole season spoilers: The entire "planet" is a massive structure that life grew over after the builders died off. The chain of islands were the tops of reactors, the moons were defense satellites, and the buildings sticking out of the ground were just the tops of massive skyscrapers. Edit: Oh, you want to know WHAT the machines were for? Good luck figuring that out. This was a species that fought a war against something whose bullets look like giant holes in reality. Humans don't have the context to understand a lot of what these civilizations are doing. Anonymous Zebra fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Dec 15, 2019 |
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Dec 15, 2019 00:15
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Anonymous Zebra posted:Whole season spoilers: The entire "planet" is a massive structure that life grew over after the builders died off. The chain of islands were the tops of reactors, the moons were defense satellites, and the buildings sticking out of the ground were just the tops of massive skyscrapers. goddamn i'm still amused that the after the superreactor superexploded that the protomolecule decided the best way to prevent this was to simply ban fusion
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Dec 15, 2019 00:32
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logikv9 posted:goddamn i'm still amused that the after the superreactor superexploded that the protomolecule decided the best way to prevent this was to simply ban fusion It built an electric fence out of moons and a pocket universe It had mad skills.
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Dec 15, 2019 00:37
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piL posted:They were harnessing planets for energy. Protomolecule creators were a Kardashev 1 civilization; likely past that. I'm no book reader, but I think that the protomolecule civ was probably 2-ish on Kardashev and got deadass curb stomped by a IV or V (depending on if that civ was in this universe or a multiverse/alternate dimension) civ that they peeked in on or otherwise agitated. But, like, really: If this all happened a billion plus years ago why should we be worried that the proto-civ squashers are still alive either?! 
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Dec 15, 2019 01:06
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End of season. The "eye of an angry god" thing is pretty interesting when you consider how Holden describes what he saw in season 3. He says the protomolecule race was trying to kill something they couldn't understand. When you take into account that Miller couldn't even see what it was, he could only sense an absence. Whatever the other race was, they invented a weapon that the protomolecule couldn't see, maybe the PM race couldn't see it either. All they see is things going dark for no reason with no way to figure out why. So they just start vaporizing star systems they think are being attacked. I wouldn't be surprised if they wiped themselves out through paranoia of one of these weapons being hidden in various systems, so they just start guessing.
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Dec 15, 2019 01:15
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Full season: The books make it clear that the alien facility on Ilus was basically a giant logistics station (replete with TRAINS) Also kind of pissed that they went full on asteroids for the rocks that Marco launches, its incredibly stupid. In the books they're like 2 meter x 4 meter slabs of tungsten
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Dec 15, 2019 01:17
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I'm gonna need an Amos gif of when he goes crazy eyes after Murtry punches him, thanks and protomolecule bless. Edit: Phi230 posted:
The tungsten is the small attack on Callisto, not the other one. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 01:22 on Dec 15, 2019 |
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Dec 15, 2019 01:19
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Grand Fromage posted:I'm gonna need an Amos gif of when he goes crazy eyes after Murtry punches him, thanks and protomolecule bless. I'm also disappointed there was no Callisto attack, but I'm pretty sure that Amos states he thinks they were Tungsten slabs
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Dec 15, 2019 01:50
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Phi230 posted:I'm also disappointed there was no Callisto attack, but I'm pretty sure that Amos states he thinks they were Tungsten slabs Book 5 stuff: "While Amos is in the waiting room to see Clarissa Mao, the news reports that an asteroid hit somewhere in North Africa, causing tremendous damage. Guards take Amos to Clarissa's underground cell, and he tells her about all that has happened with the Roci since they dropped her off. In the middle of his story, the place goes on lockdown. A guard tells them that multiple other accelerated rocks have impacted around the globe, causing massive destruction worldwide. The rocks were undetected because they were hidden with stealth coating." I haven't read the book recently (though, think I'm going to reread now) but that summary fits my memory of it.
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Dec 15, 2019 01:54
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Anonymous Zebra posted:Edit: Oh, you want to know WHAT the machines were for? Good luck figuring that out. This was a species that fought a war against something whose bullets look like giant holes in reality. Humans don't have the context to understand a lot of what these civilizations are doing. That makes sense; I guess because the protomolecule's development in the first three seemed to follow an easily-enough understood path that only got delayed/altered by external factors, it set my sights a little too high that everything would be laid out clear and obvious. Then again that's in hindsight, I suppose I shouldn't judge a whole trilogy's development by its first entry.
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Dec 15, 2019 01:54
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Phi230 posted:I'm also disappointed there was no Callisto attack, but I'm pretty sure that Amos states he thinks they were Tungsten slabs season 5: Amos was just reverse engineering the blast, But they say in the book the tungsten was used on calisto, It was a dry run for earth and they really didn't want to vaourize it. Rocksicles fucked around with this message at 02:06 on Dec 15, 2019 |
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Dec 15, 2019 02:03
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pixaal posted:Anna talks in great detail about her faith and crisis of faith during the third book while they are in the ring space. They kind of gloss over it in season 3. I'm talking more about the locust, plagues and floods.
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Dec 15, 2019 02:10
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gohmak posted:I'm talking more about the locust, plagues and floods. Bro i'm more than happy to jab religious stuff with a very sharp stick, but you are reaching a bit.
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Dec 15, 2019 02:26
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What was up with that hair-do of Fred Johnson -------------, anyway?
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Dec 15, 2019 02:51
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i didn't see it mentioned (or maybe i missed it) but there was a quick scene showing amos's quick dial list and one of the listings is "my best friend"
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Dec 15, 2019 03:53
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sheriff at the centre of the universe kickin' it in stolen property every medina station scene makes me giggle.
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Dec 15, 2019 04:13
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Grand Fromage posted:I'm gonna need an Amos gif of when he goes crazy eyes after Murtry punches him, thanks and protomolecule bless. Crazy eyes Amos is the best Amos
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Dec 15, 2019 05:16
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LegoMan posted:Crazy eyes Amos is the best Amos 
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Dec 15, 2019 05:26
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Saw the whole season, really enjoyed it. Season spoilers My biggest complaint was the manufactured drama at the beginning with Naomi thinking she can out grit a literal heart attack rather than tell any of her friends about it. And I know it's normal for the named characters to not wear helmets during a battle so you can recognize them, but you think they would make an exception when it's during a spaceship breaching with a high chance of losing pressure. Still some really minor nitpicks for a fun season.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:27
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counterfeitsaint posted:Saw the whole season, really enjoyed it. I don't think this was really all that manufactured. She wants to believe that she's toughing it out and if she just keeps pushing, she'll make it because of how tough she believes she is. The show even addresses this when Lucia mentions the other belters who said they could tough it out until they were dead and in the recycler the next day. People hide information like this all the time because they believe that they are the exception because they are the protagonist in their own personal story, and those bad things only happen to other people.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:36
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I wonder what moon inhabitants like Prax fall under in the wellwallah/beltalowda scale. You'd think they'd be somewhere in the middle, living in 0 < x < 1 gravity. Why don't they get cover songs. 
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Dec 15, 2019 05:39
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Prax was technically a belter, as seen in the scene where the belter stops him from following the inners. I've always wondered how the guy knew he was from the outer planets, because Prax looked the exact same as the inners.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:41
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Avasarala's outfits are still the best part of the show.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:41
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T-man posted:I wonder what moon inhabitants like Prax fall under in the wellwallah/beltalowda scale. You'd think they'd be somewhere in the middle, living in 0 < x < 1 gravity. Why don't they get cover songs. The Belters on Illus were from the same moon as Prax. They're considered Belters.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:42
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Realities of casting. There's no question who is a Belter as described in the books. I think he speaks in Belta to the guy earlier, though.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:42
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I kind of wish there was an animated version of this show so we could really get the exaggerated belters.
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Dec 15, 2019 05:44
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Bobby was my favorite character to pay attention to this season, and it’s weird because I didn’t care much for her for the entire second half of the third season.
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Dec 15, 2019 06:24
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Cojawfee posted:Prax was technically a belter, as seen in the scene where the belter stops him from following the inners. I've always wondered how the guy knew he was from the outer planets, because Prax looked the exact same as the inners. I had the same question when I watched that scene, and I think the answer is that, really, Prax should be over 6 feet tall and weirdly skinny from growing up on Ganymede. McSpanky posted:That makes sense; I guess because the protomolecule's development in the first three seemed to follow an easily-enough understood path that only got delayed/altered by external factors, it set my sights a little too high that everything would be laid out clear and obvious. Then again that's in hindsight, I suppose I shouldn't judge a whole trilogy's development by its first entry. Yeah, I compared this season's plot to a colony of ants discovering an oven. We're not going to understand what kind of crazy, planet-sized machine they built any more than ants could understand why the giant box burned them to death after a couple weeks. I get the feeling the PM creators would think it was crazy for people to consider living on the giant machine (except that the probably wouldn't think of us as people at all).
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Dec 15, 2019 06:40
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I felt that the Jeff Bezos dollars really paid off this season, some of the best sci fi imagery I recall seeing, some of the effects were really great if completely pointless, like the Roci landing filling the canyon with exhaust fumes (isn't it silly that the crew of the Roci have to exit from the top of the ship? I'd expect there to be a ground level lift). The comm consoles look great. emanresu tnuocca fucked around with this message at 07:10 on Dec 15, 2019 |
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Dec 15, 2019 07:03
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Phenotype posted:Yeah, I compared this season's plot to a colony of ants discovering an oven.. In the book Protomiller calls humans monkeys poking at a microwave.
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Dec 15, 2019 07:18
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emanresu tnuocca posted:I felt that the Jeff Bezos dollars really paid off this season, some of the best sci fi imagery I recall seeing, some of the effects were really great if completely pointless, like the Roci landing filling the canyon with exhaust fumes (isn't it silly that the crew of the Roci have to exit from the top of the ship? I'd expect there to be a ground level lift). i'd imagine that planetary landings are more of an afterthought / checkbox feature for a ship like the roci. it was pretty funny to see them always manage to find the perfect landing spot so that airlock/ramp was always at ground level tho.
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Dec 15, 2019 07:19
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There's another airlock down by the bottom of the ship I'm pretty sure that they've used in the past. I'm loath to bring up anything from the b**ks at all because I hate book discussions in tv show threads, but in the books they just land on their side which is far more realistic, but I can see how that might be a pain in the rear end for set builders.
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Dec 15, 2019 07:21
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Fun little detail (episode 9 spoiler): The little transport tube Holden uses has the same purple field effect that the Ring Station uses to steal the velocity from offending objects in Ring Space
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Dec 15, 2019 07:55
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The story about the “other” alien race vs the Protomolecule race is pretty cool and reminds me a lot of The Three Body Problem series by Cixin Liu. In the second book, the Dark Forest (awesome sci-fi theory on why we haven’t yet made contact with alien races ourselves yet, btw) an extremely advanced alien race fires a weapon that catastrophically destroys our solar system. It isn’t some crazy super nuke though, just an infinitesimal thin strand of wire that forces the 3 dimensional nature of our space time to collapse in on itself into 2D, taking all life as we know it with it. It’s insanely cool and almost impossible for our monkey brains to conceptualize. Before that aliens simply wiped out hostile solar systems by firing coils of metal at their suns, rupturing their corona and causing their sun’s entire fusion contents to spill out into the solar system and vaporize everything. Anyways, warfare between super advanced alien races is always rad.
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Dec 15, 2019 08:03
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Firstly unspoilering this one: Then my take on this season: The ability to bingewtch the whole season was a curse and a blessing. Because of course i have to watch everything as fast as possible. But a good thing should be savored. Instead Instead i gorged down the whole fivestar meal without the times in between to appreciate the taste. It still was great, but a little breathing room for thoughts would have made it even better. Maybe some of the "nothing did happen" criticism would have vanished with a little space also. But i can totally understand those who wanted more development on the grand stage. I'm a sucker for the views on/from "normal people" on the great story and so iw as more than happy with this season and the often shunned book. We learn a lot about the "Where are they now?". Earth is not that zero poverty Utopia. Only one out of 6000 even gets the chance at some kind of purpose in life and we got something like a political caste which mostly lost contact to the human basis. Gao won by offering the masses the hope for a purpose in life beyond the rings and they took it, even with all the possible dangers out there. Mars perfect communism crumbled to dust as a lot of their strongest and brightest saw no more purpose in the millenial project of making Mars a new Eden as the Ring offers now simply better planets now at less effort. The Belters see their advantage now as creatures of Space and their underground experience but are too divided on what to do with this to make life better for everyone. Overall: Humans = still assholes to themselves. Sorry that's definitely enough words for now. More specific thoughts maybe later after a chill rewatch.
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Dec 15, 2019 08:56
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that reminds me of how iain m banks basically had an entire chapter of ship to ship combat by culture ships and the elapsed real time of it to humans was like half a second. Ships blow stuff real good in hyper space and with antimatter clouds and all kinds of neat poo poo and its over before you can blink because your meat is drat slow.
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Dec 15, 2019 09:04
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Parts of the Avasarala story were odd: Having the general (or whatever he was) resign over a few marines getting killed didn't make sense. Sure capturing Inaros would have made for good PR, but the alternative was to blow up a ship full of innocent civilians. Capture was the only sane choice. Also, I would think that events on Ilus more than proved why they shouldn't rush to colonize the new planets. Ilus was filled with eyeball eating micro-organisms, killer slugs and a whole bunch of protomolecule machinery just waiting to get re-activated. The idea that the planet was now safe was absurd.
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Dec 15, 2019 09:25
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Oasx posted:Sure capturing Inaros would have made for good PR, but the alternative was to blow up a ship full of innocent civilians. Capture was the only sane choice. Ahahaha just you wait. Marcos is 100% worth the sacrifice of a ship full of innocent civilians. 100%.
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Dec 15, 2019 09:49
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I personally binged the other seasons too, except for Season 3, and we already knew about how much earth blows and is an overcrowded, stifling, listless place. A hell of a lot less happens in Season 4! I want to comment on the humans = still assholes point because the direction the show is going is really concerning me. You're right, humans are still assholes of course. There are folks like Jules-Pierre Mao who didn't give a poo poo about the 100,000 people he murdered on Eros. But I'm seeing some people online describe the Expanse as a "grimdark" show. I'd argue that the Expanse is not one. Grimdark is an argument about human nature: human beings are essentially selfish, cruel monsters who are only looking out for themselves and their petty bullshit. Of course some people are. But at its best, the Expanse focuses on moments of humanity and self-sacrifice, and those where people overcome their mutual distrust or even hatred to work together and make painful sacrifices for the greater good. Just off the top of my head, Fred Johnson stole the Nauvoo and hurled it at Eros to try to stop the protomolecule. Millar sacrificed himself to stop Eros from crashing into the earth. The most moving scene in the entire series might have been the evacuation of Ganymede, where instead of scrambling, clawing, and killing each other like grimdark animals and overwhelming a ship with limited oxygen supplies (what the shipowner believed would happen), the evacuees accepted the inevitable so that some of them could survive. In the last season, the final conflict around the ring was between two groups of people, both of which desperately wanted to do the right thing. On the one hand, we had Ashford and the entire fleet demanding to fire the laser in the hopes of destroying the ring and sacrificing themselves. And on the other hand, we had Holden etc. who knew they needed to do what was actually a much more difficult choice: power down the ships and become entirely vulnerable to a terrifying, unpredictable unknown. And they do it. That's as optimistic as loving Star Trek. Humanity is hosed up, but it's redeemable. There's hope. With this new season I'm worried that we're going to dive into grimdark territory. Murtry is a completely unsympathetic rear end in a top hat and he won't loving die or go away. Even worse, some loving asteroid apocalypse looks like it's about to take place because belters refused to execute a monologuing Super Terrorist. If that does happen, and millions die in an asteroid holocaust-9/11, that's really just too far. I don't know if there's hope and humans are redeemable after that. It's grimdark territory. Book readers: please don't let me know what's going to happen!
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Dec 15, 2019 10:08
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If you use the words 'grimdark' or listen to anyone who does then your brain has been poisoned by online memes.
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Dec 15, 2019 10:17
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